Support NeoGAF

Darkstorne · Feb 14, 2015

Nugg said:
In the end, it's always the player's money that is involved. People not understanding what Kickstarter is is completely different.

Stop pretending like Kickstarter is like preordering a game. It's not. It has risks. You put money because you believe in a project. Breaking news: you can be wrong. Godus is a failed Kickstarter, get over it. You don't need to keep kicking the man on the ground just because it's Molyneux. The interviewer is unnecessarily harsh.

It's depressing how many don't realize that, or simply don't want to because they enjoy being dicks so much. I thought gamers would learn to ignore the bandwagon hatred after all the shit we went through last year, but no, most gamers are still twats it seems.

ZackieChan · Feb 14, 2015

Darkstorne said:
Again, the game is still in development, it's not cancelled. Even if it was cancelled, it's a Kickstarter. You aren't buying a game, you're funding the development of a concept that may or not make it to release, and will almost certainly evolve over time.

Want to get mad about failed Kickstarters? Go get mad at one of the multitude of big name Kickstarters that were cancelled. The only reason this is getting traction is because of Molyneux's name.

The bolded is simply false, again. I posted a long post explaining the legal duty to deliver the product on the last page. Just because you have this attitude and misguided belief that "most Kickstarters fail," doesn't make it true.

And these big name Kickstarter failures DO get traction, precisely for the same reason. However, that doesn't take away from the fact that the vast majority of KS projects that fund actually deliver the promised rewards. Quality is another question, but not the one at issue here.

Edit: also, he has said that the Godus mobile game has made "tens of millions". This is off the money given by backers - why aren't they getting what was promised to them, again?

Liamc723 · Feb 14, 2015

Darkstorne said:
Again, the game is still in development, it's not cancelled. Even if it was cancelled, it's a Kickstarter. You aren't buying a game, you're funding the development of a concept that may or not make it to release, and will almost certainly evolve over time.

Want to get mad about failed Kickstarters? Go get mad at one of the multitude of big name Kickstarters that were cancelled. The only reason this is getting traction is because of Molyneux's name.

The interview was incredibly aggressive and unprofessional. It wasn't looking for answers, it went in with a "theory" about Molyneux being a liar and wouldn't take no for an answer. No questions were asked for the benefit of his game's backers, and no answers were sought out to shed light on the game. All the journalist wanted was to make Molyneux look bad, which makes the journalist an utter twat.

"How long should backers wait for you to deliver the game they paid for three years ago?"

"Do you think a year and a half, to two years on, after the estimated deliveries on Kickstarter for things like, an art book and various other pledge items that dont exist, do you think at this point people can get their money back?"

"Do you not see the difference between being late for a publisher and being late for half a million pounds that gamers gave you?"

These questions that were asked are very much for the benefit of the game's backers.

Molyneux deserves all of the backlash, he has overpromised on so many games and people are sick of it.

Baalzebup · Feb 14, 2015

Darkstorne said:
Fraud? Are you kidding me? You're a joke if you believe that.

Uhhuh? The combination of what went on to Curiosity, what was said about the game and its in-app purchases, the casual forgetting of the winner AND the issue of those profits and them being put aside (or not), as addressed in the RPS interview. Plus the whole Kickstarter rewards thing that was also addressed in the RPS piece.

Note that I said "something smelling like", so whether or not it is so legally, it most fucking certainly is something scummy.

But if you honestly think that just because you think he's on a downwards slope means he should leave the industry forever so you don't have to be tempted to play any of his games in the future, then you're a terrible person.

If you honestly think it is ok for him to keep on peddling his shit to fresh victims unabated, then you are a terrible person.

I honestly think he should leave the industry forever so other people don't have to be taken in by his lies and be massively disappointed as a result. It is his lies that need to go, and if that means the man goes as well, then so be it. If he stops doing that and actually, for once, delivers what he promises, whether by keeping the promises in check or by actually managing the impossible, then I would welcome him back with open arms and an open heart. But only after the fact.

At this point, he has to earn his redemption.

Sorry you didn't like the Fable games.

