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[Bobby Roberts]

Whether the linked articles are true is tangential to the question at hand.

No, it isn't, because the answer to the question is actually contained in the articles that are presented as support.

Basically, if the linked articles don't matter, then you shouldn't have linked them. But they do matter, of course, because they answer the question you just fuckin' asked

No. Marvel isn't going to cut off its nose to spite Fox. The publishing division needs to make money. X-Men makes them money. They don't have to carry Fox's water to help their box-office reciepts, but they do have to carry their own, and there are bad business decisions, and there's wiping out some of your best known characters who are guaranteed sellers and have been for DECADES.

You don't even have to think about it that hard even IF the relevant stories weren't linked in the OP.

No. They won't do it.

Between this and the stupid ASM3 rumor thread yesterday, I'm wondering why it is people aren't even attempting to apply a modicum of thought to the stories they're reading before they start an entire thread pre-destined to go nowhere because the foundation they're trying to build from has all the consistency and stability of a fuckin cowflop.

And then these are often the same people who yell about how you can't believe everything you read. Well of course you can't. It's on you to pay attention to people who aren't talking shit all the time. You stare all day into a cow's ass, of course you're gonna think everything is full of crap.

 

[Deleted member 13876]

They won't. The ultimate line and DC itself have shown that reboots don't work and cause more problems than they solve. Marvel is NEVER getting rid of 616. NEVER.

If the Ultimate line is considered a failure, they've been investing in that failure for over a decade. At the moment, Bendis aside it does seem to be a place to stick lower tier talent. I fully agree however if your point is that the Ultimate universe reboot Ultimatum was a grave mistake.

 

[Gartooth]

They won't. The ultimate line and DC itself have shown that reboots don't work and cause more problems than they solve. Marvel is NEVER getting rid of 616. NEVER.

as for getting rid of mutants, this is nonsensical. The whole point of AVX was to better integrate the mutant teams and everyone else, and books like Uncanny Avengers and New Warriors go out of their way to show that mutants are going to be on equal footing and better integrated with the wider marvel universe going forward.

This makes absolutely no sense at all if you've been paying attention to what the books are doing.

Agreed about 616 staying, I'd be absolutely shocked if they threw out their history like that.

Your comments about mutants makes a lot of sense. My skepticism is just coming from that quote from Tom Brevoort where he mentioned that if you have the time to work and develop properties, wouldn't you prioritize those that you get 100% of the profits on.

Considering that there was ever a chance that X-Men/Fantastic Four would be cancelled was pretty naive of me, but I doubt Marvel is looking to give them the spotlight or build upon those series due to movie issues.

 

[Manmademan]

Marvel universe is convoluted with mutants in them. It always struck me as weird that so many super-powered people are loved in that universe, but mutants are feared by huge parts of the population for some reason. The idea of x-men disappearing forever would be disappointing but I wouldn't mind seeing them separated from the rest of marvel at all.

Mutants are feared while captain America and iron man are not, because the X Gene is genetic, mutants breed, and a certain segment of humanity is concerned they'll be replaced over time and become a sub class....which is not entirely off base as there are futures where this has happened.

Spider man isn't as scary if anyone can be bitten by a spider and get powers. Iron man isn't scary if anyone with enough money gets a super suit.

An "idiocracy" scenario where you may wake up and everyone around has extra powers except you because you don't have the right genes IS.

not that hard. No one likes inhumans for the same reason.

 

[Mariolee]

Only if you skipped the last paragraph.

What? Your OP is needlessly misleading. I would suggest you edit out the article completely.

Edit: Lol that thread title change.

 

[richiek]

http://m.neogaf.com/showthread.php?t=828979

Rob Liefeld was right.

 

[Manmademan]

If the Ultimate line is considered a failure, they've been investing in that failure for over a decade. At the moment, Bendis aside it does seem to be a place to stick lower tier talent. I fully agree however if your point is that the Ultimate universe reboot Ultimatum was a grave mistake.

The ultimate line is really, really struggling compared to the mainstream lines right now sales wise. It's also just as if not MORE laden down with continuity problems than 616, meaning that it's original intent of being an easy jumping on point for new readers brought in by the movies is now pointless.

