Support NeoGAF

[Red Crayon Aristocrat]

You know what was a huge missed opportunity? An all new Mario game for the GBA in the vein of Metroid Fusion and The Legend of Zelda: Minish Cap.

Instead all we ever got was ports, while there was something like that on DS obviously with New Super Mario Bros, I would have liked to see something done with the GBA's gorgeous 2D instead of the DS's meh 3D.

In my mind's eye I can picture an all new Mario on GBA so clearly, it's just a shame it didn't happen.

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

Because Nintendo (Miyamoto, specifically) doesn't like 2D Mario.

It wasn't until the huge success of NSMB (skyrocketing the DS's sales) and the more-huge success of NSMB Wii (skyrocketing the Wii into the Most Consoles Sold In One Month World Record) that Nintendo woke up to the profitability and thirst for 2D Mario.

 

[Red Crayon Aristocrat]

Because Nintendo (Miyamoto, specifically) doesn't like 2D Mario.

It wasn't until the huge success of NSMB (skyrocketing the DS's sales) and the more-huge success of NSMB Wii (skyrocketing the Wii into the Most Consoles Sold In One Month World Record) that Nintendo woke up to the profitability and thirst for 2D Mario.

Didn't like 2D Mario in the 2000s or has never liked 2D Mario? Because that doesn't make any sense, where have you heard that?

 

[JoeyWestSide]

Superstar saga?

 

[Red Crayon Aristocrat]

Superstar saga?

Which was an RPG, I'm talking a platformer.

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

Didn't like 2D Mario in the 2000s or has never liked 2D Mario? Because that doesn't make any sense, where have you heard that?

The former. I think once he made a 3D Mario game, he was uninterested in making more 2D Mario games. He's said in multiple interviews that he believes 3D Mario is the "norm" now. Notice how NSMB series was handed off to the younger, no-name producers and directors at Nintendo. Miyamoto's name isn't even on most of them (though to be fair, he has been stepping back from directing/producing).

I would say it seems to be a cultural thing at Nintendo. Aonuma seems to despise the action-adventure roots of Zelda and has been trying to mold the Zelda series into PuzZelda. Sakamoto seems to despise the challenge and obscurity of old Metroid games and has been trying to mold the Metroid series into Sci-Fi Linear Anime Narrative since he remade the first game (Zero Mission).

 

[Gavin Stevens]

I will never understand why Nintendo don't just make a new Mario World, with these graphics:

Am I just insane or what? The NSMB art is AWFUL... Just use the damn cartoons you already made as a base...

 

[Werewolf Jones]

Am I just insane or what? The NSMB art is AWFUL... Just use the damn cartoons you already made as a base...

No you're right. Art style for NSMB is literal garbage.

Never really felt the need or desire for a 2D Mario on GBA after playing Wario Land 4 when I was a kid. Also never noticed there wasn't one made. lol.

 

[AV]

Super Mario Advance was a remake of 2, but it was the only place you could play that remake as far as I know. I guess that kinda counts?

 

[Yoshi]

Aonuma seems to despise the action-adventure roots of Zelda and has been trying to mold the Zelda series into PuzZelda.

Puzzles have been a fundamental basis for Zelda gameplay since ALttP though, and are an action-adventure staple. So I do not think this statement makes much sense.

EDIT: By the way, what some people do not know, the GBA did get six new levels in a Mario game though. Super Mario Advance 3: Yoshi's Island has six good new levels. Also, Super Mario Advance 4: Super Mario Bros. 3 got a whole game worth of new levels, which can now conveniently be played on Wii U.

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

Puzzles have been a fundamental basis for Zelda gameplay since ALttP though, and are an action-adventure staple. So I do not think this statement makes much sense.

I'm not implying they should be absent. Aonuma himself said that the original Legend of Zelda was too hard to complete and that he prefers the more open-world/exploration of LttP. When the designer of Zelda cannot beat a game that children were able to beat on the NES, and when his Zelda titles are all fairly easy (in terms of combat and danger) that should tell you something.

I think this explains why the series has continued to skew towards puzzle-solving and gimmicks (even to the point where combat itself became a puzzle/gimmick in Skyward Sword). This appeals to an audience that is not necessarily the same audience that fell in love with the old Legend of Zelda titles.

You and I have different viewpoints on the franchise. I think in another thread you mentioned how you loved the Divine Beasts in BotW while I pretty much hated them. I see this as a difference in tastes, nothing more, so don't take this as "disagreement" per se. In the same way that 3D Mario ruled the roost until Nintendo brought back 2D Mario, I think it's okay that "challenge Zelda" makes a return since we've had plenty of "PuzZelda" for the past 20 years.