I haven't invested a penny in any of his games since B&W, so I wouldn't know about whether or not I would like the Fable games. I do know that he promised the sky and some really awesome shit, but delivered something far less. I'm totally ok with people liking the Fable games. Hell, I might even like 'em. But they are not even close to what Molyneux talked them up to be.

666 · Feb 14, 2015

Eric the Red said:
Okay you say that and it's an easy out that Molyneux also makes allusions to in the interview. But then he accidentally gets too honest and says:

It's a really long interview so it's hard to really take in the important bits but quotes like this should help people realize that Walker isn't pulling his questions out of nowhere. More apt, he's not pulling them out of a big bag of unprofessional spite. Molyneux was so scared he wasn't getting funding he kept adding more promises and more stretch goals without giving thought to the consequences. Isn't that unprofessional? The consequences are here now and it's not due to Walker's "unprofessionalism", it's from Molyneux's.

True

nomster · Feb 14, 2015

SmartBase said:
Guys you shouldn't rag on PM because he is just passionate about games, like how Belfort and Madoff are passionate about stocks.

Horseshit comparison, come on now.

Water · Feb 14, 2015

Sorcerer said:
I cannot wait for Godus to be finished.

Then Peter can immediately move on to another project and tell us that Godus is a piece of shit.

I'm not quite sure if you are being sarcastic, or if you are unaware that Molyneux already did both?

http://www.funandseriousgamefestiva...s-the-trial-at-the-fun-serious-game-festival/

According to Mr Molyneux, The Trial will set right the aspects that went wrong with Godus, his latest project under the independent studio 22Cans. The Kickstarter-funded god simulation game lacked in narrative, progress and reward.

RPS' comment on that is devastating: "A fascinating use of the past tense for a game still being sold, for £15, as Early Access."

TheSeks · Feb 14, 2015

Darkstorne said:
It's a Kickstarter that hasn't been cancelled. That's a rarity. The only reason this is getting so much attention is because it's "cool" to hate Molyneux these days, which is a symptom of just how fucked up most gamers are. We love to hate, and we love controversy. It's leading to another shit storm where gamers flock in droves to jump on the bandwagon and personally attack a developer without any thought for the implications and consequences. Most Kickstarters fail, with many big name devs having to apologize and attempt to offer refunds, sometimes not even managing that. This one is stalling but still continuing, but hey! It's Molyneux! Fuck it, let's grill the guy just because it's him!

If it was any other big name up there, this wouldn't be happening. That's a fact you can't deny, because MANY big name Kickstarters have suffered far worse than this. It's only because it's Molyneux and most people like to say "He overpromises and never delivers! He's a rubbish developer!" Conveniently forgetting all the industry-shaping games he's developed in the past.

Cancelling has nothing to do with the fact that he still has the product "in development," has a version of the game to release (PC) that is light years behind the main (mobile) branch of the game, has no fucking time-table for said neglected branch. AND IS TALKING ABOUT ANOTHER NEWER GAME TO DEVELOP while said branch of the game is still lagging behind.

Again: why wouldn't anyone call him out on that bullshit? If it was CliffyB or anyone else I'd hope someone would call them out for pulling that bullshit as well. You can't simply go "oh we're going to do these versions" and then bounce when you release a "pre-alpha" and then ignore that branch of the game you're advertising. You can't. Especially when said branch was funded by customers.

The only misstep is starting the interview with an "attack" question. But Walker is completely in the right to call out Peter on the state of Godus.

Peter is playing the victim and trying to deflect after said attack question and going "well we're still developing it."

"That's great. But why is there no time-table for backers to understand what is going on?"

"WE'RE STILL DEVELOPING IT!"

Why would someone defend Peter on that? Peter was trying to play the victim after being called out on his miss-steps. He could've went "you know, you're right. We screwed up and we're sorry" but he continued to try to blame Walker on writing an attack piece when that really wasn't the direction the interview was attempting to go for outside that initial first question.

ZackieChan · Feb 14, 2015

It is maddening that people are actually shrugging and defending a failed Kickstarter that, by the developer's own admission, had further publisher financial support AND made millions of dollars. Is it because you didn't actually back the project? Try some empathy, maybe.