 

[DonasaurusRex]

They won't. The ultimate line and DC itself have shown that reboots don't work and cause more problems than they solve. Marvel is NEVER getting rid of 616. NEVER.

as for getting rid of mutants, this is nonsensical. The whole point of AVX was to better integrate the mutant teams and everyone else, and books like Uncanny Avengers and New Warriors go out of their way to show that mutants are going to be on equal footing and better integrated with the wider marvel universe going forward.

This makes absolutely no sense at all if you've been paying attention to what the books are doing.

Yeah the book line is separate from the movies , they gotta sell online subs , and its proven that book readers will go see whatever the hell they want because no matter the situation of licensing, we have been reading and enjoying all the chars of the marvel U and will see what we like. They wont sway long time readers from their previous stances , and non readers dont give a crap...so why try this.


Like you said AvX was to reel the xmen in to the marvel U proper and better integrate mutants with other areas of the 616 since they had become a sub world unto their own.

 

[bjork]

In the comics, did Marvel every do anything with Scourge? They could have Scourge kill off whoever. Justice is served!

 

[gazele]

Mutants are feared while captain America and iron man are not, because the X Gene is genetic, mutants breed, and a certain segment of humanity is concerned they'll be replaced over time and become a sub class....which is not entirely off base as there are futures where this has happened.

Spider man isn't as scary if anyone can be bitten by a spider and get powers. Iron man isn't scary if anyone with enough money gets a super suit.

An "idiocracy" scenario where you may wake up and everyone around has extra powers except you because you don't have the right genes IS.

not that hard. No one likes inhumans for the same reason.

Pretty sure normal people don't know that spiderman was bit by a radioactive spider, i don't see why they shouldn't think he's a mutant, the hulk either

Mutants don't make sense in the Marvel Universe period, but I doubt they would ever take them out at this point

 

[SillyEskimo]

Marvel/Disney would never do this in a million years. I find it hard to believe people actually thought this might possibly be true.

 

[Deleted member 13876]

The ultimate line is really, really struggling compared to the mainstream lines right now sales wise. It's also just as if not MORE laden down with continuity problems than 616, meaning that it's original intent of being an easy jumping on point for new readers brought in by the movies is now pointless.

I know, but for a long time it did work. The continuity laden thing doesn't bother me that much. It's bound to happen at some point. While its original purpose may have been lost a lot of people have grown up with USM and are still invested in the universe. Will also note a lot of the now successful movies have lifted elements from the Ultimate universe, so that's another benefit of maintaining it for so long.

 

[Malyse]

Edit: Lol that thread title change.

I would at least like the mods to be able to spell things correctly.

 

[DonasaurusRex]

Pretty sure normal people don't know that spiderman was bit by a radioactive spider, i don't see why they shouldn't think he's a mutant, the hulk either

Mutants don't make sense in the Marvel Universe period, but I doubt they would ever take them out at this point

...huh

you gonna take out the inhumans, eternals, and deviants too?

 

[Gordon Shumway]

Marvel Topic!!!

 

[Tyrant Rave]

They won't. The ultimate line and DC itself have shown that reboots don't work and cause more problems than they solve. Marvel is NEVER getting rid of 616. NEVER.

Not sure but isn't DC's market share better now than it was before the reboot?

 

[enzo_gt]

Sounds just as bullshit as the last rumour we had for them locking out Spider-man and X-Men properties, which was, of course, completely bullshit.

Bullshit.

 

[ReAxion]

Like you said AvX was to reel the xmen in to the marvel U proper and better integrate mutants with other areas of the 616 since they had become a sub world unto their own.

AXIS is doing the same thing in October.

 

[Zen_Arcade]

I highly doubt that this is true. It wouldn't make any financial sense for Marvel and would totally screw up books where mutants crossover.

 

[DeathyBoy]

I know, but for a long time it did work. The continuity laden thing doesn't bother me that much. It's bound to happen at some point. While its original purpose may have been lost a lot of people have grown up with USM and are still invested in the universe. Will also note a lot of the now successful movies have lifted elements from the Ultimate universe, so that's another benefit of maintaining it for so long.

The second Bendis leaves USM, Ultimate Line is going bye-bye.

I mean I'm pretty sure he takes a substantial pay-cut just to write it, given the sales are aggressively average.

 

[gazele]

...huh

you gonna take out the inhumans, eternals, and deviants too?

