Back-In-Black
Banned
I'm sorry, is there another developer out there making an RPG series where your choices carry over into future games and have weight? Enlighten me.
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Why the bad vibes on Mass Effect Andromeda?
- Thread starter Caipirinha
- Start date
I'm sorry, is there another developer out there making an RPG series where your choices carry over into future games and have weight? Enlighten me.
Oh boy lol
Bioware clearly needs to include more fathers who go on a chain of meandering busywork quests (that could be resolved using their abilities in a second) to save their super saiyan daughters who can literally move planets through space by force of will alone.
facetheslayer92
Member
Thank you, I will try this.
Fruitster
Member
A lot of the ill will for Andromeda does seem to come from the confused marketing approach that EA/Bioware are taking this time around. We just haven't seen enough of it in action, the core systems and so on. I get this odd vibe that Bioware are just reluctant or nervous about discussing the game in depth. No doubt their games attract a curiously poisonous fanbase at times, but saying little about a game only a few months from launch makes people suspicious about why.
Just put the game out there and let people see it in action.
Just put the game out there and let people see it in action.
ViewtifulJC
Banned
You're saying bioware does this???
elrechazado
Banned
Define carry over.
Fruitster
Member
I give kudos for Bioware for trying that, very tricky to pull off I imagine. It didn't work out as well as it could have but there we are. I doubt anyone will try such a thing again either. That approach caused more grief than i'm sure Bioware ever could have forseen.
Yeah, well, when they decided to do that (pretty much at the start of both their series) they had different objectives. ME1 and DA:O were done by a different Bioware, that's kind of my point.
My assessment and use of the word is in regards to their latest efforts, which were full of compromise and bad decisions. The development and culmination to both the Geth and Genophange storylines is the most I'll give them and were certainly the better part of ME3, but none of that had any weight at all, especially after how that game originally ended, so I'm not sure you even have a point there.
Triggerhappytel
Member
This is pretty much it I think, but point 3 is the main one for me. The marketing so far has been absolutely awful and nothing they have shown has looked at all compelling. I also find it odd (and somewhat suspicious) how secretive - or should that be reluctant - they have been in showing it.
Big Green Anus
Member
I'm not as anticipated for a new Mass Effect game as I thought I was going to be. Looks okay so far 
MisterShine
Member
There are three big ones for me on this
me1: Virmire survivor. Each one takes a different role in the series going forward (what little they are in ME2) and reacts differently to what you do.
me2-3: If you 'mess up' choices in ME2 with the Geth & Tali, in ME3 it is impossible to achieve peace. One of them must be exterminated and will result in the deaths of at least one party member.
me1-2-3: The krogan. Depending on how you handle Wrex and Mordin (and whether they survive their respective games) will change the fate of the Krogan in a few possible ways. Basically, they head toward extinction, stay roughly where they are but pissed at the galaxy, or are cured and find new hope.
The Artisan
Member
inclusivity?
i'm not a newcomer to bioware games. i played the ME games. first 2 which i fell in love with, then 3 which i hated, then 1, because i played on Ps3. mass effect 3 was critically acclaimed which I thought was dumb, but reviews are supposed to reflect the product, see street fighter 5, no man's sky, etc.
i would argue a downward trend with ME, but that only started with Me3, which was the end of an era for this series as Me4 isn't supposed to have anything to do with the original trilogy. but I wouldn't be surprised if it continues the downward trend started by the 3rd game.
can't speak on da, i tried inquisition but couldn't vibe with it but my general thought was that, well i thought it was considered good overall. not amazing, but not every game can be a masterpiece.
Back-In-Black
Banned
They have and still do, just because ME3 ended horribly doesn't change the fact that they tried and continue to do it as evidenced by Inquisition. First, just because the ending of ME3 negated everything you did before doesn't mean that the entire time before that your choices had an effect on ME3. This included who was alive, which affected how many party members you actually had available, as well as everything to do with both the Tuchanka and Rannoch mission arcs.