Darkstorne · Feb 14, 2015

mclem said:
I think your statistics are broken.

They're not. The vast majority of Kickstarter games don't even get funded at all. Even the big name Kickstarter games that do get funded almost always end up missing their original deadline by a country mile. Godus is a late Kickstarter, still in development. The only reason this is blowing up is because Molyneux is attached to the project.

Despite all of that, nothing excuses the journalist's pathetic attack. Even if Molyneux had done something terribly wrong here, nothing excuses a professional journalist deliberately acting like a twat.

MC Safety · Feb 14, 2015

Maledict said:
Seriously, our best journalists have made careers on this. It is part and parcel of quality, hard hitting journalism in the UK. When you say it is bad journalism you are just wrong, and demonstrably so. You might *think* it a bad technique, or rude, which is completely fine - but it's not bad journalism.

I'll tell you exactly why it's bad journalism. The idea is to get answers, not to put forth your agenda. One serves your readers, the other serves the writer.

Your hard-hitting journalists would all agree the purpose of a piece is to serve the readers.

Eric the Red · Feb 14, 2015

ZackieChan said:
The bolded is simply false, again. I posted a long post explaining the legal duty to deliver the product on the last page. Just because you have this attitude and misguided belief that "most Kickstarters fail," doesn't make it true.

And these big name Kickstarter failures DO get traction, precisely for the same reason. However, that doesn't take away from the fact that the vast majority of KS projects that fund actually deliver the promised rewards. Quality is another question, but not the one at issue here.

Edit: also, he has said that the Godus mobile game has made "tens of millions". This is off the money given by backers - why aren't they getting what was promised to them, again?

Why are you being so aggressive and belligerent and mean spirited by following up on unsubstantiated statements with facts instead of letting them go unchallenged? You're being such an unprofessional forum poster right now. I'm never visiting the thread pages you post on ever again!

ZackieChan · Feb 14, 2015

Darkstorne said:
They're not. The vast majority of Kickstarter games don't even get funded at all. Even the big name Kickstarter games that do get funded almost always end up missing their original deadline by a country mile. Godus is a late Kickstarter, still in development. The only reason this is blowing up is because Molyneux is attached to the project.

Despite all of that, nothing excuses the journalist's pathetic attack. Even if Molyneux had done something terribly wrong here, nothing excuses a professional journalist deliberately acting like a twat.

Goalposts moved.

Why would a KS that doesn't get funded even count? They've taken no money from backers.

Why do only "big name" KS projects count? And can you produce a list of these and what percentage failed?

Missing the deadline isn't even the most egregious thing here (though it is 2YEARS overdue), it is all the other deception going along with it.

elhav · Feb 14, 2015

MC Safety said:
I'll tell you exactly why it's bad journalism. The idea is to get answers, not to put forth your agenda. One serves your readers, the other serves the writer.

Your hard-hitting journalists would all agree the purpose of a piece is to serve the readers.

But he did try to get answers....A lot of questions were questions that anyone who funded the game wants to know the answers to.

Did you even read the entire interview?

angelic · Feb 14, 2015

The thing with molyneux is that he immediately loses interest once the engineering starts. He likes the pitch, the PR, the bullshit. Not making games, which is why he never does..he hands the work over to someone else. I find it ironic that their new game is called "the Trail". Let us guess...is it a new and revolutionary never seen take on a genre? Also...while I agree the interview is harsh, anything that annoys cliffyb is a bonus.

ZackieChan · Feb 14, 2015

Eric the Red said:
Why are you being so aggressive and belligerent and mean spirited by following up on unsubstantiated statements with facts instead of letting them go unchallenged? You're being such an unprofessional forum poster right now. I'm never visiting the thread pages you post on ever again!

Haha, I know you're joking, but I have clients that use Kickstarter to fund their games. It pisses me off when people who should know better abuse the system and make all of KS look bad.

Hell, there are people in here defending this as just the way things are and that backers should expect a KS to fail. Wtf is that?

mclem · Feb 14, 2015

Darkstorne said:
They're not. The vast majority of Kickstarter games don't even get funded at all. Even the big name Kickstarter games that do get funded almost always end up missing their original deadline by a country mile. Godus is a late Kickstarter, still in development. The only reason this is blowing up is because Molyneux is attached to the project.

