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[SkylineRKR]

For the people who hate the battle system, how long have you played with it?

10 hours or something? I put about 8 in Duscae and 2 in Platinum. Ended up not really enjoying both but trying to find something good in it. Same reason why I platted XIII, lol.

The weapon thing was a good change though. It was fucking awful in OG Duscae.

 

[Nauren]

For the people who like it, how long have you played with it?

I've played Duscae probably 10-15 hours. Love it.

Beat Platinum twice and I didn't care for it as much. Glad Duscae controls will be available.

 

[Balls]

For the people who like it, how long have you played with it?

20 hours in Duscae and 7 hours in Platinum demo.

 

[redcrayon]

Demo came out. Checked GAF. everyone impressed.
Game about to release. Checked GAF. everyone hating.
Usual GAF. Game is going to be fine.

I'm impressed you managed to find everybody agreeing on something both times. I suspect that isn't true. Also that you manage to discount a wide variety of criticism, lots of it fairly specific to particular aspects, as hate.

'Usual Gaf. dismissive sweeping comments fail to sum up multiple lengthy threads.'

 

[DrROBschiz]

Those crying about the combat being bad obviously stink at it and have never seen videos of skilled players playing the platinum demo. Hype is through the roof. GOTY potential

lol

Yup Witcher 3, Kingdom hearts and DMC had a baby BRO! Its so amazing!#$)*(#U()*%#(*)

 

[Shredderi]

It hasnt changed THAT drastically from the Duscae demo

So im pretty sure people are well versed in the combat by now.

(im referring to Duscae with the latest updates and the recent demo)

I've played Duscae probably 10-15 hours. Love it.

20 hours in Duscae and 7 hours in Platinum demo.

Yes, exactly! If what's been available is enough grounds for liking it, it's enough grounds for not liking it also.

 

[Balls]

10 hours or something? I put about 8 in Duscae and 2 in Platinum. Ended up not really enjoying both but trying to find something good in it. Same reason why I platted XIII, lol.

Regarding the plat demo have you tried using the hero shield and shuriken? Have you tried using air combos?

 

[schlynch]

I don't hate it, but we haven't seen anything positive of it since the early Versus CGI trailers. Everything after that was worrisome at best. Duscae demo back then showed that the combat is terrible too. So it makes me wonder more what all the hype is about. Probably because it has FF in its name. As a huge fan of the early games I have very little hopes for this one.

 

[AzureFlame]

Well from what I've seen and played

-the gameplay is not that fun
-horrible camera
-horrible QTEs
-Ugly UI ( heard they still not done from it )
-bad English voice acting and awkward cutscenes
-it's not Versus XIII anymore
-bad presentations from demos
-it took a long time and still feels rushed
-it's trying to appeal to western audience
-the graphics engine is bad for consoles
-the team behind the game is not that good
-Tabata's ego

 

[Kyzer]

It's gonna be so trippy to finally play versus xiii and the last guardian...

 

[forknknife]

Personal opinion of course but there's something about final fantasy XV characters that just annoys me to no end. It's this edgy cool attitude that some anime always instills in their characters and just puts me off completely and this game seems to have it three fold.

I know you'll say it's on purpose and meant to be goofy but it doesn't matter, that's the feeling I get.

Specially the FFXV VR trailer, that was really bad.

 

[Balls]

It hasnt changed THAT drastically from the Duscae demo

So im pretty sure people are well versed in the combat by now.

(im referring to Duscae with the latest updates and the recent demo)

That's not true at all. Platinum has manual weapon switching which makes a huge difference. You can air combo with the air step sword in platinum which to me adds a whole other layer to the combat You also have the shuriken and hero shield which both add a different play style. Me personally, I enjoyed the combat in platinum more due to more freedom and choices. Duscae was more automated and menu based since we had to always switch our weapons around in a deck.

 

[Koozek]

Idk other than EasyAllies and most of the negativity here, all of the E3 press seem surprised and impressed...

