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Which should i play first, Bayonetta or GOW3?

Amir0x said:
You confuse technical prowess for presentational competence.
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No, I don't, unless you explain how Dwarf Fortress' and Nethack's presentation is "competent" :-D

Those puzzles games are reductive in their visual design, but nonetheless frequently sport arresting, color-coded appropriateness; their tetriminos slamming down to nostalgia-fed backgrounds in Tetris DS, or whimsical fish swimming by in some other version. The fantastic sound of something clearing in Bejeweled.
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People still love super simple versions of tetris (you know the portable tetris machine stuff) and the very simplistic Windows games too. The point is, there are simply no such rules, they're heuristics at best.

Just because something doesn't have a hundred layers of shaders does not mean its presentation was ignored.

Puzzles games are a simpler core and demand a simpler type of presentation. But I'll tell you what, I prefer to play an attractive puzzle game than an ugly one (re: This is part of Lumines charm. Gunpey added an attractive visual element too. As did Meteos. Even puzzle games understand the requirement).
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I'm not saying it doesn't make a game (even if slightly) better. I'm saying that it's possible for a game to be great based only on gameplay, even if it looks crap. Some types of games are absolutely focused on gameplay. I think anyone who plays chess would prefer a chess game that plays awesome to one that has fancy battle animations etc but plays worse. I don't really disagree with you saying GoW3 is a better package or game or whatever than Bayonetta, I'm just saying that general rules like "If one game has great gameplay and bad everything else, it's still a good game just not great. If another game has good gameplay and great everything else, it's not just a good game it's a GREAT game." do not exist and are just overgeneralisations. But that's just nitpicking, sorry.

It's a false choice. Only in Bayonetta are you choosing between one or the other. In Bayonetta you only have great gameplay. In God of War III, you have good gameplay and great everything else. You're not forced to choose. It's the -complete- package.
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Maybe there are some people for whom GoW3's gameplay is not good enough and thus don't find it a complete package?
 
I respect your position. I'm essentially just layering out my rules for games, which may or may not apply for you.
 
I played both, went gaga over Bayonetta's combat, and I think GoW3's weapons are great as well. The thing about GoW3 is it don't have a grade system that lets you jump around and farm like Bayonetta. In GoW3 you can unlock a lot of stuff and you get into not letting anything touch you, but it's not as needed. GoW3 has crazy weapons and you can change between all of them, you can probably make a youtube of your awesome combos but all you'd get from it is a video. There is no game+ and you can't unlock accessories that help you farm better or new abilities like Bayonetta. Bayonetta is a replay beast, more gameplay there.

Bayonetta made me smile on the
Bike sequence
like GoW3 made me smile on
the Titans, first big boss
. And the credits for Bayonetta showed how serious it was as a story game.

Bayonetta Fighter 2 please! Beat Square to the punch before they release a new Boshido Blade.

Edit: You can get through Bayonetta pressing buttons too, just not on hardest mode just like GoW3 (can't get away with just pressing buttons). Getting bronze medals don't matter to everyone, it just triggers something in a lot of people like achievements and trophies making them think they have to be better, or that they failed even though they progressed.
 
Bayonetta has a far better and engaging combat.
God of War III is an epic adventure but plays like GoW2 and it's really pretty.
Bayonetta is a very good looking game too considering it runs at ~60 fps but not as good as GoW3 obviously. play GoW3 first.
 
Amir0x said:
better battle system, not better game.

Unlike what GAF "elite" would like people to believe, other aspects of games are just as important. It is necessary to have a captivating presentation and graphics, a purposeful soundtrack and a fantastic level design. It's important to have good controls, it's important to have good gameplay.

It's ALL important.

If one game has great gameplay and bad everything else, it's still a good game just not great.

If another game has good gameplay and great everything else, it's not just a good game it's a GREAT game.
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In the end and what history shows us is that only games with great gameplay are the ones that survive and the ones that get remembered.
 
Overall Gow III is definitely not a better overall package not even close.

Gow III
Better Presentation
Better Story
Superior Graphics.

Bayonetta
Great Combat
Superior Replay value
Excellent Reward system
Runs alot Faster
Longer game.
Plenty of fan service.


I enjoyed both games though, and think the op made the right choice playing Gow III first.
 
