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[WIRED] The inside story of the Xbox One X

B

Blobbers

Member
people: "graphics don't matter"
me, an intellectual: "on the contrary, they're the key to gaming finally being accepted as an art form"
 
D

Dabanton

Member
shandy706 said:
Some of the things in that article are downright fascinating.

That Sound Chamber for example. Very cool.
Click to expand...

The dream killer is hilarious

betting on a new technology that few can afford carries inherent risks. That’s why Microsoft has the Dream Killer. “It’s where we break designers’ hearts,” says principal design manager John Snavely, one of the leads on the redesign of the Xbox software interface. Hidden away in a side room, the Dream Killer is a reminder to all engineers and designers that many gamers don’t have the latest technology, even if they’re happy to shell out on a new console. “It’s a TV we should’ve thrown away a long time ago. It’s awful. We put a lot of time into making sure our content looks good on the Dream Killer,” Snavely says.
Click to expand...
 
I

Irminsul

Member
This article is really funny. What is especially astonishing is how it manages to get the most obscure things wrong in such a laser-guided way. For example, there are tons of examples for systems that aren't backwards compatible. Even in recent history. So what does the article come up with?

”Why can't you put your entire Atari 2600 catalogue into your ColecoVision?,"[...]
Click to expand...

Well, let's consult Wikipedia.

Expansion Module #1 makes the ColecoVision compatible with the industry-leading Atari 2600, with some exceptions. Functionally, this gave the ColecoVision the largest software library of any console of its day. The expansion module prompted legal action from Atari, but Atari was unable to stop sales of the module because the 2600 could be reproduced with off the shelf parts. Coleco also designed and sold the Gemini game system, which was a clone of the 2600, but with combined joystick/paddle controllers.
Click to expand...

1920px-colecovision-epoum8.jpg
Click to expand...

It's just such a weird, obscure little detail to get wrong. Or maybe that Microsoft engineer wants to tell us that cross-play against the will of a platform holder should be okay, who knows.
 
S

shandy706

Member
Dabanton said:
The dream killer is hilarious
Click to expand...

Haha, yeah.

There's a lot of really neat and interesting things in that article.

I found the OP really bad, and it's a shame people aren't reading the article for the interesting stuff in it.

... Or at all based on some of the reactions.

It does have its moments where it feels like the writer doesn't quite understand some of the things, haha.
 
C

Complicated

Banned
I love articles that look at people with titles like psychoacoustician. The weird details that go into consumer products that get worked on for months and years are always interesting.
 
Fredrik

Fredrik

Member
In the former document archives of a Seattle-based insurance firm lurks the quietest room in the world. The human ear can hear down to zero decibels. Here, the sound of silence has been measured down to negative 20. “Welcome to the world of quiet,” whispers Gopal Gopal, a diminutive, middle-aged psychoacoustician working for Microsoft’s Devices division. As he closes the door, Gopal’s voice changes. I’m suddenly aware of the blood flow in my head. My ears ring and I swallow hard, as if rapidly descending from altitude. He’s standing beside me, but Gopal’s voice is struggling to pass through the air.

To get this quiet, you’ve got to go to extreme lengths. The entire room, which was designed by Gopal, is cut off from the rest of Microsoft’s Building 87 and suspended on 63 giant springs. An air gap surrounds it and the walls are so thick that were a jumbo jet to take off outside the door, the sound inside the chamber would barely be louder than someone speaking. “It’s a floating chamber,” Gopal says, bobbing on the spot and directing my gaze towards the floor. Beneath our feet is a see-through mesh of steel cables, the same kind used to snare fighter jets landing on aircraft carriers. I look down, peering at the cones of sound-absorbing foam that continue into the gloom. The lights and sprinklers are also designed to ensure as little noise is reflected as possible.This room alone – Microsoft’s Redmond campus has more than 20 chambers with varying degrees of quietness – cost more than $1.5 million (£1.2m).

It’s here, in his temple of silence, that Gopal measures the noise made by computer fans. “There’s no such thing as a fan sound. There are different kinds of fan noises,” he says, smiling and moving his hands through the unpleasantly silent air for emphasis. “Power supplies make humming sounds. LEDs make humming sounds. When you’re playing a game and the fan heats up, it makes sounds. It is when we get quieter that we begin to hear those things.” To measure sound, he continues, you need to take readings in absolute silence. “A room like this offers an absolutely controlled environment. Any time a sound is made, it’s reflected by the surfaces around you. This cuts out the internal reflections, so our measurements are pure.” With an incredibly accurate measurement, you can make incredibly small adjustments.
Click to expand...
This is actually really interesting. I've done CD/MP3/Flac sound quality comparisons in a room like this at the University. It's the coolest thing and it's 100% true that you can hear your own pulse. Freaky.
I just wish they would've mentioned something about the noise level because so far I've seen zero reports about how loud this thing is.
 