Yup, see:

Arstechnica:

I very quickly felt overwhelmed by the variety in world geometry, buildings, structures, and textures in what might seem like an ill-fitting comparison. Square Enix's starting zone looked more awe-inspiring and required more draw-distance horsepower out of the preview build's PC than anything Bethesda had mustered in last year's Fallout 4. You may argue that those series target different kinds of players, but if Final Fantasy is really taking this big of an open-world turn, then the comparison is fair game. I criticized the last Fallout's copy-paste aesthetic, which made its enormity feel hollow. By contrast, this is what an incredible open-world RPG should look like. As a result, I was charmed.

[...]

This sense of scale—of monsters and familiars alike becoming part of the game's sprawling environments—left me feeling the same way I felt the first time I saw Final Fantasy VI's "Mode 7" effects spin a giant new world in front of me on the Super Nintendo. There may be quirks, bugs, and an uneven battle system, but there will also certainly be an enormous, lore- and monster-loaded world in Final Fantasy XV whenever it launches. As an admitted Final Fantasy hater in recent years, I am shocked at how much I anticipate grappling with the best and worst of FFXV. I guess we'll just have to wait and see whether I wind up eating some disgusting object as a result of a surprisingly successful on-time launch.​

Destructoid:

In all likelihood, Final Fantasy XV will be the first Final Fantasy I complete. I've gotten into stuff like Tactics before, but never the mainline series. I'm sure some of you know how that goes. Square Enix certainly does. At a press event, we were told the intent with XV is to appeal to veterans and first-timers alike, which is precisely the sort of thing developers always say they're striving for with sequels. I could feel it here, though. Genuinely. And as a new player, I am into this game.

[...]

All told, the preview session convinced me I'll want to dig into the final version which, as a non-fan, is a big deal. They finally did it. But there are two things I'm anxious about: whether or not consoles will be able to handle running Final Fantasy XV reasonably well, and what the open-world design will feel like after, say, 25 hours (will it become a slog?). We probably won't know until September.
​

IGN:

After two hours into Final Fantasy XV’s campaign, I can’t help but trace the lineage of Square Enix’s new blockbuster RPG in the back of my mind. But the first two chapters never feel like a derivative work, with the core story and presentation leaning on the type of strong characterization and blockbuster graphics that have come to define Final Fantasy. You could almost picture director Hajime Tabata and his team spending the last few years playing other games and saying, “Hey, wouldn’t this be a great idea to put in Final Fantasy?” And, somehow, the unique sauce blends multiple flavors into a cohesive and ambitious vision of a modern RPG.​

 

[MMaRsu]

Well from what I've seen and played

-the gameplay is not that fun
-horrible camera
-horrible QTEs
-Ugly UI ( heard they still not done from it )
-bad English voice acting and awkward cutscenes
-it's not Versus XIII anymore
-bad presentations from demos
-it took a long time and still feels rushed
-it's trying to appeal to western audience
-the graphics engine is bad for consoles
-the team behind the game is not that good
-Tabata's ego

Ouch.. pretty much this tho

 

[Dice]

Its isnt direct control

Its tethered... As instanced in teh video you posted

Its why when one enemy dies Noctis fires across the screen to the next target without any input from the player except hitting attack

Hit literally calls out that in one scene he did nothing but use two buttons the entire time and that the system is built around this simplicity

Now Im not saying you cant do compelling combat with simple input but this just isnt a prime example of such. Its tethered. Much like what Witcher 3 gets knocked for.

If you liked Witcher 3 than I guess this is up your alley?

Yeah, it's not a reflex action game. On the one hand, by cultivating the technology to such far ends, they open up a whole new world of cinematic possibilities and open up accessibility to large demographics of casual gamers at the same time. On the other hand, you don't have to be that lazy if you don't want to be and I proved that to myself when playing the demo. Your freedom to direct everything that you do is still there, it just isn't 100% 1:1 manual reflex action and immediacy with inputs.

