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Brazilians are losing faith in democracy and considering a return to military rule

The more I examine history, the more I find myself more surprised that the US actually succeeded in leveraging their land and resources to become a world superpower than I am the fact that other American states have failed to do the same.

I think having England as the primary governmental template, followed closely by France helped a lot. I'm guessing Portugal and Spain were likely not as entrenched democratically and systematically as the other two and it caused longstanding issues. Canada is cut from much the same cloth as the US is and it succeeded as well.
 

Jotaka

Member
"O erro da ditadura foi torturar e não matar."
"The error of dictatorship was to torture, not to kill"
- Bolsonaro

"Pinochet devia ter matado mais gente."
"Pinochet should have killed more people"
- Bolsonaro

Brasil é um Estado cristão: "A minoria que for contra, que se mude"
Brazil is a Christian State: "The minority who is against, (they) should move"
- Bolsonaro
 

ty_hot

Member
Brazilians do not want that. We do have an idiot running for president and people want to vote for him because he ~defends the families~ and is against human rights and wants to kill the criminals. (Yeah, Duterte like). At least now we clearly know that 10-20% of the people are fascists and they dont need to vote for PSDB anymore, they have an open racist, homophobic, pro-torture criminal to advocate for them.

I do believe Doria or Alckmin will end up beating him in the elections because the media wont risk putting Bolsonaro against Lula. Btw Lula isn't going to be a candidate since he will be found guilty for any and all reasons possible even if they dont make any sense, but whoever he supports is going to the 2nd round for sure.
 

SephLuis

Member
My understanding is that Brazil's rampant protectionism, the softening of the global economy for commodities, and simply overspending basee on optimistic projections during the BRICs rise are a large part of the problem.

Another huge issue is the mismanagement and endemic corruption of state owned entities which were paying out millions (billions?) in kickbacks over decades. This kind of behavior over the long term hollows out talent from the entity, ala PDVSA in Venezuela, as the more important thing is who you know rather than how your perform in your job. That cripples a company in the long run.

Those are all big factors, but there's also the issue that Brazil lost a lot of confidence when our economic numbers were being manipulated. This is what eventually lead to the coup of Dilma.

I also heard that they were trying to change Brazil's economy (Nova Matriz Econômica plan) at the time and that the plan was doomed from the start and it failed horribly too. Though in this case, I only heard comments and I am not very well informed on how it failed or how big was the hit to our economy because of it.
 
"O erro da ditadura foi torturar e não matar."
"The error of dictatorship was to torture, not to kill"
- Bolsonaro

"Pinochet devia ter matado mais gente."
"Pinochet should have killed more people"
- Bolsonaro

Brasil é um Estado cristão: "A minoria que for contra, que se mude"
Brazil is a Christian State: "The minority who is against, (they) should move"
- Bolsonaro

My god...the world is losing its mind.
 

Platy

Member
"O erro da ditadura foi torturar e não matar."
"The error of dictatorship was to torture, not to kill"
- Bolsonaro

"Pinochet devia ter matado mais gente."
"Pinochet should have killed more people"
- Bolsonaro

Brasil é um Estado cristão: "A minoria que for contra, que se mude"
Brazil is a Christian State: "The minority who is against, (they) should move"
- Bolsonaro

From a religious politician :

"Arresting a painting is not censorship, it is common sense. And the leftists keep saying the dictatorship was censoring art .... we never had a dictatorship on this country!"

https://twitter.com/RicMat123/status/910149952038457344
 

Linkark07

Banned
I'm interested in the part about people going to the right and becoming more evangelical.

Why do they believe being conservative is the way to go? Taking the US into consideration, or Canada with Harper, it is usually the conservatives who fuck up the country. I seriously doubt a conservative president will help them; in fact, they will continue stealing money and leave people even more poor and uneducated than before they rose to power.
 
My god...the world is losing its mind.

He said such things in response to other shitty people who were provoking him.

Also his promises as President are to make the market more open and improve security, while fighting corruption.

I'm sure as hell that the way things are *right now* they aren't good.

Brazilians do not want that. We do have an idiot running for president and people want to vote for him because he ~defends the families~ and is against human rights and wants to kill the criminals. (Yeah, Duterte like). At least now we clearly know that 10-20% of the people are fascists and they dont need to vote for PSDB anymore, they have an open racist, homophobic, pro-torture criminal to advocate for them.

