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Why Horizon Zero Dawn's Success is Good(No matter who you are) - Jimquisition

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He makes three main points really.

1. It's great that it's a new IP that was given a big budget and plenty of time in the oven by a major publisher.

2. It's great that doesn't have microtransactions or season pass like most big budget games these days.

3. And he does mention having a female lead, diversity etc.

Basically, just that it's a good thing for the AAA space that there's a game that is doing so well that just didn't play it safe by being a sequel, having a male (or heavily sexualized female) lead, and being heavily monetized with DLC from day one.

Yeah I don't know, It's obviously a good thing but I don't trust the video is really genuine. Sony/Devs have done that with many of their ips so why talking about that now?
The diversity thing yeah, that's worth mention because even if many games are starting to take on this topic, Horizon does it incredibly well, the diversity on the cast is fantastic.
 

Aaron D.

Member
Can't argue with his thesis.

Variety is good for the consumer and it's nice to see a recent success story with such high stakes that breaks many stereotypical molds in the AAA space.

I think a lot of his complaints about the big-budget marketplace speak to why I've been so disinterested in it over the past number of years. Perhaps Horizon can set some trends of its own to make the field more creative and interesting. Here's hoping.

Besides, that Life Hacxz segment at the end was GOLD!
 
I really liked Horizon, haven't finished it because of Zelda, but open world done right doesn't really fit the game from my experience. The game somehow felt open and claustrophobic at the same time. That feeling is now worse after botw, but I can't wait to go back to it.
He actually talks about this, how it's smaller than others but dense and filled with a lot of fun things to do and how he liked that about it.
 
D

Deleted member 752119

Unconfirmed Member
Why would you need Micro-transactions for a single-player game?

What would they even be?

Purchasable costumes, weapons, loot boxes etc. Basically ability to buy with cash things you can unlock/buy with in-game currency.
 
A lot of people didn't receive it well. Saying something is being received well can imply that literally 1 person out of a million liked that thing.

That's not remotely how it works.

I really like Knack, but I know it's not well recieved. The general consensus is that's it's not a good game and, despite liking it, I'm not able to dictate consensus. It was well recived by me, but it was not well recieved by the wider gaming community. Horizon is well recived by the wider community.
 

KyleCross

Member
Yep. I already got one week ban recently for complaining about the modding, but honestly if it doesn't improve I'm done with this community anyway.

Woah there, I'm not complaining about the modding. You shouldn't really do that, it isn't exactly easy. I was merely offering a suggestion.
 
So which game, other than botw obviously, did ow right?

Not a lot, then again, I'm not really fond of open world so that's personal, but I don't think that Horizon is so much different than Far Cry or Assassin's Creed on this part, better yes, but not great tho
 

prwxv3

Member
I bet GG are flattered though​. Their game is being compared to a legendary series in gaming.

I bet that is you told GAF a few years ago that this would happen you would have been laughed at.
 
The notion that a game can do open world "right" is pretty strange to me. There's more than one way to tackle to open world idea, and I don't think one idea is more right than the other. BotW's design has its flaws, same with TW3s method.

For me persinally, Witcher 3 remains the king of open world design. Though I enjoy Horizons world far more due to some of the reasons outlined by Jim here.
 

KalBalboa

Banned
He's right.

A game that well made with a female lead and zero remake/franchise rehash factor is important. We should all be jazzed about it coming out so well and selling.

Why not celebrate a good thing for once?
 
Destiny didn't launch with micro transactions, and as far as I know, The Division only had season pass stuff.

Then why are you in the thread? To discuss Zelda? Grow up.
Jim makes money from this. He can grow up first.

I usually watch Jim's videos. Not watching this for the opening bit and the description.
 
Questioning a poster's honesty for not agreeing that a game "perfects" something, is pretty ridiculous to begin with.

