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Why are scientists so obsessed with Europa?

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I would be ecstatic if we found even the simplest single celled organism on Europa or any planet. Would love to see what its DNA is like compared to ours, does it have DNA like our life? Think how crazy it would be if the alien DNA is similar to earth DNA... or think of how crazy it would be if it was completely different. Super fascinating, it's unfortunate the OP and many other people can't see that.

HK-47 said:
Rocks and melty rocks.
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And the organisms which live off the gases of the melty rocks.
 
Jonm1010 said:
I haven't seen it mentioned but hasn't Titan(Saturn's moon) been in discussion recently as possibly having life?
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Yes, on the somewhat tenuous basis that Titan was discovered to have (methane) oceans and tidal systems which resemble those on Earth, combined with the (ultimately incorrect) discovery of non carbon based lifeforms here on Earth around the same time (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/12/02/AR2010120204183.html ).

I don't know if that discussion went anywhere seeing as it relies on life being able to arise in liquid methane which we probably have little understanding of whether or not that is even possible (see more which raises Titan specifically here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypothetical_types_of_biochemistry#Methane_and_other_hydrocarbons ).
 
Mario said:
Europa is likely the best chance of finding living extra terrestrial organisms over the coming decades based on what we know and the technology we have at our disposal. And yes, that chance is likely to be tiny.

But it isn't the only chance, certainly not over the long term, and certainly not once we attain interstellar travel capability.
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It's probably an even more miniscule chance that man will ever find a way for any kind of efficient interstellar travel than there is that we'll find life on Europa. Unless some kind of wormhole shit is actually possible, that ain't gonna happen. Just gathering enough energy (in any way) to power up a space ship that could move vast distances at fast enough speed would take a long, loooong time, let alone it even being possible to store that much energy in any kind of realistic way, and it would still be problematic from a length of time POV.
 
What would the outcome really be if we found life on Europa? Because we know the universe inhabits life (we live here).

Just to shut the religious fanatics up?
 
They read Arthur C. Clarke?

I know this sounds crazy, but I think the most likely place to have life is in the Sun. Obviously it wouldn't be like anything we know, but when you consider the size of it
 
fanboi said:
What would the outcome really be if we found life on Europa? Because we know the universe inhabits life (we live here).

Just to shut the religious fanatics up?
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It would confirm life on two different solar bodies within our own star system. The implications would be profound
 
GaimeGuy said:
It would confirm life on two different solar bodies within our own star system. The implications would be profound
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In what way really? I mean, I know that it is a big thing that we find life on a different planet, and especially on a planet within our own solar system (which implies that life is more common that believed).

But in our daily lives short and long term? I can't see anything.
 
Jonm1010 said:
I haven't seen it mentioned but hasn't Titan(Saturn's moon) been in discussion recently as possibly having life?
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As was mentioned earlier if we find life on Titan it will be very different from our own (having evolved in liquid methane, but Encaladus, Saturn's sixth largest moon, likely has liquid water and could also harbor life.

fanboi said:
In what way really? I mean, I know that it is a big thing that we find life on a different planet, and especially on a planet within our own solar system (which implies that life is more common that believed).

But in our daily lives short and long term? I can't see anything.
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So far we have only one sample of life, our own, finding life that originated from a separate biogenesis would be a remarkable find that would challenge many of our assumptions about life. When doing science it is very difficult to have a sample size of one; with a second type of life we will have a better understanding of how life arises, what life is. The reverberations through our daily lives will not come immediately, but when they do they will be profound. Of course, we could find that both the life on some other world and our own life have a common ancestor which would also be a remarkable find. If that is the case then life must be able to travel between stellar bodies, and it would be even more likely that life very similar to our own is abundant in the universe, perhaps we even have distant cousins orbiting a distant star.
 
OuterLimits said:
Many scientists estimate the ice of Europa is likely more than 10 miles thick. Seems like a difficult challenge indeed. Would be cool though to somehow get to the ocean beneath it.
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Well the main problem we have with drilling deep holes on Earth is the heat. That's not a problem when you're drilling through -100C ice.
 
Dryk said:
Well the main problem we have with drilling deep holes on Earth is the heat. That's not a problem when you're drilling through -100C ice.
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I agree that the heat is a problem which is nullified here. However, just shipping the raw materials required for a task like this to another body would be incredible, let alone constructing it all when it got there. This is a problem we don't really have here on earth.
 
CyclopsRock said:
I agree that the heat is a problem which is nullified here. However, just shipping the raw materials required for a task like this to another body would be incredible, let alone constructing it all when it got there. This is a problem we don't really have here on earth.
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Cant we just send some radioactive thing that heats up so it goes through the ice? It's just ice right, some sort of mini nuclear reactor should do it.
 
Imagine there was a whole aqua civilisation living there in the water and the ice is protecting them like our atmosphere. And we send a probe to land and drill the ice and it ends up being a catastrophic environmental disaster of unimaginable proportions. They trace the probe back to earth and view this as an act of war.
What then!?!
SEA INVASION IS WHAT!
 
Famassu said:
It's probably an even more miniscule chance that man will ever find a way for any kind of efficient interstellar travel than there is that we'll find life on Europa. Unless some kind of wormhole shit is actually possible, that ain't gonna happen. Just gathering enough energy (in any way) to power up a space ship that could move vast distances at fast enough speed would take a long, loooong time, let alone it even being possible to store that much energy in any kind of realistic way, and it would still be problematic from a length of time POV.
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i think the rate at which our understanding of the fundamental forces of the Universe is increasing, alongside improvements in general technology and computational power, I'd bet on there being a fundamental breakthrough in this area within the next 100 years, and then a practical application of that breakthrough within 100 years of that. I fully expect we'll have probes on the ground on a planet in another solar system by the time 2300 rolls around, and could be well on the way to having boots on the ground too.
 
happypup said:
As was mentioned earlier if we find life on Titan it will be very different from our own (having evolved in liquid methane, but Encaladus, Saturn's sixth largest moon, likely has liquid water and could also harbor life.