Hmm. I think we're working to different definitions of failure, here, then. I'd argue that not getting funded is the campaign failing, not the project. A very different situation given that if the campaign fails, there's no financial stake involved.

As for missing deadlines, that's a fair point. I personally take them with a pinch of salt anyway, particularly if the developer makes more money than they were planning to; it takes time to spend money!

My criteria for failure is more "Kickstarter campaign succeeds, runs out of money, shutters development". And there aren't all that many that did that.

GeordieMark · Feb 14, 2015

Liamc723 said:
Those gamers poured their own money into the fucking development of this game, how dare you attack them. They have every right to know what's gone wrong with Godus and Peter Molyneux is the main culprit. We need more of these type of interviews, there's enough bullshit in this industry that needs to be dealt with in a similar manner. People have clearly had enough.

Let's be honest. Most probably paid $5 at most. Only a tiny percentage would have invested anything significant. All this heart aching for people who didn't get exactly what they thought they were getting is a bit overblown. Investing a kickstarter is a gamble. There is a very real chance that you might not get a good return. There is a game here. People didn't get nothing. It's just not exactly as it was initially pitched.

ZackieChan · Feb 14, 2015

GeordieMark said:
Let's be honest. Most probably paid $5 at most. Only a tiny percentage would have invested anything significant. All this heart aching for people who didn't get exactly what they thought they were getting is a bit overblown. Investing a kickstarter is a gamble. There is a very real chance that you might not get a good return. There is a game here. People didn't get nothing. It's just not exactly as it was initially pitched.

But this shouldn't be a gamble.

They over funded.

They got further funding from a publisher.

They have made a large amount of money from IAP.

The developer has decades of experience.

And now they're relying on their intern to get the game completed with a skeleton crew while most have left or moved on to the company's next game.

How is this in any way defensible?

Liamc723 · Feb 14, 2015

GeordieMark said:
Let's be honest. Most probably paid $5 at most. Only a tiny percentage would have invested anything significant. All this heart aching for people who didn't get exactly what they thought they were getting is a bit overblown. Investing a kickstarter is a gamble. There is a very real chance that you might not get a good return. There is a game here. People didn't get nothing. It's just not exactly as it was initially pitched.

Taken from the Kickstarter page, 1518 people pledged £50 or more. What do you have to say to those people? Should they accept that the money they gave is going to a project that is over 2 years late, and still hasn't been released?

ZackieChan · Feb 14, 2015

Liamc723 said:
Taken from the Kickstarter page, 1518 people pledged £50 or more. What do you have to say to those people?

It's Kickstarter. They should have expected it to fail.

/s

bsod · Feb 14, 2015

Liamc723 said:
Taken from the Kickstarter page, 1518 people pledged £50 or more. What do you have to say to those people?

The thing that you knew wasn't a certainty still isn't a certainty.

Maledict · Feb 14, 2015

I love the idea that if you only gave a little, you deserve what you get. On the back of that notion a million scams have flourished over the years...

GeordieMark · Feb 14, 2015

ZackieChan said:
But this shouldn't be a gamble.

They over funded.

They got further funding from a publisher.

They have made a large amount of money from IAP.

The developer has decades of experience.

And now they're relying on their intern to get the game completed with a skeleton crew while most have left or moved on to the company's next game.

How is this in any way defensible?

It always a gamble. Publishers also gamble when they fund a game. Sometimes the game doesn't even get made. Sometimes studios close as a result.

Game development is a huge gamble for anyone financing it. That's why we get constant re-hashes of the same games, rather than original IP.

Eric the Red · Feb 14, 2015

MC Safety said:
I'll tell you exactly why it's bad journalism. The idea is to get answers, not to put forth your agenda. One serves your readers, the other serves the writer.

Your hard-hitting journalists would all agree the purpose of a piece is to serve the readers.

