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Mizuguchi does damage control on Lumines Live 'microtransactions': Next Gen SUCKS

DECK'ARD

The Amiga Brotherhood
hyp said:
from his tone in the article, i think what Q is trying to do is expand their userbase a little. maybe by offering just a basic part of the game, they can snag some more people to purchase their products since the cost ($15) is a small barrier to entry for consumers as opposed to a $30-$40 fee at once. joe schmoe on the street might just be happy with the basics? maybe that's what they're banking on...

That's the Gran Turismo HD philosophy as well.

Each time though it's going to be a bitter pill to swallow when it happens to a franchise you really like, and want to enjoy it to it's full.

Also it has to be a slippery slope, because if developers find they can make the same (if not more) money from releasing less, and being able to release it on a timetable of their choosing then there will be absolutely no reason at all to do it the old way and release a whole complete thing in one go.
 

Brobzoid

how do I slip unnoticed out of a gloryhole booth?
But a 360 isn't a free download like iTunes. Nor is it a $(whatever iPods cost) accessory. It's a media-center game console. And it needs to be treated as one. People buy it because they want games, often long and fleshed out games. I think Q would have been easier off releasing this shit on iTunes itself...
 

icecream

Public Health Threat
akachan ningen said:
He probably didn't have any choice in the matter. I'm betting it was MS pushing for this.
Is that honestly true? After N3 I was inclined to believe MS just scrwed Miz over and he became the scapegoat. But to twist us like this again... the guy's either got it out for gamers, likes to sell out, or insane. I can't imagine anyone loving having their name being criticized over and over again.
 

mr jones

Ethnicity is not a race!
Nash said:
That's the Gran Turismo HD philosophy as well.

Each time though it's going to be a bitter pill to swallow when it happens to a franchise you really like, and want to enjoy it to it's full.

Also it has to be a slippery slope, because if developers find they can make the same (if not more) money from releasing less, and being able to release it on a timetable of their choosing then there will be absolutely no reason at all to do it the old way and release a whole complete thing in one go.

You know what, that's not even what I'm pissed about.

I'm ****ing angry about how they are presenting this to the customer. I truly hope that an XBL dev is reading this, so they can understand how to tone down the amount of backlash.

1. If I'm gonna buy a product, let me know EXACTLY what I am getting, and NOT getting. Notice how many folks are asking "wait, what? What's not being included? There's stuff that I can't play? Wha?!" Yeah, that's because there's no documentation that states that when you purchase this software, features will be unavailable, unless you download more content for an additional fee. This is where the core of my anger lies.

2. You make early additional content that adds personality to the game, not features. New skins, new icons, new music. They're optional, and if they're cool enough, folks will buy them.

3. You offer more features that boost functionality at a later date. The game already has multiplayer, but now you can add garbage to your opponents grid. Or you make your opponents bricks fall faster. Or single player has new bombs that will eliminate more bricks. This keeps the game fresh, and you feel like the developer is providing good support for a product that you already like. But the features have to be NEW. Not greyed out options that I couldn't use previously because it said I had to buy it after I already bought the damn game. That's a slap in the face, and is insulting to the consumer.

But the way they're handling this whole Lumines thing is screwed.
 
xbox live is the best place to try shit like this. mizugooch is smart. live users are a bunch of lab rats anyway, let's be honest here. "hmmmm...let's see...what can we sell today...uno! that shit will make MILLIONS. make it happen!"

he and q (and presumably MS) will take what works with them and apply it in the future, and toss whatever doesnt work out...how much you think it cost Q to port lumines live to 360 live? those people at q are on salary anyway. prolly got a fat little check from MS
 

DjangoReinhardt

Thinks he should have been the one to kill Batman's parents.
Anyone happen to know how much the profit margin increases for "content providers" once they remove physical media from the equation if they still charge the same MSRP?
 

