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Why are there suddenly cards in so many non TCG Video Games?
- Thread starter RexNovis
- Start date
I do.
cards in games were around long before hearthstone.
unless those devs were from the future and tried to make hearthstone before hearthstone only to, for some reason never capitalize on them
TheSpoiler
Member
The OP was original about how all these games have cards in them, despite the fact that many, many games use cards either as a battle system or an upgrade system over the years.
OP reveals that he is actually annoyed at their usage in action and FPS games because they have no place there. But RPGs are totally okay!
When pressed, even more revealing information is uncovered.
Turns out, OP doesn't even know what those cards do in said games. He's just putting them up there because they contain the vile creatures.
Our story, however, doesn't end there. OP goes all out, and displays his truest of intentions - cards = microtransactions because someone on in this very forum told him, while forgetting to tell him of the context of each game!
And this beautiful example of why you read up on what you'd like to complain about is located on a single page.
As for even more examples, PvZ contains cards as a form of unlocking things and assists, but it's so easy to get them I couldn't see how anyone would want to pay money for that. A few decent matches and you have enough for the highest pack, easily.
But the fun doesn't end there.
OP reveals that he is actually annoyed at their usage in action and FPS games because they have no place there. But RPGs are totally okay!
When pressed, even more revealing information is uncovered.
Turns out, OP doesn't even know what those cards do in said games. He's just putting them up there because they contain the vile creatures.
Our story, however, doesn't end there. OP goes all out, and displays his truest of intentions - cards = microtransactions because someone on in this very forum told him, while forgetting to tell him of the context of each game!
And this beautiful example of why you read up on what you'd like to complain about is located on a single page.
As for even more examples, PvZ contains cards as a form of unlocking things and assists, but it's so easy to get them I couldn't see how anyone would want to pay money for that. A few decent matches and you have enough for the highest pack, easily.
Introduce the mechanic in the first one, then once people are comfortable with it monetise it in the inevitable sequel. You can see what they're planning from a mile off.
toddhunter
Member
Because some countries have very strict regulation around online gambling. However gambling in games is currently under the radar so companies are trying to cash in from exploiting this as much as possible before it is shut down.
And you sincerely believe this.
TheSpoiler
Member
So it hasn't actually happened yet, but it could happen because they are tangibly related by having cards. Even though one is used as a burner for powerups like perks, and the other would mean replacing that system with someone that would break the game's balance, piss off customers, and equate to less sales overall and less longterm traction.
That's quite the leap of logic you got there, even if it is EA.
He's right.
Not directly related to console games, but mobile game companies have been bringing in gambling specialists and casino firms into the fold when it comes to their gameplay design over the years. Maximum addiction, maximum money draw based on random factors.
It's really only a matter of time before it's cracked down... or maybe never? Because card games have always slid by when it comes to random payouts.
NullPointer
Member
No, I'd imagine people would just respond to that stuff like this:
The writing on the wall couldn't be much clearer.
toddhunter
Member
Yes.
Do you dispute that paying money for a randomised outcome, with some outcomes being more desirable than others is not gambling?
Do you dispute that gambling isn't addictive?
Do you dispute that companies are not fully aware of this and are increasingly including it in games despite the social risks?
Fair enough if you do, but then you may need to articulate a full reply. Maybe in America it'll never be an issue, but elsewhere it is a storm waiting to happen.
Well it already happens in other EA games so...
TheSpoiler
Member
Ah, twisting my words! How perfect. Might want to get your eyes checked and re-read that writing on the wall, though.
You failed to realize that PvZ is
1). A game that I have literally not spent a dime in.
2.) A game that players have not had an issue gaining cards in.
3.) A game that allows you to unlock buyable cards with in-game currency.
4.) Isn't a sequel of anything. It's a spinoff title that didn't change the concept with cards alone.
It might take having played it to realize, but then again, that might be asking too much of someone going out of their way to warp my words into me being a sheeple.
Here's the thing - if it was done in such a manner where players are forced to spend money to keep up, unfairly balancing the game, most people would rightfully avoid that shit. F2P games get away with it, but not a 60 dollar asking price game.
F2P is a different story, however, but we can discuss that later. For now, spend some time reading up on games before you make commentary.
On second glance, I think I see what you are saying, if you mean mobile too. But what areas are being targeted over bigger places like the US? I don't think The Witcher 3 was made to circumvent the laws of the land, nor Battlefield. And gambling features in gaming have been a thing since the dawn of time. Even the NES days had you gambling choices and such.
I don't think cards are an indication of that, but I do think maybe there's something to be said about mobile gaming forcing on select areas to bypass those laws, whatever they might be.
True, but how PvZ uses it is different than how, say, Madden uses it. I mean, I'm all against cards, or any system, morphing the game to give players with more money an unfair advantage. But until I see it happen first hand, it's merely hearsay in my eyes.
Cards have long been a popular way to collect things, and easy to understand how you collect them randomly.
In most games they're just stand in for what would otherwise be sprites or an item not on a card.
I'd like to draw a very distinct line between those and things like Hearthstone, Gwent, or Magic: The Gathering which are games played with cards on a much more fundamental level.
In most games they're just stand in for what would otherwise be sprites or an item not on a card.
I'd like to draw a very distinct line between those and things like Hearthstone, Gwent, or Magic: The Gathering which are games played with cards on a much more fundamental level.
NullPointer
Member
oh I can't wait.
That's gambling, yeah.
Gambling is addictive.