I don't want to put words in anyone's mouth, but I think what you're trying to articulate, Amirox, is that in God of War's case, it wouldn't matter if the core gameplay consisted of Uncharted-style stop and pop or Mario style platforming. The gameplay is just a means to an ends; a way of moving from one 'whooooaa shit' moment to the next.

That style of game will always come off as a tad more shallow to me, like a big budget summer blockbuster (a good one, like, I don't know, The Dark Knight), or something, to me, whereas a game that is designed around a very specific style of gameplay will always be more appealing to me, they're the ones that win the Best Picture Oscar in mind.

Both games are about combat, but in God of War's case, it's an extension of the settings and themes. It's a way of pressing a button and watching mayhem unfold. Bayonetta, on the other hand, feels like an actual game system build from the ground-up first, with scenarios (bosses, levels) built specifically around accommodating said systems, rather than the other way around. You're rewarded for doing well within the game systems with a medal and score, whereas your rewards in God of War are usually found by exploring the environment (artifacts) else they're delivered visually through a QTE or cutscene to continue the story along (something Bayonetta also does, but never as a sole reward).

It's what makes a game like Bayonetta very replayable and ultimately much more memorable to me. I feel like I'm slowly learning and mastering a kick-ass game, whereas with God of War I'll play it once or twice to see everything, but otherwise I get little feeling of reward from masochistically forcing myself through a punishing for punishments sake difficulty. The combat cripples under the weight of its own difficulty (more HP on enemies). By the time I hit the top difficulty in Bayonetta, I feel like I've learnt the game enough to be ready for it, in addition to having a shit load of other rewards to bring with me into that mode (accessories, weapons) to make it an actually engaging and fair experience.

Long story short, God of War is more of an experience piece for everyone, whereas Bayonetta feels more like more of a finely tuned game for people who fucking love games.

Trying to make it some sort of zero sum ( Good Gameplay + Average Visuals = Average Gameplay + Good Visuals) is far too over simplified. It is not that black and white.
 
yeah completely misinterpreted there Rez.

My comments do not mean visuals are more important than gameplay. God of War III HAS good gameplay. It's not bereft of good gameplay. It is a fun to play, albeit shallower-than-Bayonetta, gameplay experience.

Obviously a pretty game with bad gameplay is still a bad game.

Bayonetta has great gameplay. I think we're all agreed. Unfortunately, everything else tied to that gameplay is terrible. I can't think of a less appealing game aesthetically. It has dreadful level design and is crying for more variety. It takes shortcuts all over the place. The story is offensive.

God of War has good gameplay. And mostly everything else tied to that gameplay is fantastic. Unbelievable presentation of visuals, fantastic soundtrack, good level design and more.

This is why I chose one over the other. Not in a 'graphics-over-gameplay' exercise, but in a 'THIS IS THE COMPLETE PACKAGE" vs. "THIS IS NOT".

Re: Reward. Your reward for fighting well in God of War is a high combo. It's simply not a grade.
 
bayonetta is awesome but way to overrated on gaf,go with gow first,then ngs2 (best fighting engine ever),then bayonetta
 
tass0 said:
God of War 3 is so much better than Bayonetta, it's not even funny.

deal with it, fanboy.
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dont start the fanboy crap. Nothing in this thread is about being a fanboy
 
I guess we'll just have to leave it at 'our priorities are ordered differently'.
 
tass0 said:
God of War 3 is so much better than Bayonetta, it's not even funny.

deal with it, fanboy.
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Pathetic, and typical don't really know who you are addressing though, be more clear or stop typing at all.
 
if you consider 'gameplay' one area, I suppose.

I -- uh -- wouldn't consider every IGN review point to be equally weighted.

(That's working under the assumption that the soundtrack and visuals and fun factor and IGN review point 3 don't deliver in Bayonetta, I guess.)
 
People can play GOWIII for the great experiece the game offers. But if you're more into beating your previous combo records and replaying the same levels over and over again for beating those said records, you can go with Bayonetta.

Bayonetta has a more refined battle system and better framrate. But everyting else is better in GOWIII imo. I'm a sucker for great presentation, and not many games present themselves the same way as GOWIII does.
 
Amir0x said:
yeah i just expect my games to deliver in all areas, not one
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And some people prefer games to be really good and deep in the area they specialise in (aka "gameplay"), and think of the production value stuff as unimportant gimmicks, pollution from Hollywood :-) Anyway, you're absolutely consistent regarding how you approach this issue (remembering the Red Steel discussions).
 