I'm just saying, there's no reason for people to be afraid of mutants and not the other heroes, so yeah people should be afraid of those guys too, although i don't think you'd lose much by taking any genetically manipulated population out

 

[richiek]

Marvel/Disney would never do this in a million years. I find it hard to believe people actually thought this might possibly be true.

X-Men will match If not exceed ASM2's domestic box office, meaning lots of eyeballs, but there are no toy tie-ins. The Fox shut out is real.

It's not $$$$ that matters in this strategy, it's the hearts and minds of kids/toy buyers, not-too-subtly communicating what's "important"

Cap 2 toys & ASM2 toys everywhere, X-Men - zippo. No promotions from toy aisles. Starve those properties. Makes X-Men comeback impressive!

No emotion in these facts/reporting, it's just numbers and business. But the messages are clear.

X-Men DOFP toys would get in the way of upcoming Guardians of the Galaxy onslaught of toys.

Bottom line, it's a ballsy move to downgrade properties with high profile, big budget support in favor of stuff you control wholesale.

Gotta respect it. And equal respect to those properties slugging it out without equal support across multiple platforms.

Marvel Disney ain't getting the Xmen film rights anytime soon. So they're going to make sure there are no ancillary tie ins that would benefit Fox, in an attempt to starve them out, which they are doing by discontinuing the FF comic.

 

[wildfire]

http://m.neogaf.com/showthread.php?t=828979

Rob Liefeld was right.

So if true the motivation is about the residuals. Children's parents only have so much money so creating Xmen toys would be competing with MCU toys. I'm sure this logic extends to other property but regardless Marvel wants more money.


The original rumor makes it clear will know this is true in 1-2 years when the reboot begins after that Axis arc. This isn't really outlandish considering what DC tried to do with their multiple reboots.

 

[- J - D -]

Sounds farfetched, but it is fascinating and I have a morbid curiosity just to see the aftermath. It'd be dumb but very audacious.

 

[StalkerUKCG]

If marvel was this unhappy with foX-Men wouldn't the power house that is Disney just give them a shed load of money to change the contract and/or buy the rights back.

 

[Malyse]

I'm just saying, there's no reason for people to be afraid of mutants and not the other heroes, so yeah people should be afraid of those guys too, although i don't think you'd lose much by taking any genetically manipulated population out

Since when has racism ever made sense?

.

 

[Zen_Arcade]

I'm just saying, there's no reason for people to be afraid of mutants and not the other heroes, so yeah people should be afraid of those guys too, although i don't think you'd lose much by taking any genetically manipulated population out

There are plenty of people who are weary of Spider-Man and the Hulk in the comics. One of the common themes for Spider-Man is people misunderstanding his actions and JJJ slandering his name as a hero.

 

[Dr.Acula]

Stupid. If anything the movies draw interest for the comics, toys, games, and other revenue streams for Marvel that are not movies. They've just shot themselves in the foot if they believe killing the X-Men is going to hurt Fox more than themselves.

 

[Deleted member 13876]

The second Bendis leaves USM, Ultimate Line is going bye-bye.

I mean I'm pretty sure he takes a substantial pay-cut just to write it, given the sales are aggressively average.

Certainly possible. Ultimate FF got cancelled really quickly, but then it was really bad in a lot of ways. Had some minor redemptive qualities but not enough to sustain the book.

 

[Pai Pai Master]

Marvel Disney ain't getting the Xmen film rights anytime soon. So they're going to make sure there are no ancillary tie ins that would benefit Fox, in an attempt to starve them out, which they are doing by discontinuing the FF comic.

I think that has more to do with poor FF book sales? I haven't read the new run but hasn't the FF property, in comics, been struggling since Hickman's run ended?

I don't believe this one bit - FF maybe but X-Men is such a huge property I do not see Marvel killing what, 5-6 books?

I'm just saying, there's no reason for people to be afraid of mutants and not the other heroes, so yeah people should be afraid of those guys too, although i don't think you'd lose much by taking any genetically manipulated population out

The idea is that in the public perspective, the rise of mutants directly correlates with the fall of humanity. This wouldn't be such a persistent belief if people like Magneto didn't spend DECADES shouting from the rooftops that he was going to end humans and give mutants their day. Magneto finally comes down and then things eventually go to absolute shit, and the mutant race is nearly extinct - until Iron Man fucks things up for everyone yet again and sets the Phoenix loose at a time when the fate of the mutant race is at its most volatile.