Yeah... I'm a little uncomfortable with this trend of knee-jerking to "you haven't played the game" whenever someone posts a personal opinion that you happen to disagree with. Just as bad as the other shitposts ITT. I see a lot of defensiveness to any negative Horizon opinions on GAF lately.
 

Silvard

Member
I believe it's a linear open world in terms of its story. Sure, you can go anywhere, hence, open world but if you don't advance the story line, you can be stuck in the water.

Advancing the main story line is decoupled from the rest of the exploration of the open world and other content. In fact, the main story line is pretty optional provided you reach a certain point of the story:
leaving The Embrace
. Is the main story line linear? Sure, because it has specific story with a specific structure to tell, but it doesn't get in the way of its open world.

In fact, Horizon does something that I don't see a lot of people praising it for, and it's kind of understandable because it's very well done and so subtle as to be almost unnoticeable. The dialog in Horizon, both for the main story line and side quests and such, is extremely dynamic. It can change completely depending on what you've done, who you've met, where you've been and what you've said in the past, and it does an amazing job of keeping multiple parallel narrative threads (from main story line to sidequests) not only coherent but also bouncing references between each other. That does a lot to prevent the usual disjointedness that a lot of open world games with a narrative emphasis have some times.
 
D

Deleted member 752119

Unconfirmed Member
Yeah I don't know, It's obviously a good thing but I don't trust the video is really genuine. Sony/Devs have done that with many of their ips so why talking about that now?
The diversity thing yeah, that's worth mention because even if many games are starting to take on this topic, Horizon does it incredibly well, the diversity on the cast is fantastic.

I just disagree with you on those I guess.

Far too many games are sequels or spinoffs the past couple of generations. Far too many new IPs are lower budget games vs. getting the level of funding HZD got that's on par or greater than some established hit franchises. Many/most games launch with lots of problems that need patched. Most games are launching with season passes, day one dlc etc.

A new IP with this level of budget, development time, polish and lack of DLC at launch has been super rare post PS2/X1/GCN era IMO.
 

Plum

Member
He adresses that in the video.

He does but he doesn't exactly justify them that well. He says they're "only pieces of armour that quickly get outclassed" which somehow doesn't make them Day One DLC. Being inconsequential doesn't make them not Day One DLC; to say the game has none is simply wrong. They also cost $15 more digitally, so the price isn't exactly inconsequential either.
 

Altairre

Member
Damn, you caught me. How's he justify it?

I just don't understand why you're here if you have no interest in watching the video and then bring up points that are addressed in the video. If you want to disagree with him after you watch the video and make some good arguments then go ahead, but that is clearly not the case.

He does but he doesn't exactly justify them that well. He says they're "only pieces of armour that quickly get outclassed" which somehow doesn't make them Day One DLC. Being inconsequential doesn't make them not what they are,

It would certainly be better without even that but it really is the most inconsequential kind of bonus. There was nothing announced before it came out and no story content or pay to win stuff is locked behind it.
 

Toxi

Banned
Main points

  • New IP
  • Little industry bullshit - No microtransactions, season passes, or day 1 DLC
  • Embraced diversity
 
You dont have Horizon in your trophy list which either means you haven't played the game with the account you have made public, haven't synced your trophies, or you just haven't played the game, and you haven't watched the video, but yet you're here in this thread arguing for some reason
 
I just don't understand why you're here if you have no interest in watching the video and then bring up points that are addressed in the video. If you want to disagree with him after you watch the video and make some good arguments then go ahead, but that is clearly not the case.

Conker can't even back up his own points, let alone watch the video.

He moved on from the "lots don't like Horizon" so quickly.
 

LordRaptor

Member
Can't argue with his thesis.

His thesis comes from the premise that all AAA games should have the exorbitant production budgets they currently do, but aren't "allowed" to charge more than $60 for a "complete" game.

