• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Transgender journalist at EG Expo called "this person" on stage at MS event (See OP)

Status
Not open for further replies.
C

Cryoflar3

Member
LeeRoyBrown said:
f50928bec271bb75dcf758b76381257c.jpeg


OK.

So....was the presenter not aware she was a male at birth and still looks like one but prefers to be called a women?

Or was the presenter aware, and just being a dickhead?

I need some context here? Is there a video of this?

What's the story behind it?
Click to expand...

He called her an "it" twice. You don't refer to someone like that unless you know. Even if they still look like a man its much more respectful to refer to them as a man than an it. At the very least you're not dehumanizing them.
 
R

Replicant

Member
Jenga said:
"still in shock"?

don't patronize her now
Click to expand...

Don't mean to. I'm just speaking from personal experience after hearing insult as a gay guy (the F word) from someone I considered a friend. My first thought process was "Ah, he probably didn't mean what he mean, did he?", trying to cope with the shock of hearing the word in the first place.
 
W

Warmijwilf

Banned
B-Dubs said:
He called her "it," so I'd say it was fairly intentional. When was the last time you called someone "it" in regards to their gender?
Click to expand...

Sigh. We have no context as to what "it" was aimed at. Like I said, the guy was referring to avatars as "it" when I was there (yes I was there and fully know what comedian people are talking about) so she could've taken offense to something not even aimed at her in the first place and she could've just understood.

All we have is one side of the story and people have already made up their minds. Wonderful.
 
A

Amalthea

Banned
You just don't call people "it". This term is humiliating beyond gender. It's humiliating your dignity as a human person.
 
T

TheStevo

Banned
Alo81 said:
Calling someone it is never justified and removes any room for confusion in your argument.
Click to expand...
Oh please, let's stop with the high horse mantra. The world is not black and white; stating declaratives when none of us have the context is silly.
 
M

macewank

Member
Warmijwilf said:
The guy was improvising for the most part, he wasn't given a script and brief representing Microsoft's views and policies. Or if he was, he ignored it. Thus, he wasn't representing Microsoft.
Click to expand...

when microsoft pays someone to get on stage and talk at a microsoft event, they are a representative of microsoft.
 
L

Loofy

Member
So... Im gonna say this probably didnt have anything to do with gender. Mainly cause I just dont think anyone is that stupid to cause that much controversy.

He probably referred to her as 'it' because he thought she was some weird otaku person. Hes a comedian.
 
KaiserBecks

KaiserBecks

Member
Replicant said:
Yes, let's blame the victim, who's likely still in shock and trying to rationalize that people can't possibly be that hurtful to another person.
Click to expand...

Do you live on cotton ball island? It was a joke in bad taste and uncalled for, but some people here need a reality check. Would you be "in shock", because somebody made fun of you? There are plenty of people out there who probably don't like you. Screw them, move on.
 
NoMoreTrolls

NoMoreTrolls

Banned
Holy shit that's reprehensible. This kind of garbage doesn't benefit anybody but bigots; the comedian should have known better than to make tasteless jokes of this nature.

The people who are trying to make this about Microsoft are jumping the gun a bit, though. It's not like Microsoft explicitly allowed him to be a bigot on stage. Microsoft is generally known for being a great LGBT employer, as far as I know.
 
I

inherendo

Member
DomeSplitter said:
So because some one was insulted/humiliated, the ENTIRE Microsoft staff that worked that day has to be reprimanded?

You're a little bit extreme aren't ya?
Click to expand...

They allowed that shit to go down. Extreme? They should be punished in some way. They knew it was wrong as soon as the lady asked for their names and they refused to give her them. If you do something wrong at work, they aren't going to ignore it. There has to some kind of consequence for your actions. Depending on how big this gets, I don't expect them to go unscathed.

No company wants to offend a group of people unless they are willing to take the bad pr and I don't think MS will allow this to slide since they are in WA state.
 
D

Deleted member 10571

Unconfirmed Member
RexPower said:
Holy shit, the fact this situation exists is pretty ridiculous. I was there and saw the whole thing. The presenter genuinely did not know whether or not is was a man/woman and didn't really say anything that could have been taken in offense.
Click to expand...

Except for "it" and "thing", you mean?
 
S

Sorian

Banned
Warmijwilf said:
All we have is one side of the story and people have already made up their minds. Wonderful.
Click to expand...

People don't want the truth, you know that :p

Regardless, Microsoft is still going to have to apologize for this even if this entire thing is off base. As for me, I react to the information I have and this is all we have right now.
 
stargateheaven

stargateheaven

Member
inherendo said:
Yeah, a comedian isn't going to go call a gay person a "faggot" or a lesbian a "dike." Not unless they are a shitty comedian going for shock value. Anyone defending the comedian doesn't have a leg to stand on and should feel bad for even trying.
Click to expand...

you have a point.
and to others, i wasnt trying to justify someone calling someone an "it", that's rarely used unless its non human or a baby.
 
