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DigitalFoundry: RotTR Xbox One X vs PS4 Pro First Look Graphics Comaprison
- Thread starter Colbert
- Start date
Journey
Banned
If the image on the left is only slightly better... ah **k-it not even worth it lol.
Man, I'm so jealous that you are able to do this when it's not working for us.Random ass post looking at Lara in leather. PC with DoF disabled, SMAA.
Might even be 4 stages of roughed up and may depend on the outfit. I tried the red expedition jacket and couldn't get Lara to show any cuts or marks, maybe idea is the tough jacket keeps her from getting marked?
It has to be the save game thing versus using the Chapter Replay feature.
If you took the time to read why I fucking got the Pro...the "extra effect" were a bonus to my shitty ps4. If you didn't have a Ps4 before i would recommend it just for the HD size.
Right. I'm entitled to make adjustments to my decisions. Completely overprotective in their future investments.
Darklor01
Might need to stop sniffing glue
If the image on the left is only slightly better... ah **k-it not even worth it lol.
I'm nearsighted. When I take off my glasses, the image on the right is what the world looks like to me.
Shpeshal Nick
aka Collingwood
There's not even a big difference here and we've got 37 pages.
Wait until you see the difference in games that were developed from early on with One X in mind that will show bigger differences. Won't be surprised if we see 100 page threads.
I read it.
Now sure, you're entitled to make changes to your opinion on the worth of a more expensive console for better graphics, but it's hardly a case of lack of reading that would draw the conclusion that you'd consider the "refined visuals" to be something that would justify additional cost. And it's not like the XB1X lacks the sort of misc upgrades that you'd otherwise cite as making the PS4 Pro a worthwhile purchase.
And I wouldn't say that developers "barely use" the additional resources afforded by the PS4 Pro... rather the 2x performance (and almost no additional memory) doesn't scale very well once aspirations for 4k output enter the equation. It also has a problem with consistency, with stuff like supersampling being up in the air across different titles and boost mode initially not being an option (and being more limited in improvements vs XB1X's equivalent).
chromatic9
Member
From the next bit of the scene Lara is closer and well in the foreground but enabling DoF still blurs image.
I'd expect DoF to be in the final code, would be silly without it unless they want dat 4kness and it does look beautiful and also removes the gamey looking edges to bring a filmic like quality.
http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/116044
I'd expect DoF to be in the final code, would be silly without it unless they want dat 4kness and it does look beautiful and also removes the gamey looking edges to bring a filmic like quality.
http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/116044
Uno Venova
Banned
Damn, an actual accurate summary of this thread without a hidden agenda behind it.
Sadly rare.
Mithos
Member
If I would photoshop the picture to look what it looks when I take of my glasses...
TGO
Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
So so, I mean it's pretty evident it's better in Resolution when zoomed in but we've been through this before with the original Pro release vs PC, and even John said in that analysis the CB effects was the only tell sign when zoomed in.If the image on the left is only slightly better... ah **k-it not even worth it lol.
1.1 picture is not as dramatic and will just be sharper overall picture and probably the Jacket texture will be better which will likely be most noticeable side by side honestly when it's the full picture as noticeable.
I even didn't know what was improved originally, I just knew the PC and Pro version looked off in the comparison.
For people who have played the game on Pro I don't think this title if worth the upgrade, especially if they played the original on Xbox One and upgraded to Pro, a 3rd time a minor upgrade to one game?
For anyone with a Xbox One and is getting a Xbox One X and has never played it it's definitely worth a look, especially at it's current price.
I don't know, but thats my opinion, not sure what other people think
I did the Chapter Replay, you just need to ruff Lara up a bit, a few fire arrows to the ground and throwing her in it does the job.Man, I'm so jealous that you are able to do this when it's not working for us.
It has to be the save game thing versus using the Chapter Replay feature.
Man, it's not that simple. We tried it all. Blowing up everything possible and taking her right to death's door. The decals are there during gameplay but always disappear during the cutscenes. We spent two hours on it. Never worked even one time no matter what on PC. It's broken for us.
TGO
Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
A bug perhaps?
That must be annoying, btw I notice that cutscene on the the Pro a microblocking effect in parts one jacket, what is that?
Thats interesting, wonder if the IQ would be Improved on Pro without it enabled, although I think the game looks great but I've got a 1080p screen so.From the next bit of the scene Lara is closer and well in the foreground but enabling DoF still blurs image.