Whatever you did OP you couldn't go wrong, both are superb experiences and different enough that playing one first over the other won't alter the experience of the last. Enjoy both!
 
Play GoW III first if you like nice graphics and over the top violence.
Play Bayonetta first if you like nice combat and over the top body proportions.

I like nice graphics and over the top violence.
 
Bayo's presentation does the job IMO. all the important parts (camera, visual cues, audio cues) are executed extremely well.


I imagine the main problem is the style, but that's purely subjective.
 
I can't tell you the answer to your question, OP, because I'm yet to play God of War 3 and will probably never play Bayonetta for one reason - the absolutely hideous art style I've observed from several gameplay videos and screenshots that absolutely disgusts me.
 
Darkman M said:
Pathetic, and typical don't really know who you are addressing though, be more clear or stop typing at all.
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Yes, because Bayonetta received much more critical acclaim and didn't flop, right?

Unless you're a feminine guy who's into the whole girl power thing, you're not gonna enjoy this game.

omg, opinions?!
let's see how the mods take this one :)
 
Beil said:
Afraid not. :)
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Wait you think Transformers has a better visual style than Memento? Hahaha.

tass0 said:
Yes, because Bayonetta received much more critical acclaim and didn't flop, right?

Unless you're a feminine guy who's into the whole girl power thing, you're not gonna enjoy this game.

omg, opinions?!
let's see how the mods take this one :)
Click to expand...

a "feminine guy"? What the hell is wrong with you?
 
tass0 said:
Yes, because Bayonetta received much more critical acclaim and didn't flop, right?

Unless you're a feminine guy who's into the whole girl power thing, you're not gonna enjoy this game.

omg, opinions?!
let's see how the mods take this one :)
Click to expand...


Feminine? :lol i thoroughly enjoyed the game i can guarantee you would never walk up to me and call me feminine carry on.
 
remz said:
Bayo's presentation does the job IMO. all the important parts (camera, visual cues, audio cues) are executed extremely well.
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90% of the cutscenes are told in still screens,most annoying level and boss recycling i've ever seen in a game (iirc one of the bosses was used 4 fuckin times,in a 3h game)
 
tass0 said:
Yes, because Bayonetta received much more critical acclaim and didn't flop, right?

Unless you're a feminine guy who's into the whole girl power thing, you're not gonna enjoy this game.

omg, opinions?!
let's see how the mods take this one :)
Click to expand...

..feminine? Uhm, I could've seen your point had you called Bayonetta fans weeaboos, but feminine?
 
i was having such a good time not shit slinging
 
Psssh. What a silly argument going on in this thread. Everyone knows Dragon Blade: Wrath of Fire kicks the shit out of both of them. $5 bargain bin, bitches!
 
Bayonetta

Graphics 3/5
Gameplay 5/5


GOWIII

Graphics 5/5
Gameplay 5/5



The way I see the two games. Just because GOWIII combat is more simplistic, doesn't mean it's worse than Bayonetta gamepaly. Virtual Fighter probably has the deepest combat system in a fighter. But does it have better gameplay than Super Smash Brothers????
 
Jigsaw said:
90% of the cutscenes are told in still screens,most annoying level and boss recycling i've ever seen in a game (iirc one of the bosses was used 4 fuckin times,in a 3h game)
Click to expand...
cutscenes- who gives a shit if they're stills

boss recycling- I take it you didn't play DMC4? the board game boss recycle playing the game backwards BS still gives me chills

3 hr game- only if you try really hard
 
I have the game right now infront of me guys, please tell me how to enjoy it.

I'm sorry I don't find dancing around in flowers, licking lollipops, taking care of a little girl and fighting monsters with terrible designs every few seconds (which you can all beat with the dodge button, how exciting) appealing.

But hey, GAF is insisting it's sooo good, perhaps I should force myself to finish this one and see if it gets any better.
 
Second said:
Bayonetta

Graphics 3/5
Gameplay 5/5


GOWIII

Graphics 5/5
Gameplay 5/5



The way I see the two games. Just because GOWIII combat is more simplistic, doesn't mean it's worse than Bayonetta gamepaly. Virtual Fighter probably has the deepest combat system in a fighter. But does it have better gameplay than Super Smash Brothers????
Click to expand...
failure-of-logic-fail-demotivationa.jpg


tass0 said:
Yes, because Bayonetta received much more critical acclaim and didn't flop, right?

