hydrophilic attack
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the weed stuff was never anything more than marketing
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Why are Libertarians so silent about Trump
- Thread starter Bleepey
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jellies_two
Member
Observing they appear to be silent while Trump is spectacularly awful, is demonising?
I happen to take the observation as being that libertarian thought leaders, the ones who were very free with their opinions before, seem currently, to be quiet.
Not that "random people who say they are libertarians are demons".
sir_kevith
Member
Just about every libertarian I know has posted some version of this lately:
And unfailingly they are white guys. Its the epitome of privilege.
Yeah Libertarians always struck me as the type that don't believe in the entirety of sociology.
And discriminate against non-white, non-straight people
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
Rand Paul has spent infinitely more time since Trump's election writing about how we need the gold standard (literally the worst economic idea of all time) then criticizing Trump for "Take the oil."
Paul voting Yes for Jeff Sessions will hopefully be the end of his fandom as Sessions hates all weed smokers and wants them in prison.
Paul voting Yes for Jeff Sessions will hopefully be the end of his fandom as Sessions hates all weed smokers and wants them in prison.
Already Torn
Banned
Your avatar combo is so good haha
Gordon Shumway
Banned
Just about every libertarian I know has posted some version of this lately:
And unfailingly they are white guys. Its the epitome of privilege.
Ha! I know that guy..
More Fun To Compute
Member
If the gubermint and society collapses then it just means less gubermint gettin all in the way and stuff. Then you can go back to core libertarian values like Jesus and slave ownership.
Knuckle Sandwich
Member
Because they're just republicans who are ashamed to call themselves republicans.
One Eyed Willy
Member
Most people have moved on with their lives, there is no conspiracy or mustache twirling villain here.
Sorry if that's not the answer you're looking for.
Sorry if that's not the answer you're looking for.
Ohhh...ya got meJust about every libertarian I know has posted some version of this lately:
And unfailingly they are white guys. Its the epitome of privilege.
I see...
Just about every libertarian I know has posted some version of this lately:
And unfailingly they are white guys. Its the epitome of privilege.
That is a fucking stupid image.
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
?
I think the OP is more asking about the people who have screamed "Obamacare is tyranny!" for the last eight years, but aren't talking about "Take the oil."
Fantastical
Death Prophet
I have a Libertarian friend who is very vocally negative about Trump.
BadenBadenLily
Banned
One of my self-professed libertarian college professors loves Trump because he thinks he's going to abolish the fed and institute a balanced budget amendment.
ftfy.
Veritigo_X
Member
Libertarians are like 1% of the voting population. They are always pretty quiet, relatively speaking.
Just about every libertarian I know has posted some version of this lately:
And unfailingly they are white guys. Its the epitome of privilege.
what do they always do? masturbate to anthropomorphic cartoon animals?
excelsiorlef
Member
Because civil liberty to most of them just means a freedom to discriminate...
Man Called Aerodynamics
Member
Because in the context of the USA in 2017 'libertarianism' is basically just a slightly different flavor of the GOP.
hey_monkey
Banned
Yep.
Already Torn
Banned
To be fair, this is just because he's a beta male without any testosterone or male hormones in his body. It's the same reason his hands and penis are so small, you shouldn't pick on him.
Nooooooooooooooooo
a lot of the libertarians i know are heavily vocal against trump and were some of the first to arrive at dulles to protest
a lot of libertarians have also distanced themselves from the ideology given the influx of white neocons who use it as means to justify their racist viewpoints
a lot of libertarians have also distanced themselves from the ideology given the influx of white neocons who use it as means to justify their racist viewpoints
But actually I'm not even sure if that's true on second thought. I wish it was true. Most conservatives I know are actively jeering protesters while cheering on Trump and everything he does even if they have no horse in the race. Either way I argue "most" people have not moved on.
God Dayumm
Banned
It is the obesity. Fat causes chemical castration on the body
JordanN
Banned
I'm 100% against Drumpf and find right-wing politics a joke, but it's overreaching to say they're all evil.
Libertarians at least denied Trump from getting their votes, even though their ideologies are supposedly closer.
Bl@de
Member
Yep. General impression I have is: Trump was the better choice (especially because of tax plans etc.). And I follow 99% libertarian sources.
KO Traveling Hobo
Member
Just about every libertarian I know has posted some version of this lately:
And unfailingly they are white guys. Its the epitome of privilege.
Libfurtarians?
Well, there honestly aren't a lot of well-known libertarian voices out there. I don't think anyone would argue that it's a mainstream ideology.
In pop culture, I'd say Penn Jillette is probably the most well-known libertarian voice, and he's extremely anti-trump. He even voted for Clinton since he lives in swing state Nevada (while vote-swapping with friends for Johnson in dem strongholds like CA and MA). On his podcast, he recently said "Trump is so far our least libertarian president, ever"...so that doesn't strike me as being silent, nor supportive.
In politics, I suppose Rand Paul is probably the most recognizable "libertarian-leaning" voice, and in that regard, he's been quite disappointing so far, as noted by other posters. The only thing I could maybe give credit to Rand for was being vocal against Trump potentially picking Giuliani or Bolton as Sec of State.
Justin Amash, however, has been a pretty consistent Trump critic, and is the only Republican to be fully against Trump's ban IIRC.