R

redcrayon

Member
jonno394 said:
I call babies of indeterminate sex it/thing like "aww, isn't it cute" or "aww that's an adorable little thing".
Click to expand...
Do you question what they are or are not in front of a room full of people for a cheap laugh?

Bit of a difference between calling a baby a neutral term in front of their parents to limit offence when you don't know any better and deliberately aiming to humiliate a grown adult in public.
 
W

Warmijwilf

Banned
macewank said:
when microsoft pays someone to get on stage and talk at a microsoft event, they are a representative of microsoft.
Click to expand...

I get that viewpoint, but I don't think MS should be blamed for one guy's actions. MS doesn't have a magical transphobe scanner that they can scan over people, and I very much doubt the topic of people's opinions and views of transpeople comes up when hiring comedians, so why is it their fault they got unlucky and hired a dick? Assuming this guy was even being one and not just painfully ignorant.
 
N

Nibiru

Banned
Evil Monkey DTT said:
I'm going to repeat alot of people here, that man is a disgusting piece of shit. It wasn't just a slip up either, he repeatedly insulted the poor woman. I don't entirely blame microsoft (although I am going to say jesus christ your pr guys) but this man is a fucking monster.
Click to expand...

Ok he's insensitive and dumb but hardly a monster lol.
 
J

jonno394

Member
redcrayon said:
Do you question what they are or are not in front of a room full of people for a cheap laugh?

Bit of a difference between calling a baby a neutral term in front of their parents to limit offence when you don't know any better and deliberately aiming to humiliate a grown adult in public.
Click to expand...

Comedians humiliate grown adults for countless things ie weight, ugliness, taste in clothes etc. I admit this is a different context altogether though. I was just stating there are situiations where you can refer to people as it/thing ie. When they are babies, as yous aid, in a room full of people is not the right situation.
 
L

LeeRoyBrown

Banned
This story reminds me of this.

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2013/03/25/adria-richards-fired-donglegate_n_2948161.html

You can't ever call someone IT or the incorrect Sex if you have been working with them all day and are quite aware, if that is the case he should be fired.

I feel sympathy if this poor woman was honestly made fun of in public, however I also feel sorry for this presenter IF it was said in jest because honestly, she's ugly as fuck. If she walked on stage and I'd never met her and looked at her head, I'd call her a guy. If I then had a double take and saw what looks like tits, I'd be really fucking confused and maybe a bit in scared of what to say. The English language really needs a middle ground word like Swedish does.

Hon = She
Han = He
Hän or Hen = Gender Neutral.

Again, I need to see the whole context.

EDIT: I want to hear the presenters defense before I get my pitchfork.
 
R

Replicant

Member
KaiserBecks said:
Do you live on cotton ball island? It was a joke in bad taste and uncalled for, but some people here need a reality check. Would you be "in shock", because somebody made fun of you? There are plenty of people out there who probably don't like you. Screw them, move on.
Click to expand...

You know for a fact that it's just a joke in bad taste and not anything more? Even if it is, why should that kind of joke be acceptable? And no, I don't have to accept people making fun of my sexuality. I'll also bet you won't like it if people make fun of you. You want to move on and let them do it again and again to you and others, have it your way. But I'd rather confront them and let them know that their behavior is offensive and unwelcome.
 
D

Deleted member 10571

Unconfirmed Member
aaand she just put her phone number out there. This will end well.
 
S

Sorian

Banned
Warmijwilf said:
I get that viewpoint, but I don't think MS should be blamed for one guy's actions. MS doesn't have a magical transphobe scanner that they can scan over people, and I very much doubt the topic of people's opinions and views of transpeople comes up when hiring comedians, so why is it their fault they got unlucky and hired a dick? Assuming this guy was even being one and not just painfully ignorant.
Click to expand...

Companies do have to take responsibility for outside people that they hire. That is the risk to "outsourcing." Even for some of us here who can alienate him from MS, the general public won't because he is on stage with other MS employees.

Bufbaf said:
aaand she just put her phone number out there. This will end well.
Click to expand...

*sigh*
 
A

Alo81

Low Poly Gynecologist
TheStevo said:
Oh please, let's stop with the high horse mantra. The world is not black and white; stating declaratives when none of us have the context is silly.
Click to expand...

Alright then how about this.

Calling someone a "thing" is never justified or excusable.
 
M

macewank

Member
NoMoreTrolls said:
Pump your brakes. Let's not take it too far. A witch hunt benefits nobody.
Click to expand...

oh, i'm not advocating a witch hunt. merely stating that the guy was representing microsoft.

personally, i don't have enough of the story to light the torch and grab a pitchfork. the facts, as presented, paint a pretty bad picture for the guy, but i don't have context and context is key.
 
W

Warmijwilf

Banned
Sorian said:
People don't want the truth, you know that :p

Regardless, Microsoft is still going to have to apologize for this even if this entire thing is off base. As for me, I react to the information I have and this is all we have right now.
Click to expand...

I agree MS should apologise, purely out of professionalism, but I don't think they're to blame at all, and people using this to trash the Xbox One is just hilarious...
 