D

Dabanton

Member
Fredrik said:
This is actually really interesting. I've done CD/MP3/Flac sound quality comparisons in a room like this at the University. It's the coolest thing and it's 100% true that you can hear your own pulse. Freaky.
I just wish they would've mentioned something about the noise level because so far I've seen zero reports about how loud this thing is.
Click to expand...

The X1 still astonishes me how quiet it is. I'm hoping it retains that level of near silence.
 
S

Servbot24

Banned
jbug617 said:
could it be that the people who work at Xbox are proud of their new product? I mean it must of been a shitty time to have people shit on Xbox One before it came out and throughout the years.
Click to expand...

There's proud of your product and then there's "The experience and emotions tied to listening to Kid A are like witnessing the stillborn birth of a child while simultaneously having the opportunity to see her play in the afterlife on Imax".
 
Fredrik

Fredrik

Member
Dabanton said:
The X1 still astonishes me how quiet it is. I'm hoping it retains that level of near silence.
Click to expand...
I hope so too, especially since I plan to use it as a UHD Bluray player. But the small size combined with the power makes me worried...
 
T

The Last One

Member
”There's no such thing as a fan sound. There are different kinds of fan noises," he says, smiling and moving his hands through the unpleasantly silent air for emphasis. ”Power supplies make humming sounds. LEDs make humming sounds. When you're playing a game and the fan heats up, it makes sounds. It is when we get quieter that we begin to hear those things."
Click to expand...

maxresdefault.jpg
 
H

Head.spawn

Junior Member
Fredrik said:
This is actually really interesting. I've done CD/MP3/Flac sound quality comparisons in a room like this at the University. It's the coolest thing and it's 100% true that you can hear your own pulse. Freaky.
I just wish they would've mentioned something about the noise level because so far I've seen zero reports about how loud this thing is.
Click to expand...

After Xbox One and Xbox One S, my expectations are a bit high. For a device that is on the majority of my waking hour on a daily basis, it's putting in lots of work and is pleasant to have in the room. Not like my small 360, when I'm trying to watch a DVD movie and it sounded like someone was trying to land a jet in my room.
 
D

Dabanton

Member
family_guy said:
I hope so too. However if it's like PS4 Pro then unpatched games will be virtually silent and One X supported games might be a bit loud.
Click to expand...

Yeah after having a friends PS4 OG for a while, I was shook as that thing was noticeably loud but my PS4 Pro is very quiet thankfully even running games like HZD.
 
E

Everlya_Apocryha

Banned
I know they are supposed to hype up the system prior to release but jeez.....knock it down a bunch. This is an updated console, not Schindler's list or Ann Frank's diary....what's up with the feels...lmao
 
D

Dabanton

Member
Head.spawn said:
After Xbox One and Xbox One S, my expectations are a bit high. For a device that is one the majority of my waking hour on a daily basis, it's putting in lots of work and is pleasant to have in the room. Not like my small 360, when I'm trying to watch a DVD movie and it sounded like someone was trying to land a jet in my room.
Click to expand...

Yeah my X1 is the media centrepeice of my living room. I like knowing that I could leave it on all day and it will run quietly.

I still get flashbacks of trying to late night game on my OG 360 and PS3
 
J

Jakoo

Member
I thought the actual manufacturing bits about the care and thoughtfulness they are putting into the hardware's feel itself was really interesting with regards to the fan noise and look of the system. But at the end of the day, that's just the box.

Nothing about Xbox's exclusive software make me want to hop into their ecosystem, and I'm sorry, I don't think this newfound "emotional impact" of Forza is somehow going to get me into a series that has seen a yearly iteration for the last 9 years.

These exec's are leaning into ephemeral marketing speak because they really don't have a slate of actual, tangible titles to get people that excited about.
 
J

jelly

Member
It makes me hyped for Xbox 4. That team has moved on and going other places......roads....where we are going.....we don't need roads.
 
Fredrik

Fredrik

Member
Head.spawn said:
After Xbox One and Xbox One S, my expectations are a bit high. For a device that is on the majority of my waking hour on a daily basis, it's putting in lots of work and is pleasant to have in the room. Not like my small 360, when I'm trying to watch a DVD movie and it sounded like someone was trying to land a jet in my room.
Click to expand...
Yeah the 360 was insanely loud when running the games from disc. And the PS4, some apparently have silent PS4s but I'm certainly not one of them, mine is almost at the same level as the 360. And Xbox One X is smaller than both... And we haven't heard a single word about it's noise from MS or the press. Makes me worried... But this article at least makes it sound like they know they did it right with the XB1, they've set the bar themselves for where they need to be this time.
 