I do believe Doria or Alckmin will end up beating him in the elections because the media wont risk putting Bolsonaro against Lula. Btw Lula isn't going to be a candidate since he will be found guilty for any and all reasons possible even if they dont make any sense, but whoever he supports is going to the 2nd round for sure.

Poor Lula, the most honest person in that country.
 

Ac30

Member
"O erro da ditadura foi torturar e não matar."
"The error of dictatorship was to torture, not to kill"
- Bolsonaro

"Pinochet devia ter matado mais gente."
"Pinochet should have killed more people"
- Bolsonaro

Brasil é um Estado cristão: "A minoria que for contra, que se mude"
Brazil is a Christian State: "The minority who is against, (they) should move"
- Bolsonaro

Oh goody, a murderous religious fundamentalist. Definitely need more of those in power.
 

Tagyhag

Member
Wouldn't be surprised if Bolsonaro is elected. Middle-class and richer Brazilians don't give one shit about those that live in the Favelas.

If Bolsonaro ends up killing them all, they'll feel safer in the streets.
 

Platy

Member
I'm interested in the part about people going to the right and becoming more evangelical.

Why do they believe being conservative is the way to go? Taking the US into consideration, or Canada with Harper, it is usually the conservatives who fuck up the country. I seriously doubt a conservative president will help them; in fact, they will continue stealing money and leave people even more poor and uneducated than before they rose to power.

Long time ago we had a political saying that "it is better to let the cake grow before sharing". Maybe they believe on this ?

He said such things in response to other shitty people who were provoking him.

Also his promises as President are to make the market more open and improve security, while fighting corruption.

I'm sure as hell that the way things are *right now* they aren't good.

Dude was having a dinner with the head of corruption of Minas Gerais state these days.
Dude thinks chemical castration is the way to go with rapists, implying it is based on sexual desire. AND hates sexual education and basic "teaching what rape is" stuff.
Dude also thinks education must be militaristic based.

Also, kinda hilarious that you are going for a "heat of the moment" defense of a nazi Racist sexist homophobic transphobic rape apologist torture fan dictatorship denier.
Where did I saw that before ?
 

Tiops

Member
Dude's heroes are torturers. Dude would make it easy as pie to transition to military dictatorship. Those are the ones that send us to that type of situation.
Hell, we are taking steps on this direction with the "gay cure" nonsense

I just don't think we're anywhere close to having a death squad for LGBTQ people on Brazil. I understand you being worried about Bolsonaro's election, it's definitely not positive, but an actual death squad just for being trans didn't exist even during the military dictatorship.
 

Jotaka

Member
Oh goody, a murderous religious fundamentalist. Definitely need more of those in power.

The evangelicals are growing for decades here... And bishops/scammers who want to become popular they go all fundamentalist batshit crazy.
 
Long time ago we had a political saying that "it is better to let the cake grow before sharing". Maybe they believe on this ?



Dude was having a dinner with the head of corruption of Minas Gerais state these days.
Dude thinks chemical castration is the way to go with rapists, implying it is based on sexual desire. AND hates sexual education and basic "teaching what rape is" stuff.
Dude also thinks education must be militaristic based.

Also, kinda hilarious that you are going for a "heat of the moment" defense of a nazi.
Where did I saw that before ?
In defense of a Nazi. Holy shit.

Ok.
 

kmfdmpig

Member
Long time ago we had a political saying that "it is better to let the cake grow before sharing". Maybe they believe on this ?



Dude was having a dinner with the head of corruption of Minas Gerais state these days.
Dude thinks chemical castration is the way to go with rapists, implying it is based on sexual desire. AND hates sexual education and basic "teaching what rape is" stuff.
Dude also thinks education must be militaristic based.

Also, kinda hilarious that you are going for a "heat of the moment" defense of a nazi.
Where did I saw that before ?

He sounds a bit like Duterte, which is obviously a bad thing.
 

Linkark07

Banned
Long time ago we had a political saying that "it is better to let the cake grow before sharing". Maybe they believe on this ?



Dude was having a dinner with the head of corruption of Minas Gerais state these days.
Dude thinks chemical castration is the way to go with rapists, implying it is based on sexual desire. AND hates sexual education and basic "teaching what rape is" stuff.
Dude also thinks education must be militaristic based.

Also, kinda hilarious that you are going for a "heat of the moment" defense of a nazi.
Where did I saw that before ?

I fear for Brazil if that madman gets elected as President.
 

Ac30

Member
The evangelicals are growing for decades here... And bishops/scammers who want to become popular they go all fundamentalist batshit crazy.