But, let's talk about the more recent example of DA: Inquisition. Here are just a few decisions that carry over and are shown within the game (DAI SPOILERS!!!):
-Whether or not the Hero of Ferelden is alive. This allows for numerous dialogue discussions about him and allows for a War Table mission to contact him.
-Whether the Hero slept with Morrigan and/or went with her through the Eluvian. The game accounts for these many variables such that Morrigan either had her kid with Alistair, Loghain, or the Hero. And, further whether she is essentially married to the Hero or lived apart from whichever lover. The game further adds conversations between Morrigan and whichever partner if you the Hero didn't sleep with her.
-Whether Alistair is King or not. Alistair shows up as King in the Redcliffe/Mage quest and proceeds to have several War Table missions afterwards if the player made him King in Origins. If he's not King and alive from Origins then he is the Greywarden the player meets with and travels with for the whole Adamant Fortress plot line.
-Whether Loghain was killed or not. The same as above, if Loghain was kept alive in Origins he becomes the Grey Warden the player contacts and travels with for the whole Adamant Fortress/Grey Warden plot line.
The Adamant Fortress/Grey Warden plot is pretty impressive as it essentially calls for three separate voice actors and full in-game models to account for all the player's world-states due to Origins. This also includes separate dialogue between the characters (Alistair, Loghain, Stroud) to explain what they've been up to. I could go on.
So, tell me what developer does that kind of reactivity? Not even god-tier Witcher 3 gave two fiddles about what you did in the past games. Why is Roche fighting Redania? Last I checked he had joined up with Redania in TW2 after I have Foltest's bastards to Radovib after having previously married Foltest's incest born daughter to him in TW1.
Spartancarver
Member
After ME3, I don't think even bioware fits this description. Define "have weight"
Hasphat'sAnts
Member
O please.
Mordin's fate is determined by choices you made in both ME1 and ME2. Just because the ending is dumb doesn't mean that choices don't have consequences.
OK, so you understand that critical reception doesn't have to align with your personal opinion and not every game can be a masterpiece, even though DA:I's GOTY status is being used as some sort of metric of how the game was great or whatever.
I think we are on the same channel here, just arguing semantics. When people consider them average it doesn't mean incompetent, just average. They've production values and budget and voice acting and all other sorts of things that I'm sure will show up in Andromeda. Like others have explained better before, there's just an apprehension about what the final product can be.
Spartancarver
Member
But the endings literally took all the weight away from the previous choices. Maybe leading up to the endings it felt like the choices had some weight, sure. Endings wiped it all away
And for the record, I'm planning on buying Andromeda. I'm just being more cautious about it after ME3 and DAI
The Artisan
Member
yeah i think i understand where you're coming from, see the thing is with video games I guess because it is such an expensive hobby, sometimes it feels like there's no middle ground i.e average, just really good or really bad.
that's irrelevant though. to get back to your point, yes perhaps by this explanation, all the factors going into the product which will be Me4 makes it "average", but what made ME so huge was the unique powers in the shooter gameplay, and the character interaction; that's after all what made the outcry in Me3's ending because everybody gives a shit about the characters.
same will go for Me4 now since they're starting over. as for dragon age 3, I didn't pay much attention to the press honestly and I know how it got some goty shit, I didn't think too much of it but if you're implying that it got goty because 2014 was meh and da3 doesn't really deserve it, I don't blame you
First conversation changes from "Hello" to "Hello I think we've met before".
TatteredHat
Member
It'll probably be fine, I'm expecting it to be very safe in terms of the design decisions they're making which is why I'm not really interested in it.
Yup another reason that Bioware are singular for me, noone comes close. Even their latest game had carried on choices that held weight to me.
RadAndrew502
Member
I loved DA:I
I loved all Mass Effect games.
I will love this game.
I loved all Mass Effect games.
I will love this game.
It's made by them.
