OG_Original Gamer
Member
No television manufacture had anything to do with the development of HDR in display technology, it was all Dolby and the company they purchased.
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Whats a good HDR TV?
- Thread starter ussjtrunks
- Start date
No television manufacture had anything to do with the development of HDR in display technology, it was all Dolby and the company they purchased.
Theonik
Member
Depends on the implementation. For the most part you don't want to adjust TV brightness outside optimising for your lighting. The problem HDR sets have at the moment is they are barely bright enough as it's so they can't compensate for bright rooms easily. Dolby vision offers a solution to adjusting for different sets but it's kinda dead due to requiring manufacturers to put a proprietary Dolby chip in their sets and no content. Good processing solves many of these issues but different TV makers have a different approach to how they do it.
About Sdr being different content? The HDR version is a different master as you need to compress the dynamic range for an SDR set. You need to see these sets in person to 'get it'
E: As for comparing sets in this way you run into another issue. All or most HDR sets at the moment are high end sets. You won't find a huge gulf in their quality. The benefits of each tech in SDR don't disappear though OLED will have better viewing angles and better contrast for example.
RealityCheque
Banned
Is what I've read about HDR modes causing a big increase in input lag true?
J_ToSaveTheDay
Member
Those Sony X800Ds look to be really great pricing, I just wonder what it's going to feel like going from a super low latency BenQ monitor to a ~30ms response time TV. I'd also be going from a desktop 27" to a 43" display, huge leap in size since I sit right at my desk. I have the monitor maybe 2.5 feet away from my face... Wonder if a 43" is too big at that close a range?
No doubt the IQ is going to be one hell of a difference too, 4K+HDR from my kinda budget-range BenQ console gaming monitor.
No doubt the IQ is going to be one hell of a difference too, 4K+HDR from my kinda budget-range BenQ console gaming monitor.
I got the same setup in my game room. At times, I set up the PS4 on the LG OLED in game mode (I forget the ms response) and it doesn't bother me. I played Street Fighter V and Destiny on the LG. Hope this helps.
I second this.....even the Vizio-P models that folks are suggesting have a 60ms delay with HDR on
that is unacceptable and don't know how the series can be recommended for gaming.
Maedre
Banned
exactly, im gaming on a Sony woth 13,9 ms input lag and everytime i have to change to another TV ( hotels etc.) i get frustrated.
SeeNoWeevil
Member
Thirded.
The first person to find a display that does low latency HDR AND low latency backlight strobing wins my love.
PLASTICA-MAN
Member
If you wnat a good advice, I copy-paste my post from the other thread:
Listen. If you want to invest in a good TV around 1500 US, just wait a little for TVs with dynamic Metadata HDR via HDMI 2.1 which will be released soon.
You don't want to invest in sth pricy when something much better will come very soon. Many were unlucky to get an UHD TV that doesn't support Static Metadata HDR and are now facing the results of their precipitation. Just don't be hasty and you will get the best of us all.
Here is sth to convince you to wait : https://vimeo.com/164616954
You also want to get to get 4K TV that can play 4K @ 60 FPS @ 4:4:4 Chroma for best range of colours especially when there are games that can reach 60 FPS at 4K on PS4 Pro like Smite : https://www.reddit.com/r/Games/comments/51n52n/ps4_pro_announced_399111016/d7dathb
Listen. If you want to invest in a good TV around 1500 US, just wait a little for TVs with dynamic Metadata HDR via HDMI 2.1 which will be released soon.
You don't want to invest in sth pricy when something much better will come very soon. Many were unlucky to get an UHD TV that doesn't support Static Metadata HDR and are now facing the results of their precipitation. Just don't be hasty and you will get the best of us all.
Here is sth to convince you to wait : https://vimeo.com/164616954
You also want to get to get 4K TV that can play 4K @ 60 FPS @ 4:4:4 Chroma for best range of colours especially when there are games that can reach 60 FPS at 4K on PS4 Pro like Smite : https://www.reddit.com/r/Games/comments/51n52n/ps4_pro_announced_399111016/d7dathb
Darryl M R
Member
If you wnat a good advice, I copy-paste my post from the other thread:
Listen. If you want to invest in a good TV around 1500 US, just wait a little for TVs with dynamic Metadata HDR via HDMI 2.1 which will be released soon.
You don't want to invest in sth pricy when something much better will come very soon. Many were unlucky to get an UHD TV that doesn't support Static Metadata HDR and are now facing the results of their precipitation. Just don't be hasty and you will get the best of us all.
Here is sth to convince you to wait : https://vimeo.com/164616954
You also want to get to get 4K TV that can play 4K @ 60 FPS @ 4:4:4 Chroma for best range of colours especially when there are games that can reach 60 FPS at 4K on PS4 Pro like Smite : https://www.reddit.com/r/Games/comments/51n52n/ps4_pro_announced_399111016/d7dathb
Will all TVs with HDMI 2.1 have dynamic Metadata HDR? Are people expecting TVs with it to be released this year?
Doesn't exist yet. Things will be better in 2017 but you won't see the low latency you do on all monitor.
