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Google bans atheist commentator from youtube

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140.85

Cognitive Dissonance, Distilled
Boogie said:
Why is it that every time someone says this, they never offer their own, "accurate" translations of said verses in order to demonstrate how "massacred" they are?

Because, even if you strictly translate the scriptures of Islam, the criticisms are still supported by the words.
 
140.85 said:
More and more people in the west are turning a blind eye to the Islamic threat so I'm very pessimistic about our chances to defend ourselves. How many youTube videos are kept up or altogether ignored that criticize Catholicism or Judaism?
Many think fighting Islamism is George Bush's fight and would rather gouge their own eyes out than align themselves with anything "Bushie" thinks or does, even though the fact is that this issue transcends the Bush administration. Years of multiculturalism and moral relativism have weakened the west to the point that some think our country and it's leaders are more evil than radical Islam. It's a recipe for disaster and the best possible situation for the enemy. We've learned nothing - the fact that people scoff and laugh at any mention of September the 11th and what happened that day is quite telling. The only thing it represents to them now is some Orwellian icon leveraged by Bush.


I couldn't agree more, except about moral relativism. You don't need to be a moral absolutist or a moral objectivist to realize just how scary Islam is. Postmodernism and, as you pointed out, multiculturalism are to blame.
 
Just saw the vid. Quran seems really fond of fire. Anyway I'm a leftist and I endorse the critisism of every religion (and especially the ones that derived from the Jewish mythology and seem the most rotten ones) so I don't agree with the generalization that leftists are attacking christanity and defend Islam. If anything Islam seems to have more fundamentalits than christianity which I consider worse.
 

Nikashi

Banned
Slurpy said:
uhh...

I won't even bother. May God shed some of your enlightened self amongst us all.


I think his quote was referring to the enlightenment of Christianity around when they decided to stop literally following the bible word for word, and stopped stoning people for adultery and burning people as witches (Salem aside). All that shit is still in the Bible, but it's entirely disregarded by the overwhelming vast majority of Christians.

The Muslim religion is still fairly fundamentalist in that respect, from my understanding, and there are a number of passages in the Qu'ran with violence similar to that in the Bible (Stone/kill non-believers, etc) which really shouldn't apply or be followed anymore in a modern society.


Oh, and as for the video being removed, this is nothing to do with Google's political views, this is just about Google not wanting to bring any shitstorm down upon themselves. Simple cartoons have caused worldwide uproar and murder, this is them covering their ass. Christians just don't seem to give a shit, so the Anti Christian videos stay up. This is unfortunately just common sense right now.
 

Boogie

Member
Nikashi said:
I think his quote was referring to the enlightenment of Christianity around when they decided to stop literally following the bible word for word, and stopped stoning people for adultery and burning people as witches (Salem aside). All that shit is still in the Bible, but it's entirely disregarded by the overwhelming vast majority of Christians.

Uh, no, I'd imagine Phlegm was referring to the actual Enlightenment.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Enlightenment
 
Nikashi said:
I think his quote was referring to the enlightenment of Christianity around when they decided to stop literally following the bible word for word, and stopped stoning people for adultery and burning people as witches (Salem aside). All that shit is still in the Bible, but it's entirely disregarded by the overwhelming vast majority of Christians.

The Muslim religion is still fairly fundamentalist in that respect, from my understanding, and there are a number of passages in the Qu'ran with violence similar to that in the Bible (Stone/kill non-believers, etc) which really shouldn't apply or be followed anymore in a modern society.

Boogie said:
Uh, no, I'd imagine Phlegm was referring to the actual Enlightenment.

Haha, I was a bit unclear. Yes, I was talking about the time period, but in my mind it was that time of blossoming of science and philosophy that lead to the moderate version of Christianity which is most popular these days (less so in the USA, but still...).

Nikashi said it very well.


Sadly, it will be much more difficult for Muslims to ignore the bad parts of the Quran than it was for Christians and the Bible.

First, because it's explicitely said in the Quran who wrote it and how it was written (the archangel Gabriel dictated it word for word to Mohammed), making it rather hard to claim that the bad verses are in the Quran because it was written by fallible humans.

Second, because the Bible makes it easy for Christians to say that Jesus negated... err I mean 'fulfilled' the old covenant, which is something that's just not possible with the Quran.

Third, because the current methodology (the principle of abrogation) used for resolving contradictions contained within Muslim scripture is that more recent verses take precedence over older verses; unfortunately, the peaceful parts of the Quran happen to be the older ones, so they are superseded by the violent, oppressive, more recent ones.
 

7Th

Member
I won't argue if the comments of the critic were accurate, valid or not, the simple fact of him being censored in an act that isn't something to be celebrated at all. YouTube administration is indeed in control of every video they decide to show on their website so legally they aren’t stepping over any barrier, but it does seems to be terrible for an organization with such power over today’s culture, one that supposedly was born directly to support free speech, to be selective of what they’re able to show or not, specially since this is no copyrighted material or even cp.
 
