Well, I'm a registered Republican, believe in a lot of conservative values, and I'm voting Hillary Clinton.
I'm conservative, not insane.
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Why is NeoGAF more far-left compared to most sites/forums?
- Thread starter Wiz
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Well, I'm a registered Republican, believe in a lot of conservative values, and I'm voting Hillary Clinton.
I'm conservative, not insane.
The things I feel like I lean conservative about are minor issues compared to the icon of xenophobia and ignorance that the Republican Party selected as their standard bearer this election.
I might disagree with Hillary on a lot of things, but I at least trust that she has an understanding of issues and an ability to do the job. Maybe if the Republican's put forth a mentally sound candidate a better argument between the policies of the two could be had.
I might disagree with Hillary on a lot of things, but I at least trust that she has an understanding of issues and an ability to do the job. Maybe if the Republican's put forth a mentally sound candidate a better argument between the policies of the two could be had.
Liquid-San
Member
Gaf always came off as leaning more to the left, but OP, ask yourself, is that usually the case? I think it comes across as such recently because we are all seeing Hillary vs Trump, but Trump spews hate. Even as a conservative, you have to realize that the man is irrational. Perhaps if it had been a different candidate, there would be more dissenting opinions and that would incite some more debates, but as things stand, there are two people running for president. One of them basks in saying racist, sexist, etc., remarks almost all of the time to procure people with the same beliefs. It's not hard to see why people would come across as liberals if they oppose what said candidate says, and said candidate was also conservative.
partyphone
Banned
I'm not right or left.
I'm more.....South Park....so I guess I'm South rather than East or West.
X-D
there's a ton of this "both sides are equally bad" bullshit on this site, yeah.
I always figured it was due to it attracting members world-wide and most of the world isnt as conservative are parts of the US. I also dont see it as far left more moderate maybe slight lean to the left. Truth is pre George W Bush most of the right wasnt all that far right, during his reign tea party/Christian conservatives started to move into power and effectively moved conservatism farther right while the left pretty remained the same. Then the new right painted the left as extreme liberalism when it was the right that shifted.
Head of Vengarl
Banned
The fact that people think GAF is far left, when it really isn't at all, is quite interesting.
Wiz
Member
I think Hillary v. Trump has a lot to do with exposing the divide between left and right in American politics. Before, we knew there was a difference but that it was never this stark. With this election - there is like a grand canyon shaped divide between both candidates, and in turn between the American people.
With that being said, how has GAF historically dealt with this divide? I'm talking Obama v. Romney, Obama v. McCain or if you want to go all the way back, Bush v. Kerry (not sure if GAF was around for the 2000 election). I know it's not anywhere close to this year, but you'd have to think that the right leaning candidates still got the short end of the stick when it comes to representation here.
Demographics below the poverty line in the US
17.5 million white
12 million hispanic
10 million black
So in relative numbers black and hispanic groups have it really really bad.
Less than 10% of white but more than 20% of black and hispanic live under the poverty line.
But that raw number of 17 million are losing really really hard and they're looking for someone to blame.
The other groups already have someone to blame, white people and conservatives. But the 17 million poverty stricken whites haven't made any progress either. They are more rural than the other demographics. Far away from safety so they know they have to take care of themselves (guns), far away from government getting into their lives and the government programs that are talked about the most are for the other demographics.
They get more help from churches than they do the government as they see it. The government to them is not something that will benefit them but something that will rob them of what little they have.
Whether this is reality or not doesn't matter, its how that group sees things.
Obama was right when he said they cling to guns and religion. Try bringing up something that I feel is reasonable, black reparations, to a bunch of rural whites below the poverty line and imagine their reaction.
Iorv3th
Member
I would say it's probably because the right and GOP have nobody worth talking about and nothing worth discussing right now. I tend to lean more right but can vote either way.
Right now though, nothing to talk about. Trump is a joke and you are going to find it hard for most people especially those that use sites like this that have a diverse community support someone like Trump.
So it only makes sense you see less posts that are 'right leaning' on political issues. Simply not worth talking about with the idiots they put in office and the stupid things they do/say.
