Sony burned through all of the PS1 and PS2 profits turning the PS3 around. Microsoft does have the means, if necessary, but I'm not sure they have the will.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
NPD Sales Results for January 2014 [Up3: PS4/XB1 #1/#2 best selling; Poke/SM3DW/ALBW]
- Thread starter Nirolak
- Start date
True, but NPD at least is really accounting for a much smaller portion of the market then they have in the past. Digital sales are now a signifigant thing, as is DLC for each individual game released. NPD gets retail numbers, but that is about it. Yes they are attempting to start tracking digital sales, but that is a fools game with the number of partners they would need to accurately report such numbers.
Just looking at the Xbox One for example. If you look at the top selling games on the dashboard Killer Instinct and XBOX Fitness are number 1 and 2. Forza Motorsport 5 is number three and that is a micro transaction hell hole. None of that is equated into current NPD numbers. Look at IOS games. Unless EA releases a press release on Simpsons tapped out, again NPD has no clue what is going on there. And then you have free games like flappy Birds which are all ad driven. I think outside of console sales, and retail sales for top games, NPD gives us a very small picture. Of the gaming industry as a whole.
Not to add too much to the ridiculous hyperbole in this thread but if that happens just before Titanfall comes out it's the beginning of the end for the Xbox division. Any substantial price cut would cut too deeply into profits and piss off shareholders/board members even more. The Xbone has to be profitable (and not just a little profitable) or the division is done. I'm of the opinion that they sealed their fate at E3 2013 but we'll just have to see how this plays out.
Hopefully this will at least shut people up who don't remember 2006 and who think brand loyalty in the US trumps anything else. Most of us in this country are capable of making an informed decision when we want to buy a $400-$500 luxury item. That's what's going on here, not some "it's a new Xbox so it's the only thing worth buying" shit.
shinra-bansho
Member
I see that more as a flaw in execution - I don't think having a motion sensing camera included is a bad thing, and it will probably be useful later for attracting late adopter markets, families looking for a home entertainment system. But it was useless for attracting early adopters. They shouldn't have tried to go after everyone at once essentially. Sony is sticking to their traditional strategy, target "core" audiences first and foremost and then others as they can afford to reduce the price.
At its core though the device is still ultimately conceptually pretty similar to the PS4 and aimed at the same audiences.
BruceLeeRoy
Banned
Yeah of course not I just find the notion that "panicked" companies being a good thing has never made sense to me.
At this point I think Microsoft should focus on being price competitive.
A quick look at the software charts will tell you that what's left of the dedicated device industry in the West is almost entirely driven by EA, Activision, Ubisoft, and Take-Two, so having a platform that is both more expensive and runs their games worse is not the place you want to be.
Exclusives are useful, but I think on a basic level you want to make sure you don't look double bad when it comes to the games that really matter.
A quick look at the software charts will tell you that what's left of the dedicated device industry in the West is almost entirely driven by EA, Activision, Ubisoft, and Take-Two, so having a platform that is both more expensive and runs their games worse is not the place you want to be.
Exclusives are useful, but I think on a basic level you want to make sure you don't look double bad when it comes to the games that really matter.
That's my point. PSP was "PS2 in the palm of your hand". 3DS is kinda "Wii in the palm of your hand", but Wii fell off way too hard for that to be a secure position. And Vita is just dead.
With the advent of mobile time-wasters with zero depth, that leaves a lot of market space for "real" games that wasn't there when MH on PSP was basically Japan's raiding scene.
or there's not a market for two devices priced $400 and over.
Rogue_Ledr
Banned
I can't even believe people would think Xbox One is "Struggling" at all, at least, at this point.
The console is still doing incredibly well. Just not PS4 well. Like I stated previously, this could EASILY change if MS made the right moves and Sony didn't properly counter them.
People are not asking the real question: What is Nintendo going to do with Wii U?
They are the ones who are struggling and really need to come up with a viable answer.
So what are the right moves?
The Maverick
Member
1. The decline of the 3DS should be scaring Nintendo. It peaked in 2012.
2. Microsoft losing North America means it's a wrap as far as competition goes. Distant second.
3. Wii U under 55k by the second January? No words.
I don't know how to feel about these numbers. Looks like all the people calling the fall of gaming weren't too far off. Going to wait until the PS4 is in stock before assessing the market entirely.
2. Microsoft losing North America means it's a wrap as far as competition goes. Distant second.
3. Wii U under 55k by the second January? No words.
I don't know how to feel about these numbers. Looks like all the people calling the fall of gaming weren't too far off. Going to wait until the PS4 is in stock before assessing the market entirely.
