The only game I've played that I would consider to have Euro-Jank is E.Y.E. The tutorial is pretty useless, the story is damn near incomprehensible and enemies 300m away are alerted to your presence if you tip over a can. That said, the weapon load stuff is neat and I really dig the cyberpunk ascetic.
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What exactly is "Euro jank" anyway?
- Thread starter StoppedInTracks
- Start date
Revolutionary
Member
STALKER 1 upon release, every Piranha Bytes game ever, etc.
The bugs are there because of the better game design. PC games from the early 2000s have tons of "bugs" too. When your game isn't stripped down to the most basics, and when you give the player a ton of latitude to how the game can be played, it's impossible to squash everything. No matter how much QA you do, it's just not possible. There's an almost infinite number of ways a player can do something. And as a result, shit happens. You either accept "shit happens", or you completely reign in the gameplay and make it a controlled experience that can be refined with QA (since linear takes unforeseen circumstances off the table).
morningbus
Serious Sam is a wicked gahbidge series for chowdaheads.
I don't even consider eurojank a pejorative. For me, it's shorthand for a game more ambitious than it is technologically sound (and, of course, from Eastern Europe).
Check out The Precursors, Xenus 2, or Pirate Hunter. They're so god damn ambitious and have so many crazy, crazy good ideas that I can almost completely look past any other short comings because there is nothing else trying what they're trying.
Check out The Precursors, Xenus 2, or Pirate Hunter. They're so god damn ambitious and have so many crazy, crazy good ideas that I can almost completely look past any other short comings because there is nothing else trying what they're trying.
Pyrrhus
Member
It's a matter of budget and experience. The folks who said this is a continuation of the old way of making computer games have it right. In a lot of ways, I think the state of the computer game industry in Europe, that is, the market they're playing to, the ambitions and maturity level of the developers, the love of deep, even to the point off-putting mechanics, and so on feel a lot like the American computer game landscape of 15 years ago. I really respect what they're doing over there these days.
E.Y.E. is on a whole different level of "janky"ness compared to the other games mentioned in this thread. But it also has some extremely intriguing gameplay systems (a whole ton of them).
lol
I've also never come across the term, but I realize what point it's trying to get across, that games out of some Western European and former Soviet satellite states tend to have bugs/quirks in areas that most Western-developed games don't due to the different focus of the developers and usually a more limited budget.
Also derogatory way of saying 'outdated gameplay compared to <modern Western game in genre of choice>', which just means it's got a learning curve or doesn't subscribe to the latest trends in gameplay mechanics.
Also derogatory way of saying 'outdated gameplay compared to <modern Western game in genre of choice>', which just means it's got a learning curve or doesn't subscribe to the latest trends in gameplay mechanics.
Jake Tower
Banned
I read 'euro jank' as 'PC ass PC game'
Same. I get why someone from Europe might find it offensive or condescending, but some of my favorite games are full of eurojank. It's a big bullet point for me.
This too. It's not a coincidence the countries these games come from have the highest ratio of PC to console gamers.
Oh god, I had forgotten about that song. WHY DID YOU HAVE TO POST IT?!? WHY?!?
And for some reason, when someone says eurojank in relation to games, I immediately think of Big Rigs: Over the Road Racing.
Agree completely on both points. I see it as a positive thing for a lot of games.
I would use Pathologic or Men of War as examples of "Eurojank" being one of the reason I bought the games in the first place.
StoppedInTracks
Member
I think the point is Big Rigs is just a shitty shit game. Euro jank is a good game brought down by lack of money spend on QA, overly complicated design and UI etc. The game is good at its core but just not polished enough.
cr_blah_blah
Member
This has how I've always seen it. I've never thought of it as an insult. Sometimes budgets or engines don't coincide with ambition but the intent and interesting aspects can still shine through.
The Return of
Banned
This is what I go by
Haunted
Member
euro jank is caused by overly ambitious game designers
american jank is caused because the devs are lazy fatass fucks
Joking aside, many others have already stated good definitions (#4, #11, #18#, #30). It's ambitious and not concerned with user experience or accessibility. Function over form, often with a negative connotation but excusable because you just have to respect the ambition on display.