Vindicator
Member
Due to some PS4 Pro Preorder yesterday, I'm now busy looking for a HDR-TV but like said above it may be the best to wait, guess even holiday will be to early to jump in as the TV shouldn't be too expensive like below 1000€...
HIGH DEF JEFF
Banned
4th'd.
I am not making the same blind buy I did for my 1080p TV.
I've had to jump through hoops to get the settings just right so there isn't noticeable lag.
OG_Original Gamer
Member
I wonder how Sony, Samsung, and Panasonic are going to market these displays to consumers, with "dynamic metadata".
Ultra Dynamic HDR. We could have given you Dolby Vision, that was already dynamic.
Oh, don't forget your Ultra Dynamic HDR UHD blu-ray player.
This is all assuming HDMI 2.1 is required because dynamic means more bandwidth and higher frequencies. Although, Dolby Vision doesn't require a new HDMI spec.
Ultra Dynamic HDR. We could have given you Dolby Vision, that was already dynamic.
Oh, don't forget your Ultra Dynamic HDR UHD blu-ray player.
This is all assuming HDMI 2.1 is required because dynamic means more bandwidth and higher frequencies. Although, Dolby Vision doesn't require a new HDMI spec.
Flintty
Member
I came to this thread to ask a more specific question: If I'm buying a 4K HDR TVs, what key stats should I look out for. I'm guessing this post kind of answers that?
Additionally, what about the refresh rate?
PLASTICA-MAN
Member
Yes that is the purpose of releasing the new category of HDMI 2.1:
http://www.flatpanelshd.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=1457513362
Yes, 2.1 is required because of that.
Theonik
Member
This all sounds cool until you realise that HDR10 which is the defacto standard at the moment doesn't support it so you are looking at least 2 years of format wars brewing with HDR with currently only HDR10 being widely adopted.
Hero_of_the_Day
Member
This is incorrect. The KS8000 is a 2016 model. Anything with a KS at the beginning is 2016, it would be JS for 2015.
As for the differences, rtings says there isn't much:
Unless you have money to burn, get the KS8000.
OG_Original Gamer
Member
You know it wasn't cost that is the reason for not including Dolby Vision. The reason is, there would have not been any way to differentiate HDR on there displays because HDR10 and Dolby Vision would be decided by the required SOC.
so basically what we ended up with is a console thats really affordable for a 4k output and gaming render
only to find out there really is no good TV on the market that's not under a grand to do it with
doesn't even look like holiday TV buying this year would be a great idea.
guess I'll stick to supersampling for the time being. Maybe by the time scorpio comes around TV manufacturers will realize that HDR with low input lag is a fucking must.
Meaning the only display tested so far thats great for gaming even close to affordable that is somewhat future proof is the KS8000 from samsung.
only to find out there really is no good TV on the market that's not under a grand to do it with
doesn't even look like holiday TV buying this year would be a great idea.
guess I'll stick to supersampling for the time being. Maybe by the time scorpio comes around TV manufacturers will realize that HDR with low input lag is a fucking must.
Meaning the only display tested so far thats great for gaming even close to affordable that is somewhat future proof is the KS8000 from samsung.
HIGH DEF JEFF
Banned
So this KS8000...
What can I expect to see when watching anything current on it (Cable TV, Streaming, Games, Blu-Ray)...is everything going to be blown up and blurry?
I went from I'm sticking with my TV to I might go buy a 4K TV today because that price is looking good.
What can I expect to see when watching anything current on it (Cable TV, Streaming, Games, Blu-Ray)...is everything going to be blown up and blurry?
I went from I'm sticking with my TV to I might go buy a 4K TV today because that price is looking good.
Not as simple as a single number:
For reference:
Holy shit. Is the added latency for HDR modes typical across brands and models? If so, that's a complete dealbreaker.
for the most part yes, only the sony one tested (that is under a grand) doesn't move its 33.3 if i remember correctly with game mode or graphic mode for PC's with HDR on.
But gaming input lag is brutal with HDR on and only a handful of models seem to be respectable period for gaming with it.
nowheretorun
Member
I don't get the direction here from Sony.
Looking to push HDR yet 'all' tv sets that have it increase the input lag considerably? Is this right?
Why would you want to spend hundreds/thousands on a tv and more money on a Pro and can't even get a tv with a decent response with HDR on?
Currently game on a tv measured with Leo Bodnar and sits @ 22ms. It's not bad but my son has one which is @ 14ms and I can tell the difference.
Again, am I right in saying there isn't even a tv 'available to buy now' that has a response rate under 25ms (WITH HDR ON), never mind the quality of the nits, chroma, so on and so on?
I'm thinking Sony has missed a trick here unless they intend to bring out a new series of 4K HDR Low Gaming Latency TV's at reasonable prices, and soon?
Looking to push HDR yet 'all' tv sets that have it increase the input lag considerably? Is this right?
Why would you want to spend hundreds/thousands on a tv and more money on a Pro and can't even get a tv with a decent response with HDR on?