Clear

Clear

CliffyB's Cock Holster
I'd feel more welcoming about all this hype if it was an actual new-generation of hardware, not just a mid-gen upgrade to a system that in all fairness is not exactly setting the world on fire.

The only real advancement the One X is touting over the S is improved visuals/performance, a benefit offset by a significant cost increase.

It just doesn't seem to me that is going to be enough to shift the status-quo, rather it strikes me as an over-engineered solution to a problem that's not the main factor holding back Xbox in the marketplace.
 
J

jelly

Member
Clear said:
I'd feel more welcoming about all this hype if it was an actual new-generation of hardware, not just a mid-gen upgrade to a system that in all fairness is not exactly setting the world on fire.

The only real advancement the One X is touting over the S is improved visuals/performance, a benefit offset by a significant cost increase.

It just doesn't seem to me that is going to be enough to shift the status-quo, rather it strikes me as an over-engineered solution to a problem that's not the main factor holding back Xbox in the marketplace.
Click to expand...

I think they are just reasserting their power 'Xbox' that will lead them into next gen better. The brand needs it now not later and Microsoft is paying for it so I don't really care. More will believe they can deliver good hardware at least but they need the games too.
 
RedAssedApe

RedAssedApe

Banned
right in the feels...thought that was VR. still...4k and HDR is legit...so anything that helps speed up adoption is a good thing (outside of my tv becoming obsolete)
 
J

Jumeira

Banned
Everlya_Apocryha said:
I know they are supposed to hype up the system prior to release but jeez.....knock it down a bunch. This is an updated console, not Schindler's list or Ann Frank's diary....what's up with the feels...lmao
Click to expand...
Well that's just as dishonest, its certainly more than an update, the tech being used and the engineering involved is quite impressive.
 
T

The Albatross

Member
To answer the subtitle of the article...

"Could this next-generation machine lead to the rise of games as high art?"

No. "Games as high art" will probably not have anything to do with computing power.

Otherwise, really good article from the outset. I really like tech-porn stuff like this. Obsessing over details that you'd otherwise miss in the manufacturing process.

I love this too:

That's why Microsoft has the Dream Killer. ”It's where we break designers' hearts," says principal design manager John Snavely, one of the leads on the redesign of the Xbox software interface. Hidden away in a side room, the Dream Killer is a reminder to all engineers and designers that many gamers don't have the latest technology, even if they're happy to shell out on a new console. ”It's a TV we should've thrown away a long time ago. It's awful. We put a lot of time into making sure our content looks good on the Dream Killer," Snavely says.
Click to expand...

I'm a developer at a software company and we have a similar device used for web performance. Basically a hosted VM that has shitty specs that we use to see how poorly our apps/software runs on shitty connections, shitty hardware, etc. We use it in meetings whenever we want to bring an idea back down to earth.

There's more good tidbits about the gaming industry/history in this article... It's a good read in general:

”The original Xbox was the DirectX Box," Penello says, referring to the DirectX software introduced with Windows 95. The idea behind DirectX was to make PC gaming continuous: buy a game and, within reason, you should be able to play it forever. Penello has worked at Microsoft for 17 years and in the games industry for 23. A broad-shouldered man whose voice fills any space, he is all firm handshakes and retro-gaming references. ”I was Atari versus Intellivision," he jokes. Console gaming has always struggled with the burden of its past. A vinyl record bought 30 years ago can be ripped to another format and enjoyed today. On a PC, the copy of Worms 2 you bought in 1997 still works on Windows 10 today. In console gaming? Not so much. ”Consoles were more bespoke than PCs," Penello explains. ”Why can't I make Ms. Pac-Man run on my Pac-Man arcade board? Well, they're two different boards. Atari was an arcade company. Nintendo was an arcade company."

Caught between the technical difficulty of backwards compatibility and financial necessity to launch new hardware every few years, console manufacturers have forced people to ditch old software in order to play the latest games. ”Console gaming is the only form of entertainment that doesn't let you do that," says Kevin Gammill, group program manager at Xbox. Gammill, spiky haired and wide eyed, often finishes Penello's sentences, and vice versa. ”Why can't you put your entire Atari 2600 catalogue into your ColecoVision?," Gammill asks. ”The delivery mechanism has changed, people have moved to digital. Knowing that digital thing you just purchased will carry forward with you is important. That's a new paradigm we didn't have in 2001."
Click to expand...

