• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
  • The Politics forum has been nuked. Please do not bring political discussion to the rest of the site, or you will be removed. Thanks.

What PS4 Pro games could look like on 1080p screens

jett

D-Member
Jun 6, 2004
98,866
11
1,765
Sony has kindly uploaded its entire meeting at 4K on YouTube, so I got some captures off of that. YT's bitrates at 4K are quite high, but I screencapped scenes with very little camera moment to reduce compression artifacts further, in order to highlight image quality gains. Then I resized them to 1080p. Overall picture quality is pretty nice considering they're from YouTube.

Here are some pictures:

Days Gone



Spider-man



Watch_Dogs 2



https://abload.de/img/17i6ovw.png
https://abload.de/img/1645p6w.png
https://abload.de/img/22dcqxj.png

For Honor
https://abload.de/img/9wdqld.png
https://abload.de/img/71dqod.png
https://abload.de/img/65hp5e.png

Deus Ex
https://abload.de/img/13s6p6l.png
https://abload.de/img/14sfr9d.png

Is it a huge boost in clarity compared to what we're used to on PS4? Is it worth spending 400 smackers if you already own a PS4 but don't have a 4k/HDR TV? I dunno about that, but it looks pretty clean, although you can still see some of the fuzzy jaggies from the 4K reconstruction process in 1080p.
 

Primethius

Banned
Jan 20, 2008
17,874
0
0
U.S.
twitter.com
Yea, as per your question on the value of worth:

I own a PS4 and it seems worth it for me due to the image quality improvements alone. But then again, I'm a sucker for IQ and try to downsample most of my PC titles.
 

Lil'DigiOp

Member
Dec 18, 2013
3,141
1
0
The downsampling is really cool to introduce that to the mainstream public.

Its nice to have an option for better visuals... But I was really looking for better performance and stability with Sony exclusives.

Seems like that wasn't the goal.
 

jett

D-Member
Jun 6, 2004
98,866
11
1,765
Side by side would be nice for ps4 vs pro. I know you don't have em but.

Paragon's the best I can do, although this comparison seems to showcase difference in assets and effects rather than image quality:





Honestly, Digital Foundry's workload just got a heck of a lot bigger. :p
 

jett

D-Member
Jun 6, 2004
98,866
11
1,765
This was also the only part of the conference where I felt I was actually seeing a difference.

Yeah, even the textures on the distance look really blurry on "PS4." Probably running at 900p or something, I have no idea.

Another thing I noticed while taking these screencaps is that despite the GPU boost For Honor and Uncharted 4 still use the same low quality motion blur found in most PS4 games.

 

BraXzy

Member
Sep 6, 2012
12,824
0
0
Manchester, UK
Yeah, even the textures on the distance look really blurry on "PS4." Probably running at 900p or something, I have no idea.

Another thing I noticed while taking these screencaps is that despite the GPU boost For Honor and Uncharted 4 still use the same low quality motion blur found in most PS4 games.

Wasn't the premise that the 4K 'mode' didn't have improved textures/models etc, just the resolution boost? Vs the 1080p 'mode' that will feature improved IQ based on the dev's tweaks.
 

butman

Member
Jan 23, 2013
4,700
20
580
So if both are in 1080, the upgrades form PS4 Old to Pro are like 3DS to N3DS. Like happen with MH4 improvement for example? Or more noticeable?
 

SimpleCRIPPLE

Member
Jul 5, 2008
1,597
0
975
I feel like the PS4 Pro shots are what we assumed we were getting when we bought into this generation 3 years ago.
 

Mediking

Member
Aug 22, 2015
11,700
2
375
27
St. Louis, Missouri
So if both are in 1080, the upgrades form PS4 Old to Pro are like 3DS to N3DS. Like happen with MH4 improvement for example? Or more noticeable?

I think it depends on the game if it's more noticeable or not but I'll tell you this... my jaw isn't dropping in awe from these screens.
 

Lil'DigiOp

Member
Dec 18, 2013
3,141
1
0
Paragon's the best I can do, although this comparison seems to showcase difference in assets and effects rather than image quality:





Honestly, Digital Foundry's workload just got a heck of a lot bigger. :p

It was hard as hell trying to see the difference and I was watching on Youtube on a Sony 1080p TV...

Not the best showcase to show this stuff...

