Late last week we discovered a gaming message board called Neogaf where they were crowd-sourcing funds to buy die photos of the multi-chip CPU/GPU package in the Nintendo Wii U. They had raised enough to purchase top metal die photos of the CPU, the GPU and the tiny NOR memory chip.
To a manufacturer of said chips, these types of top metal die images are useful, but for the purposes of analyzing the specifications, you need to go a little lower and look at the polysilicon layer. Rather than have the community continue to raise money, we thought we would step-in and help out. Since (at the time of publication for this blog) we are only 1 day away from the release of Dead Space 3, we thought that the gaming community might be able to put their funds to better use.
Someone's going to have to explain what it means to me lol.
They beat me to the punch! Was in the process of putting together a new thread with the image after a quick analysis. This was the surprise that we were hinting at - you all get to see the die with your own eyes. Also, they did it free of charge so those who contributed will be refunded shortly.
They beat me to the punch! Was in the process of putting together a new thread with the image after a quick analysis. This was the surprise that we were hinting at - you all get to see the die with your own eyes. Also, they did it free of charge so those who contributed will be refunded shortly.
They beat me to the punch! Was in the process of putting together a new thread with the image after a quick analysis. This was the surprise that we were hinting at - you all get to see the die with your own eyes. Also, they did it free of charge so those who contributed will be refunded shortly.
So awesome.To a manufacturer of said chips, these types of top metal die images are useful, but for the purposes of analyzing the specifications, you need to go a little lower and look at the polysilicon layer. Rather than have the community continue to raise money, we thought we would step-in and help out. Since (at the time of publication for this blog) we are only 1 day away from the release of Dead Space 3, we thought that the gaming community might be able to put their funds to better use.
Major kudos to Chipworks!
So I'm guessing it's good?
So, can you provide extra informations ?
Very different from what we were expecting. At first glance, there appear to be significantly less shaders and significantly more custom/legacy logic than expected.
Major kudos indeed!
Very different from what we were expecting. At first glance, there appear to be significantly less shaders and significantly more custom/legacy logic than expected.
Several people are already in the process of analyzing.
So fewer shader units for programmable/compute shaders and more for fix function shaders? Just guessing.
So fewer shader units for programmable/compute shaders and more for fix function shaders? Just guessing.
Which would make it almost impossible to compare it to the Orbis/Durango gpus?So, at the end we will get an ultra customized design. If we can know how many shaders there are, at the very best we will have the ABSOLUTE MINIMUM performance of the GPU.
Now we could be in front of a 150-200 GFlops GPU of flexible and programable power, plus the customized functions.
significantly less shaders
Actually, looking at Nintendo's history, everything that wasn't in Wii will be disabled in Wii mode, not the other way around.Judging from Nintendo's history of hardware level 'perfect' emulation, I'd wager the entire hollywood logic is embedded in the CPU. And probably disabled when not in Wii mode.
Will be GAF's entire takeaway from this.
Just a prediction.
I'm pretty frustrated with how little we still know too. Every new APple product has gotten its chip looked at under a microscope, for a gaming console the details are perhaps even more relevant (for some, at least). It would be easy for someone like Chipworks to at least tell us how many shader units and how much eDRAM is in the GPU for instance, and a bit about the CPU. All we know right now is clock speed and memory bandwidth, with a decent guess at core count (3 all but confirmed at this point).
About the eDRAM: Is the consensus here that both the CPU and GPU have their own dedicated pools? 3MB eDRAM, cache for the CPU, 32mb for the GPU is what I keep hearing, but I can't find official mention of both having some.
I wonder if they can talk to the other chips eDRAM pool quickly, that would make for some interesting programming. Ie, if the GPU didn't need all of its 32MB, the CPU could use it as an extended L3 cache or at the least a scratchpad. I think the GPU will be using most of that anyways though, I think it's just big enough to fit one 1080p buffer or one 720p buffer with 4x AA in it.