----

Banned
People are complaining that the base game doesn't come with enough content, but Lumines Live uses up the maximum amount of space that is allowed for an Xbox Live Arcade game, so maybe the game just isn't a good fit for the platform.

I think it's kind of silly that any Live Arcade game that exceeds 50MB is going to have to be broken up and sold in additional pieces. The whole point of the 50MB limit is so that the games can fit on a memory card, but if the additional packs cause the game to exceed 50MB then you can't put the full game on a memory card anyway. Someone who depends upon a memory card to play Live Arcade games isn't going to bother with Lumines because it wastes too much space already.

Nash said:
That's the Gran Turismo HD philosophy as well.

Each time though it's going to be a bitter pill to swallow when it happens to a franchise you really like, and want to enjoy it to it's full.

Also it has to be a slippery slope, because if developers find they can make the same (if not more) money from releasing less, and being able to release it on a timetable of their choosing then there will be absolutely no reason at all to do it the old way and release a whole complete thing in one go.
The difference is that there are two ways to buy Gran Turismo HD. That is my main problem with this method. I don't have a problem with them selling Lumines piece meal to attract new customers at a cheaper entry price, but I do have a problem that there is no alternative for people who like Lumines to buy the whole thing at once.
 

chespace

It's not actually trolling if you don't admit it
Pandora's box has been opened. No amount of righteous anger (even if justified) can close it back up. The reason why this model isn't going away is because the millions out there who do not read gaf and gaming forums may actually think this is a pretty good deal. Just you wait. :p
 

DECK'ARD

The Amiga Brotherhood
Lipton%20Pandora's-Box.jpg

You stupid girl!
 

----

Banned
chespace said:
Pandora's box has been opened. No amount of righteous anger (even if justified) can close it back up. The reason why this model isn't going away is because the millions out there who do not read gaf and gaming forums may actually think this is a pretty good deal. Just you wait. :p
Well there could also be a negative backlash in that people think they're not getting their money's worth with XBLA games and since there is no way to resell or get your money back just avoid XBLA all together.

Like I said I think MS needs to provide both alternatives to keep everyone happy. There has to be a way to choose to buy the full game or to buy it piece by piece. I think if you don't offer a way to buy the entire game you risk alienating a lot of customers.
 

DjangoReinhardt

Thinks he should have been the one to kill Batman's parents.
---- said:
Well there could also be a negative backlash in that people think they're not getting their money's worth with XBLA games and since there is no way to resell or get your money back just avoid XBLA all together.

Like I said I think MS needs to provide both alternatives to keep everyone happy. There has to be a way to choose to buy the full game or to buy it piece by piece. I think if you don't offer a way to buy the entire game you risk alienating a lot of customers.
No, all MS needs to do is wean the market off physical media. The number of people who quit buying new games in protest will barely register with them. We already know Sony won't do anything to stop the transition to all-digital distribution, and Nintendo will be there if it maximizes profits
(It almost certainly will.)
.

In 20 years, there'll be a whole generation of gamers who've never had to buy a tangible copy of a game. It might not even be an option. They'll tear open _____ Points Cards on Christmas. Hell, how many Gaffers never experienced 'new cartridge smell'?
 

Safe Bet

Banned
kevm3 said:
If developers become 'content providers' in the sense of following what tv developers are doing, then I'm most likely done with gaming... especially if this hits rpgs, my favorite genre. Instead of playing a game and beingrewarded with a satisfying ending, we're going to continually be left with a 'to be continued' theme?
Does every movie or televison program you watch end like that?

I doubt the industry will stray too far from the movie/tv model.

Hopefully....
 

mattiewheels

And then the LORD David Bowie saith to his Son, Jonny Depp: 'Go, and spread my image amongst the cosmos. For every living thing is in anguish and only the LIGHT shall give them reprieve.'
so...which pack do i gotta buy to unlock vs. cpu mode? and how much?

i think that's the only necessary pack to get, i don't give a fig about skins and videos and stuff.
 