But these pics are eyeopening.
 

jett

D-Member
Jun 6, 2004
98,866
11
1,765
Wasn't the premise that the 4K 'mode' didn't have improved textures/models etc, just the resolution boost? Vs the 1080p 'mode' that will feature improved IQ based on the dev's tweaks.

Well some games are doing more than just 4K, like Paragon. The motion blur part is kinda funny to me, since you never see this kind of low-res implementation in PC games, and it's still hanging around for the next iteration of the PS4.
 

Ricky_R

Member
Dec 28, 2010
11,969
1
0
Yeah. The chances of me getting a PS4P will rest on the amount of support games get to downsample to 1080p.
 
Sep 4, 2015
13,402
2
0
It all looks good to me. I stopped playing on PS3 last year so everything looks great to me. We aren't talking a PS2 -> PS3 sort of leap or anything so I am fine with a OG PS4 or Pro.
 

gofreak

GAF's Bob Woodward
Jun 8, 2004
43,343
2
1,645
If that's legitimately how they'll look, that's pretty great. Very clean/detailed. Spiderman looks amazing.
 

v1lla21

Member
Feb 19, 2013
10,987
0
0
Silicon Valley
I wasn't really feeling the ps4 pro but downsampling and a better IQ does make me want a pro. Too bad I'd have to get psvr as well and I can't afford both right now.
 

jett

D-Member
Jun 6, 2004
98,866
11
1,765
Well, The Witness devs announced their Pro patch details and they aren't downsampling shit. Game will run at native 1080p on regular HDTVs. I guess the downsampling process ins't standard at all.

This thread was a royal waste of time.
 

SlimySnake

Member
Feb 5, 2013
10,764
29,349
1,240
Well, The Witness devs announced their Pro patch details and they aren't downsampling shit. Game will run at native 1080p on regular HDTVs. I guess the downsampling process ins't standard at all.

This thread was a royal waste of time.

lol you did fine.
 

Risk Breaker

Member
Sep 23, 2010
5,796
1
0
Well, The Witness devs announced their Pro patch details and they aren't downsampling shit. Game will run at native 1080p on regular HDTVs. I guess the downsampling process ins't standard at all.

This thread was a royal waste of time.

It is a standard as in if devs set the resolution to 3200x1800 or whatever, it will be downsampled to 1080p automatically. That's all they need to do. Clearly Jonathan Blow doesn't seem to care much about it.
 

jett

D-Member
Jun 6, 2004
98,866
11
1,765
As an idiot who knows nothing about 4K, can this essentially reduce jaggies caused by low resolution? I mean upscaling from 1080p?

Yes this process would reduce jaggies on a 1080p screen. You're grabbing a larger image (4K~) and downsampling it into a smaller one (1080p). Console games would look the cleanest they have ever looked.

It is a standard as in if devs set the resolution to 3200x1800 or whatever, it will be downsampled to 1080p automatically. That's all they need to do. Clearly Jonathan Blow doesn't seem to care much about it.

Actually FlashbladeGAF just now made it clear they can't just flick a switch and forget about it, otherwise all of the UI elements would be squished along with the graphics. Somebody on the devteam needs to actually care. :p

OP, you know GamerSyde uploaded a direct-feed sizzle trailer in 4k of all those games. You could get screengrabs from it : http://www.gamersyde.com/news_psm_ps4_pro_games_sizzle_trailer-18344_en.html

That trailer is constantly in motion so you get a lot of compression artifacts, gamersyde or not. :p
 

jett

D-Member
Jun 6, 2004
98,866
11
1,765
Do I understand that correctly, if I use a 1080p TV and use the 4K mode on PS4, it downsamples to 1080p?

This thread is just a maybe. It will depend on a case-by-case basis. Guerilla Games have specifically mentioned using downsampling on 1080p displays, while The Witness is going to render at 1080p+4X MSAA on PS4 Pro, for instance(an upgrade over 900p and 2X MSAA on the regular PS4).
 

Risk Breaker

Member
Sep 23, 2010
5,796
1
0
Actually FlashbladeGAF just now made it clear they can't just flick a switch and forget about it, otherwise all of the UI elements would be squished along with the graphics. Somebody on the devteam needs to actually care. :p

Hmmm... I think the UI would just look bad if it's using the same icons as for 1080p and not crisper ones for 4k. As a dev I know that does happen.