I'd expect DoF to be in the final code, would be silly without it unless they want dat 4kness and it does look beautiful and also removes the gamey looking edges to bring a filmic like quality.
http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/116044
Liabe Brave
Member
Liliana Eileen solely interested in tedious ad hominems as per usual, only to get proven utterly wrong by the man himself.
Yep.
Fair enough. The One X may well have twice the effective memory bandwidth of the standard PS4. My metanoia is unjustified then. But I think it's clear that SenjutsuSage's original claim, that One X bandwidth is more than double Pro's, is false.
Resolution is more refined, and textures are improved, but what effects are higher in that same mode? This isn't a rhetorical question, I honestly don't recall DF mentioning any.
Resolution isn't refined, it's doubled than what pro produces. 4K native requires double the pixels to be rendered in real time compared to cb using previous rendered frame to add in to the rest. Then you have Enhanced mode that pro only capable of 1080p while the Xbox One X pushes out 4k cb. Other effects such as the hair fx was seen to be improved.
I wonder how Enhanced mode fairs compared to pro on the effects used
foxuzamaki
Doesn't read OPs, especially not his own
This thread blew up lol, its looking an awful lot like 7th gen now
NXGamer
Member
They cannot mention it, as they do not know. They have access to the same press shots that went out and I have also. It is too soon to be judging micro facets of materials, decals and such from realtime cutscenes without being able to line then up and even then with variations possible you have to account for.
Wasn't really directed towards you, but since we're here why don't you quote the entire post. I used words like quality of life console and refined effects. I really don't see how those statements leaning towards a bias, which I'm being low key accused of. I even mentioned the 5ghz wifi card over it's graphics. I still stick to what i said; if it weren't for the extra perks I would not have gotten the Pro. It's the sum of all it's parts.
Shpeshal Nick
aka Collingwood
The DF Battlefront 2 thread is going to be really bad isn't it?
EtherMagic
Member
here lets see if Gaf can tell me what this is
vs
can you see the blocky effect on the jacket and her hair and edges
you can also see it here on the grenade
what is that? and this is from the same cutscene.
Them are called Pixels, or "Jaggies"... The process to smooth them out is called "Anti-aliasing".
Anti-aliasing was most noticeable on the N64 in 96", right around when the process started taking form, which took away the Jaggies but blurred the heck out of every outline in the game. They have gotten much better since them days, but to answer your question, yes, them Jaggies are not "anti-aliased"!
Yeah it'll be interesting to see how the console is taken advantage of.
Problem is you can't talk about the game like all modes are rolled up into one. Before you talked about higher resolution and higher quality effects as if they are both accomplished at the same time.
here lets see if Gaf can tell me what this is
vs
can you see the blocky effect on the jacket and her hair and edges
you can also see it here on the grenade
what is that? and this is from the same cutscene.
I'm only viewing this from my phone at the moment but could it be artifacts from CBR? Either that or poor coverage of the AA.
Cause they are? Native 4k or 4k cb with ultra textures
Liabe Brave
Member
You consistently misrepresent the CBR process, no matter how many times people correct you. Native 4K does not have double the resolution of 2160c, period. It is the exact same number of pixels. The difference is that with CBR, the game tries to retain (but reposition) pixels that haven't changed value since the last frame. If it wholly succeeds, the results are literally identical to native 4K. In usual practice, some of the retained pixels should have been changed, leading to inaccuracies in the image.
Clever approximations like this are used all over the shop in realtime rasterization. Sometimes they're effective, and in other situations not. Dismissing any of them out of principle just because they're not 100% precise isn't reasonable. To be consistent you'd also have to reject AO, SSR, 2D billboards, some AA methods, etc. etc.
Here, on the other hand, you're maybe underselling what One X is doing. In enhanced mode it's rendering four times the resolution as Pro (though only twice as much at the same accuracy), in addition to other improvements.
The most rational expectation is that most of the effects will be turned up further (better resolve, stronger, more accurate, etc.). It's just a question of which ones, and how much.
Okay, thanks.
rodrigolfp
Haptic Gamepads 4 Life
From the next bit of the scene Lara is closer and well in the foreground but enabling DoF still blurs image.
I'd expect DoF to be in the final code, would be silly without it unless they want dat 4kness and it does look beautiful and also removes the gamey looking edges to bring a filmic like quality.
http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/116044
and that is another example why DoF, motion blur, chromatic aberration, FXAA, etc, can all burn in hell...
