The Librarian
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What is tnsply100 even arguing about?
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Late to the Party: The Wire (spoilers unmarked)
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PhoenixDark
Banned
tnsply100 said:
It's not a parallel though! We can agree Stringer was very different from Marlo. I doubt Marlo would spend time at a community college or read philosophy books in his spare time. Stringer's goal initially was to create a legitimate front for the Barksdale's, thus decreasing the amount of police tampering they had to deal with. He later decided he was going to bring Avon down, take over/legitimize the business, then move on.
Compare that to Marlo, who's only interest in business was to legitimize his money further, and support his crime empire. He doesn't hobnob with Levy's friends because he likes the company. They have something he wants.
Cornballer
Member
There really aren't enough gifs from The Wire in GAF's rotation. Here are a few you might find useful:RepairmanJack said:
somuchwater
Member
Dax01 said:
Yeah, this. I can't tell at all what is being argued here except for strange minutiae about genre or exposition... This is the weirdest thing I've seen on GAF in a while, and that's saying something.
afternoon delight
Member
YES.
Treefingers
Member
Sorry but I have to go back to one of your first posts in this thread tnsply100:
With a statement like this I'm surprised people are even responding to you.
tnsply100 said:
With a statement like this I'm surprised people are even responding to you.
MMaRsu
Banned
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YrzpoUjJ_0g
Love that scene from S2
And ofcourse..
I WANT SOME OF THAT PEPPAH STEAK
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXv-1CMcUu4&feature=related
MMaRsu
Banned
Acid08 said:
Fuck this kid for life. I hate this little shit and not just because he kills Omar. He's consistently a stupid little shit and I wish he got beat the fuck up more often.
MAN FUCK KENARD. I actually had a dream about that little shit last night. Can't remember if somebody in my dream mentioned him or if he was in there but I know I dreamt of him.
Kenard is the most annoying little fuck on the show imo. I'm glad Michael beat his bitchass up for taking that package.
Black Mamba
Member
As I said before, Marlo is the evolution (or devolution) or the gang life.
Stringer Bell wanted out of the game and to be legitimate. Why? Because the game was always about bettering yourself and once he got to that spot he wanted out. This was how it was supposed to be, at the least.
Stringer still adhered to a code. As Bunk said, "a man must have a code." When Omar's grandma was nearly shot, Stringer was furious they violated the Sunday Church rule. He sent her a new hat an apology. Stringer didn't take anyone who wasn't a threat to him.
Avon wasn't much different. The only thing is he was cynical towards the belief that they could escape the game as a whole, so he ignored it. but he too was a man of some code. He gave Cuddy money to finance a gym to help kids stay off the streets. He protected as much he could those who protected him, even if they were eaten by the game.
Now cut to Marlo. Marlo had no code at all. He took out Prop Joe after teaching him the ways. He went after the security guard just because he could. He took out one dude for basically just annoying him by questioning a couple things. Stringer didn't do that with Bodie.
Remember what Bodie said to McNulty before he got capped? IMO, that scene conveyed the entire point of the show. But anyway, he talked about how Marlo's crew was different. That he didn't care about them because where would they be for him?
Chris and Snoop were extensions of this. They didn't question any kills, they just did. And when Michael asked Snoop about why so & so had to get capped, she said cuz they've heard he's saying stuff and Michael wondered why go ahead without verifying it because he didn't believe it and Snoop basically said "it's just his time, now," and "deserve got nothing to do with it."
Avon and Stringer capped people because they deserved it, albeit in their own messed up world (which included witnesses), but it was still a code. Marlo's crew ran without a code.
So that is the point of the final scene. Marlo was the antithesis to Stringer, yes. And Stringer fought so hard to get out of the game and become legitimate and died trying while Marlo gets out scott free and gets what Stringer wanted. But here's Marlo returning to the street to take a corner. To take his name.
The point of that is to show that what we've done, as a society, is making the "corner boys" and the "street game" so fucked up that now they want to be a part of the game for the sake of the game itself. Marlo doesn't want out. He wants to be in charge, live without a code, and die doing it. No longer are people just turning to this drug dealing life to make provide for families, they're doing it because they want power.
We've made the "street game" worse. That's what it's about.
At least, IMO.
Stringer Bell wanted out of the game and to be legitimate. Why? Because the game was always about bettering yourself and once he got to that spot he wanted out. This was how it was supposed to be, at the least.
Stringer still adhered to a code. As Bunk said, "a man must have a code." When Omar's grandma was nearly shot, Stringer was furious they violated the Sunday Church rule. He sent her a new hat an apology. Stringer didn't take anyone who wasn't a threat to him.
Avon wasn't much different. The only thing is he was cynical towards the belief that they could escape the game as a whole, so he ignored it. but he too was a man of some code. He gave Cuddy money to finance a gym to help kids stay off the streets. He protected as much he could those who protected him, even if they were eaten by the game.
Now cut to Marlo. Marlo had no code at all. He took out Prop Joe after teaching him the ways. He went after the security guard just because he could. He took out one dude for basically just annoying him by questioning a couple things. Stringer didn't do that with Bodie.