Really though, their latest titles have gone further and further towards "Meh" territory in recent years. Mass Effect 3 had a absolutely devastatingly stupid ending that just ruined everything the series had built up to. Dragon Age: Inquisition was poorly ported to PC with dumb controls, boring combat, uninteresting story and antagonist. Bioware just don't have the same power in terms of writing anymore, one of the most important aspects of a good RPG.
Sure, we can celebrate some of their characters like Garrus or Alistair and say they are great, but then Bioware really fucking misses the door with characters like Sera and you just wanna repeatedly punch yourself for putting up with their shit cause you wanna try to achieve "the best ending".
God I fucking hated her.
I don't have high expectations for Andromeda, some of the gameplay bits looked cool but that is as far as I can go, "it looks cool". Without substance it will all be just looks though and nothing to it.
FIREKNIGHT2029
Member
^ ^ This. I'm definitely gonna day one it.
IcyRhythms
Member
People keep using that gif(can't lie, it does looks poorly done. nothing that would keep me from buying though)with her taking the gun away. If it's one thing I've learned in life, don't take a small piece of a picture and try and claim you know everything about something.
God I fucking hated her.
I honestly found it pretty fun to play the Inquisitor as absolutely condescending towards her, while still gaining her approval. But yeah, I know many have problems with her, she's a rather divisive archetype.
Theslammer
Member
Mass Effect 3 had the best gameplay of the series and an abundance to do, plus had one of my favorite DLCs ever (Citadel). Hell, the ending to Citadel is a bit emotional considering the journey you've had with these characters.
Yes, I get how ending it with a few main choices left a portion of the fans sour. Totally understand, though the extended ending added some weight to the last mission, especially that "leave" dialogue depending on who's in your party (or watching
).
But I was pretty overwhelmed once I got to the end of ME3 and the extended cut, so by that alone, I'm looking forward to Andromeda. I definitely wish we could see much more and I'm surprised we haven't, so I'm a bit more cautious with my optimism.
Yes, I get how ending it with a few main choices left a portion of the fans sour. Totally understand, though the extended ending added some weight to the last mission, especially that "leave" dialogue depending on who's in your party (or watching
them die if you haven't accumulated enough points
But I was pretty overwhelmed once I got to the end of ME3 and the extended cut, so by that alone, I'm looking forward to Andromeda. I definitely wish we could see much more and I'm surprised we haven't, so I'm a bit more cautious with my optimism.
Alpha Phoenix
Member
DAI is the reason I'm slightly meh.
Same could be said of DA:I DLC. All three packs were exceptionally designed with the final epilogue playing out similarly to Citidel in ME3. Lots of callbacks to content across the entirety of the franchise, wrapped up many loose ends that pissed off many in vanilla DA:I, and also set up the next game rather nicely.
Still, it came way too late(nearly a year) and the damage was already done. Particularly most also disliked the combat and questing in vanilla beyond the story issues.
The Artisan
Member
I disagree with the popular opinion that Me3 had the best gameplay and also don't care for the citadel dlc, after having learned that it is just another pre ending dlc I found the whole premise to be stupid
Back-In-Black
Banned
Why is it good writing to like every character in the game and have them in turn like you? I found Sera to be a great character because I hated her simplistic views and she was stubborn enough to never change them, you know like a real person. I don't want every companion character waiting suck my my character's virtual cock. I prefer complex characters with their own motivations and ideals. Sera is her own person, you can either like what she stands for or hate her and she will in turn judge you based on your ideals and decisions.
Theslammer
Member
There's nothing ME1 does better gameplay-wise. Sniping is far more difficult simply because it doesn't feel as good to snipe, the cover system is better in 3, rushing is better in 3, shooting is better in 3.
Then the RPG mechanics: it also brings back more of the depth of the RPG mechanics in 1 but trims the fat, giving you lots to upgrade but in a more user-friendly way.
It sounds like you didn't play the Citadel DLC?