Futureman

Member
This has probably already been asked, but I scanned through and did not see it.

How much does it cost to buy all of the packs?
 

Wario64

works for Gamestop (lol)
mattiewheels said:
so...which pack do i gotta buy to unlock vs. cpu mode? and how much?

i think that's the only necessary pack to get, i don't give a fig about skins and videos and stuff.

The Vs CPU pack. Too bad it isn't available...and we have no idea how much it will cost.

Buying games blindly ftl


Futureman said:
This has probably already been asked, but I scanned through and did not see it.

How much does it cost to buy all of the packs?


Again, we dont even know what packs will be offered in the future, when they will be offered or even the prices of the packs


Buying games blindly ftl
 

Safe Bet

Banned
Dr. Kitty Muffins said:
I just don't like the fact that they assumed we would easily accept this sort of crap in the first place.

What do they think we are?
Gamers...

The same people that bought unplayable and unenjoyable games for years and years because they had pretty pictures on the cover.

:(

But seriously...

If my wife can get into an argument with an old friend of her's over blu-ray when neither of them even really play games (props on the viral marketing campaign), we can move public opinion against this if we want to.
 
Some small game company should see this whole microtransactions bullshit that all big guns are pulling on the gamer as a opportunity for them and provide better service without all these bullshits.

If they try to entertain this idea with decent games, if not superb, they will get lots of love for sure.
 

Balzac

Member
chespace said:
Pandora's box has been opened. No amount of righteous anger (even if justified) can close it back up. The reason why this model isn't going away is because the millions out there who do not read gaf and gaming forums may actually think this is a pretty good deal. Just you wait. :p

It all depends on how they present it. If Lumines Live launches with a multitude of locked skin chioices and trying to pick Shinin yields a text box saying "available in skin pack #2 on 11/28", than I think even casual gamers are going to be pretty pissed. But if they try to pass off what they currently have as if it were a full game, then most people will buy into it. Particuarly those who have never played Lumines before and don't know that the original game's appeal rested heavily on it's skin variety.

What all transaction centric games need to do in the future though, is give gamers a choice. With Lumines for example; if someone wants to buy a specific skin then let them do so. But also offer theme packs that come with 10 skins at a 10% discount . Then, a few months later when the developers have enough content to qualify as a complete game, sell that at a reasonable price.
 

Jonnyram

Member
Balzac said:
It all depends on how they present it. If Lumines Live launches with a multitude of locked skin chioices and trying to pick Shinin yields a text box saying "available in skin pack #2 on 11/28", than I think even casual gamers are going to be pretty pissed.
But that's what happens now in puzzle and mission modes.
Select any puzzle after the 5th and it says "You need to buy Puzzle Pack, coming soon." It doesn't even show a date.
 

pswii60

Member
WTF happened to the pop videos in the background of Lumines, like Madonna etc? I thought they'd be downloadable and it was going to be a live showcase? Did they scrap that idea?
 

Odysseus

Banned
pswii60 said:
WTF happened to the pop videos in the background of Lumines, like Madonna etc? I thought they'd be downloadable and it was going to be a live showcase? Did they scrap that idea?

800 points in December

i have no idea
 

ToxicAdam

Member
It's Darwinian Economics. People stupid enough to lose their money deserve it.


I can't wait to see what kind of microtransactions Halo 3 brings. It could be very reasonable (like the map pack for Halo 2) or something much worse. Could go either way.
 

DopeyFish

Not bitter, just unsweetened
ToxicAdam said:
It's Darwinian Economics. People stupid enough to lose their money deserve it.


I can't wait to see what kind of microtransactions Halo 3 brings. It could be very reasonable (like the map pack for Halo 2) or something much worse. Could go either way.

Microsoft has been pretty good with their downloadable content, except for Counter-Strike :lol
 

Dsal

it's going to come out of you and it's going to taste so good
Let me guess, the buy prompt will say: "There will be no refunds for this item"
 
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