Yet in not being so, a fluid blend of cinematic options are added to the experience. Those could involve your chosen tactics and magics, travel about the area, interaction with your team, boss actions, surrounding cinematic elements happening in the world, or all at once. Whether or not scenarios ever get that complicated in the game, they have opened up those worlds of possibility by developing the system in this way.

While Witcher 3 does have tethered attacks as well, this is going faaaaaar beyond Witcher 3 in design and possibilities. It's going beyond anything gaming has ever done, yet what many games have seemed to want to do since Shenmue. It is a huge deal and they should get due credit for bringing it to realization. I hope they do at least from other developers at the GDCA.

 

[Exentryk]

The combat is crap. The controls are crap. I have no faith in the writing, and some of the voice work I've heard has been pretty poor.

Tabata's philosophy about combat (getting old and needing easier controls, QTEs, etc.), about monsters (no telegraphing attacks), about tech (AA only only some frames), about marketing, and other things that I can't recall right now are all contributing towards my dislike for this game.

I will be voting with my wallet and not purchasing the game (at least on consoles). I am excited about other SE games though, so looking forward to them.

 

[Nauren]

Yes, exactly! If what's been available is enough grounds for liking it, it's enough grounds for not liking it also.

I don't fault anyone for not liking a game generally. However there are a number of people who haven't played the demos. Many comments are about emo boy band, which is funny because I find most of the characters upbeat and their colors are associated with their nation. Some people made comments about how bad the MS conference was which means they didn't see the newest build at the SE livestream. And several car trip comments even though there is a movie, a 2D brawler prequel story and an anime all about this world.

 

[OmegaDL50]

I dont know what to expect from the story. They should just go full Metal Gear ridiculous since there is very little to ground these characters outside of the roadtrip angle

It's not difficult to put some of the early stuff together. Noctis was away from home with his friends to his Wedding. Then the attacks on his home began, hearing it from a secondary source on the news at a Gas Station on a TV.

On top of that Niflheim basically is put out a kill on spot order to any members of the Lucis Royal family.

Basically Noct and his crew are trying to get back to Lucis to see the situation for themselves in the meanwhile encountering soldiers of Niflheim on their way.

The limited synopsis of early game information as well as the two existing episodes of Brotherhood paints somewhat of a picture of what the game is going to be like.

It's limited information true, but I don't see what is not grounded about it.

 

[jrush64]

I was surprised there wasn't really much hype with this game this year. But they've shown it too much. We know it's coming out soon. The game has been a long time coming, hype dying down was expected. Wait until it's almost out.

I'm looking forward to it greatly. Already preordered that special edition.

 

[Balls]

The combat is crap. The controls are crap. I have no faith in the writing, and some of the voice work I've heard has been pretty poor.

Tabata's philosophy about combat (getting old and needing easier controls, QTEs, etc.), about monsters (no telegraphing attacks), about tech (AA only only some frames), about marketing, and other things that I can't recall right now are all contributing towards my dislike for this game.

I will be voting with my wallet and not purchasing the game (at least on consoles). I am excited about other SE games though, so looking forward to them.

Lol that's not what you were saying a couple months ago.

 

[SkylineRKR]

Regarding the plat demo have you tried using the hero shield and shuriken? Have you tried using air combos?

Yes, Plat has better combat but sadly there was only one enemy at the very end making me quit it much quicker. But I still didn't like the input lag and general timing of everything. It doesn't feel like i'm completely in control while doing mid air stuff.

 

[Dice]

I will agree with people saying the English VA is bad. I really hope Japanese VA is available on Xbone because Noct being another run of the mill Aladdin-sounding anime twit would get on my nerves.

 

[Veldin]

It hasnt changed THAT drastically from the Duscae demo

The battle system is drastically different from Duscae in more ways than I can list right now. Many of the changes are self-evident.