 

[#Phonepunk#]

i actually like NSMB art style but agree they've been doing it for so long it's time for something new. from the sound of things, a new 2D art style is what they are working on.

 

[Yoshi]

You and I have different viewpoints on the franchise. I think in another thread you mentioned how you loved the Divine Beasts in BotW while I pretty much hated them. I see this as a difference in tastes, nothing more, so don't take this as "disagreement" per se. In the same way that 3D Mario ruled the roost until Nintendo brought back 2D Mario, I think it's okay that "challenge Zelda" makes a return since we've had plenty of "PuzZelda" for the past 20 years.

Love is a bit overstated, I liked them the most of BotW, but found them much inferior to the dungeons and puzzle areas in older Zeldas. That being said, I have no issues with more challenge in Zelda games, but it should not be to the detriment of puzzles. Zelda 1 is not even a very difficult game by the way, it just is more obtuse due to very limited text and missing a proper map.

 

[Starlight Lotice]

You know what was a huge missed opportunity? An all new Mario game for the GBA in the vein of Metroid Fusion and The Legend of Zelda: Minish Cap.

Instead all we ever got was ports, while there was something like that on DS obviously with New Super Mario Bros, I would have liked to see something done with the GBA's gorgeous 2D instead of the DS's meh 3D.

In my mind's eye I can picture an all new Mario on GBA so clearly, it's just a shame it didn't happen.

Superstar Saga was amazing! What are you talking about "No 2D Mario.

Spoiler

Just kidding.

 

[petran79]

. Zelda 1 is not even a very difficult game by the way, it just is more obtuse due to very limited text and missing a proper map.

One reason I could not beat it was that it was impossible to find the red ring in the last level, even after searching for hours. Even after playing the game years later on Nesticle, I stumbled onto the same issue and had to use save states. Though I had borrowed the game, so did not have too much time to look for the ring.
Zelda 2 on the other hand was a breeze.

Compared to Ys I Dark Fact, nothing in Zelda comes close though.

 

[Space Runaway]

Possibly because they didn't have to. They pretty much just did enhanced ports for the entire GBA run until they ran out of old titles and had to create a new title. Even then that still wasn't until after they did a Mario 64 enhanced port for DS as well.

 

[Flapples]

Best Game ^

 

[Spukc]

Best Game ^

shit OP GOT R E K T

best frikking mario game on the gba too

 

[Codes 208]

Best Game ^

This right here (as well as the GOAT yoshi's island and SMB3 getting a gba port) is why I never complained why we never got a gba Mario.

Also to continue the subject, NSMB and NSMBW weren't bad. But then they just kept making the same game, the same art, the same characters/enemies over and over again and they've gotten so lazy that the switch didn't even get its own, they just ported the Wii U version to it. It's disgusting.

NSMB in general is trash.

 

[StormCell]

You know what was a huge missed opportunity? An all new Mario game for the GBA in the vein of Metroid Fusion and The Legend of Zelda: Minish Cap.

What new opportunities did GBA present for them to do with Super Mario Bros. that they hadn't already explored on SNES with Super Mario World and Yoshi's Island? Once they were able to fully realize Mario 64, there was nothing new brought to the table by N64 or GameCube for a new 2D Mario, and that's why I think they took a break until NDS. Even now, the games are more targeted at nostalgia and reliving the 2D style than pushing the envelope.

Frankly, I've been playing through SMB3 again, and there's still nothing that compares. I would never say that about NSMB games. The magic has not continued.

 

[Red Crayon Aristocrat]

Super Mario Advance was a remake of 2, but it was the only place you could play that remake as far as I know. I guess that kinda counts?

I thought it was just a port of Super Mario All Stars version of 2, but I guess it was a little different.

Even so it was still a remake of 2 rather than all new game.

Puzzles have been a fundamental basis for Zelda gameplay since ALttP though, and are an action-adventure staple. So I do not think this statement makes much sense.

EDIT: By the way, what some people do not know, the GBA did get six new levels in a Mario game though. Super Mario Advance 3: Yoshi's Island has six good new levels. Also, Super Mario Advance 4: Super Mario Bros. 3 got a whole game worth of new levels, which can now conveniently be played on Wii U.

Yes, said GBA ports had new things about them, but they were still remakes of already existing games, I'm talking a from the ground up new Mario.

Best Game ^

I really don't have to keep explaining I'm talking about a platformer, do I?