Oh wait, I see what you mean. You're refering to the actual UI being too small due to scaling. I think a good UI system nowadays should take those things into account to avoid problems with 21:9, high resolutions on PC, etc.

Still yeah, I guess somebody needs to actually care about that to make it look good. Still would technically work, but yeah I get your point :)
 

adversarial

Member
Sep 30, 2015
788
11
355
Has their been a definitive "It will be worth getting a PS4 Pro even if you use a 1080p display?"

I've looked through all the threads and seen a ton of info but am having trouble pin-pointing the above. Pardon the ignorance.
 

Inuhanyou

Believes Dragon Quest is a franchise managed by Sony
Jul 26, 2014
26,221
2
0
America
I mean....looks very nice but not "I'm going to spend $300 for this" nice.

You don't have to. But just realize that this is just the 4K rendering mode, devs are free to use the power however they want. Better graphics and IQ at 1080p, other resolution options and framerate boosts as well.

Has their been a definitive "It will be worth getting a PS4 Pro even if you use a 1080p display?"

I've looked through all the threads and seen a ton of info but am having trouble pin-pointing the above. Pardon the ignorance.

Yes. The Official FAQ says so
 

SlimySnake

Member
Feb 5, 2013
10,764
29,349
1,240
Jett, if its any consolation, Guerrilla Games is going to do exactly that.

The Guerrilla devs didn’t have a 1080p TV nearby to plug their game into, but they talked through how the game running on a Pro might look on one of those TVs, which is the kind of TV this self-interested author has. They pointed to some plants in the foreground and noted that their shadows on the 4K TV were a little blurry, something they said was due to having to maintain a good framerate while still showing an ultra-pretty 4K HDR image on the Pro. “If we have all that extra power, and you only have a 1080p TV, we can put that into making the shadows crisper,” Van Der Leeuw said. Or, even better: “The easiest thing for us is, when people have a 1080p TV, is render the game internally for 4K and then super-sample it down for 1080p. Internally we’ve calculated a 4K image, but we then use all the information to create a better-looking image. There are so many knobs to turn and whatever suits the game best.”

“We see it as our job to make sure that all that enhanced power that the Pro brings, that you’re not losing that if you don’t have a 4K display,” Hulst added. He suggested that for those 1080p Pro players Guerrilla might “get rid of any jaggies” in the graphics or offer “a less grainy image.”

http://kotaku.com/the-ps4-pro-will-help-launch-a-new-more-complicated-er-1786366610
 

Risk Breaker

Member
Sep 23, 2010
5,796
1
0
Has their been a definitive "It will be worth getting a PS4 Pro even if you use a 1080p display?"

I've looked through all the threads and seen a ton of info but am having trouble pin-pointing the above. Pardon the ignorance.

You'll get noticeably better IQ 95% of the time. Better effects and settings less often, and better framerate sometimes.
 

Bluekaveli

Member
Feb 17, 2013
34,196
0
0
I don't care what anyone says, I loved the order. Now I want a sequel to see how good they can make it look on the pro.
 

TheCanisDirus

Member
Sep 10, 2013
5,470
0
0
Man i used to be a graphics snob but nowadays i just cant when we have stuff like this...


1080p and 60+fps is pretty much all i crave. I have no desire (strangely) for 4k. Like at all. I've seen 4k HDR sets and yes they look great but it only matters (to me) when you glued right up close to it like with a 22" or below monitor.

I'm likely in the minority but i super content with standard PS4 graphics. I do wish we could keep the 900p-1080p stuff and simply get a frame rate bump if we wanted. But i understand how that would totally trash online shooters. Which is a big portion of what i play.
 

Ploid 3.0

Member
Jun 6, 2004
28,300
4
1,510
And here is how the subtitles will look like on 1080P screens

What? I downsample on PC a lot and the subtitles are pretty much the same ratio from what I remember. Maybe it's game based, or PC games are treated differently than console games?

With SD televisions playing HD games that was very different, as the HD games were designed differently due to the increase in screen space and clarity.

Someone know anything about this? I'll try Diablo 3 again when I get home to see if the subtitles change.
 

Loris146

Member
Dec 6, 2012
4,487
1
490
This is a "game changer" for open world games ( which have a very bad image quality in general on console ) .