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What is the point of humanity? Alternatively - Post Materialism discussion

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Zaptruder

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The two are related of course; in the modern world, as has been through out the entirety of human history... the exploitation and control of natural resources and their derived products have been the primary driving force behind cultures, empires and civilizations.

There are of course other points to been human... but more than anything in this world, exploiting resources has become the largest driving force through an almost darwinian mechanism of positive feedback.

The more resources that are exploited, the more efficiently one is able to exploit more resources, and so on and so forth.

But extrapolating that thought; is humanity really only here to exploit resources? Consume and destroy? Or is the act of doing that a side effect of what is necessary to achieve other goals?

If not the exploitation of the world, then what else is it that humans aim to do? We don't aim to do anything as a collective whole, so the entire world defaults to the emergent behaviour of what occurs when the sum actions of all individuals become a collective.

I suppose the charitable way to spin this basic exploitation is the desire and drive for humans to improve human welfare, progress, exploration and discovery.

But realistically, is that what we'd really do? Skip past the difficult problem of resource distribution; say that we've finally invented technology that allows post materialism, through compelling virtual reality and nano-replication devices.

What do you think people would do in this scenario? What would you do in this scenario?

Or do you perhaps disagree with the premise that we're here to exploit? Do you believe there's a point to humanity outside of survival, something that we can realistically galvanize humanity towards prior to discovering post-materialism technologies (which may after all, never actually occur).
 
Is this a viral thread for that one movie that is coming out where it has some news person talking about (paraphrasing): "... when a planet is wanted for it's resources, the indigenous species is exterminated. We are being colonized."
 
People like distractions and people like stuff. You can't undo what evolution has hardwired into us for centuries.

Until we can exist physically outside of our bodies, the constant need for materials will continue.
 
Humans, as inquisitive creatures who also rely on compartmentalisation, we seek 'reason' and a 'point' to our existence. But what defines a 'point'? To what end are we referring? Better yet, why do we need a reason?

In the grand scheme of things, the life of a human being serves no greater 'purpose' than the 'life' of a rock. We exist because we do, and we will exist for as long as we can.

The point of life is to live, nothing more.
 
You make your own point. It's like asking: what's the point of a rock, a mountain? What's the point of a spider or a bear?

Really, what's the point of looking for function in things that simply are? The point of society should be to support and help each other as much as possible I guess. To make life easier and easier for other generations.
 
I truly believe that humanity is doomed in the next 60 years if there is no a MAJOR change in the way society is behaving. Sustainable development is a way to see it, but right now there is already more people than the Earth is "able" to sustain. : S
 
These questions were asked thousands of years ago and the best answer we got was.... "We don't know."
 
AlucarD.eq said:
I truly believe that humanity is doomed in the next 60 years if there is no a MAJOR change in the way society is behaving. Sustainable development is a way to see it, but right now there is already more people than the Earth is "able" to sustain. : S

The Earth is doomed in about 4.5 billion years anyways... Not really much we can do about it so might as well live it up while we can!
 
Nocebo said:
To make life easier and easier for other generations.

Yea.


If you think of humanity as a giant pile of pebbles, the "point" is to add your own pebble to the pile. Don't knock off other peoples pebbles and make sure your contribution is stable enough for others to build upon in the future.


That's my view of life in a nutshell.


AlucarD.eq said:
I truly believe that humanity is doomed in the next 60 years if there is no a MAJOR change in the way society is behaving. Sustainable development is a way to see it, but right now there is already more people than the Earth is "able" to sustain. : S


You should read a book called The Population Bomb or Our Plundered Planet. Your worries are the same ones many have had for quite awhile now (and they were wrong).
 
AlucarD.eq said:
I truly believe that humanity is doomed in the next 60 years if there is no a MAJOR change in the way society is behaving. Sustainable development is a way to see it, but right now there is already more people than the Earth is "able" to sustain. : S
I respectfully disagree. We managed to sustain this long without any major sustainable devolopment. What makes us go away if we have manged to get this far. Humanity and intelligence will only evolve but there is no way we are going to change our mindset, at least not in a helpfull manner.
 
I think it has to do with the predisposition to finding patterns in nature.
Patterns usually helped us (as predators) to understand our surroundings and survive, though the backlash, is that we tend to search and see "patterns" in every aspects of our life, and this is misleading.
Reason why superstition is so relevant.

So this also means that we apply the "causality" to the very basic concept of life and therefor, look for a meaning where there (probably) isn't any .
 
ClosingADoor said:
Yeah, that won't get me up in the morning. I need something of a purpose, how useless it might be in the grand scheme of things.

The purpose is to live. To experience and enjoy your life, and you dont need an ultimate goal to do that. Over complicating our existence will do nothing more than bring stress and missery. Just live, and enjoy it however you want to; read a book, climb a mountain, go on a picnic, play a videogame, love another, paint a picture, build a house, write a book, tell a joke, study, learn, live.