Unless you're a feminine guy who's into the whole girl power thing, you're not gonna enjoy this game.

omg, opinions?!
let's see how the mods take this one :)
Click to expand...

tass0 said:
I have the game right now infront of me guys, please tell me how to enjoy it.

I'm sorry I don't find dancing around in flowers, licking lollipops, taking care of a little girl and fighting monsters with terrible designs every few seconds (which you can all beat with the dodge button, how exciting) appealing.

But hey, GAF is insisting it's sooo good, perhaps I should force myself to finish this one and see if it gets any better.
Click to expand...


21dj5h3.gif


It was nice knowing you
 
Second said:
Bayonetta

Graphics 3/5
Gameplay 5/5


GOWIII

Graphics 5/5
Gameplay 5/5



The way I see the two games. Just because GOWIII combat is more simplistic, doesn't mean it's worse than Bayonetta gamepaly. Virtual Fighter probably has the deepest combat system in a fighter. But does it have better gameplay than Super Smash Brothers????
Click to expand...
holy moley, don't even go there
 
You know very well when someone starts a thread of "Should I start "game X" first or "Game Z", both of the same genre, you're bound to have the elite come in and start bashing one game over the other because of a single aspect being better over the other or whatever mix ups there are. However, I do agree with Amir0x.
 
tass0 said:
I have the game right now infront of me guys, please tell me how to enjoy it.

I'm sorry I don't find dancing around in flowers, licking lollipops, taking care of a little girl and fighting monsters with terrible designs every few seconds (which you can all beat with the dodge button, how exciting) appealing.

But hey, GAF is insisting it's sooo good, perhaps I should force myself to finish this one and see if it gets any better.
Click to expand...
You're a terrible troll.
 
tass0 said:
I have the game right now infront of me guys, please tell me how to enjoy it.

I'm sorry I don't find dancing around in flowers, licking lollipops, taking care of a little girl and fighting monsters with terrible designs every few seconds (which you can all beat with the dodge button, how exciting) appealing.

But hey, GAF is insisting it's sooo good, perhaps I should force myself to finish this one and see if it gets any better.
Click to expand...

Don't try to enjoy it. You've already wasted your money on it. GAF's totally wrong and it's a game that noone in their right mind could find fun, it's just the GAF hive mind that makes people believe that. I think everyone who thinks they like the game can admit this, which makes your continued presence in this thread unnecessary. You won, congratulations.

Edit: oh no, he lost. Damn, world's unfair sometimes
 
Want my honest opinion? Play God of War 3 first. They're both great games but the combat of Bayonetta will make you wish there was something more to God of War 3.
 
Second said:
Bayonetta

Graphics 3/5
Gameplay 5/5


GOWIII

Graphics 5/5
Gameplay 5/5



The way I see the two games. Just because GOWIII combat is more simplistic, doesn't mean it's worse than Bayonetta gamepaly. Virtual Fighter probably has the deepest combat system in a fighter. But does it have better gameplay than Super Smash Brothers????
Click to expand...
posts like these make me wonder why I even bother trying to articulate a rational thought on the internet.
 
LordPhoque said:
Depends on what you're looking for. Both are worth buying though.
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He should definitely play both, but the common fear here is that if he plays Bayonetta first he will end up finding GoW 3's gameplay to be boring in comparison.
 
AzureNightmare said:
He should definitely play both, but the common fear here is that if he plays Bayonetta first he will end up finding GoW 3's gameplay to be boring in comparison.
Click to expand...

Won't happen if he already knows the GOW series.
 
I know you've already chosen, but since the debate is continuing anyway I'm gonna throw my lot in with GoW3. The combat system in Bayo is awesome no doubt, but the level design is pretty boring, the characters are fucking abysmal, the main character is annoying and the art style is fucking atrocious. God of War 3 is, as others have said, the complete package. It does everything VERY well, and while the combat may not be as technical as Bayo's technical doesn't translate to better. There's a reason Jaffe got pissed at the comparisons, because they're not trying to do the same thing. I tried to get a friend of mine to play Bayo, he just got pissed since he couldn't keep up on normal and on easy he felt like it was on autopilot. PURE skill based gameplay is only fun when you're good at it.
 
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