 

[DrROBschiz]

Yes, Plat has better combat but sadly there was only one enemy at the very end making me quit it much quicker. But I still didn't like the input lag and general timing of everything. It doesn't feel like i'm completely in control while doing mid air stuff.

At least Plat had a one on one fight

The tethered system really only breaks down when you have a lot of enemies on screen

I feel like I will get very frustrated trying to do simple things and maintain control on my character like what I experienced in the Duscae demo

Im sorry but when it comes to 3D action rpgs... full control always wins in my book. That means Souls, Monster Hunter, Dragons Dogma. (For Honor looks like a HYBRID!!!)

Zelda is going in a better direction as well from what I can see.

 

[Vlaphor]

I'm personally still looking forward to this game, but would really prefer a PC version just so it'll run better. It seems like it will be an inevitability, so I doubt I'll buy it at launch though.

Also, that VR demo kinda made me want to get A PS VR (the Cidney part anyway).

 

[DrROBschiz]

I'm personally still looking forward to this game, but would really prefer a PC version just so it'll run better. It seems like it will be an inevitability, so I doubt I'll buy it at launch though.

Also, that VR demo kinda made me want to get A PS VR (the Cidney part anyway).

Im pretty confident this will hit PC at some point

 

[Oersted]

Not a dig against the game, but you make it sound like we owe the game hype simply for the virtue of coming out.


Thats just really silly.

 

[Desi]

Well from what I've seen and played

-the gameplay is not that fun
-horrible camera
-horrible QTEs
-Ugly UI ( heard they still not done from it )
-bad English voice acting and awkward cutscenes
-it's not Versus XIII anymore
-bad presentations from demos
-it took a long time and still feels rushed
-it's trying to appeal to western audience
-the graphics engine is bad for consoles
-the team behind the game is not that good
-Tabata's ego

honestly, I am a bit curious about what this actually means?

 

[Chao]

It's just not fun to play. If you're trying to sell me on huge titanic boss fights make sure the gameplay is fun first, because right now it just feels bad.

It's like they built a gorgeous next gen graphics on top of a N64 era game, even while walking it doesn't feel natural.

I don't know how to describe it but I believe it has to do with the animations and how disconnected they are from the graphic, character feels weightless and doesn't react how you would expect to the most basic actions, let alone combat

 

[OmegaDL50]

honestly, I am a bit curious about what this actually means?

Sounds like people are just fabricating reasons for FFXV dislike based on that list.

I get the combat might not being everyone's cup of tea, and may dislike the fact the characters all wear black despite the lore significance behind it, or any other numerous legitimate reason for being skeptical about FFXV.

But reasons like Tabata's Ego, The staff behind the game, or not being Versus XIII anymore just seem strange to me.

 

[Mupod]

Well FF fans have proven they will hype up any crap with the series' name on it so I don't trust anything they say. I haven't had time to play any of the demos but the game doesn't look great. Or good. Maybe I'll fire it up later today and actually form an opinion.

I love open world RPGs and my amazon.ca order is less than half price so I guess I'll be in anyways. But my expectations are at 0.

 

[Nauren]

Sounds like people are just fabricating reasons for FFXV dislike based on that list.

I get the combat might not being everyone's cup of tea, and may dislike the fact the characters all wear black despite the lore significance behind it, or any other numerous legitimate reason for being skeptical about FFXV.

But reasons like Tabata's Ego, The staff behind the game, or not being Versus XIII anymore just seem strange to me.

Not to mention that you can hide the UI you find ugly. Camera control hasn't been finalized. Then contradictory things like it tries to appeal to western audiences but then finds the cutscenes "awkward" due to cultural differences. Graphics engine being bad for consoles when we just saw Digital Foundry's video saying its a stable 30fps. And wide brush strokes such as "the team not that good."

 

[DrROBschiz]

Im still interested

Thankfully they are adding the Wait system which interests me

Also you can change costumes which is nice

The game still looks pretty bonkers. It has stealth, set pieces, giant QTE bosses, and a tons of other shit.