Superstar Saga was great, but it was a different genre of game than what I'm talking about.

What new opportunities did GBA present for them to do with Super Mario Bros. that they hadn't already explored on SNES with Super Mario World and Yoshi's Island? Once they were able to fully realize Mario 64, there was nothing new brought to the table by N64 or GameCube for a new 2D Mario, and that's why I think they took a break until NDS. Even now, the games are more targeted at nostalgia and reliving the 2D style than pushing the envelope.

Frankly, I've been playing through SMB3 again, and there's still nothing that compares. I would never say that about NSMB games. The magic has not continued.

Reinventing the wheel would not be the point, just bringing back some of that SNES style, just like Metroid Fusion was in the vein of Super Metroid and Minish Cap in the vein of A Link To The Past.

An all new GBA Mario in the vein of Super Mario World would have been cool.

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

Technically, you could count the Super Mario Bros 3 eReader extra levels as unique to the GBA.



I don't think it qualifies for what the OP is asking for, but it's certainly closer than M&L Superstar Saga.

EDIT: here's a screenshot. It's a nifty mishmash of Mario mechanics.

 

[EverydayBeast]

If you go back to that era Nintendo was focused on the Cube (Mario Sunshine, Lugi's Mansion etc)

 

[JimboJones]

If you go back to that era Nintendo was focused on the Cube (Mario Sunshine, Lugi's Mansion etc)

Yeah, the DS the first handheld generation to sort of turn heads that the handheld market could actually be the main focus or at least get as much focus as the consoles. Especially in Japan at least.

 

[Jubenhimer]

To understand the problem, we need to look at the developers who were behind 2D Mario, Nintendo EAD. EAD had not developed a single GBA game through out the system's entire lifespan. The GBA's Mario Kart? That was done by Intelligent Systems. The Super Mario Advance Ports? Those were handled by Nintendo R&D2. Mario Vs. DK, the closest thing to an original Mario Platformer on the system? That was Nintendo Software Technology. None of the GBA's first party games had any involvement from EAD. This is because Nintendo at the time was a much more silosed company than it is today. Each division of Nintendo was responsible for their own consoles, and almost never had development kits for other Nintendo platforms. EAD had the burden of propping up the GameCube themselves, while R&D1 and Intelligent Systems were left to carry the GBA. This is also why Nintendo brought in Treasure to develop WarioWorld for the GameCube as R&D1 didn't have a GameCube development kit. It wasn't until Iwata came into the picture that he started breaking this silos down, and encouraged departments to actually share their technology with each-other.

The Nintendo DS was the first Nintendo mobile platform that had serious input from EAD both in hardware and software.

 

[EverydayBeast]

Yeah, wasn't the DS the first handheld generation to sort of turn heads that the handheld market could actually be the main focus or at least get as much focus as the consoles. Especially in Japan at least.

Yeah, DS was really good at setting up Nintendo for its future (Bulk of games being exclusive, innovative ect)

 

[Northeastmonk]

We will never have the feather and the cape back. They want to add every single power up beyond imagination, but no feather.

 

[hecatomb]

I think its too late to bring up GBA, since they don't make games for it anymore. New super Mario for DS is one of the best Mario games though. Though you can get Mario vs donkey kong, its about as close as you can get.

 

[FStubbs]

The former. I think once he made a 3D Mario game, he was uninterested in making more 2D Mario games. He's said in multiple interviews that he believes 3D Mario is the "norm" now. Notice how NSMB series was handed off to the younger, no-name producers and directors at Nintendo. Miyamoto's name isn't even on most of them (though to be fair, he has been stepping back from directing/producing).

I would say it seems to be a cultural thing at Nintendo. Aonuma seems to despise the action-adventure roots of Zelda and has been trying to mold the Zelda series into PuzZelda. Sakamoto seems to despise the challenge and obscurity of old Metroid games and has been trying to mold the Metroid series into Sci-Fi Linear Anime Narrative since he remade the first game (Zero Mission).

Now all we get are shinier versions of New Super Mario Bros Wii, a 10 year old game. 3D Mario gets new games like Odyssey. You're on point with the rest of it.

 

[Aren117]

I think its too late to bring up GBA, since they don't make games for it anymore. New super Mario for DS is one of the best Mario games though. Though you can get Mario vs donkey kong, its about as close as you can get.

Mario Vs Donkey Kong was sooo good. Damn, I should replay this and the GB version of Donkey Kong sometime.

Too bad the series took a nosedive from there.