Currently game on a tv measured with Leo Bodnar and sits @ 22ms. It's not bad but my son has one which is @ 14ms and I can tell the difference.
Again, am I right in saying there isn't even a tv 'available to buy now' that has a response rate under 25ms (WITH HDR ON), never mind the quality of the nits, chroma, so on and so on?
I'm thinking Sony has missed a trick here unless they intend to bring out a new series of 4K HDR Low Gaming Latency TV's at reasonable prices, and soon?
Empyrean Heaven
Member
If you're looking to buy a 4k TV I'd recommend 50'' and up, 60 if you can afford it. Less than that and you won't really notice the difference.
Impulsor
Member
My bad!
In my case, I just wanted a cruved display.
Samsung has all the 2016 and 2015 lineup supporting HDR under Game mode with a latency of 22-24 ms.
PLASTICA-MAN
Member
nowheretorun
Member
Oh right. So that's game mode with full HDR on? Superb!
Time to start saving & pre-ordering, albeit not too keen on Samsung TV's (bought a 3D one @ ÂŁ1000 when it first come out and had nothing but hdmi hand shaking problems).
Thanks.
Hero_of_the_Day
Member
I can't speak for cable TV 'cause I don't watch it. But, everything else looks fantastic. From the rtings review:
I would rather watch a 1080p bluray than go to the theater, it looks so good.
Apparently. According to the rtings review, the KS8000 only adds a tiny bit with HDR enabled in game mode, going from 20.9 to 22.6. Not bad at all. I'm guessing a lot of companies didn't think about HDR and gaming at all when designing their TVs.
I am wondering why so many people are just talking about Samsung or Sony as possible options. Isn't anyone concerned that we still don't have a HDR standard and that these two companies only support HDR10 and not Dolby Vision?
I understand that HDR10 is the more common format at the moment but many say that Dolby Vision is superior and until one is fixed I would feel uncomfortable to get a TV that only supports one of the two...
I am a Samsung TV owner but am seriously looking at LG tvs as a result of this, as LG TVs support both formats.
I understand that HDR10 is the more common format at the moment but many say that Dolby Vision is superior and until one is fixed I would feel uncomfortable to get a TV that only supports one of the two...
I am a Samsung TV owner but am seriously looking at LG tvs as a result of this, as LG TVs support both formats.
Impulsor
Member
HIGH DEF JEFF
Banned
Thanks.
The more I look at this TV now though..I dunno.
I don't like that 1950's future sci fi stand it comes with and I especially don't like TV's that have such a tiny bezel. Plus I see people talking about edge light in this thread.
I am gonna just go to PC Richard today and see what it looks like in person.
PLASTICA-MAN
Member
No problem. You are welcome.
nowheretorun
Member
What are the response rates for the LG's?
I’ve had this model for about 3 months now and I love it. Was it expensive? Yes, but well worth it IMO.
And in regards to input lag, it’s not something I’ve noticed at all. I have played the new Odin Sphere with it, and that’s an incredibly fast and precise game and didn’t notice any lag while playing. I've also played Diablo III with it and haven't noticed any lag.
I highly recommend the LG E6 if it’s within your budget.
I would love to afford one of the LG OLED but keeping budget lower I am looking at LG UH8500 which has an Input Lag of 26.9 ms. Not as good as the KS8000 but not bad.
Yep that does look good.
Input Lag: 34.2 ms
I read that samsung HDR was bugged that it would turn off after awhile in game mode. Did they ever fix that?
Theonik
Member
As a person that paid 200 euro on a disk drive that supported both HD-DVD and BD in 2008 I wouldn't worry about it. In the end there will be only one or at worst a weird coexistence but you are likely to be screwed either way.
Well that is why I am leaning on getting the LG as it supports both formats and whatever happens I am covered.
ArkhamFantasy
Member
Any downsides for watching 1080p or 720p content on a 4k TV?
Any weird problems playing content at those resolutions?
Any weird problems playing content at those resolutions?
Impulsor
Member
Where did you read that?
PLASTICA-MAN
Member
There is in fact in movie and even games. a 720P or 1080p game or video has less pixels than a 4K screen so you will get noisy effect when playing a PS4 game or watching a movie since the screen tries to fill the space of the missing pixels.
Calavera520
Member
I'll just peek my head into the thread to see what these sets are going fo...
? these prices are much lower than I was expecting
Impulsor
Member
Samsung's upscaling is icnredible. 1080p content in my tv looks way better than it did in my 1080p tv.
1080p is also exactly a quarter of the resolution of 4k soy the scaling is perfect.
Correct me if I'm wrogn though.
CentralScrutinizer
Member
1080p gaming on my Samsung looks insanely good. I have an Xbox One S and you have to turn it into 1080p mode when gaming because the built in upscaler on my Samsung JS7000 is much much muuuuuch better than the built in upscaler on the Xbox One S.
PS4 games scale fantastically on this TV as well. They looks much better and more crisp than on my 1080p tv.
Sleeping Lesson
Member
1080p upscaled to 4K can look fantastic with a good upscaler, better than on a native display even.