The whole reason Walker's tone is so blunt and aggressive is BECAUSE he feels he's giving voice to all the backers who believed in Molyneux. He's trying to be sort of an advocate for them. Off the top of my head it's kind of like when John Stewart has segments about the VA or other veterans issues, he gets very heated especially when questioning those responsible. It's also in line with what I know about Walker, as the best articles from him I remember were of his were from the Xbone reveal. He had some great consumer rights slanted articles. This is sort of his wheel house. So I don't agree that this is self-serving from Walker at all.

GeordieMark · Feb 14, 2015

Liamc723 said:
Taken from the Kickstarter page, 1518 people pledged £50 or more. What do you have to say to those people? Should they accept that the money they gave is going to a project that is over 2 years late, and still hasn't been released?

So, like I said, a really tiny percentage.

And again, it's a gamble.

MC Safety · Feb 14, 2015

elhav said:
But he did try to get answers....A lot of questions were questions that anyone who funded the game wants to know the answers to.

Did you even read the entire interview?

I tried to. I couldn't get much beyond Walker's agenda.

Molyneux is easy to interview. He'll answer everything. And he'll elaborate when it's necessary. It's really shooting fish in a barrel.

I got the sense Walker thought the interview was more about John Walker's righteous indignation than Molyneux's accounting for Godus. And the piece suffers accordingly.

Eric the Red said:
The whole reason Walker's tone is so blunt and aggressive is BECAUSE he feels he's giving voice to all the backers who believed in Molyneux. He's trying to be sort of an advocate for them. Off the top of my head it's kind of like when John Stewart has segments about the VA or other veterans issues, he gets very heated especially when questioning those responsible. It's also in line with what I know about Walker, as the best articles from him I remember were of his were from the Xbone reveal. He had some great consumer rights slanted articles. This is sort of his wheel house. So I don't agree that this is self-serving from Walker at all.

Here's where we differ: I do not agree that browbeating an interview subject is serving the customer. I believe that clear and comprehensive answers serves the consumer far better.

One reads like a showcase for the writer, the other serves as invaluable aid for the reader.

Darkstorne · Feb 14, 2015

mclem said:
My criteria for failure is more "Kickstarter campaign succeeds, runs out of money, shutters development". And there aren't all that many that did that.

Fair enough, which means by your definition Molyneux's hasn't failed. It's still on-going in development, and the team has just been bulked up.

There are three issues I see here:

1) People assuming that backing a Kickstarter project is the same as buying a game. You can't expect that game to be developed - you're voluntarily taking the risk and understanding that as an investment it might not work out, and should know that since you're backing a concept rather than an almost complete game it's likely to evolve and change as development requires through trial and error, working out which systems work as fun mechanics and which don't.

2) The interviewer is a professional journalist who treated a developer with utter disrespect from the very start. I hate GamerGate, and would rather he didn't justify the need for an "ethics in game journalism" movement. But with interviews like this that's exactly what he'll accomplish. Highly unprofessional.

3) People hate Molyneux because it's a popular bandwagon these days, and are blowing this way out of proportion just because his name is attached. The game is still in development. It hasn't been cancelled. It's not what some people were hoping it would be, but let's not try kicking him out of the industry for it, shall we?

PensivePen · Feb 14, 2015

Fantastic interview, I didn't think there was anything unprofessional about it in the slightest (but then again I never put much stock into so-called professionalism anyway). He asked questions that were wholly warranted given the state of Molyneux's career and his latest project.

R_thanatos · Feb 14, 2015

GeordieMark said:
Let's be honest. Most probably paid $5 at most. Only a tiny percentage would have invested anything significant. All this heart aching for people who didn't get exactly what they thought they were getting is a bit overblown. Investing a kickstarter is a gamble. There is a very real chance that you might not get a good return. There is a game here. People didn't get nothing. It's just not exactly as it was initially pitched.

Sorry but if you had paid , expecting a reward , or a strech goal , the basic courtesy is to communicate about those points if you know you can't deliver

i don't think i'm asking for too much , is there ?
It doesn't matter if you've paid 1$ , 5$ or more

Liamc723 · Feb 14, 2015

GeordieMark said:
So, like I said, a really tiny percentage.