TGO
Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
can't be AA as it effects even the texture on the jacket and the scarf, if you look it seems lower res and a bit pixelated lack of AA wouldnt do that, the blocky edges it would.Them are called Pixels, or "Jaggies"... The process to smooth them out is called "Anti-aliasing".
Anti-aliasing was most noticeable on the N64 in 96", right around when the process started taking form, which took away the Jaggies but blurred the heck out of every outline in the game. They have gotten much better since them days, but to answer your question, yes, them Jaggies are not "anti-aliased"!
while the other is higher res with clean edges, you can make the lines in the material of the scarf while the first image its just smooth or blurred
I'm wondering that too, but I've never seen CB artifacting before
Again when speaking of what the engine renders in REALTIME checkerboarding renders a scene using HALF the pixels. It FILLS in the rest using the previous frame.
There's a reason why checkerboarding is LESS demanding than rendering an entire scene NATIVELY
lol I'm not dismissing it's a great rendering technique but no way matches native in technical rendering requirements
It's a technical fact
Sad Affleck
Member
1. Create beautiful high-poly models of human characters and breathtaking environments.
2. Use 4K-resolution textures for stunning detail.
3. Smear DoF, poor AA, various blurs and post-process effects that hide all that glorious detail.
I'll never understand this. Never. Games aren't movies, let me enjoy sharp and detailed graphics.
Preach.
2. Use 4K-resolution textures for stunning detail.
3. Smear DoF, poor AA, various blurs and post-process effects that hide all that glorious detail.
I'll never understand this. Never. Games aren't movies, let me enjoy sharp and detailed graphics.
Preach.
HeWhoWalks
Gold Member
XB1 vs PS4 vs 1X vs Pro vs PC. Damn, DF will have their work cut out.
Probably the same when/if a BF1 patch appears for 1X.
You specifically said:
From what we can tell so far effects are dialed back or cut out when in the native 4K mode. I'm sure they'll be in the final game but we don't know for sure and we especially don't know if they'll be higher quality in the native 4K mode. Point is you're statement here is wrong.
When I get home, I can try and create a screenshot showing CBR artifacts.
TGO
Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
I'm gonna have to agree, while the overall picture looks good enough to be 4k the detail isn't there compared to Native 4k as evident by zooming in.
For people like me with a 1080p TV it gives it this great low cost downsampling but those with a 4K TV, Native is obviously better.
RichiRamjag
Member
I'm sure it'll look great on both, but I can't wait to see that o the One X.
I didn't quote the whole post, as I figured there wasn't actually a need to, seeing as we'd both be aware of what the full post contained. I quoted the section I did to draw focus to it, as it demonstrated a specific understanding of how refined graphics carry value, even drawing a comparison with PCs where everyone is familiar with the practice of paying more for more powerful hardware in order for it to benefit from extra whizzbangs and pixels. Alternatively I could have quoted the entire post, and bolded the part I wanted to draw focus to, like this:
But that seemed unnecessary, as the bold would pretty much be my way of saying "look at this bit here", rather than everything else.
I acknowledged that whilst your purchase may not have been driven by primarily by graphics, this doesn't have a lot of bearing either way, because the XB1X similarly improves many quality of life aspects also. If a bigger HDD was all someone wanted, $70 for 2TB sounds far more reasonable than trading up for a $400 version of the same console with half that capacity (minus the 500gb you already had... so more like quarter the added capacity). But that didn't dissuade a recommendation that someone should "Just get a pro.", because unlike here you didn't isolate a single aspect of the upgrade to dump the entire cost upon. And in the case of the XB1X, it wouldn't be "slightly better effects" (plus resolution, performance, etc) unless you had already upgraded to a PS4 Pro... otherwise you'd be coming from an XB1 or PS4, where the the term "slightly" shouldn't really be applied to pretty much any part of the improvements.
Polygonal_Sprite
Member
If the image on the left is only slightly better... ah **k-it not even worth it lol.
Why does the PS4 Pro screenshot look so blurry? Wasn't there three modes on the Pro - 1) 4k native with lower graphics. 2) CB 4k with much better graphics. 3) 1080p with unlocked framerate and low graphics for maximum framerate?
No, there's no native 4k mode on the PS4 Pro.
There's
- CB 4K with other settings matching the regular PS4.
- 1080p with better graphics.
- Unlocked 1080p with settings matching the regular PS4.