Its so cheesy, but its true. There is no purpose to life other than to exist, and to live. You have a choice; either dwell in missery, or chose to live a life of joy regardless of any ultimatum. The former is a silly choice, as you by default are alive, and if you're going to live you might as well enjoy it how you see fit.
 
mat14.jpg



I'd like to share a revelation that I've had during my time here. It came to me when I tried to classify your species and I realized that you're not actually mammals. Every mammal on this planet instinctively develops a natural equilibrium with the surrounding environment but you humans do not. You move to an area and you multiply and multiply until every natural resource is consumed and the only way you can survive is to spread to another area. There is another organism on this planet that follows the same pattern. Do you know what it is? A virus. Human beings are a disease, a cancer of this planet. You're a plague and we are the cure.
 
faridmon said:
I respectfully disagree. We managed to sustain this long without any major sustainable devolopment. What makes us go away if we have manged to get this far. Humanity and intelligence will only evolve but there is no way we are going to change our mindset, at least not in a helpfull manner.


I have been reading a lot lately, since I'm doing a Master degree in Sustainable Development for the UNEP, this is my first semester and books as Ecological Economics, Capitalism 3.0, and the publications from the UN are showing really conservative data. But in the best case scenario is our generation the one that can make a change.

I'm not being pessimistic, I only saying what I have seen now I have research a lot more. Either way the resources are going scarce in a much more rapid rate, and I truly hope we came with an answer. Not for us but for next generations.

Btw, as you can see my english is not really amazing, just in case you see something really incoherent in my posts.

ToxicAdam said:
You should read a book called The Population Bomb or Our Plundered Planet. Your worries are the same ones many have had for quite awhile now (and they were wrong).

Thanks, I'm going to check if my library has it.
 
The first duty of every human is to the truth, whether it's scientific truth or historical truth or personal truth.

It is the guiding principle upon which Starfleet is based.
 
faridmon said:
I respectfully disagree. We managed to sustain this long without any major sustainable devolopment. What makes us go away if we have manged to get this far. Humanity and intelligence will only evolve but there is no way we are going to change our mindset, at least not in a helpfull manner.

maybe that we're running out of natural resources? That is a pretty big deal. Also the way we are using these natural resources is also going to ruin the planet within a few generations. You aren't alone in your misplaced hope that someone will figure something out that save us, yay. And thus failing to do something now before we reach the point of no return.
 
domlolz said:
maybe that we're running out of natural resources? That is a pretty big deal. Also the way we are using these natural resources is also going to ruin the planet within a few generations. You aren't alone in your misplaced hope that someone will figure something out that save us, yay. And thus failing to do something now before we reach the point of no return.

I'm trying to find a link to a few papers that show we already reached that point haha.

Actually I'm an optimistic but I can't deny the facts (at least the ones I have find over a few books)
 
AlucarD.eq said:
I have been reading a lot lately, since I'm doing a Master degree in Sustainable Development for the UNEP, this is my first semester and books as Ecological Economics, Capitalism 3.0, and the publications from the UN are showing really conservative data. But in the best case scenario is our generation the one that can make a change.

I'm not being pessimistic, I only saying what I have seen now I have research a lot more. Either way the resources are going scarce in a much more rapid rate, and I truly hope we came with an answer. Not for us but for next generations.

Btw, as you can see my english is not really amazing, just in case you see something really incoherent in my posts.
So far, your english is way better than mine, mate, So no worries in that departmant.

The thing is, I recently did an essay on sustainable envirounment in construction technology (as I study Architecture), and I may talk about sustainable devolpment in another context than you are, but I see the whole sustainability issue a fad (at least in construction industry). Volaconos and other natural resources produce more CO2 than many of us imagin, the global warming is just a lifecycle to the temprature of the earth and the energy resources could be devoloped from altarnative methods (remember, Eenergy is conversed). The whole Sustainibility debacle makes me furious as there are so many regulations upon creativty these days.

In terms of resources, as in foods and whatnot, I can see the problem, but you have to consider we have devoloped so much in the late two decade or so in terms of biological advance that I see it as the solution to that. Not to mention that there are some poissibility that we may not even be on earth anymore, at least in theory...
 
Jason's Ultimatum said:
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Why, Mr. Anderson, why, why? Why do you do it? Why get up? Why keep fighting? Do you believe you're fighting for something, for more than your survival? Can you tell me what it is? Do you even know? Is it freedom? Or truth? Perhaps peace? Could it be for love? Illusions, Mr. Anderson, vagaries of perception! Temporary constructs of a feeble human intellect trying desperately to justify an existence that is without meaning or purpose! And all of them as artificial as the Matrix itself, although, only a human mind could create something as insipid as love! You must be able to see it, Mr. Anderson, you must know it by now, you can't win! It's pointless to keep fighting! Why, Mr. Anderson, why?! Why do you persist?!
 
There isn't a point, we are a random result of natural processes. The closest thing we have is to propagate, but still, that's not really the point.

But that's only on a macro level, figure out what you want to do with your life.
 
ClosingADoor said:
Yeah, that won't get me up in the morning. I need something of a purpose, how useless it might be in the grand scheme of things.
There is no purpose to you being here. But since you are here, you can pick any purpose you damn well please. So it's even better than actually having a predestined purpose.
 
We are here to survive. Just like every other single life form that exists.

It's only when survival is all but ensured that we begin to think about all of that existentialist stuff.

Deal with it.
 
I think maybe he was talking about what we are trying to achieve as an institution? Like, are we simply trying to discover everything or are we trying to discover and then conquer everything?
 
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