If anything I think the sheer variety being thrown around is going to make this a mixed reactions game for a lot of people

 

[Exentryk]

Lol that's not what you were saying a couple months ago.

It was crap then and it's crap now. It can be made bearable (even enjoyable) with certain things, like a shield, attacks with quick fixed animations, etc. But the whole combat design philosophy with hold button, animation priorities, monsters not telegraphing attacks, poor controls, etc., just rubs me the wrong way.

The sad thing is I know ways to make this system a lot better with minimal work, but it will never get implemented. May be I'll buy it on PC when it gets there, as then I'll be able to customise controls to my liking, and enjoy the world more in 1080p or 4K at 60fps with grass and shadows not popping in right in front of my face, hopefully.

 

[Star Falcon]

Hate would be the wrong word, but i'm not that bothered for XV:

- Duke Nukem Forever development time
- Boring and uninspired demos
- Unimpressive technically
- Too much bloat with peripherals and movies, not enough info on the game
- Long time since a decent triple A final fantasy game

There are much more exciting games on the horizon than XV.

 

[NHarmonic.]

I think our old friend Final Fantasy 15 is getting a lot of unnecessary hate guys. Yes Zelda and Persona are phenomenal. Yes the game has been in development for like a decade. Yeah yeah, I watched the same Xbox One demo reel you did. It was pretty bad. But it's actually here. Final Fantasy Versus XIII. FFXV. It's coming out in like 3 months. And not only that, but it's incredible.

the almost complete lack of deserved hype for FFXV after this E3 makes me sad. It really is an amazing game, that you might have to actually play to truly appreciate.

It's not versus 13, in fact it's nothing like it. We have a rushed, disjointed clunky mess that's borrowing the characters from Nomura's vision, 10 years ago.

 

[YankeeDonB]

Hmm I thought W3 combat was very enjoyable, so maybe that's why FFXV combat doesn't feel bad to me

I've been ploughing through Blood and Wine and have been thinking about this too - the combat is serviceable, but pretty janky in a sense (main issue being all the swoops and spins and flourishes Geralt does with even fast attacks). This does little to detract from my enjoyment because I'm in it for the story, world, and characters, and the progression of these. And all that is good enough that W3 was my 2015 GOTY.

If XV can present a compelling journey in an engaging world, a little combat jank is not a concern for me. These aren't 10 hour character action games that take place in a series of hallways, and they're not built to scratch all the same itches. Complaining that a 100 hour plus RPG doesn't have the tightest combat design is fine, but it's akin to complaining that Bayonetta doesn't have an interesting open world. (Dragon's Dogma is a potentially interesting exception here - although the game is ugly and very limited outside of combat. Still, would love to see another iteration of this).

That said, what I've played of XV demos, the combat is much better than W3 - far more flexibility and freedom, and in some ways more responsive (at least with warps and perfect guards). And that's without party commands, much magic, skills, or weapon variety. I think XV's final combat is going to be head and shoulders over other big open world action RPGs, at least until Horizon comes out (and that appears so bow-centric it reminds me more of Tomb Raider or Far Cry on the combat front).

 

[Mediking]

It's still day one for me! You guys are sleeping on this game. Might even be a sleeper hit!

 

[Oxn]

For the past few years FF15 is a game I wanted to like, but it just doesnt look fun at all.

Im skipping it sadly, until the price is like $20.

FF12 remaster on the otherhand I cannot wait for.

 

[Brawly Likes to Brawl]

I have no idea how anybody could manage to maintain hype for a game they've known about for over a decade, that these types of reactions are happening now shouldn't come as a surprise.

 

[AgentLampshade]

Did Tabata really say "don't telegraph monsters moves?" That's fucking stupid.

 

[dramatis]

I don't hate FF15, but I have a negative view of it. I don't think it will turn out to be a particularly good game, not when its peers are all way ahead of it now. I don't think the story will be good, so it doesn't have that going for it either.