No pro was 1)4kcb 2)1080p enhanced 3)1080p 60fps
You and I know how a good amount of Neogaf members are with not researching information so just providing snippets if info can be completely misleading. Many members do it here. Additionally, I sold my Ps4 for $200 to get the Pro so I did not pay full price. Essentially, subtracting the cost of a HD, I bought the Pro for $120. And if I recall GameStop had a deal to trade in your PS4 to get a discount on the PRO. Lastly, that post was 8 months ago...8 months ago. Enough, for a trial and assessment to make my current statement. Talk about reaching. And I bet the members of this thread didn't even check the date of the post.
I'll state again I didn't direct that post to you, but I stick to my stance. If you have to zoom 200% at specific a position of a rendered frame to discern a difference in image quality, more power to you. IMO, that's not worth $500 usd. It all just seems like a pissing contest for superiority.
And let me make it clear that comment is NOT directed towards you.
Polygonal_Sprite
Member
Thanks ^^
Zooming in 200% to see a difference......riiiiiiiiiiight lol
Kleegamefan
K. LEE GAIDEN
The really bad one will be the Read Dead Redemption 2 face off!
Since I MUST enjoy that game at its full graphical potential, I am buying an X for it. I feel RDR2 and PUBG will push sales of the X the most.
Add in the fact Red Dead Redemption 2 probably won't be available for the PC and that should REALLY push that thread over the top.
For sure, Battlefront 2 will be a huge thread......best graphics of any AAA title this fall+Pro/X/PC availability +60fps framerate = benchmark game for DF comparison. It will be ugly
OdysseusVA
Banned
Don't worry, I'm aware that your posts aren't directed at me specifically (besides parts that in direct response to something I posted to you), it's a forum and not PMs, otherwise I wouldn't have quoted you in the first place.
But yea, again these are things that apply across the board. If you were going to upgrade from an XB1X, you'd sell your XB1. You'd gain 500gb more HDD space (not the 2TB more that you'd have got for the $70... so you'd probably still end up space limited), and you certainly wouldn't need to zoom in to notice the graphical differences from that jump... again, that'd only (debatably) apply if you'd already made a jump to the PS4 Pro prior. The frequent portrayal of the options being as though you'd be paying $500/£450 to go from 4kcb to 4k native is disingenuous. It shouldn't be assumed that someone already has a PS4 Pro, and even if they did, paying $500 wouldn't only give you slightly better graphics.. it'd get you a whole new console in a separate ecosystem, as that price implies you kept the previous console too.
Uno Venova
Banned
Whew
thelastword
Banned
Yes, but that's the point....The PS4 is more powerful than the XB1 and XBONEX more powerful than PRO...so could it be that PRO had a lower resolution than 4kCB in cutscenes????
Just trying to figure this out, but i'm still leaning towards the extra blur on DF's Jacket pic is exxagerated quite a bit because of DOF, FXAA and the fact that CB resolves a bit worse over native when you zoom in. Native will always resolve better under zoom.
And here we go, it's undeniable that DOF blurs the entire image, with DOF added in on PRO + FXAA + a Zoom on a 4KCB shot, puts the XBONEX at huge advantage in terms of clarity, detail and sharpness....In essence, it's not close to an ideal comparison......From the next bit of the scene Lara is closer and well in the foreground but enabling DoF still blurs image.
I'd expect DoF to be in the final code, would be silly without it unless they want dat 4kness and it does look beautiful and also removes the gamey looking edges to bring a filmic like quality.
http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/116044
When we do a proper comparison, we will see then how big a disparity there is, if there is one......
One thing I think I should touch on for some of the driveby posts and persecution complex type posts....This is a tech thread, we get to the bottom of things..If proper methods are not used to draw towards a proper conclusion, we question it. This is not about subjective or overhyped conclusions, it's evidence based and has nothing to do with preferring a piece of hardware over the other....
The XBONEX is indeed more powerful than the PRO, but yet, every game will be tested and compared, so we can see the differences between the platforms, if they exist. At the end of the day not every game will show the power difference we expect and there are always tradeoffs if a developer values native 4k for XBONEX on top of better graphical features...4k native alone is a huge footprint on a GPU like the RX480 in modern games, on top of pushing all other logic and functions through a single pipeline. There will be tradeoffs guys because the XBONEX does not have infinte power...
So yes, i'ts a bit disingenuos to speak of the huge powerlift of the XBONEX over the PRO in non.. like for like situations. No one is saying your box is not more powerful, we simply want to show that power under fair conditions and comparisons....is all.....
On the flip, I've just seen this video on my youtube feed......If this is your take on this matter, when people are simply looking for more clarity in these comparisons, then I think you're doing something very wrong, or perhaps tech analyses are not for you.....