Regarding libertarian media and academia, I would agree with many posters here that the majority of libertarian outlets have continued to be as critical of Trump as they were of Obama.
That being said, we will see these outlets occasionally agree with Trump on specific issues, as have been the case with past presidents (for example, there was a lot of libertarian support for Obama ending the Cuba embargo, as well as commuting Chelsea Manning's sentence).
From a libertarian perspective, I find it hard to go much beyond 'I told you so' to the progressives who have always supported a larger federal government.
Libertarians have been warning for decades that this is where we were heading, but no one listened. Now you expect a niche political ideology(that has no actual power on the national level) that you were probably calling crazy yesterday to be the focal point of Trump criticism?
Sorry but that's not really how things work. You can't decide that when government does something you disagree with that everyone should be as outraged as you are when libertarians have been fighting against this creeping incrementalism every step of the way with little to no help from either side. After a certain point the outrage kind of runs out.
If you really want to work with Libertarians on fighting Trump, call your senators and representatives and tell them to support Mike Lee's article 1 project. Congress needs to take back its role as a law making entity instead of merely being the purse of the executive branch. That would be a decent first step.
Libertarians have been warning for decades that this is where we were heading, but no one listened. Now you expect a niche political ideology(that has no actual power on the national level) that you were probably calling crazy yesterday to be the focal point of Trump criticism?
Sorry but that's not really how things work. You can't decide that when government does something you disagree with that everyone should be as outraged as you are when libertarians have been fighting against this creeping incrementalism every step of the way with little to no help from either side. After a certain point the outrage kind of runs out.
If you really want to work with Libertarians on fighting Trump, call your senators and representatives and tell them to support Mike Lee's article 1 project. Congress needs to take back its role as a law making entity instead of merely being the purse of the executive branch. That would be a decent first step.
The libertarian label has been kinda ruined by the people who have chosen to adopt it. Hell, I've seen people claim the reason they support Trump is because they are "free-market libertarians".
But I've been screaming, don't you worry. Although at this point what most people take libertarian to mean definitely doesn't represent my views.
But many libertarians are definitely against all the immigration stuff. They are against the whole expanding the military thing. They are against the climate change denial and oppose letting companies go wild with pollution. No really. There is a view that most taxation is bad and unfair, but taxing people for polluting is justified. Perhaps they might go so far as to say that it is imperative that pollution be taxed. Because polluting affects other people and their property, and society must be compensated by polluters.
But I've been screaming, don't you worry. Although at this point what most people take libertarian to mean definitely doesn't represent my views.
But many libertarians are definitely against all the immigration stuff. They are against the whole expanding the military thing. They are against the climate change denial and oppose letting companies go wild with pollution. No really. There is a view that most taxation is bad and unfair, but taxing people for polluting is justified. Perhaps they might go so far as to say that it is imperative that pollution be taxed. Because polluting affects other people and their property, and society must be compensated by polluters.
hey_monkey
Banned
They would probably say they had, regardless of the evidence. Just like nobody protested Obama or ever said anything against him, even while he was actively dividing the nation and breaking down race relations, which were great before. #maga #alternativefacts
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
Rand Paul, Jeff Flake, and Mike Lee can block everything Trump wants to do.
But they aren't doing anything. Sad!
hydrophilic attack
Member
instead they voted for a party that wants to give business the right to discriminate against minorities
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
If Jeff Flake, Mike Lee, and Rand Paul came together and said "we won't stand for this" they could block all of Trump's horrible EOs by simply voting against all of his cabinet appointments and letting the government not work (they are very good at this btw) until Trump rescinded these orders.
But instead, they have done nothing. Sad!
But instead, they have done nothing. Sad!
JordanN
Banned
Then they're stupid. I don't think they're evil until they elect someone who is a demagogue in which case, a man like Gary Johnson was nowhere near as heinous as Trump is.
hydrophilic attack
Member
there is a pretty big overlap between being stupid and being evil (conservative or libertarian) in usa (and all over the world for that matter), yes
Pretty much. They're frauds.
excelsiorlef
Member
Except this is bullshit because in your limited government fantasy land progressives, especially minorities, would have about as much protection as they do under Trump... which is to say none.
"Big government" isn't bad. "Bad big government" is bad.
You don't get to sit back and tut tut progressives as if Trump is a reap what you sow moment.
And Senate/Congress was insanely powerful during Obama. They shut down just about everything he wanted to do. He couldn't even get a hearing on his SC nominee.
Seth Enosh
Member
Gary Johnson actually supported forcing bakers to make cakes, it was a point at issue during his primary campaign as his main opponent Austin Petersen was arguing for freedom of association to trump anti-discrimination concerns.
(I understand why you say what you did though since Gary Johnson was at odds with a decent part of the official LP platform.)
IrishNinja
Member
pretty thorough breakdown here between these, yeah
like any ideology stemming from rand, it's great (in that it effectively appeals to the most base, selfish notions in those not fully understanding how a society around them operates) until given nearly any degree of actual thought/implementation. after that, when the numerous gaping holes of people left behind are pointed out, a faith-based notion in the market is applied & it's a wrap
yeah, i was made aware of just how controversial this was to libertarians, and it's a pretty perfect go-to example of why they're fringe & shouldn't expect to be otherwise
hydrophilic attack
Member
that's why i said voted for a party that wants to give businesses the right to discriminate
The Hermit
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