"Hirsi Ali: The doctrine stating that the faith is inalterable because the Koran was dictated by God must be replaced. Muslims must realize that it was human beings who wrote the holy scriptures. After all, most Christians don't believe in hell, in the angels or in the earth having been created in six days. They now see these things as symbolic stories, but they still remain true to their faith."

I read the interview and this last part is really interesting.

As an atheist myself I think religions are a waste of time, but you have, at least in most democratic countries, the right to believe in whatever/whoever pleases you.
As long you don´t try to convert/convince me, try to force it in schools science classes or use it as an argument why this or that law should be approved or not, fine.

But it´s a big, big problem when you have a religion, whichever one, that reaches a point where a medium has to censor/supress any criticism against it out of fear. Specially when videos that criticize other religions are still up.
 

Pachael

Member
Sidestepping the contents in the video - I echo the OP's comments about Google becoming our new Web overlords. Which is worrying if only for the fact that Google and Apple are becoming the new 'nice corporations' while using Microsoft as their foil and the whole Darth Vader shtick.

So pray tell guys, what's the alternative? What, Microsoft? Yahoo? Myspace?

Altavista?

Hello?
 
I just wanted to add that people often take verses out of the Quran out of context. The time of Muhammed wasn't a very peaceful one and there were numerous numbers of battles against the "non-believers".
 

Chairman Yang

if he talks about books, you better damn well listen
CurseoftheGods said:
I just wanted to add that people often take verses out of the Quran out of context. The time of Muhammed wasn't a very peaceful one and there were numerous numbers of battles against the "non-believers".

That's true, but does the violent historical context of the Quran really make the verses better? I mean, I know some violent-sounding verses refer to specific enemies of Muhammad and aren't supposed to be generalized to all unbelievers, but you'd think the perfect word of Allah would be less ambiguous about this sort of thing and be a little less prone to misinterpretation.
 
CurseoftheGods said:
I just wanted to add that people often take verses out of the Quran out of context. The time of Muhammed wasn't a very peaceful one and there were numerous numbers of battles against the "non-believers".

it seems to me that the whole "things were different in that time, that's why it seems so bad" defense shouldn't apply when we're supposedly talking about the "all knowing never changing word of a loving God".
 

DopeyFish

Not bitter, just unsweetened
Cyan said:
You mean these people?

_15678_london-demo-7-2-2006.jpg

the fantastic 4 are on their way?
 

Nikashi

Banned
soul creator said:
it seems to me that the whole "things were different in that time, that's why it seems so bad" defense shouldn't apply when we're supposedly talking about the "all knowing never changing word of a loving God".


He wasn't charging it with being less relavent due to the fact the time period is different, he was stating that the verses themselves are more specific in scope, referring to a specific group, rather than non-believers as a whole.
 
Nikashi said:
He wasn't charging it with being less relavent due to the fact the time period is different, he was stating that the verses themselves are more specific in scope, referring to a specific group, rather than non-believers as a whole.

Too bad there's not a single Muslim, except two or three scholars living in Europe, who actually believe that.
 
Cyan said:
You mean these people?

_15678_london-demo-7-2-2006.jpg

Yes. You have to realize that there are 1.4 billion Muslims in the world today, and it is the world's fastest growing religion. People like those in the picture really do not represent Islam, and should be ashamed to call themselves Muslims.


Nikashi said:
He wasn't charging it with being less relavent due to the fact the time period is different, he was stating that the verses themselves are more specific in scope, referring to a specific group, rather than non-believers as a whole.

Exactly.

PhlegmMaster said:
Too bad there's not a single Muslim, except two or three scholars living in Europe, who actually believe that.

That's horrible of you to say. :(

I myself believe that and I know plenty of other Muslims who also do.
 
CurseoftheGods said:
I myself believe that and I know plenty of other Muslims who also do.

I'm not saying every Muslim actually takes those verses to heart, or else the number of tourists in Muslim countries would be much lower than it currently is. What I am saying is that among the general Muslim population, those parts of the Quran are believed, although they're only remembered when Islam and Mohammed are insulted or critiqued. The kind of tortuous reasoning you describe, while widespread in Christianity, is a novel phenomenon in Islam, and is limited to a few scholars and a small minority of moderates.

People like those in the picture really do not represent Islam, and should be ashamed to call themselves Muslims.

That's the mirror image of what reality is like. People like you don't represent Islam. The majority of Muslims almost see moderates like you as apostates and betrayers, and would tell you that you "should be ashamed to call yourself a Muslim".

