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Why aren't Character Action Games labeled 3D Beat 'Em Ups?
- Thread starter CO_Andy
- Start date
Off-Kilter
Banned
is GoW a character action game though?
Yes.
beat em ups/hack and slash games are like dynasty warriors or Ninety Nine nights, or the licensed dragonball/naruto games, or Assasin's creed or the batman titles.
They signify something a lot more basic than a 'character action game' like what itsuno or Platinum, or even Santa Monica makes. Even something like Darksiders would apply as 'character action'.
Character action games usually involves far more detailed combos and actual intricate level design, beat em ups are just mashing, usually in simple level design.
Stylish action is a more advanced form of character action and usually reserved specifically for Itsuno and Platinum's type of games. They essentially created that sub genre and the character action genre itself with DMC.
They signify something a lot more basic than a 'character action game' like what itsuno or Platinum, or even Santa Monica makes. Even something like Darksiders would apply as 'character action'.
Character action games usually involves far more detailed combos and actual intricate level design, beat em ups are just mashing, usually in simple level design.
Stylish action is a more advanced form of character action and usually reserved specifically for Itsuno and Platinum's type of games. They essentially created that sub genre and the character action genre itself with DMC.
baphomet
Member
The terms are interchangeable. If its one awful term then its both.
Viewtiful Joe, The Dishwasher, Bleed
It's not like adventure is better, and point & click is a genre already.
shit you're right
I guess all genre names are terrible but Character Action and Adventure are attempts to not sound absolutely god damn silly and I much rather that
Stallion Dan
Member
I wanna know why people call side scrolling brawlers beat em ups, when beat em ups were fighting games.
This anti-hipster mentality is very... fascinating. Not everything is labeled for the sake of "feeling different" jeez.
Beat em ups are usually older games with simplistic mechanics and a score focus, but even a recent game like MadWorld, certainly falls more into the beatemup category rather than character action.
Character/Sylish action games are almost the opposite, their main selling points is mechanics and combat system, and obviously... the character itself.
We use labels to describe different subgenres, or would you say Civilization is the same as Frozen Synapse? They are both strategic games in the grand scheme of things, after all, no?
Yeah. You get the idea.
Beat em ups are usually older games with simplistic mechanics and a score focus, but even a recent game like MadWorld, certainly falls more into the beatemup category rather than character action.
Character/Sylish action games are almost the opposite, their main selling points is mechanics and combat system, and obviously... the character itself.
We use labels to describe different subgenres, or would you say Civilization is the same as Frozen Synapse? They are both strategic games in the grand scheme of things, after all, no?
Yeah. You get the idea.
baphomet
Member
This frustrated me even as a kid. Just people calling anything with fighting in it a fighting game.
Don't only Europeans call fighting games beat-em-ups?
I'm just glad it exists. I don't want to be the one to explain it here though. Debating genre classifications on the internet is a great way to get a headache.
The distinction being "subset".
ftfy. There is no distinct definition.
Germans. Brits also, though they did so only in the last century.
No wonder, they are blurry piles of made-up crap.
I'm not a fan of the name "beat 'em up". Generally I prefer "belt scrolling action game" for the sprite-based ones that take place on, uh, a belt, but I don't have a good name for the ones that don't (typically polygonal). There's definitely an evolution from Final Fight to Dynamite Deka to Dynamite Deka 2 to Spikeout to Devil May Cry, though, and I'm not against calling both Spikeout and Devil May Cry "3D beat 'em ups" for lack of a better parent genre name.
"Character action" and anything with "stylish" in the name are nonsense to me, and the use of those labels feels like a desperate move to differentiate good games in the genre (DMC) with bad ones (Musou). That's the sort of qualitative distinction that leads to arguments like what is and isn't "true survival horror", which is the height of Clown Shit.
"Character action" and anything with "stylish" in the name are nonsense to me, and the use of those labels feels like a desperate move to differentiate good games in the genre (DMC) with bad ones (Musou). That's the sort of qualitative distinction that leads to arguments like what is and isn't "true survival horror", which is the height of Clown Shit.
Jerry Orbach
Member
"Character action game" is a big umbrella. It describes any action game based around a defined character (as distinct from spaceship shooters, for example). Yuji Naka considers Sonic The Hedgehog a character action game (source), and I'm pretty sure Naughty Dogs have talked about Crash Bandicoot / Jak and Daxter / Uncharted in the same terms. "Stylish hard action games" (or "tactical espionage action games", or what have you) are usually "character action games", but not all "character action games" are "stylish hard action games". Make sense?
BakedTanooki
Member
I call that Genre "Extreme Combat"
Because that is what some japanese developers called them in an Interview / Documentary, which i watched a few years ago.
Because that is what some japanese developers called them in an Interview / Documentary, which i watched a few years ago.
Then what genre is Final Fight on the SNES?
bobbychalkers
Member
I think character action works seeing as most people who have heard of the term know what type of games you are referring to when you mention it. 3D beat em ups is too broad as that term would also describe a metric ton of games from all of the Musou games to Sleeping Dogs to Zeno Clash. Stylish action is too limiting because not every game in that genre emphasizes style like Bayo and DMC.
"Shitty Port"
Touche...
I still think that is more an exception to the rule, though. It was obviously not a good thing that the game didn't include multiplayer...