I think the only way FF15 could get past the negativity is for the world to be amazing, but I don't think that's likely either.

Just to add.

FFXIV only become good because it is a MMO where people were paying ~$30 per month. SE did create a entry new game just to not lose these monthly $$$.

I hardly believe SE will do the same if any retail FF is released like the trash that FFXIV at launch.

They won't make a new game to fix it like they did with FFXIV.

Pretty late response, but at the time 14 was being reworked, people were not paying a subscription to play at all. That was Square's apology to people who bought the game, that they could play and give feedback without paying for a period of time. Moreover, a subscription for 14 ranges from $13 to $15, which is a pretty far cry from $30.

It also became pretty evident to current FF14 players where their subscription money was going after the March FF15 Uncovered event. Which is to say not back into 14, but into (in my opinion) a wasteful marketing campaign for 15.

 

[Kagari]

To be blunt, I feel like this game is suffering a massive identity crisis. I want it to be good but the more they show the more the steel plates of Tabata's ship begin to buckle and E3 was probably the peak of this.

I really wish he hadn't changed so much.

 

[Dark_castle]

It was crap then and it's crap now. It can be made bearable (even enjoyable) with certain things, like a shield, attacks with quick fixed animations, etc. But the whole combat design philosophy with hold button, animation priorities, monsters not telegraphing attacks, poor controls, etc., just rubs me the wrong way.

The sad thing is I know ways to make this system a lot better with minimal work, but it will never get implemented. May be I'll buy it on PC when it gets there, as then I'll be able to customise controls to my liking, and enjoy the world more in 1080p or 4K at 60fps with grass and shadows not popping in right in front of my face, hopefully.

Lol high five!

It's interesting that we both share the same feelings towards the game's combat, like we managed to have fun with the Iron Giant's fight after tinkering with the shield, shuriken and aerial combo, but in retrospect, not feeling content with the overall design, mechanics and controls of the battle system.

Though unlike you, I'll still get the game because I still have some foolish hope that the game might actually be decent, and it's like I've waited so long, might as well give it a fair shot.

 

[Kintaro]

To be blunt, I feel like this game is suffering a massive identity crisis. I want it to be good but the more they show the more the steel plates of Tabata's ship begin to buckle and E3 was probably the peak of this.

I really wish he hadn't changed so much.

I'm in this camp.

With the addition flavor of the fear that a mainline FF may never return to ATB again.

So, I don't hate FFXV, just a bit frynarroweyes.gif

 

[DrROBschiz]

Lol high five!

It's interesting that we both share the same feelings towards the game's combat, like we managed to have fun with the Iron Giant's fight after tinkering with the shield, shuriken and aerial combo, but in retrospect, not feeling content with the overall design, mechanics and controls of the battle system.

Though unlike you, I'll still get the game because I still have some foolish hope that the game might actually be decent, and it's like I've waited so long, might as well give it a fair shot.

My hope is that there is enough variety for me to find some weapons and magic that suit my playstyle so I can get though the game

we will see

 

[wild wild rice]

I think it looks extremely disjointed. Every time I see footage or play a demo it seems like a different game and I'll be stunned if it is somehow pulled together in a cohesive package. Seems like it is trying to be everything to everyone and lacks a consistent focus or vision.

 

[Edorian]

I really wish he hadn't changed so much.

By that do you mean the stuff he changed during development?

 

[Taruranto]

The demo played terribly and everything else I disliked it from the day it was re-named FFXV. (I'd be fine if it was a spin-off, but action battle system and characters straight out from one direction are not what I want from Final Fantasy)

 

[DKHF]

To be blunt, I feel like this game is suffering a massive identity crisis. I want it to be good but the more they show the more the steel plates of Tabata's ship begin to buckle and E3 was probably the peak of this.

I really wish he hadn't changed so much.

Yeah this.