Right now though, nothing to talk about. Trump is a joke and you are going to find it hard for most people especially those that use sites like this that have a diverse community support someone like Trump.
So it only makes sense you see less posts that are 'right leaning' on political issues. Simply not worth talking about with the idiots they put in office and the stupid things they do/say.
Oh hey, yeah I know why they do it, and I have empathy. It's the simultaneous insistence to dwell in hateful imagination, coupled with the petulant demand for ultimate respect for these ideas, that gets to me.
I don't think left or right is necessarily a very meaningful debate (though this here is certainly a technocratic progressive liberal place). I would sooner call NeoGaf very Humanist.
Using the Wikipedia definition for Humanism to illustrate
Looking at the ToS of Gaf we see in terms of critical thinking and rational evidence::
And in terms of human value and calling people out on their own agency:
Using the Wikipedia definition for Humanism to illustrate
Looking at the ToS of Gaf we see in terms of critical thinking and rational evidence::
And in terms of human value and calling people out on their own agency:
ElBoxyBrown
Banned
It's more that GAF is really good when it comes to calling out bullshit racist, sexist, etc. ideology that many people try to disguise as simple right-way thinking instead of entertaining the idea. You can be a Trump supporter and/or Republican but you will get called out and you will get banned if you spread toxic things that go beyond politics. GAF is also one of the rare forums to encourage listening and synpathizing with people who have it worse than you. It's why black culture and feminist topics are handled well here compared to others.
This is probably a big reason. Compared to Europe, the Democrats which represent american left, would be seen as right, thus if you feel like "centre" or even slightly left-leaning in the us, most people from the rest of the world would consider your views rightist, and thus engage in conversation with you from the left.
By the way, i am from Norway, and dont find this board left-leaning at all.
I don't think this is as true as many suspect. The requirement of a non-freemail email address puts a soft floor on the age of GAF members that's higher than the floors on other gaming forums.
I wish this forum was actually farther left. Make a minimum wage, basic income, true universal healthcare, tax raise , and/or gun control thread and you'll see how not far-left this forum actually is.
Yeah, moderation prevents this forum from looking like a Yahoo or Youtube comments section, or 4chan and r/politics when all the alt-right kiddos join in on the conversation, but I don't think that means we're that far-left compared to most sites out there. Just means this forum doesn't tolerate the rampant racism and bigotry those places almost welcome.
But when it comes to actual policy discussion, Gaf ain't far left at all. Not even close. Most people here probably align with Obama/Clinton/Biden/Pelosi/Harry Reid and they are all damn near leaning right from center from my POV.
Yeah, moderation prevents this forum from looking like a Yahoo or Youtube comments section, or 4chan and r/politics when all the alt-right kiddos join in on the conversation, but I don't think that means we're that far-left compared to most sites out there. Just means this forum doesn't tolerate the rampant racism and bigotry those places almost welcome.
But when it comes to actual policy discussion, Gaf ain't far left at all. Not even close. Most people here probably align with Obama/Clinton/Biden/Pelosi/Harry Reid and they are all damn near leaning right from center from my POV.
This might sound shitty but we recently moved from a poorer white school district to a much much more diverse but better funded district. My daughter is the only white girl in her class (majority asian with all other demos sprinkled in)
White poor kids are mean as hell. None of my kids could bring anything non-standard in their lunchbox without being made fun of. Sushi, Cucumber slices, roasted seaweed, hard boiled eggs, rice crackers. It got so bad my kids asked that I not make that stuff or pack it for them, not because they don't like it (those little items are staples for them around the house) but because they'd get made fun of every single time.
We had lots of bullying issues at their old school.
New place doesn't have any of it. Classrooms are far better behaved. My kids don't get made fun of for bringing non-standard lunch food, parents are more involved and there is a lot more peer assistance built into how the classrooms are run.
My only real problem is I can't spell anyone's name when my 5 year old comes up with a list of people to invite to her birthday. I'll have to talk to her teacher.
crimzonflame
Member
Like you, I also signed up in my early 20's and was very immature. If it wasn't for the constant fear of getting banned from NeoGAF, who knows what kind of person I would have become?