I don't have to -like- the character as in them being on my side in every conversation in order to be a good written character. Yeah, I also like characters with motivations, ideals, personalities, I still I find Sera grating to my senses as nails on a chalkboard however in the same way as much as I hated Vanille in FFXIII.
I love characters like O'Dimm and Olgierd from The Witcher 3, even though I loathe what they stand for, because they are well written characters.
The Artisan
Member
I should have clarified that I thought Me2 had the best gameplay. Also yeah, I did not play citadel after learning what it was and I still don't have the desire to play it because it still leads to shit ass ending
edit: also I only played Me1 once since it took its sweet ass time coming to Ps1, but I just remember the gameplay being annoying with the guns recharging instead of reloading
Blackthorn
"hello?" "this is vagina"
I loved Inquisition and if it wasn't for The Witcher 3 it would be easily my favourite RPG this gen so far. I don't feel any need to pit them against each other though (I'm not sure what I'd gain from that) and I enjoy them both for different reasons.
I enjoyed the characters, sense of responsibility and progress, lore (I typically can't stand RPG lore) and themes of Inquisition. If they can exceed those aspects in Andromeda while stripping away some of the filler then I see no reason it wouldn't be great.
I enjoyed the characters, sense of responsibility and progress, lore (I typically can't stand RPG lore) and themes of Inquisition. If they can exceed those aspects in Andromeda while stripping away some of the filler then I see no reason it wouldn't be great.
Back-In-Black
Banned
Sera is also well written. And, comparing her to Olgierd makes no sense when he's a smarmy bastard, you're supposed to like his charismatic manner which then conflicts with his cold hearted nature.
Alpha Phoenix
Member
I think it's worth noting that the reason DAI won GOTY has more to do with luck and timing than anything else. When the game was released, the generation had yet to see a big RPG. The Witcher 3, for instance, was still months away. I feel that contributed majorly to DAI winning in spite of its mediocrity.
Boobahzone
Member
Bioware's characters have become so predictable to the point of trying to guess their specific quirk at first introduction. Don't worry if you can't though, they're all so willing to share their issues at the drop of a hat. Its like none of the characters can prioritize things anymore and just have to let it all out immediately. I feel like a therapist eveytime I talk to some of them.
eot
Banned
I think ME2 has better gameplay. It's great to replay, whereas I was tired of ME3 after my first play through.
ViewtifulJC
Banned
the narrative that ME1 was good needs to END
no matter what Andromeda ends up, it cant be worse than ME1's tedious inventory management, and janky awful combat, and the goddamn Mako, and the three tubberware warehouses it reused for mission environments
no matter what Andromeda ends up, it cant be worse than ME1's tedious inventory management, and janky awful combat, and the goddamn Mako, and the three tubberware warehouses it reused for mission environments
Back-In-Black
Banned
FTFY.
If being such an annoying cunt that I wanna catapult her repeatedly onto the castle walls of my Inquisitional fortress was the purpose then I guess good job Bioware?
And I don't like Olgierd for his charisma only, it was his development, the slow character building that truly made him shine into a great antagonist. The hidden side to his evil that was not apparent at first but slowly made you sympathise with him.
Theslammer
Member
2 doesn't do anything better in the gameplay department. Rushing is worse, cover was pretty similar (maybe a bit improved in 3), sniping wasn't as good (though it improved on 1). And the RPG elements are really dumbed down for some reason. It's a pity because the gameplay's certainly better than 1, but 3 takes the best of both and refines them for a better overall experience.
Plus, scanning planets, though not a bad idea on paper, was in 2, and that was a bit worse than exploring planets. When I replay 2, scanning planets for resources is not something I'm most looking forward to. It's not the worst thing I've done, and I'm never like, "God, I hate this game," but it certainly was a strange gameplay element to spend a good chunk of the game doing.
Mechanics in ME3 were better, but the enemy encounters themselves fatigued me.
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