Which must be nice if you're wholly funded by a platform owner who has motives other than purely ROI on the product, and sort of shitty for everybody else, particularly where customers start to buy into this bullshit and start declaring companies just trying to make a high quality product at the fairest price they can to be "scamming"them.
 

prwxv3

Member
Advancing the main story line is decoupled from the rest of the exploration of the open world and other content. In fact, the main story line is pretty optional provided you reach a certain point of the story:
leaving The Embrace
. Is the main story line linear? Sure, because it has specific story with a specific structure to tell, but it doesn't get in the way of its open world.

In fact, Horizon does something that I don't see a lot of people praising it for, and it's kind of understandable because it's very well done and so subtle as to be almost unnoticeable. The dialog in Horizon, both for the main story line and side quests and such, is extremely dynamic. It can change completely depending on what you've done, who you've met, where you've been and what you've said in the past, and it does an amazing job of keeping multiple parallel narrative threads (from main story line to sidequests) not only coherent but also bouncing references between each other. That does a lot to prevent the usual disjointedness that a lot of open world games with a narrative emphasis have some times.

I think GG made a story for the open world of horizon instead of throwing one in it. in fact I think the story would not have worked nearly as well if this was a linear game.
 
What single player game has micro transactions?

Deus Ex: Mankind Devided

deus-ex-mankind-divideds-annoying-microtransactions-in-the-spotlight-147204283325.jpg
 
He does but he doesn't exactly justify them that well. He says they're "only pieces of armour that quickly get outclassed" which somehow doesn't make them Day One DLC. Being inconsequential doesn't make them not what they are,
This is the same dude who's opposed to Overwatch's micro transactions, despite the fact that they're cosmetics. Of course armor that impacts your stats being day 1 DLC isn't a big deal in a game he gave a 9.5 to.

You dont have Horizon in your trophy list which either means you haven't played the game with the account you have made public, haven't synced your trophies, or you just haven't played the game, and you haven't watched the video, but yet you're here in this thread arguing for some reason
That's weird. I might not have been online when I played it. PSN hates my account and keeps making me change my password.
 

Midas

Member
Main points

  • New IP
  • Little industry bullshit - No microtransactions, season passes, or day 1 DLC
  • Embraced diversity

Pretty much. A good video. That's what so good about Horizon, that it's a NEW IP that sells well, hopefully companies will take notice.
 
Put around 90 hours into it I thought it was a great game. Don't know about game changing but was a great game.
At the bare minimum it changes the game to where it breaks the stereotype that games with non-sexualized women protagonists aren't selling well or being well received.
 
The diversity is one of the main reasons I loved this game so much. There seemed to be a large amount of asian and black characters in the game-many of whom were interesting. I hope GG goes the CDProjekt Red route (Witcher 2) and makes the DLC/Enhanced version free and continues to grow the story in future expansions.
 
In fact, Horizon does something that I don't see a lot of people praising it for, and it's kind of understandable because it's very well done and so subtle as to be almost unnoticeable. The dialog in Horizon, both for the main story line and side quests and such, is extremely dynamic. It can change completely depending on what you've done, who you've met, where you've been and what you've said in the past, and it does an amazing job of keeping multiple parallel narrative threads (from main story line to sidequests) not only coherent but also bouncing references between each other. That does a lot to prevent the usual disjointedness that a lot of open world games with a narrative emphasis have some times.
This was one of the things I loved about the game, I realised it was doing it and it really helped keep the immersion that Aloys actions were having an effect within the community. Really nice touch.
 
This is the same dude who's opposed to Overwatch's micro transactions, despite the fact that they're cosmetics. Of course armor that impacts your stats being day 1 DLC isn't a big deal in a game he gave a 9.5 to.

Armour that impacts your stats in a single player game but is worse (I know this because I had it) than literally the first armour you can buy in the game. It's not DLC, it's an early unlock for something that isn't even good to begin with. It doesn't even have any impact on anyone else because, and here's the kicker, it's a single player game and it's not a game changing item.
 
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