It's not exclusive to [Eastern-]European developers/games, that's just where it got the name.
american jank is caused because the devs are lazy fatass fucks
Joking aside, many others have already stated good definitions (#4, #11, #18#, #30). It's ambitious and not concerned with user experience or accessibility. Function over form, often with a negative connotation but excusable because you just have to respect the ambition on display.
It's not exclusive to [Eastern-]European developers/games, that's just where it got the name.
The Skyrim UI is the complete opposite of euro jank. Polished, easy to use and looks great - but the longer you use it the more its limits and shortcomings become clear and you really wish it had more functionality.Skyrim stealth-made in europe?
bonesmccoy
Banned
I've never heard 'euro-jank' specifically, but I've come across many who allude to a game being typically 'european' - usually when we're talking about Eastern European developed games.
I take it as a sign that a game has some incredibly redeeming features, but will lack the polish some of us are used to seeing. They're usually wildly ambitious and innovative too. Mount & Blade is a good example of this: Gameplay like no other you'll see, but notoriously difficult for newcomers - to the point in which you pretty much have to read through a forum to figure out how to actually succeed.
I <3 euro 'jank'.
I take it as a sign that a game has some incredibly redeeming features, but will lack the polish some of us are used to seeing. They're usually wildly ambitious and innovative too. Mount & Blade is a good example of this: Gameplay like no other you'll see, but notoriously difficult for newcomers - to the point in which you pretty much have to read through a forum to figure out how to actually succeed.
I <3 euro 'jank'.
There are some good definitions and examples pointed out here, the STALKER games being the classics. And bear in mind that the games mentioned have GOOD things about them, and people like them, it's just that they tend to have their own variety of idiosyncrasies.
In ARMA II with DayZ yesterday, I was in a building with 3 doors. I stood in front of one with the <> icon, scrolled the mouse wheel to bring up a menu (with such options as open door and close door), and tried to open the door...which apparently resulted in a different door 6 feet behind and/or to the side of me opening. I was reading a getting started guide and it was saying that sometimes one might simply give up trying to loot something because it was so difficult to get the cursor on it. I'm not sure whether the above is specific to the mod or an artifact of ARMA II itself, however.
Overall, it could consist of odd animations or odd/clunky control schemes, possibly combined with strange bugs of the "the game is good, but you'd better have 20 quick-saves" sort. Yes Bethesda is known for that sort of thing as well, though I would say Skyrim is their best yet in terms of a fairly polished user interface and a game that is easy to get into.
In ARMA II with DayZ yesterday, I was in a building with 3 doors. I stood in front of one with the <> icon, scrolled the mouse wheel to bring up a menu (with such options as open door and close door), and tried to open the door...which apparently resulted in a different door 6 feet behind and/or to the side of me opening. I was reading a getting started guide and it was saying that sometimes one might simply give up trying to loot something because it was so difficult to get the cursor on it. I'm not sure whether the above is specific to the mod or an artifact of ARMA II itself, however.
Overall, it could consist of odd animations or odd/clunky control schemes, possibly combined with strange bugs of the "the game is good, but you'd better have 20 quick-saves" sort. Yes Bethesda is known for that sort of thing as well, though I would say Skyrim is their best yet in terms of a fairly polished user interface and a game that is easy to get into.
D
Deleted member 59090
Unconfirmed Member
It's basically what differentiates pc games from console games/ports for me aside from maybe stuff like Blizzard games because they have infinite amount of time/money to polish their stuff.
Of All Trades
Member
That's being pretty nice. It's not just ambition, it's a total lack of interest in QA other than "will this literally break a PC". I'm playing Gothic 3 and even with the (basically required) community patch the combat, which along with exploration is the backbone of a game like this, is a total mess with constant stunlocks and victory through abusive playing. Gothic 2 is almost as bad. I can only imagine how bad Risen was at launch but when I played it after the major patch the combat had been improved to "poor".
What makes it euro-jank, though, is that a lot of the problems come across as incredible myopia, like they were so focused on having lots of options that they never considered that maybe a lot of them are pointless or broken. Comparisons to Obsidion/Alpha Protocol are only semi-accurate: there was a lack of QA (likely due to budget or schedule) resulting in some gameplay styles being either too easy or way too hard, but at no point did I come across something that felt like the devs didn't have any interest in improving.