So far we have only one sample of life, our own, finding life that originated from a separate biogenesis would be a remarkable find that would challenge many of our assumptions about life. When doing science it is very difficult to have a sample size of one; with a second type of life we will have a better understanding of how life arises, what life is. The reverberations through our daily lives will not come immediately, but when they do they will be profound. Of course, we could find that both the life on some other world and our own life have a common ancestor which would also be a remarkable find. If that is the case then life must be able to travel between stellar bodies, and it would be even more likely that life very similar to our own is abundant in the universe, perhaps we even have distant cousins orbiting a distant star.
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Thank you for your answers! (I am a bit of a devils advocate since I would love to see what will happen when we find life on Another planet).
 
I just think it is going to be a lifeless black abyss - if it even has an ocean. It is more likely to be this:

frozen_ocean_theory.jpg


Also read this: http://www.space.com/14757-europa-moon-ocean-acidic.html

Jupiter Moon's Ocean May Be Too Acidic for Life.
 
Elfforkusu said:
2) A large body of water is basically the best radiation protection there is.
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Indeed, you can swim safely in a pool with radioactive stuff. Ignoring the particles if there are any, of course.
https://what-if.xkcd.com/29/

EDIT me, i reckon there won't be life on Europa. Or Mars for that matter. I don't deny or doubt the possibility of extra-terrestrial life, i just doubt we find it from our own solar system. Admittedly arbitrary but i figure that the probability of finding life from less ideal places (Earth seems to be very ideal) is very unlike, far more so than finding more ideal places (and finding life from those) in other solar systems.
 
Mario said:
Probably not irradiated as the ice layer on the surface probably does a good job of blocking radiation etc.

And the gravitational forces of Jupiter heat the core of Europa, so there is the combination of heat energy and liquid water which I believe are considered necessary ingredients for biogenesis. I don't think "light" is a strict requirement.

Mars may have had life, but since losing its atmosphere the chance of it remaining has plummeted. Which isn't to say we won't find signs of former life, but it is hard enough to find fossils here on earth relative to how abundant life has been in our history much less with the limited and restricted equipment we have on Mars now and in the near future.

Based on our best understanding of how life gets the opportunity to arise, it seems Europa is the best candidate to find actual life outside of this rock. How to get under that ice is a massive engineering problem though.

Black abyss? Yes. Lifeless? Maybe.
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so probably maybe...you think?

no one knows the OOL requirements for even a single damn cell, its not probably it is definitely a guess.
 
What if we permanently fuck up the life there by drilling a hole into it? Like the ice around it is a shell that helped foster that life, akin to what our ozone layer does for life on Earth?
 
Mario said:
Probably not irradiated as the ice layer on the surface probably does a good job of blocking radiation etc.

And the gravitational forces of Jupiter heat the core of Europa, so there is the combination of heat energy and liquid water which I believe are considered necessary ingredients for biogenesis. I don't think "light" is a strict requirement.

Mars may have had life, but since losing its atmosphere the chance of it remaining has plummeted. Which isn't to say we won't find signs of former life, but it is hard enough to find fossils here on earth relative to how abundant life has been in our history much less with the limited and restricted equipment we have on Mars now and in the near future.

Based on our best understanding of how life gets the opportunity to arise, it seems Europa is the best candidate to find actual life outside of this rock. How to get under that ice is a massive engineering problem though.

Black abyss? Yes. Lifeless? Maybe.
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Is it a complete abysys. If there is volcanic activity then isnt there is a possibility of continually open craters and rifts that continually emit light and heat?
 
DonasaurusRex said:
so probably maybe...you think?

no one knows the OOL requirements for even a single damn cell, its not probably it is definitely a guess.
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Well, we have one example of life arising at least. All I'm saying is that Europa comes the closest to replicating the conditions that led to that based on what we know. I'm not saying finding life there is probable.


Nilaul said:
Is it a complete abysys. If there is volcanic activity then isnt there is a possibility of continually open craters and rifts that continually emit light and heat?
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Hmmm I could be wrong but I don't think the volcanic activity in the deep ocean here on Earth usually emits light.

Any light created would only travel so far anyway.
 
Surface of Me said:
What if we permanently fuck up the life there by drilling a hole into it? Like the ice around it is a shell that helped foster that life, akin to what our ozone layer does for life on Earth?
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Didn't the scientist believe there were oceans underneath because of vapor coming out? Or am I confusing it with another moon?
 
Badenergytroll said:
I keep hearing of missions to pierce the ice and explore the subsurface ocean of Europa, and rumors and conjecture that there is complex life in it's ocean. Even if there is a liquid ocean under the crust (which there probably is not), it is likely an irradiated sterile acidic lifeless black abyss. http://www.iflscience.com/space/nasa-plans-mission-europa
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Most scientists think there is, so where does your probably not come from?
 
Because it's one of the most likely candidates for life within our reach that we're not all ready at? lol

Surface of Me said:
What if we permanently fuck up the life there by drilling a hole into it? Like the ice around it is a shell that helped foster that life, akin to what our ozone layer does for life on Earth?
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This is unlikely, but you could very easily seal the hole behind you. Biggest issue to detecting potential life there is introducing and subsequently detecting earth-borne microbes carried there by the probe.
 
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