Damage is done but in the end, new mutants are popping up all over the world, and Scott Summers has apparently taken on the role of Magneto from years past. He's as directionless as anyone, but his gut tells him to start gathering new mutants and he's shouting the word "revolution" all over TV and the internet. Steve Rogers has to put together a special Avengers/X-Men superteam to boost book sales/salvage the public perception of the new mutant situation, but Scott Summers is still out there doing his thing and dangerous supervillains are gaining power and followers in their cause to wipe out the mutant race once and for all.

Basically, the mutant "problem" in the comics is as bad as it's been in a very long time, after things seemed to be okay for humanity as a species for a while. Mutants present a very specific threat to people when they look at it from the perspective of one race is facing a clear evolutionary disadvantage. In there eyes, these aren't just people who gain superpowers and will join the Avengers and protect them. These are once-humans who are ascending to a new evolutionary status and leaving the rest behind to die.

 

[Patryn]

If marvel was this unhappy with foX-Men wouldn't the power house that is Disney just give them a shed load of money to change the contract and/or buy the rights back.

Fox would demand a ridiculous amount of money that Disney would never be able to justify.

Remember that Fox has perpetual rights to the X-Men so long as they keep churning them out, and they're making bank. So we're talking possibly north of $100 billion.

 

[DonasaurusRex]

I'm just saying, there's no reason for people to be afraid of mutants and not the other heroes, so yeah people should be afraid of those guys too, although i don't think you'd lose much by taking any genetically manipulated population out

people were afraid of mutants because their powers arose in their lives. hit close to home type deal and they are a population not some incident or exception

Hulk came about as a military accident and people are afraid of him, Spiderman was a research lab incident and he hides it, he's in out and gone to most and he's one person, and yes the population is split on him. Captain America was an experiment so again the avg citizen doesn have to deal with that and yes historically the people have been split on cap. Same goes for Iron Man which is all tech so its different but some people trust him...others don't even that made it into the movies. Thor is the same, hes the "reason" for phase 2 in the movies.

Youd be hard pressed to find a hero regardless of how they got their powers that hasn't had bad press, PUnisher, DareDevil , Namor, GR...the only beloved heroes are the FF4

 

[DrFaustPhD]

Mutants are feared while captain America and iron man are not, because the X Gene is genetic, mutants breed, and a certain segment of humanity is concerned they'll be replaced over time and become a sub class....which is not entirely off base as there are futures where this has happened.

Spider man isn't as scary if anyone can be bitten by a spider and get powers. Iron man isn't scary if anyone with enough money gets a super suit.

An "idiocracy" scenario where you may wake up and everyone around has extra powers except you because you don't have the right genes IS.

not that hard. No one likes inhumans for the same reason.

Fair point. Keeping in mind that most other super-heroes have powers that were acquired would affect public perception quite a bit. Still wouldn't mind seeing the properties separated though, X-men has more than enough to stand on its own imo. Not that I really think it'll happen...

 

[EatinOlives]

X-Men is one of Marvel's most iconic IP. The only reason why they'd do this is to throw a temper tantrum that they don't have the movie rights to the X-Men series, but to permanently kill off iconic characters like Wolverine just because they don't have the movie rights sounds incredibly childish and not at all plausible.

 

[ReAxion]

which they are doing by discontinuing the FF comic.

They're dumping a book that doesn't sell.

Wolverine sells, therefore there's Death of Wolverine: Legacy and the others related to the death event.

 

[Wazzy]

I'm just saying, there's no reason for people to be afraid of mutants and not the other heroes, so yeah people should be afraid of those guys too, although i don't think you'd lose much by taking any genetically manipulated population out

Well like I said, it does kind of make sense in that mutants are people born with powers while superhero's are people given powers which humans might see as controllable while the other is unknown.

.

I also mentioned earlier how spiderman is treated with mixed reception so it's more the hero's that are presented as more human are considered fine while mutants aren't.

 

[Malyse]

.

I also mentioned earlier how spiderman is treated with mixed reception so it's more the hero's that are presented as more human are considered fine while mutants aren't.

Well Spidey's a bit of a special case, no? He has a paper specifically gunning for him.