BrokenIcarus
Member
So the general consensus is that console gaming is dead?
C'mon guys, it's February. It's not going to be 250million+ across all three consoles, but it's not gonna die completely.
C'mon guys, it's February. It's not going to be 250million+ across all three consoles, but it's not gonna die completely.
Yeah, having essentially the same architecture should help a lot.
The Hermit
Member
It all begun at "panic Nintendo is best Nintendo."
They are about to become "fucked nintendo" now
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
With all the rumblings about MS barely finding their games division to be worth keeping, though, I'm not sure how the people upstairs would respond to cutting the price on the console. Is it even worth it to them to continue if it's floundering as is?
Delusibeta
Banned
It was December NPD, and had he not been banned he would have lost the bet.
[insert dancingmonokuma.gif here] [links certified spoiler free] [you know exactly what it's going to be]
Neuro
Member
According to the Wedbush report, they do not expect vita to sell more than 10 million units in its lifetime..
Argh, I'm going to say something stupid again and I am open for a tomato slugging
but Microsft should really put the brakes, do a recall and bump up the specs. Pay for it now rather than later.I really believe that these numbers are telling us that consumers know more than these companies give them credit for and it matters to them even if MS argues about it till our faces turn blue.
That would finish them in this industry. Guaranteed.
I wouldn't completely say this. Certain genres can appeal to more owners of one console over the other.
Didn't Bayonetta for the PS3 sell better than the 360 version?
Yeah, they will definitely do this.
Uh, I don't think February will do too hot either bruh
nothing's selling enormously well.
They need more than just third party support since all those third party games will be better on the PS4. They need third party exclusives, which become very hard to get when then competing console is performing a lot better.
It was also the successor to the most successful console in history.
rokkerkory
Member
Do we know if shooters are selling more on X1 vs PS4?
Wonder if shooter crowd still more on xbox and action/adventure games more on PS
Wonder if shooter crowd still more on xbox and action/adventure games more on PS
Really depends how important the play part of the work and play strategy is to leadership seeing as Xbox is their only entertainment brand.
BruceLeeRoy
Banned
Wiki is your friend here my man.
Yeah that will be nice for consumers but I don't know how happy stockholders will be.
It's not really /floundering/. It is low this month and would need something to boost it up before it lands itself in hot water though.
Removing the expensive camera is the fastest way to make it profitable at a cheaper price.
Saint Gregory
Member
The whole meme has been going on since Nintendo, seeming panicked by Sony's entry in the handheld market, went crazy and released the DS starting one of the best periods for them in their history.
I guess the pressure of what's going on with the XB1 will be good in the long run for gamers since it will force price cuts and fiercer competition but it's definitely not good for the gaming market.
I feel like for every case like that there are a dozen others where the 360 version sold better than PS3.
I'm not sure that's the most important question. Nintendo has cash and this is pretty much their entire business. Their stock prices will suffer but they can come back.
MS has a ton of cash but shareholders don't want them spending it on Xbox. MS has a wealth of products with most of them being huge profit centers like office, cloud, business, and OS. Poor sales is more detrimental to MS keeping the Xbox going more than this is detrimental to whether or not Nintendo will stop making consoles. Because the MS thing has a greater chance of happening first.
while true, i think the big difference between the two was supply. i forgot the ps3 was incredibly supply-restrained until january. the xbox one was kinda everywhere throughout a lot of december. it took the ps3 longer to hit 2.1m
shinra-bansho
Member
That's a possibility, but not one I ascribe to as yet, because it begs the question: where has the market gone?
And I don't believe mobile/tablets as yet, serves as a sufficient substitute for a home console device. It may in the future, but I don't think it does yet.
Last gen has died off more quickly than anticipated, but the generation has run on longer - thus the record breaking launches of both platforms. I will remain optimistic that these systems can return the market to historical norm for now, although we'll see I'm open to being completely wrong.
The weird thing is that this has been pretty damn obvious since at least 2008. Nothing Sony or Microsoft published last generation sold on par with any of the biggest third party franchises.
It is like Microsoft had a strange case of collective amnesia leading up to the release of Xbox One. There is no rationalizing whatever the hell Sony was thinking with initial PS3 pricing, but you could at least forgive them for not realizing nearly every big PC games developer would start making more money on Xbox 360 (Half-Life 2 sold 15 million copies, after all). In this case, it was pretty damn clear what was going to move units and what the best decision making would be to position yourself to benefit from it.
If it did that would only be because of Japan.
but then how else would they be able to tell you that shirt really doesn't go with those pants.