This must be a relief, as a parent. I'm glad there's less tension
A Link to the Past
Banned
Not the direct subject of the thread, but I really do hate the notion of the right not interfering with social lives. They do that shit ALL the time. :|
Isn't one of core ideas of the Republican Party "minimal interference of an individual's life"?
And "small government"?
Yet everything they seem to be doing run counter of those things...
There's a lot of putting words in people's mouths on this site too. GTFO here.
I don't like either candidate, and that's a perfectly acceptable opinion that I'd respect as you should too.
I didn't say they were equally bad, but I also will NOT vote for either leading candidate. K
If you want more logical discourse religion is going to have to die out more in the US.
I say that, but Brexit seems to indicate it isn't just relgiosity.
Problem is that the rhetoric/propaganda that various conservative movements have used has ended up becoming the main voice of the movement itself. Theres no reason why conservative ideals cant live in a strictly moderated place...the problem is that your bigots, your sexists, youre racists throw on a cloak of conservatism as if its a those are viable political belief as opposed to just good old hatred.
Like police brutality posts tend to be a graveyard of banned posters . We can discuss conservative solutions to the problems that lead to years of neglect and as a result bad relationships between the police and the community. But when a poster hops in on, Yeah, the dude that got shot in the head stealing a candy bar is a criminal and deserves what he got! has very little to do with traditional conservative values but is a hodgepodge of bias and just general apathy towards life.
I also give respect to the moderators. I used to moderate a pretty popular music site and id have to thread the line
I would love to hop in a forum and read/debate about conservative values that doesnt traffic in that hate unfortunately over time its become one and the same for those that like to debate/discuss on the internet
Like police brutality posts tend to be a graveyard of banned posters . We can discuss conservative solutions to the problems that lead to years of neglect and as a result bad relationships between the police and the community. But when a poster hops in on, Yeah, the dude that got shot in the head stealing a candy bar is a criminal and deserves what he got! has very little to do with traditional conservative values but is a hodgepodge of bias and just general apathy towards life.
I also give respect to the moderators. I used to moderate a pretty popular music site and id have to thread the line
I would love to hop in a forum and read/debate about conservative values that doesnt traffic in that hate unfortunately over time its become one and the same for those that like to debate/discuss on the internet
The only reason right leadership cares about social issues at all is due to the fact that their base votes based on anger about it, especially given the collapse of public perception of Republican economic policy. It's relatively easy to manipulate people's inherent bias instincts to dehumanize gays, single mothers, immigrants, etc.
Stoke paranoia and anger about social issues enough and you can make people vote against their economic interests. Then, give this money to corporate interests who will reinvest in your election campaign. Repeat.
Guileless
Temp Banned for Remedial Purposes
Logical discourse like a recent thread here about Pope Francis? A selection of the posts:
"Pope Francis can go fuck himself."
"Somebody should shove his stupid hat down his throat."
"Saying someone's the best pope is like saying 'that's the best dog shit I found on the street, at least compared to that previous dog shit'.
"The pope can just fuck right off."
"Yeah well you believe in ghosts you goofy old fuck."
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Such a good collection of tolerant posts.
lostsupper
Banned
GAF is a safe space. Triggers are banned.
Then it's another example of why GAF leans left
The young and irreligious probably aren't very conservative.
But you're right, I usually attribute Gaf's intolerance of religion as an attribute of their youth. Hopefully they'll grow out of it. I have more hope for them than I do for protestants and evangelicals engaging with their religion in a culturally healthy way.
A Link to the Past
Banned
What? People were mad at the Pope because he said something shitty, not because he's a religious figure. Tolerating bigotry is not required. The fact that he is EVER called "good Pope" demonstrates that an implicit bias against religion does not exist to the same degree that people claim.
ChosenPredator
Banned
I feel most people are afraid to be banned if they openly want to express themselves on here, maybe thats why it seems it's mostly far-left.
GeordieMark
Member
Those kind of posts aren't particularly insightful, useful, or of any value to discussion. It's just noise, and pretty much shit-post territory. That's why they got called out here. You don't have to be tolerant of bigotry to see that.