May I suggest a series of polite emails from a few of us to Chipworks to check the chips?
Fourth Storm said they're analyzing it, I think they're going to post the new thread when they're done.someone should post a new thread with this info. Please guy stop with "Can the next gen game run on wiiu?". That is not the point of this thread. It to talk about the tech behind the wiiu.
someone should post a new thread with this info. Please guy stop with "Can the next gen game run on wiiu?". That is not the point of this thread. It to talk about the tech behind the wiiu.
Huge props to this guy and the people that sent the emails/money. VERY COOl!!
Yes. At the end, Orbis and Durango will be more "future proof" in the sense that they will have much more raw power to run anything that is thrown at them, so if new algorithms are discovered they could be implemented in more volume.Which would make it almost impossible to compare it to the Orbis/Durango gpus?
They beat me to the punch! Was in the process of putting together a new thread with the image after a quick analysis. This was the surprise that we were hinting at - you all get to see the die with your own eyes. Also, they did it free of charge so those who contributed will be refunded shortly.
So, at the end we will get an ultra customized design. If we can know how many shaders there are, at the very best we will have the ABSOLUTE MINIMUM performance of the GPU.
Now we could be in front of a 150-200 GFlops GPU of flexible and programable power, plus the customized functions.
Isn't this a bit presumptive considering we don't know for certain what kind of custom logic will be found in durango/orbis?On WiiU on the other hand, there will be certain effects that will be done almost for free thanks to the custom logic, so it will be MUCH MORE effective at running those algorithms than Durango or Orbis, but outside of those, the raw power of the GPU may be at the same level of the Xbox 360 (maybe lower, or maybe a bit higher).
So much for it being a stock R700...
If they were aiming at having ports from the new console and appealing 3rd party i don't know how good this would be sincerely but if they are trying to do their own thing then it's goodIn any case, I think it's not a bad choice to go this route.
Isn't this a bit presumptive considering we don't know for certain what kind of custom logic will be found in durango/orbis?
Yes die area, but Hollywood isn't all that big or power hungry, shrunk down, it would be fairly small... what they are talking about though is that the 12GFLOPs Wii had, could do next gen lighting AND other effects without touching the programmable shaders at all.I'm confused as to how fixed-function is free. Its still die area taken up for less
I know: auto-aiming chip, brown colorz chip, corridor DSP, Anonymous ARM proc' (Sony exclusive), AGPU (Adverts GPGPU, 720 exclusive). Nintendo: Mario DSP and Duct taped Gamecube chip. Laugh DSP (Nintendo exclusive).Isn't this a bit presumptive considering we don't know for certain what kind of custom logic will be found in durango/orbis?
People are going to wish it was a stock r700. The system is not so unbalance as I first thought.
I know: auto-aiming chip, brown colorz chip, corridor DSP, Anonymous ARM proc' (Sony exclusive), AGPU (Adverts GPGPU, 720 exclusive). Nintendo: Mario DSP and Duct taped Gamecube chip. Laugh DSP (Nintendo exclusive).
Fourth Storm, you can keep my $20 for the analysis and leg work. Buy yourself a steak or something.
People are going to wish it was a stock r700. The system is not so unbalance as I first thought.
Fourth Storm, you can keep my $20 for the analysis and leg work. Buy yourself a steak or something.
Be nice, USC-fan. This is going to be a tough pill to swallow for many if my first impressions are correct. But I'm not saying anything until I have verification from a more knowledgeable source.
Be nice, USC-fan. This is going to be a tough pill to swallow for many if my first impressions are correct. But I'm not saying anything until I have verification from a more knowledgeable source.
Be nice, USC-fan. This is going to be a tough pill to swallow for many if my first impressions are correct. But I'm not saying anything until I have verification from a more knowledgeable source.
Uhoh
Hey ! Weren't you that guy claiming there'll be no changes, just a R700 GPU ? I guess anyone can do mistakes
should we be excited? lul