Hellsing321
Member
I wonder what will happen if things continue like this for the XBone and Microsoft does sell it off/spin it off to another company. Would third parties follow the brand? Could a company without as deep pockets as Microsoft actually fix it without operating in the red for years on end?
So Microsoft has not only lost this gen after 3 months it has also lost next gen? Holy shit.
well I am ready to eat my crow I predicted same ratio from December but with smaller number. Since in both case ps4 was supply constraint and xb1 all over.
This can't be good for MS. The console was design first and foremost for US. how can they survive? hell, sony at least has a little hope in japan.
This is an unbelievable change of events
This can't be good for MS. The console was design first and foremost for US. how can they survive? hell, sony at least has a little hope in japan.
This is an unbelievable change of events
honestly? steam. and sorta pc in general. microsoft was right to make the xbox one a sort of digital platform, but they also wanted a retail box with retail games and fucked up the execution in an amazing way.
pieatorium
Member
only january, nov and dec were leagues ahead for the one, ps3 cratered to not quite wii u levels but the worst for its time by june.
gundamkyoukai
Member
If the tear downs are right the camera cost 70 to 80 if i remember right so while it would be cheaper it might not be more profitable depending on the price drop .
Thunder Monkey
Banned
Currently that isn't true.
One has outsold PS3 significantly to date. But with this very precipitous drop who knows how long that will last. I honestly didn't expect it to start performing worse on a monthly unit basis until around May or June. This low this quick is almost as shocking as WiiU's first Jan cratering.
edit: Damn it.
I saw the post before the edit and now I look schizophrenic.
Aquamarine
Member
Welcome, Internet denizens and the CROWD AT THE REVERED FORUM OF NEOGAF
I, Aquamarine...a colleague and peer whom some of you may or may not recognize...know nothing! ABSOLUTELY NOTHING ABOUT NPD OR ITS NPD RELEASE.
I am just a HARMLESS GIRL who wanders the mire day in and DAY OUT!
So because I know nothing, I am going to say absolutely NOTHING about NPD numbers. You want NPD numbers? You have Creamsugar, our Lord and Saviour!!!!!!! And there are others as well on GAF who have NPD info like like...wait...I'm not supposed to talk about them...
But...
....before I go....
.........there is one thing I wish to say......
Look! Over there! Do you see it?
IT'S A SIGN FROM THE HEAVENS!!!!!
WHAT DOES IT SAY?!?!!?
IT
...
SAYS
...
...
...
....!
270K < PS4 < 272K
140K < Xbox One < 142K
48K < Wii U < 50K
AND WITH THAT, I DISAPPEAR.
FLASHBANG
*billowing smoke, exeunt*
I, Aquamarine...a colleague and peer whom some of you may or may not recognize...know nothing! ABSOLUTELY NOTHING ABOUT NPD OR ITS NPD RELEASE.
I am just a HARMLESS GIRL who wanders the mire day in and DAY OUT!
So because I know nothing, I am going to say absolutely NOTHING about NPD numbers. You want NPD numbers? You have Creamsugar, our Lord and Saviour!!!!!!! And there are others as well on GAF who have NPD info like like...wait...I'm not supposed to talk about them...
But...
....before I go....
.........there is one thing I wish to say......
Look! Over there! Do you see it?
IT'S A SIGN FROM THE HEAVENS!!!!!
WHAT DOES IT SAY?!?!!?
IT
...
SAYS
...
...
...
....!
270K < PS4 < 272K
140K < Xbox One < 142K
48K < Wii U < 50K
AND WITH THAT, I DISAPPEAR.
FLASHBANG
*billowing smoke, exeunt*
but xbone did win december?
As long as they could get the price down, the third party games will help.
Appealing exclusive content + features alongside good third party support at a good price is a good combo.
Yes. I mentioned before that I don't count Wii's success as indicative of a growing console market-- because most of its audience was temporary. And I also mentioned before that I thought sales of this gen would be similar to 5th or 6th gen.
I was too quick to want to prove a mod wrong that I posted something dumb and even contradicted myself.
Apologies to everyone I've made dumber.
considering the drop, and knowing how the fanbase for these consoles were trained on the ps3 and 360, it wouldn't surprise me if you were seeing incredibly frontloaded sales.
IMO, believe Nintendo can get out of this. If they release a new Zelda for the wii u that's enough for me to buy a wii u. Also if they can make a Pokemon game like the GCN one, gale of darkness or a donkey kong game like the one in N64 that was like Super Mario 64. Games like that would make me buy a wii u without a doubt.