A Link to the Past
Banned
There are many, MANY posts that have done nothing to contribute to threads in the past. In this case, these are people replying to some pretty serious bigotry by the Pope by expressing their frustrations, and I'll just be here playing the world's smallest violin for someone making a bigoted statement catching people's ire, especially when what the Pope says influences people and puts people at risk as a direct result.
I wonder how much examination of one's ideas occurs after seeing such fervent pushback and consequence for these ideas' expression, particularly when the feedback comes specifically from those who these ideas expressly target.
If "open expression" means "say racist, sexists, homophobic, etc etc. stuff", they deserve to be banned and are right in staying silent. No decent human being can defend those in any reasonable way.
EDIT Arguing for right-wing stuff that isn't anything like that is completely OK, if people can keep it civil. But to me it seems those positions tend to count as centrist nowadays...
And GAF isn't really far left. I can't recall seeing many anarchist comments (which are pretty much far left if not extremists), nor anything supporting (leftist or right-wing) authoritarianism or forms of marxism, leninism etc., or other actually far-left stuff. Radical greens like Greenpeace or radical animal rights activists are also very rare. IIRC, PETA tends to gain comments like "Fuck PETA".
The latter positions are more of emotional things, while GAF in general is proponent of fact-based things, hence centre-left attitudes.
ViewtifulJC
Banned
Did you see that "Who here is voting Trump?" thread? Anybody admitting to being a republican gets tarred and feathered.
A Link to the Past
Banned
That this happened does not indicate an inherent desire to tar and feather, but rather that being a Republican is creating a higher threshold for justifying your own views.
Darkangel
Member
Neogaf as a website has an official left-wing stance when it comes to social issues.
If you say something that is socially conservative then you will probably get banned (e.g. "I don't consider trans-women to be actual women"). I don't think the community is necessarily left-wing bias when it comes to economics, but the heavy moderation has sort of created an environment where right-wing ideology is generally discouraged.
I think most members who lean to the right just don't post about it (though there's usually some kind of debate going on in every political thread).
If you say something that is socially conservative then you will probably get banned (e.g. "I don't consider trans-women to be actual women"). I don't think the community is necessarily left-wing bias when it comes to economics, but the heavy moderation has sort of created an environment where right-wing ideology is generally discouraged.
I think most members who lean to the right just don't post about it (though there's usually some kind of debate going on in every political thread).
Seriously! I see so many people say that no one wants to talk about right wing ideas and it's like
HAVE YOU SEEN WHAT YOU GUYS ARE TALKING ABOUT
partyphone
Banned
yeah. asking for a reasonable republican policy position is met with either silence or a complete misunderstanding of what "reasonable" means.
Acidote
Member
If a sort of democrat mindset is what you call the 'USA left', then you have a point. That would be considered right (and even close to financial far right) in Spain. But I'm sure there is a real non-lunatic left in USA even if it's minoritary.
Then you would have grown up to be a Frey.
Also you can totally shit on either conservative public figures or non- individual specific conservatives with almost violent amounts of rhetoric and not get called out or even warned.
In a mass shooting thread you can probably call for all concealed carry license holders to be summarily executed and not get your ass a time out. I have been personally called a murderer in some of those threads.
There were some posters advocating violence against whites as part of the venting in some of the recent protest/riot thread related to police shootings and black lives matter.
In a mass shooting thread you can probably call for all concealed carry license holders to be summarily executed and not get your ass a time out. I have been personally called a murderer in some of those threads.
There were some posters advocating violence against whites as part of the venting in some of the recent protest/riot thread related to police shootings and black lives matter.
A Link to the Past
Banned
Myup. I recall being a conservative was a bit more acceptable back in the 2008 election; inevitably though, if you stick with the party whose political views are growing more extreme, people are going to ask you why, and it's not going to get any easier to give a good answer.
Wait, what? What are you referring to specifically?
partyphone
Banned
*theatrically clutches pearls*
Was this the thread where the Pope showed how stupid he was on the matter of transgendered people?
A person in an unfortunately high position of respect and power shouldn't be allowed to say dumb fucking shit and get away with it. Religion allows this far too often.
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