And again, it's a gamble.

A tiny percentage that contributed over £180,000 to the total £526,563, if my Maths is correct.

Is that a small percentage? That's over 25% of the total amount of money earned. So, do you think these backers got their moneys worth when they all contributed at least £50?

SamVT · Feb 14, 2015

Despite all the coverage and the different opinions about it, one reality I'd like to add is this;

Nearly 18,000 people backed GODUS on Kickstarter, those are the people most affected by all of this and they are due some justice.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/22cans/project-godus

Their last project update was the 19th December 2014, that's almost 2 months ago. 2 months during which the team was moved off the Project onto the Trial and then some (2 or 3 depending on sources) back onto the project.

IF, and it's a big if, there is any integrity left those (backers) are the people that should be addressed directly and pronto. In fact, since the 1.5 years the project was supposed to be completed (September 2013) there's never been any communication as to a) why it's late and b) what's being done to rectify it and c) how funds raised have been used by creator to achieve rewards. That's never happened.

The only ever attempt was this 'roadmap' - posted in Spring 2014 - which unfortunately turned out to be another delaying tactic as we now know from statements by PM that said time was used for mobile development. And nothing on the roadmap has actually been brought into existence and there currently still isn't a delivery date. There's now all this talk about 'story mode' and 'multiplayer' but what of all the other stuff that was said was going to be done or was said to have been done already?

I mean, all the evidence is out there! Right there, in front of our eyes.

GeordieMark · Feb 14, 2015

R_thanatos said:
Sorry but if you had paid , expecting a reward , or a strech goal , the basic courtesy is to communicate about those points if you know you can't deliver

i don't think i'm asking for too much , is there ?
It doesn't matter if you've paid 1$ , 5$ or more

They are still working on the game are they not?

I'm not saying they have handled this perfectly, and communication could probably have been handled better.

Friction · Feb 14, 2015

Hard to read but definitely refreshing. Its rare but its good to see games journalists act like journalist.

GeordieMark · Feb 14, 2015

Liamc723 said:
A tiny percentage that contributed over £180,000 to the total £526,563, if my Maths is correct.

Is that a small percentage? That's over 25% of the total amount of money earned. So, do you think these backers got their moneys worth when they all contributed at least £50?

That's my whole point! If you pledge to a kickstarter you are taking a gamble, and may not get your money's worth!

Like I said, even games published by the likes of EA, T2, Ubisoft etc. are gambles. Many, many games are canned during production, or completely changed from the initial plan. This isn't an unusual scenario.

Imagine how Sony feel about The Last Guardian.

jelly · Feb 14, 2015

Molyneux isn't stupid or naive. He plays everyone very well and can be harsh to others if pushed. He knows exactly what he is doing. How this escapes people, I don't know. You can have a nice side but from what I'm reading he is playing dumb to mislead and knows it works, doesn't think twice about anyone else.

If you can't see beyond the RPS writer and see what Peter is really like then you don't want to believe the truth. The Guardian, Kotaku, Eurogamer articles don't paint a pretty picture of Molyneux.

ZackieChan · Feb 14, 2015

GeordieMark said:
That's my whole point! If you pledge to a kickstarter you are taking a gamble, and may not get your money's worth!

Like I said, even games published by the likes of EA, T2, Ubisoft etc. are gambles. Many, many games are canned during production, or completely changed from the initial plan. This isn't an unusual scenario.

Imagine how Sony feel about The Last Guardian.

Sony's problem is internal.

With KS, they have a legal obligation to deliver to backers. While the game IS still in development, sources say that they have cut way back on staff and the lead (the one who inspired those backers to put in their money) has moved on. Meanwhile, they have made IAP money that doesn't seem to be directed toward actually finishing the game, but who knows.

At the very least, they should be communicating with backers.

How long should they get to deliver? Two more years? Is 5 years enough? Inside sources seem to doubt that multiplayer and other parts of the game will even be achievable.

SketchTheArtist · Feb 14, 2015

GeordieMark said:
It always a gamble. Publishers also gamble when they fund a game. Sometimes the game doesn't even get made. Sometimes studios close as a result.