HoodWinked
Gold Member
if mass effect 1 was made in europe that would be euro jank.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yLxNaGQKc5w&t=1m2s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yLxNaGQKc5w&t=1m2s
StoppedInTracks
Member
Can we make a comprehensive list of games/ series?
Arcania
ArmA
Death to Spies
Divine Divinity
Drakensang
E.Y.E.
Gothic
Metro 2033
Mount & Blade
Pirate Hunter
Sacred
S.T.A.L.K.E.R.
Risen
The Precursors
The Witcher 1&2
Two Worlds
Xenus 2
Lotsa RPGs on that list.
Cryostasis. Dev based in Ukraine. Impossible to get above ~20fps with an AMD card. Nice optimization bros.
Good game though.
StoppedInTracks
Member
Oh and Serious Sam is *not* Euro jank.
E.Y.E.; I played 15 minutes and somehow had read two hours worth of incomprehensible lore.
BattleMonkey
Member
Many would say EVE is also full of Euro jank.
It's also often very broad game design that has tons of featuers and options but are very poorly explained. Lot of the games like you listed above have far more to them than most common console games nowadays so it can be scary for some, but often these games make things worse by poorly explaining the mechanics. You are stuck having to research lot of things online to learn how many aspects of the game really work. As others have said ambitious design that doesn't always follow through.
ThatObviousUser
ὠαἴÏÏιÏÏÎ¿Ï Ïαá¿Ï εἶ
It took several years but EVE was mostly jank free in 2009-on. Trinity smoothed things over even more, with great new graphics too.
thechristoph
Sir!
In my mind, Euro-jank typically boils down to "designed by engineers, not designers". From game mechanics, to UI, to graphics, to the whole dang thing. It ends up being a very interesting game with a really tough shell. STALKER is my favorite Euro-janky game. Tons of great ideas, but you can tell that the only people who designed and tested that game were the engineers that built it.
SteveWinwood
Member
EYE and stalker are the poster childs for me. Play one, you'll figure it out pretty quick what it means.
Sentenza
Member
On the other hand, Arcania is just junk.
It doesn't have any redeeming quality and it's a pretty dumb game.
Sentenza
Member
I would say Eve belongs on the list just because it's probably the hardest and most complex MMO out there right now. Especially when compared to the current "king", WoW.
mmolearningcurve.jpg
Hellsing321
Member
Witcher 1 had its share of jank when it came out. Witcher 2 is a much more polished game now with the enhanced edition but it had its share of problems when it first came out too.
I think this is the most concise way to describe the focus of Eastern European devs. They don't have the budgets of the big western guys but they still want to be very ambitious with their gameplay, at all costs.
If there's any justice, what these guys make will serve as a preview for what we eventually get from western developers during the next console cycle. I wanna see mass market shooters with the same sense of scale as ArmA II.
morningbus
Serious Sam is a wicked gahbidge series for chowdaheads.
Yeah, Serious Sam can't be included because one of the key qualifiers for eurojank is having ambition.
lastplayed
Member
World of Tanks doesn't have much jank, maybe some balance jank but what online game doesn't.
I played the demo for the original, and while I found it ridiculously hard, I never found it to be 'janky'. Maybe that's just me and the demo wasn't a good representation of the whole game?
I'd buy one!
specialguy
Banned
You'll know it when you see it. Even a huge budget dev like Crytek suffers from it imo in the Crysis games.
It's basically a lot of bugs and lack of polish (again, even in an incredibly high production value game like Crysis 2, so it seems to exist even apart from resources or lack thereof)
Deified Data
Banned
I always took it to mean games like Risen, Gothic, etc.
euro-jank = ambitious, inspired, substantial, extremely technical game uncompromisingly designed for a specific audience who can appreciate the core experience without being pandered to with shallow embellishments or dumbed down mechanical design
ameri-jank = shitty game
seriously though, besides being an incredibly lazy and thoughtless criticism, 'jank' is a horrible, ugly word and should never be used by anyone. it's worse than 'shmup.'
ameri-jank = shitty game
seriously though, besides being an incredibly lazy and thoughtless criticism, 'jank' is a horrible, ugly word and should never be used by anyone. it's worse than 'shmup.'
Sentenza
Member
Yeah, no. Now you're pushing it.