 

[Patryn]

people were afraid of mutants because their powers arose in their lives. hit close to home type deal and they are a population not some incident or exception

Hulk came about as a military accident and people are afraid of him, Spiderman was a research lab incident and he hides it, he's in out and gone to most and he's one person, and yes the population is split on him. Captain America was an experiment so again the avg citizen doesn have to deal with that and yes historically the people have been split on cap. Same goes for Iron Man which is all tech so its different but some people trust him...others don't even that made it into the movies. Thor is the same, hes the "reason" for phase 2 in the movies.

Youd be hard pressed to find a hero regardless of how they got their powers that hasn't had bad press, PUnisher, DareDevil , Namor, GR...the only beloved heroes are the FF4

I believe the public loves Cap as well, simply because he came up as part of the system and from a government that people trusted. They see him as this living legend and an honorable person who works from within the system.

Remember that his Steve Rogers identity is basically common knowledge too, so he's not hiding anything.

I think people have said that he's seen as the closest thing to Superman in the Marvel universe in terms of adoration.

 

[Schweinehund]

Sounds pretty crazy. Would this be like the first marvel reboot ever? I don't read marvel comics but as I understand it they don't do reboots, only retcons, and any different universe is usually its own label.

 

[Mac the KNife]

Came back for the title change.

 

[Mr. Poolman]

Such change on the status quo would be refreshing.

But isn't Wolverine like the most popular Marvel character? he was even turned into an Avenger to bank on this.

 

[DonasaurusRex]

AXIS is doing the same thing in October.

The xmen are already spread out all over the marvel U now

before they were very bottle necked in their own sub U. I can open some avengers books or new warriors and see some xmen/mutants

AXIS is going to be the red skull being an evil bastard as usual.

 

[Wazzy]

Well Spidey's a bit of a special case, no? He has a paper specifically gunning for him.

Sure but that doesn't change the fact he's not as accepted as every other superhero like Iron Man and Captain America.

The point is that people are willing to be more accepting of something they understand compared to something they don't. They'll see people like Iron Man and Cap as hero's who were created and thus can be controlled. You can't control mutant genes.

 

[Malyse]

Such change on the status quo would be refreshing.

But isn't Wolverine like the most popular Marvel character? he was even turned into an Avenger to bank on this.

That would be Spider-man.

 

[slightconfuse]

-wolverine is dying next month . It's called death of wolverine

-Hickman has something crazy planned for the marvel u. Looks like some flashpoint style universe

-X-men are not being canceled .

 

[DonasaurusRex]

I believe the public loves Cap as well, simply because he came up as part of the system and from a government that people trusted. They see him as this living legend and an honorable person who works from within the system.

Remember that his Steve Rogers identity is basically common knowledge too, so he's not hiding anything.

I think people have said that he's seen as the closest thing to Superman in the Marvel universe in terms of adoration.

People do love cap, but not always , and he has dropped the title as well because he agreed with them. I said historically because every character has been on ups and downs with the public.

The original Xmen as X-Factor were given a ticker tape parade in NYC at one point and were openly known as a Government funded mutant response team. Shit Ice Mans racist dad couldn't ever shut up about it , his son was a mutant a proud X man that has saved the world, but his japanese gf was a no go amazing. So its gone both ways people have loved and feared the characters depending on the story.

 

[DonasaurusRex]

That would be Spider-man.

wolverine was the most popular at that time though if there were a top 5 of the last 20 years it wouldn't be insane to say wolverine is on top.

 

[Patryn]

People do love cap, but not always , and he has dropped the title as well because he agreed with them. I said historically because every character has been on ups and downs with the public.

The original Xmen as X-Factor were given a ticker tape parade in NYC at one point and were openly known as a Government funded mutant response team. Shit Ice Mans racist dad couldn't ever shut up about it , his son was a mutant but his japanese gf was a no go amazing.

Wasn't that when X-Factor was masquerading as a mutant-HUNTING team?

 

[Malyse]

wolverine was the most popular at that time though if there were a top 5 of the last 20 years it wouldn't be insane to say wolverine is on top.

Spider-Man is an international icon. There's no Japanese* or Indian Wolverine. Literally the whole world knows him.

*well, no specifically remade Japanese

 

[jstripes]

Sounds farfetched, but it is fascinating and I have a morbid curiosity just to see the aftermath. It'd be dumb but very audacious.

Yup.

It's not likely, but I wouldn't say it's outside the realm of possibility.

I do wonder what it would be like if they put the franchise to bed for a few years...