I believe companies are fully aware of this and I genuinely believe that the end result of this is a profit of some sort, but I do not genuinely believe that the gambling industry's draconic practices are overlapping with the gaming industry. At least not now, as there has yet to be a case where the card F2P system has been overly abused by a publisher yet. That doesn't mean it won't happen, I suppose.
That's incredibly cynical.
Haven't those companies accused/admitted of those practices -- King, Zynga -- been on a steady decline of not seeing success from those casino-like strats plaguing their games? Has their been a case where hiring these people been a notable success for the developer?
NinjamicWZ
Banned
The better question is why did it take so long?
TheSpoiler
Member
The fact that you only responded to that singular element and not the rest of my post displaying your lack of knowledge of the topic shows me you aren't willing to continue an actual discussion.
Guess you'll be waiting a while then.
NullPointer
Member
Honestly, I didn't want to spend the evening disentangling all the wrong you assumed in you post. About what I was saying about paid and free to play games, what I know about these games, what I was saying about you, your perspective, or by what I'm referring to with "writing on the wall". You made plenty of false assumptions all on your own.
TheSpoiler
Member
"I don't want to spend all night responding, but I will respond to you."
I don't think there are many different ways to infer that post, particularly because you responded to my statement of "people would get angry at a card based system" with my post pointing out a decent example of a, well, card based system.
I could be wrong! But that would require a lot of backpedaling from you.
toddhunter
Member
"Haven't those companies accused/admitted of those practices -- King, Zynga -- been on a steady decline of not seeing success from those casino-like strats plaguing their games? Has their been a case where hiring these people been a notable success for the developer?"
Maybe, but decline means a lot of things when you consider other factors, specifically increased competition. You can still make a huge amount of money which is why we are seeing it more and the concept is still sound. It just needs adjustment.
Companies like EA will be tracking everything to get the maximum returns.
Maybe, but decline means a lot of things when you consider other factors, specifically increased competition. You can still make a huge amount of money which is why we are seeing it more and the concept is still sound. It just needs adjustment.
Companies like EA will be tracking everything to get the maximum returns.
Affeinvasion
Member
I always love the people who post in these threads who say "I've never spent a dime on random collectibles/power ups, so they aren't addictive." If they didn't make money off of these things they wouldn't be so pervasive. The reason why FIFA and shooters and mobile games have these things is because they make money. These games are designed to make money. If they weren't you wouldn't need a new FIFA every year.
Bry0
Member
I noticed this too.
I kind of wonder if there is a correlation with both Halo and Forza doing it this year? Kinda like how all the launch games had microtransactions stuffed in them.
Idk, but regardless I kinda like it. It appeals to the "uncrating" rush that you get opening crates in CSGO or boxes in Guild Wars.
What I like about what Halo 5, Forza 6 and to an extent Guild Wars 2 is that these games offer ways to open packs without spending money.
I kind of wonder if there is a correlation with both Halo and Forza doing it this year? Kinda like how all the launch games had microtransactions stuffed in them.
Idk, but regardless I kinda like it. It appeals to the "uncrating" rush that you get opening crates in CSGO or boxes in Guild Wars.
What I like about what Halo 5, Forza 6 and to an extent Guild Wars 2 is that these games offer ways to open packs without spending money.
Microtransaction have impacted game design in this industry. That is a fact. No matter how much you want to brush it off as a conspiracy theory its not. Many games with these Microtransactions are designed to prod players into purchases. Their built around the premise of prolonged gameplay with purchasable shortcuts to bypass the aforementioned unnecessarily elongated portions be it via pointless cooldown timers or tedious grinds.
But this is all besides the point. This thread was about the sudden appearance of cards in so many different genres of AAA game releases. It's a definite trend and it is one I am growing increasingly wary of.
As much as I appreciate you reading what I write I would appreciate it a lot more if you didnt write fan fiction. I created the thread because I've noticed these card systems as a recent trend in AAA gaming. More and more games from all different genres are including cards. This baffled me as they seem out of place in most genres. Somone explained the connection to MTs which makes sense to me and explains the recent trend. I didn't create this thread as some sort of complain thread. It was an actual question: Why are so many non TCG games starting to include card systems? One I wanted to hear people's answer to. If you have a problem with someone asking that question or my personal opinions about the presence of these card systems in certain genres that's fine but don't spout ridiculous claims about my motivations for starting this thread.
KyanMehwulfe
Member
I think cards in general, separate from card games, are just a fun, interesting, cool, and/or addictive way to collect things. It's as much or in some cases even more akin to sports trading cards as card games.
And getting people to buy sports trading cards for a game is... it makes a very, very good RMT or otherwise DLC, microtransaction, etc platform. And it's more palatable... selling a power-up is one thing. Selling a power-up in the form of a cool trading card, or a chance at cooler trading cards, is another.
But in general, cards are a good method to sell microtransactions or do RMT in general because there is some flavour, coolness, art, story, etc in there, too. Again, they're interesting and addictive, in the same way collecting other cards can be.
And getting people to buy sports trading cards for a game is... it makes a very, very good RMT or otherwise DLC, microtransaction, etc platform. And it's more palatable... selling a power-up is one thing. Selling a power-up in the form of a cool trading card, or a chance at cooler trading cards, is another.
But in general, cards are a good method to sell microtransactions or do RMT in general because there is some flavour, coolness, art, story, etc in there, too. Again, they're interesting and addictive, in the same way collecting other cards can be.
Do you honestly think people don't pay for that? If you say so. You could probably play Clash of Clans without buying gems, I do that myself, but I'm not deluded enough to think people don't in general. They buy them, they buy a lot of them.