Remember what Bodie said to McNulty before he got capped? IMO, that scene conveyed the entire point of the show. But anyway, he talked about how Marlo's crew was different. That he didn't care about them because where would they be for him?
Chris and Snoop were extensions of this. They didn't question any kills, they just did. And when Michael asked Snoop about why so & so had to get capped, she said cuz they've heard he's saying stuff and Michael wondered why go ahead without verifying it because he didn't believe it and Snoop basically said "it's just his time, now," and "deserve got nothing to do with it."
Avon and Stringer capped people because they deserved it, albeit in their own messed up world (which included witnesses), but it was still a code. Marlo's crew ran without a code.
So that is the point of the final scene. Marlo was the antithesis to Stringer, yes. And Stringer fought so hard to get out of the game and become legitimate and died trying while Marlo gets out scott free and gets what Stringer wanted. But here's Marlo returning to the street to take a corner. To take his name.
The point of that is to show that what we've done, as a society, is making the "corner boys" and the "street game" so fucked up that now they want to be a part of the game for the sake of the game itself. Marlo doesn't want out. He wants to be in charge, live without a code, and die doing it. No longer are people just turning to this drug dealing life to make provide for families, they're doing it because they want power.
We've made the "street game" worse. That's what it's about.
At least, IMO.
Messypandas
Member
Acid08 said:
Fuck this kid for life. I hate this little shit and not just because he kills Omar. He's consistently a stupid little shit and I wish he got beat the fuck up more often.
Yo, step up or step off gump
Messypandas
Member
Black Mamba said:
You make some good points, but i think you have these too confused, no offense. Stringer craved money and power and Avon wanted to retain pride and street credibility. Stringer had no qualms about ok'ing the sunday hit, it was on on reflection that he acted furious to save face in front of Avon.
Stringer consistently used tactics that would maximise profits for the Barksdale empire, including joining the co-op much to Avon's dismay. Avon didn't give a fuck about the money, even if he was selling crap dope he didn't want to sacrifice or share turf.
PhoenixDark said:
Perhaps "parallel" was a poor choice of words. But the writers certainly wanted to draw comparisons between Stringer and Marlo without laying the proper foundation for it. Here is David Simon's quote on the matter -
Now - this is essentially nonsensical. "Marlo ends up being granted what Stringer wanted" ?? It isn't clear what exactly Marlo was "granted" in that final scene, but still - why in the world would Marlo even consider wanting to be a developer. We certainly didn't see Marlo crave being a legitimate developer at any point.
Suddenly, out of the blue, Marlo reveals to Slim Charles that he can't wrap his head around it, but he's going to be a businessman. Here is a guy who has millions of dollars, can do anything legal that he wants - why would he even consider wearing a suit and putting himself through "hell" ?
And that's essentially the complaint - the writers seem to have just thrown in a scene with Marlo in a suit just to draw comparison or illustrate whatever "grand irony" they were trying to get across. They did not lay the proper foundation for it and make sure it was consistent with Marlo's character as previously portrayed.
That's as clearly as I can explain it.
Black Mamba
Member
Messypandas said:
You're right, now that I recall. He okay'd the hit, but didn't know the grandmother was with them. He was also in a business meeting and wasn't focused. He indicated later he would have never okay'd it if he was told about her, but he could have just been saving face. I still like to believe he wouldn't have.
Yeah, but I found this to be a result of Avon accepting his place. In a way, he never believed he had all the stuff he had. He was still dreaming about it.
Stringer was about business and Avon was about pride (for lack of a better term coming to mind). Both had some self-respecting qualities about it. Marlo had none.
I recall near the end when levy tells Marlo about Chris eating the murders and if he'd do it. Marlo's response was something like "yeah, as long as i take care of his family it's all good." Basically, he knew he'd have to buy Chris's trust despite everything we've seen. Since Marlo had no code or real honor about him, he knew it. Wee-bay, in contrast, seemed like someone who'd go to bat for Avon no matter what. Yes, his family was taken care of for as long as possible, but it seemed like a more mutual aspect. Wee-bay had Avon's back and Avon had his. Even now, Marlo had to buy Chris's back.
tnsply100 said:
It was perfectly consistent and sensical. Marlo was only interested in power and the glory of being king of the streets. He didn't actually care about money - that's what you find out in that scene. The last shot of Marlo is him in a corner after having ran off other drug dealers, and just standing there not really knowing what else to do.
This was contrasted to him in suit and tie at the business meeting. He got everything Stringer wanted, to parlay his criminal dealings into something more legitimate and just as lucrative, but Marlo never cared about any of that. He was meant to be portrayed as a soldier, but one with a leader's charisma and force of personality. The final shot depicts this beautifully and in highly-effective, pithy fashion.
Battersea Power Station
Member
Demand a refund.tnsply100 said:
PhoenixDark
Banned
tnsply100 said:
The irony is that Stringer, a smart, educated, well read gangster was dicked around by developers before ultimately dying right as his investment became shovel ready - at which point a completely street oriented gangster was handed his empire essentially by being at the right place at the right time.