Zen_Arcade
Banned
I think we should just start calling them Combo Action games. All of these games have combat systems that emphasize combos for efficiency right? Are there any games in this genre that don't grade you on how well you keep up combos in your battles?
Sir Ilpalazzo
Member
Depends on what you consider the term "beat-em-up" to mean. If you want it to refer to any game that's primarily focused on combat, sure, it's a beat-em-up. But there are a lot of people who seem to consider God Hand a beat-em-up (and under a separate umbrella from the DMC games or whatever) just because your attacks are visually represented as punches and kicks instead of sword slashes, which is really a meaningless distinction to make.
SixMachine
Member
I only heard the term character action game on GAF, to be honest I thought you guys were trying to make a new genre term for these kinds of games when I first heard it and trying to make it stick. In person and other sites people really just say action game and they seem to know what I'm talking about. No one I met really thinks of Uncharted or anything when I say action game in person. But I know that wouldn't fly on GAF, since this place does seem real pedantic about this stuff.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Where would Wonderful 101 go to
Isn't this a RPG thing?
MightyHedgehog
Member
There's obviously value in coming to some kind of consensus on shorthand, like terms for game genre and gametype classification, if only for the sake of making repeated conversations and general discussions easier to type up, but I think there are reasonable limits to their application that should be respected. The BEU or 'character-action' or action-adventure buckets seem to overlap frequently, so I think they all can be safely considered interchangeable as long as they include a level of added detail to differentiate in a statement. I mean, despite the nitpicky extremes of pedantry that usually crops up on an enthusiast discussion forum, we all generally know what the fuck we're all talking about to carry on in conversations without having to stop and agree to terms used. Personally, character-action just sounds dumb to me and could broadly describe almost all games these days.
Romars202129
Member
Bloodborne is definitely skirting the line, but I still prefer to think of it and the other Souls games as 'Survival Action'.
RelentlessRolento
Member
I'm still wondering where the term "em' up" came from (ie. "beat em up" and "shoot em up")
Modern beat em ups still exist though. Like in the early days they are still very basic where your just hitting people with a very limited set of strings, whereas character action are a far more advanced form with numerous strings and upgrades and a set level design based on engaging a set number of enemies
Moff
Member
I'm not necessarily disagreeing here. but FPS are far more advanced as well, sometimes with upgrades and set level design. but no one would deny that this is still the same genre as doom.
what would be the modern beat em ups? I'd love to play some
Castle Crashers is an excellent modern beat em up.
Yo... I was just thinking about this discussion matter yesterday. I always get weirded out when this happens.
I've always described the likes of Streets Of Rage as "Scrolling Beat Em Ups", Street Fighter as "Fighting game" and what would eventually become known as Character Action as "3D SBEU".
I've always described the likes of Streets Of Rage as "Scrolling Beat Em Ups", Street Fighter as "Fighting game" and what would eventually become known as Character Action as "3D SBEU".
zero shift
Banned
I usually call the games "Hard Action Games". I take it from the comparison of Rock to Hard Rock. As in Hard Action games (i.e. Bayonetta) are similar to action games (God of War) as they mostly focus on the player controlling one character as they take on a barrage of enemies and bosses while mastering a combat system and combos. The difference is that Hard Action games take this to a much more complex degree to the point where mastering the game (and at times completing the game) is a skill itself similar to that of one mastering the mechanics of a fighting game, while simple action games are just merely meant to be played from start to finish as mastering the mechanics is not meant to be an enduring feat.
"Beat-em-up" doesn't equate to games like Devil May Cry, Bayonetta, or Metal Gear Rising due to the fact that beat-em-ups are fairly shallow. There isn't much to master when it comes to the combat or even the mechanics to a beat-em-up. Your not going to find anyone putting up Youtube videos of them pulling off a 100+ hit combo Dragon's Crown, but it is standard for any Hard Action game.
"Beat-em-up" doesn't equate to games like Devil May Cry, Bayonetta, or Metal Gear Rising due to the fact that beat-em-ups are fairly shallow. There isn't much to master when it comes to the combat or even the mechanics to a beat-em-up. Your not going to find anyone putting up Youtube videos of them pulling off a 100+ hit combo Dragon's Crown, but it is standard for any Hard Action game.
Character action is fine by me. The term highlights the 2 most important aspects of these kind of games: a central character with personality and incredible abbilities and gameplay focusing on action. When I hear beat´em up I think of something like Double Dragon/Final Fight/Streets of Rage, when I hear "Hack´n Slash" I think of Diablo and when I hear "Fighting game" I think of SF/KoF/GG.
If you told me 3D beat ´em ups I would think of Musou games, the gameplay is too different between a CA game and a Beat´em Up for them to be distinguished only by the number of dimensions they use. For example, 2D and 3D platformers are both platformers, all the game´s systems in 2D and 3D are analogous, but you don´t get something like this with Beat´em Ups and CA games, there are too many and important differences.
If you told me 3D beat ´em ups I would think of Musou games, the gameplay is too different between a CA game and a Beat´em Up for them to be distinguished only by the number of dimensions they use. For example, 2D and 3D platformers are both platformers, all the game´s systems in 2D and 3D are analogous, but you don´t get something like this with Beat´em Ups and CA games, there are too many and important differences.
lensoftruth
Member
Character action? haha lol, who calls it that?