Game development is a huge gamble for anyone financing it. That's why we get constant re-hashes of the same games, rather than original IP.

This.

I've been on AAA cancelled games before; it's not fun, but it's part of game dev sadly. Shit just don't work sometimes.

R_thanatos · Feb 14, 2015

GeordieMark said:
They are still working on the game are they not?

I'm not saying they have handled this perfectly, and communication could probably have been handled better.

NO, that's not what i mean.

The linux strech goal was not possible ...why did they wait more 15 months before satying so ?

molyneux himself said on the 9th of february that it wasn't possible because of the middle ware, ok fine ..so why did you wait before talking ?

as SamVT pointed out , there was no communicatyion at ALL...untill some report came , and they felt some heat.... and all we've got is " it's still being worked on , don't worry " with no proof , except them saying so ....

Their answer is basicly " move along guys everything's fine and don't worry !!"

and you wonder why some people have problem beliving this ?.

GeordieMark · Feb 14, 2015

ZackieChan said:
Sony's problem is internal.

With KS, they have a legal obligation to deliver to backers. While the game IS still in development, sources say that they have cut way back on staff and the lead (the one who inspired those backers to put in their money) has moved on. Meanwhile, they have made IAP money that doesn't seem to be directed toward actually finishing the game, but who knows.

At the very least, they should be communicating with backers.

How long should they get to deliver? Two more years? Is 5 years enough? Inside sources seem to doubt that multiplayer and other parts of the game will even be achievable.

Kickstarter does not guarantee projects or investigate a creator's ability to complete their project. On Kickstarter, backers (you!) ultimately decide the validity and worthiness of a project by whether they decide to fund it.

That's from the Kickstarter FAQ

SolidChamp · Feb 14, 2015

Have we discussed how the Kotaku article did it better yet?

Because, the Kotaku article did it better.

Cato the Censor · Feb 14, 2015

MC Safety said:
I tried to. I couldn't get much beyond Walker's agenda.

Molyneux is easy to interview. He'll answer everything. And he'll elaborate when it's necessary. It's really shooting fish in a barrel.

I got the sense Walker thought the interview was more about John Walker's righteous indignation than Molyneux's accounting for Godus. And the piece suffers accordingly.

Here's where we differ: I do not agree that browbeating an interview subject is serving the customer. I believe that clear and comprehensive answers serves the consumer far better.

One reads like a showcase for the writer, the other serves as invaluable aid for the reader.

Why don't you read the interview completely before telling us how it went? Not that you are the only one in the thread. And no, "I could see where this was going early" is no excuse.

ZackieChan · Feb 14, 2015

GeordieMark said:
That's from the Kickstarter FAQ

You should read more of their terms of service. Maybe the part about the creator being legally obligated to deliver the promised rewards?

Morrigan Stark · Feb 14, 2015

Maiden Voyage said:
I think someone who actively identifies as a White Nationalist is far different than someone who makes terrible PR statements and should be treated as such.

"Making terrible PR statements" is not what Molyneux is guilty of, though. Having a history of outright lying over and over again for two decades, plus now swindling people out of their money, is far more serious.

Maledict said:
People have posted stuff about him lying going back 20 years.

People have posted videos where he looks the camera in the eye and lies. He literally says "this tech exists, it exists now and it's beyond anything science fiction writers have thought of".

People have even quoted Peter HIMSELF where he says he lies and makes things up to journalists for press coverage.

And yet here we are, a large number of people saying he just gets carried away, he's a man of visions, he brings so much to the industry and RPS are mean because they were rude to a man who has built a career on fraud, lying and theft and never once been challenged on it until now.

Yup.

Darkstorne said:
What an awful interview. RPS is off my list of trusted sites. Absolutely atrocious journalism, the interviewer only went in to this with the intention of insulting.

Molyneux has created, without question, some of the best video games the industry has seen. Some of them have literally shaped the industry and given rise to new genres. But fuck it, he's passionate about sharing his ideas and creativity, and some of his ideas don't work out, so therefore we should treat him like an asshole and for some bizarre reason hold him to unreasonable expectations where every project he ever engages in should be a success.