As a consumer (and videogame enthusiast) I love when developers/producers are speaking the same language that I'm speaking... Like, we take so much in gaming for granted, this idea of 'generations' and things that you don't really consider mcuh in other software space, and I'm pleased to read stuff like that. not that my Playstation catalog will ever be on my Xbox or vice versa (although... it could be...), but the idea that there's more permanency to consoles and libraries. That the device is more of a service for what you own.
 
C

cackhyena

Member
Even if it's louder than my OG One, I won't care. That thing is the most silent console I've ever owned. Unless you count the Switch.
 
S

Severianb

Member
Fredrik said:
This is actually really interesting. I've done CD/MP3/Flac sound quality comparisons in a room like this at the University. It's the coolest thing and it's 100% true that you can hear your own pulse. Freaky.
I just wish they would've mentioned something about the noise level because so far I've seen zero reports about how loud this thing is.
Click to expand...
Panello said it's louder than a X1S during stressful games, but otherwise the same.
 
T

The Albatross

Member
Irminsul said:
This article is really funny. What is especially astonishing is how it manages to get the most obscure things wrong in such a laser-guided way. For example, there are tons of examples for systems that aren't backwards compatible. Even in recent history. So what does the article come up with?



Well, let's consult Wikipedia.





It's just such a weird, obscure little detail to get wrong. Or maybe that Microsoft engineer wants to tell us that cross-play against the will of a platform holder should be okay, who knows.
Click to expand...


I think it's just a normal person giving a candid interview who is coming up with a random example... instead of trying to be super specific quoting Wikipedia. I mean, that's a pretty obscure device, and while I was alive at the time of Atari -> Colecovision -> Intellivision, I don't even remember that add on module existing. (edit: he's also probably mentioning Colecovision and/or Atari because those are mostly dead brands and companies, so nobody at those companies will take it as an insult and/or fanboys won't make YouTube videos of "XBOX ENGINEER SLAMS COLECOVISION", etc) I think the person being interviewed is just giving an example of how the console gaming space has always had these protected zones, the idea that no software will work on a future device or any other device than the one it was built on, while other industries and even gaming platforms like PC haven't had those assumptions.

I don't think he's trying to make an argument about cross-play here, not trying to say "We're going to put Playstation games on the Xbox!" but rather, why is it that we think of console games as belonging to a specific generation of hardware, when we really don't think that way about most other types of media.

A better example would be with like TV shows or movies. Seinfeld came out when I owned a 15" CRT-style piece of shit TV, but I don't associate Seinfeld with that TV, I have an assumption that I can watch Seinfeld on any TV, whether that's with a VHS that I bought in 1998, or the DVDs in 2003, with streaming, etc. Yet, Madden '97 came out around the same time for Sega Genesis, and I do have a very specific assumption that single iteration of Madden '97 will really only work on a Sega Genesis. Maybe with emulation or some obscure hardware I could get it work on something else, but there isn't that assumption in console gaming that a piece of software will have longevity, and that software is really attached to the hardware it ships with. Instead, in gaming, the assumption is that "this software is intended to be played on this iteration of hardware." While of course a Seinfeld VHS won't work on, say, my Nintendo Switch, we are more ready to disassociate the 'art' (Seinfeld) from the 'media' (VHS), which is something we don't really do with videogames (in some situations yes, but most we don't).

It's an interesting new paradigm in gaming that he didn't have when working on the original Xbox but does have now while working on the Xbox One X, and I think that's his point, not anything else.

Ushay said:
There's been a slew of these articles today it seems. Verge had one too not too long ago.

Fascinating how much painstaking attnetion goes into the design process. Would be great to see one for Nintendo and Sony.
Click to expand...

Yeah, companies will usually invite the press in for interviews and then give a certain window for the article to be released. Press gets interviews, they mostly talk about the same stuff so that shapes the articles they write, and then they both release around the same day. You see it in the auto industry a lot as well, where a bunch of YouTube channels and websites will drop interviews with car manufacturers on roughly the same day or week and all focus mostly on the same stuff in the car.
 
E

EGM1966

Member
Some interesting stuff there but I'm damn sure they have no dea what dictionary definition of high art.

Given high end gaming PCs are more powerful than X anyway the whole idea is moot.

The dream killer TV sounds like a healthy dose of common sense though: like that principle.
 
Maedre

Maedre

Banned
If the one X stays one S level of quietness it will be my main console for the next years. I hate the PS4Pro loudness.
 
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