Marlo has no interest in business, reading, real estate, etc. He's there before Levy takes him, and Levy takes him because he knows Marlo has the cash to dominate Baltimore. Marlo's interest is simply freeing up his money so he can actually spend it. He wants to rule Baltimore and have his name ring on every corner. Using his money to set up legitimate businesses/real estate would do that while keeping the police off his ass.
PhoenixDark said:
I've addressed this before... Marlo was using Levy to launder money through season 5, and there was never any need to hobnob with developers then, and there sure as heck isn't any now (in the final scene). "Freeing up money to spend" did not require him to go through "hell" as David Simon puts it - he's done that with the offshore church/hospital guy (that Joe pointed him to), and through Levy from his office.
The Librarian
Banned
Hm. This thread has me itching for a Wire re-watch. This'll be my first re-watch since I got the series back in '09.
First I wanna finish BSG.
First I wanna finish BSG.
The Librarian
Banned
Yeah I know. But I feel compelled to finish it.CygnusXS said:
ACESandEIGHTS
Member
Could they have made Marlo Stanfield a worse character?
As much as I liked Carver and Prezbyluski, I always wanted Marlo to get capped in the face, in a way that I never felt like with D'angelo, Stringer, Avon, etc.
Brilliant job at making someone so fictional so hated.
afternoon delight
Member
I'd say Marlo worked equally as hard for his - just carried himself a different way.
To me Marlo just seemed like an emotionless dude for most of the series. Nothing ever seemed to phase him that much and Chris and Snoop did all his dirty work whereas Avon was out there being a soldier constantly even though he already had everything he could ever need.
The scene that turned my feelings on Marlo was when they were in prison and Chris finally told him that Omar had been dragging his name around. Marlo finally showed some passion about something and it was a nice change from his usual character.
The scene that turned my feelings on Marlo was when they were in prison and Chris finally told him that Omar had been dragging his name around. Marlo finally showed some passion about something and it was a nice change from his usual character.
BaronLundi
Member
UrbanRats said:
Yeah, 4:3 and no blu-ray is sad.
Wait a minute... STAY THE FUCK OUT OF THIS THREAD
The Librarian
Banned
I heard Simon describe it differently: Each season is like a chapter in a book.CygnusXS said:
tnsply100 said:
It was to put a stamp on the fact that Marlo's interests lied completely elsewhere, in contrast to most of the other characters who would have loved to have been in his spot (Stringer Bell primarily, as he had been gunning for that exact thing prior to being killed). For Marlo, it simply wasn't enough, and more to the point, it wasn't at all the direction he wanted to go in. He saw himself as a soldier on the streets with a name he wanted to put out there to be feared and respected, not some shmuck in a suit and tie (as he views it). Try to think back to that scene where Avon and Stringer finally have it out over the whole "go legitimate" thing - while it could have been surmised previously, Marlo is ultimately and clearly shown to side with Avon in that debate, and fiercely.
Levy was introducing Marlo to businessmen and property dealers and such at the end because they had both just gotten off major charges through bargains (the same deal that sent Chris Partlow to jail for life), and Levy wanted to use Marlo Stanfield still-substantial money to go through (somewhat) more legitimate avenues. Stanfield, after his release from prison, sold his connection to the Greeks to the rest of the Co-Op as a way of reducing the targets on him. But clearly, Stanfield didn't care for going legit. He slips out the meeting, goes back to the streets and beats up two random Omar-praising dealers on a random corner. His final shot is of him just standing there on the corner smiling, with no direction to head in, as a metaphor for his life. By the end he's sold his big drug connection with the Greeks as a way out of the game, but doesn't particularly want to do anything else, and doesn't even have any real clout on the streets on top of that.
Rewatching Season 2 for the third time, and it baffles me even more how this is the least favorite season with many fans. Even if you don't like the docks the amount of things that happen here is just unrivaled. So many powerful scenes. Just saw the whole gun affair when they fail to drop the bag in the water. If you're a big Stringer fan this has to be the best season.
Also at the beginning of that episode where the shootout happens and the innocent kid gets killed because he got curious and wanted to take a peek through his window. And how the mom goes "it's over, get your ass to school" right after it's quiet again as if it's an everyday thing. Plenty of those moments that just hit the right notes in that season.
Also at the beginning of that episode where the shootout happens and the innocent kid gets killed because he got curious and wanted to take a peek through his window. And how the mom goes "it's over, get your ass to school" right after it's quiet again as if it's an everyday thing. Plenty of those moments that just hit the right notes in that season.
It gets so good that when you rewatch the series again you'll find the first three episodes to be amazingAkim said:
Snuggler said:
yeah that was the great thing in the end, they didnt respect him
i lol'd when omar was out having a cigarette in his p.j's and since he was stood outside a stash house they were like oh shit take our shit and threw their drugs out the window, when really he was just strolling by
Not reading the thread because I'm only just getting into the series myself but thought I'd let other people interested in buying it know that the whole run is currently available for $13 a season on iTunes. Just bought season one yesterday and after a couple episodes I'm pretty sure I'm just going to go ahead and buy the whole thing. God damn, this is good tv.
FantasticMrFoxdie
Mumber
stupei said:
WTF R U DOING HERE. Stay away from the spoilers!
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