It's really quite amazing how badly screwed up these people's minds are. I used to have two Muslim friends whom I thought were moderates in the same sense that the majority of Christians are moderates. They seemed like good people, they were well educated, and all that. It's only when we got into a conversation about evolution that I found out they were both young earth creationists, they believed every word in the Quran is the infallible, ineffable word of Allah, they believed that the Sharia should be law in this country (Canada), and they told me that while they themselves wouldn't kill someone who insulted Islam, they were glad there were Muslims who did. Needless to say, I stayed the hell away from them after that.

Western governments and corporations wouldn't bend the knee as Google has if radical Muslims were just a tiny insignificant minority.
 

JB1981

Member
misleading thread title.

they banned him because he was ridiculing Islam and the Koran, yet they didn't have a problem when he did the same to the bible and christianity.
 

Okin

Member
Hey Slurpy, let's see you finish what you started. What are the correct translations?

And Youta Mottenai, excellent post.
 

Rorschach

Member
Enron said:
Because there's the perception (perhaps not unwarranted) that the Left is very anti-Christianity (due to most of that population being moderate or conservative) but yet want to be all-inclusive at the same time, preaching tolerance (almost to a fault) of differing religions/views.
It's so sad that the Republicans have taken everything from the Democrats. Everything from rock and roll to Christianity to friggin' patriotism. The fact is, most of the candidates are Christian, yet somehow the Republicans have managed to paint themselves as the more Christian party because they are willing to infringe on other people's beliefs to further their own. It amazes me that Bush can sit there with a straight face and tell us about how he has spoken with God and he doesn't get called out on it and Christians aren't offended. If it were anyone else, people would deem that person crazy. I'm sure when God spoke to him, He talked about how Jesus was all about wars and governing by fear.

I like how Bush can talk down to us about the sanctity of marriage and the rights of unborn fetuses while those of our people are being trampled on. All the while, the VP and his daughter get a free pass. "Oh, these mandates only apply to people we don't know." And don't even get me started on bringing up the founding fathers and the constitution. When it best serves them, we're supposed to look at the intent, but when it doesn't, we're supposed to look at the literal interpretation.

I really wish there was a strong third party. The people made their voices heard by putting the democrats in power, but they are just a pathetic shamble of party that doesn't even know what it believes anymore. They have let the Republicans shape them into what they wanted by questioning their patriotism and values. Hell, they're they majority, but they won't even hold discussions about propositions that they themselves have put on the table because they get bullied and sidestepped by the opposing party. And all they can do is hold a discussion about whether or not they should even discuss issues.

..er oops seems I went off on a rant. I hope I haven't emboldened any terrorists in the process...
 
There is nothing insulting directly in the video that was posted, can any muslim refute that? All was taken from your holy book, if you don't like it choose another religion. Or perhaps, choose none. Since you were born with none.
 

Enron

Banned
Rorschach said:
It's so sad that the Republicans have taken everything from the Democrats. Everything from rock and roll to Christianity to friggin' patriotism. The fact is, most of the candidates are Christian, yet somehow the Republicans have managed to paint themselves as the more Christian party because they are willing to infringe on other people's beliefs to further their own. It amazes me that Bush can sit there with a straight face and tell us about how he has spoken with God and he doesn't get called out on it and Christians aren't offended. If it were anyone else, people would deem that person crazy. I'm sure when God spoke to him, He talked about how Jesus was all about wars and governing by fear.

I like how Bush can talk down to us about the sanctity of marriage and the rights of unborn fetuses while those of our people are being trampled on. All the while, the VP and his daughter get a free pass. "Oh, these mandates only apply to people we don't know." And don't even get me started on bringing up the founding fathers and the constitution. When it best serves them, we're supposed to look at the intent, but when it doesn't, we're supposed to look at the literal interpretation.

I really wish there was a strong third party. The people made their voices heard by putting the democrats in power, but they are just a pathetic shamble of party that doesn't even know what it believes anymore. They have let the Republicans shape them into what they wanted by questioning their patriotism and values. Hell, they're they majority, but they won't even hold discussions about propositions that they themselves have put on the table because they get bullied and sidestepped by the opposing party. And all they can do is hold a discussion about whether or not they should even discuss issues.

..er oops seems I went off on a rant. I hope I haven't emboldened any terrorists in the process...

Republicans haven't taken "anything" from Democrats. Its just, quite simply, that religious people tend to be more conservative socially. Therefore they identify more with the conservative party. End of story.

As far as your speaking to god rant goes, when was the last time you were in a church? "God spoke to me" doesnt mean you are a loonie that thinks god actually sits and has conversations with you, it means you feel as if God is trying to tell you something. "Speaking to god" simply means prayer.

And wtf? What "mandate" is Bush giving the VP and his daughter a free pass on? Last i checked, being a lesbian isn't against the law, and no one (not even evil republicans) want to criminalize homosexuality. Worst rant ever. If you are going to rant on something, at least refrain from making stuff up.
 