Fuck this interview, and fuck this industry. Gamers gave journalists a whole load of unreasonable trauma last year, and now this year journalists are doing the same thing to developers? What the fuck is wrong with this industry? Put away the pitchforks and let's just learn to appreciate the stunning achievements this man has made in his life, accept that some projects won't pan out for him, and be glad that he's still willing to stick around with us in the future despite all this vitriol heading his way.

Oh boy. Yeah, let's not take Molyneux to task because he made such visionary games 25 years ago? Despite him being pretty much a text book manipulative con man? Fuck that noise.

ecosse_011172 · Feb 14, 2015

Basically...

RPS: Do you think that youre a pathological liar?

Peter Molyneux: Yes

FranXico · Feb 14, 2015

jelly said:
If you can't see beyond the RPS writer and see what Peter is really like then you don't want to believe the truth. The Guardian, Kotaku, Eurogamer articles don't paint a pretty picture of Molyneux.

Did they need to interview him shouting "liar, liar" to get their point across? No, they didn't.

Pikma · Feb 14, 2015

jelly said:
Molyneux isn't stupid or naive. He plays everyone very well and can be harsh to others if pushed. He knows exactly what he is doing. How this escapes people, I don't know. You can have a nice side but from what I'm reading he is playing dumb to mislead and knows it works, doesn't think twice about anyone else.

If you can't see beyond the RPS writer and see what Peter is really like then you don't want to believe the truth. The Guardian, Kotaku, Eurogamer articles don't paint a pretty picture of Molyneux.

Nothing I've ever seen paints a pretty picture of Molyneux yet people still believe and defend his shit.

Zia · Feb 14, 2015

SolidChamp said:
Have we discussed how the Kotaku article did it better yet?

Because, the Kotaku article did it better.

Everyone did it better. Hence the near-universal condemnation from writers that are interested in informing their readership instead of serving as a blunt object through which the angry throngs can inact vengeance. Walker misses the point entirely, but I doubt he cares all that much.

Water · Feb 14, 2015

Regarding the long Walker interview: could have been better, but definitely good, valuable work. Way too little in the industry has been written with this degree of honesty and clarity.

Some parts weren't helping, obviously. Walker nitpicked some casual statements or chased after something he should have known wasn't actually a deception, for instance the fact the mobile publisher was also a server supplier for the PC version, which doesn't make it a publisher for the PC version. I think he also missed the chance to ask about some significant lies, deceptions and general fuckery, such as the decision to go all in on mobile when the Kickstarter backers had paid for the PC version and had been promised a game in an incredibly short time, and the free-to-play mechanics Molyneux knows to make shit games but were put in anyway.

I'm not sure why people are debating Molyneux' character in either-or terms - either a dreamer who just happens to be massively incompetent at production and has no idea how to handle responsibility, or a stone cold marketing-oriented bullshit artist who doesn't care about the results to the people he's bullshitting as long as the money is coming in. At this point there seems to be plenty of evidence for both. He scammed people who thought he'd build them a PC game, burned all of the funds on a free-to-play piece of shit that he hoped would make him Supercell money, and it didn't pan out both due to bad execution and the general unpredictability of the business.

Scrooge McDuck · Feb 14, 2015

MC Safety said:
I tried to. I couldn't get much beyond Walker's agenda.

Molyneux is easy to interview. He'll answer everything. And he'll elaborate when it's necessary. It's really shooting fish in a barrel.

I admit that I'm not familiar with Peter Molyneux beyond this interview (and then reading up a bit), but the Molyneux you described seems a little different than the one in this interview. He answered everything, yes, but he kept dancing around the main issues while contradicting himself.

Has any interviewers asked him the hard questions before this? I'm interested in reading how those went.

Support NeoGAF

The Trial Of Peter Molyneux by RockPaperShotgun

Member

Member

Member

Member

Banned

Member

Member

Blinded by the luminous glory that is David Bowie's physical manifestation.

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Banned

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Banned

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Banned

Member

Member

Arrogant Smirk

Junior Member

Member

Banned

Member

Member

Member

Similar threads