K

KoopaTheCasual

Junior Member
inherendo said:
Yeah, a comedian isn't going to go call a gay person a "faggot" or a lesbian a "dike." Not unless they are a shitty comedian going for shock value. Anyone defending the comedian doesn't have a leg to stand on and should feel bad for even trying.
Click to expand...

Indeed. And those are not even as bad as referring to someone as non-human. The people, who relate this to fat jokes have zero perspective about this. Calling an overweight person "fat" is rude, but it's actually loosely based on facts. Calling a trans individual being an "it" casts aside their humanity, and reduces them to something they are not at all. The situations are not parallel at all. It's not fucking hard, guys.
 
M

mr teaspoon

Member
RexPower said:
Technically, this journalist is a man, so saying that you're offended by being called one is pretty ridiculous.
Click to expand...

Nope. Sorry, no.

It's totally reasonable to wonder about the context of the situation and suggest that the comedian probably didn't mean to be rude or hateful. Maybe the comedian truly didn't know the gender of the journalist and it was an honest mistake.

But what you said does not hold up and shows that you haven't even tried to put yourself in the shoes of a transgendered person. The whole point is that they identify with the opposite gender, to say 'psh, I don't see the big deal, it IS a guy' is like....I don't even know. Doesn't mean you have to be on the side of the transgendered journalist in this situation, just means you're really missing the point with that remark.
 
W

Warmijwilf

Banned
Alo81 said:
Alright then how about this.

Calling someone a "thing" is never justified or excusable.
Click to expand...

ok, except we don't know she WAS called a thing. We just knew she took it that way. She could've misheard or the person was talking about something in-game: I was at Eurogamer and the same dude was using "it" and "this thing" to refer to avatars.

people are just assuming when we don't' have all the facts.
 
C

Cryoflar3

Member
inherendo said:
They allowed that shit to go down. Extreme? They should be punished in some way. They knew it was wrong as soon as the lady asked for their names and they refused to give her them. If you do something wrong at work, they aren't going to ignore it. There has to some kind of consequence for your actions. Depending on how big this gets, I don't expect them to go unscathed.

No company wants to offend a group of people unless they are willing to take the bad pr and I don't think MS will allow this to slide since they are in WA state.
Click to expand...

They should punish the offending individual not the entire staff. Just because they were on duty at the moment doesn't mean they could control what was going to come out of the speakers mouth. The presenter was the one who said what he said so he should be the one in trouble not the entire staff. At worst everyone should get a stern talking to so it doesn't happen again.
 
R

redcrayon

Member
Loofy said:
So... Im gonna say this probably didnt have anything to do with gender. Mainly cause I just dont think anyone is that stupid to cause that much controversy.

He probably referred to her as 'it' because he thought she was some weird otaku person. Hes a comedian.
Click to expand...

Honestly, I think that's probably quite likely, but it still doesn't make it a good plan to refer to either transgender people OR weird otaku people as 'it' in front of a room full of people, nor it is good for PR workers to weasel it by using the bullshit 'I'm sorry you're offended' rather than the actual commonly understood, all-purpose genuine apology of 'sorry'.
 
M

mollipen

Member
Oh joy, I just love waking up to things like this.

First, my heart goes out to Laura. Seeing some of the stuff I've seen in this industry, I'm often surprised that anyone that's female or LGBT actually stays in it. That isn't to say there aren't some wonderful people, because there are, but it can also be a horribly offensive place.

I think it's good to tell Microsoft what happened that wasn't okay, but not right to crucify them. I doubt they expected this, and while they SHOULD have handled it better at the event when it happened, I also know full well how things like this can happen due to how chaotic live events can be. Hell, people can't even get proper set-ups for schedule appointments at smaller events, so not having the right people on-hand to deal with an event like this occurring doesn't shock me.

As for the comedian, I want to hear for sure that we know the right person (maybe that's been confirmed and I've not read it yet), but if it is, fuck him. Publicly shame him. I'm tired of the idea that people can pull shit like this and not receive any fallout over it. If he's going to get on stage and say something, he should be ready to answer for those words if they come back to bite him in the ass, and I've seen too many attacks on people who are trans to have much tolerance for it (beyond what is actual, unintended ignorance).
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Jason Schreier: An explanation of rumors/reporting/sourcing
Social News Drama 2
57
3K
cormack12 replied
Phil Spencer interview - Says that their intent is for all Xbox games, including Call of Duty, to be available on Xbox Game Pass Day One
2 3
102
6K
Kenneth Haight replied
Financial Times: How Brad Smith used Microsoft’s $1bn law and lobbying machine to win Activision battle
News Drama Business 2 3
127
8K
Topher replied
Baldur's Gate 3 Patch 6.0 is now live
News
24
2K
Hero of Spielberg replied
  • Locked
FOX: Trans game developer launches first person shooter where players kill anti-trans villains, including priests. 'Terfenstein 3D'
2
70
6K
Faust replied
Top Bottom