DCharlie said:
Just noticed - not sure why - that all the plackards are obviously written by the same person... curious.
I noticed that too. I was thinking maybe it was a photoshop, or just some rabble rouser who showed up at a rally and handed out signs.
 
D

Deleted member 1235

Unconfirmed Member
Instigator said:
I'm confused about this thread. Is it about evil Google, evil Muslims or evil liberals?

I think Ark said that google is an evil pack of liberal muslims.
 

Kapsama

Member
Boogie said:
brilliant rebuttal sir. Clearly, I am hopping mad, given the amount of capslocked words and exclamation points in my post.

oh wait.
I wonder what was said before the edit. You scared doggie?
 
google sucks lately in several ways. the main google search and google groups 3 beta, there usenet archive.

Yahoo has been finding more things for me than google as of late.

btw, the best old-school search engine was lnfoseek.
 

Boogie

Member
Kapsama said:
I wonder what was said before the edit. You scared doggie?

This is what was said before the edit:

"brilliant rebuttal sir. Clearly, I am hoping mad, given the amount of capslocked words and exclamation points in my post.

oh wait."

CAN YOU SPOT THE DIFFERENCE?
 

Kapsama

Member
terrene said:
Ohhh, that ****ing Cam'ron song! I got it now.

...Haha, you listen to Cam'ron. Loser.
I might be a loser but you're dense.:lol

Boogie said:
This is what was said before the edit:

"brilliant rebuttal sir. Clearly, I am hoping mad, given the amount of capslocked words and exclamation points in my post.

oh wait."

CAN YOU SPOT THE DIFFERENCE?
You obviously are since you can found in many similar threads always lamenting about the poor treatment of Christians when compared to the favored Muslims.

Azih said:
Why can black people make fun of white people, but white people can't make fun of black people?

:(

Classic.
 

Boogie

Member
Kapsama said:
You obviously are since you can found in many similar threads always lamenting about the poor treatment of Christians when compared to the favored Muslims.

This is news to me. Can you find these posts of mine, please?

Because for the most part, I don't give a shit how Christians are treated on the internet. As a Christian, my skin is thick enough to handle being made fun of on the internet.

What I am concerned with is hypocrisy, and the trampling of freedoms and liberties through intimidation.

also, you haven't spotted the difference :(
 
PhlegmMaster said:
Westerners are blinded by the fact that in many of our countries, 'fundamentalist' is often synonymous with 'extremist', with a relatively small minority.

Islam is different from Christianity in that the vast majority of Muslims are fundamentalists, and more than a tiny minority are radical fanatics. Moderate or 'liberal' Muslims do exist, but they're very rare
. Unfortunately, unlike Christianty, Islam hasn't gone through the Enlightenment yet.

Where are you getting this bullshit? I've been sitting back reading your posts about Islam and I find them extremely one sided and inaccurate.

The building blocks of Islam are based on 5 pillars, and suicide bombings have nothing to do with it. Last time I checked the Koran states that to commit suicide is to forever seperate yourself from Allah.

The majority of Muslims in the world are located in Asia - not the middle east or Britian. So why are you making such broad generalizations?
 

unifin

Member
PhoenixDark said:
Where are you getting this bullshit? I've been sitting back reading your posts about Islam and I find them extremely one sided and inaccurate.

The building blocks of Islam are based on 5 pillars, and suicide bombings have nothing to do with it. Last time I checked the Koran states that to commit suicide is to forever seperate yourself from Allah.

The majority of Muslims in the world are located in Asia - not the middle east or Britian. So why are you making such broad generalizations?

Exactly. Before you start slandering religions yourself, you should honestly at least post some reliable statistics. :lol

And let's refrain from using loaded language like "excellent job attacking Christianity" and so forth. I respect your opinion, but throwing around phrases like that is just going to get people angry.
 

malek4980

Rosa Parks hater
PhoenixDark said:
The building blocks of Islam are based on 5 pillars, and suicide bombings have nothing to do with it. Last time I checked the Koran states that to commit suicide is to forever seperate yourself from Allah.

There is a verse in the Quran that prohibits suicide (and many others in the Hadith), but there are many verses that also praise martyrdom. What you see as an act of suicide the Jihadist sees as act of martyrdom. You think what he did was morally shameful under Islam, while he thinks it was morally praiseworthy and something rewarded by Allah.

This is why people like Harris and Dawkins go after moderate believers. The moderates praise faith, give legitimacy to a text while selectively choosing what they adhere to. The fundamentalist is not as selective.

PhoenixDark said:
The majority of Muslims in the world are located in Asia - not the middle east or Britian. So why are you making such broad generalizations?

And all this time I thought a large part of the Middle East was in Asia.
 
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