Another great American export I assume?

Stephen fry made an Interview with him
https://youtu.be/o3ZBeX9uC8s

"We brazilian people dont like homossexuals"

Wow, suggesting LGBT groups are only using a homosexual's murder as a "sob story", and lol, he even suggests there's "no homophobic behavior in brazil" before, as you say, saying "We don't like homosexuals". Thinks sex-ed classes would encourage kids to turn gay, fuck this dude.
 

Jotaka

Member
He sounds a bit like Duterte, which is obviously a bad thing.

" Sou capitão do Exército, minha especialidade é matar, não é curar ninguém. "
" I am Army captain, my specialty is to kill, not to cure someone."
- Bolsonaro

During an interview about his lack of bill(law) propositions in the Chamber of Deputies. This is how he see himself..
 

RocknRola

Member
As a Portuguese it feels weird to have our go-to "bro countries" go through weird & messy situations at the same time (Spain & Brazil).

Hope it all gets sorted out for the best on both sides as soon as possible!
 
In defense of a Nazi. Holy shit.

Ok.

His views are clearly fascist...I mean he advocates for the military to intervene in the state, for the formation of a military government, persecution of gays, refugees...An allround diseased mind. He is a disgusting person, who would be more suited to a mental asylum rather than running for office.
 

Tiops

Member

Well, I don't remember any anti semite thing about him, and he is very pro-Israel. This is the kind of accusation that ends up giving him power, as it's baseless and people use it to say that he's persecuted by the left.

You can even see that the reason for the protests and cancelation of his speech is because he's "anti semite by nature of conviction", because of his anti LGBT stances (the minorities he has more problems with). There's a crapload of real issues that can be assigned to him, we don't need to invent new ones.
 

Platy

Member
Oh and he had plans to bomb a military school in the 80's !

So lets add terrorist to the pile

Also, he was an asshole to a friend's mom because said friend's dad went to school with him
 

Eylos

Banned
I dont think Bolsonaro has the political strenght, to start a Persecution on the left and minorities, what worries me is the army.
 

mantidor

Member
I think having England as the primary governmental template, followed closely by France helped a lot. I'm guessing Portugal and Spain were likely not as entrenched democratically and systematically as the other two and it caused longstanding issues. Canada is cut from much the same cloth as the US is and it succeeded as well.

The colonization process was entirely different, English settlers in the US came to make a new living and start anew, motived mostly by religion. Spain and Portugal came to exploit and grow their empires. The "everyone for themselves" mentality in all of Latinamerica comes from this, it's even cultural, it is expected people will take advantage of you and you should take advantage of them. Brazilians call this the "jeitinho brasileiro", in Colombia we call it the "papaya", we all think this is unique to our respective countries but it's actually widespread in the whole continent. The result is crippling, endemic corruption with no solution, at least in the short term.

I'm actually surprised thry haven't found anything on Bolsonaro yet, you cannot make it into politics in Brazil without having to bribe someone.
 
You really shouldn't quote the entire article. Quote small parts and highlight some key points. Threads have been closed for doing what you did there.

On topic though, corruption is bad in a lot of places but in Brazil it certainly seems like in a whole another level.
edit: not that it's that good now, but much better after the mod edit

And this seems pretty scary.

Trump inspires actual dictator. Great.
 
His views are clearly fascist...I mean he advocates for the military to intervene in the state, for the formation of a military government, persecution of gays, refugees...An allround diseased mind. He is a disgusting person, who would be more suited to a mental asylum rather than running for office.

Persecution of gays and refugees? What?
 

Jotaka

Member
Persecution of gays and refugees? What?


"Não vou combater nem discriminar, mas, se eu vir dois homens se beijando na rua, vou bater"
"I wont fight nor discriminate but if I see two men kissing in street, I gonna punch"


”O que esse pessoal tem para oferecer para a sociedade? Casamento gay? Adoção de filhos? Dizer que se seus jovens, um dia, forem ter um filho, que se for gay é legal? Esse pessoal não tem nada a oferecer."
"What these people has to offer to society? Gay marriage? Adoption? To say that if these young people, one day, have a children, that to be gay is cool? These people has nothing to offer"


”Que respeitar homossexual. Eles que tem que nos respeitar".
"Respect homossexual. It's them that need to respect us"


"Seria incapaz de amar um filho homossexual. Não vou dar uma de hipócrita aqui: prefiro que um filho meu morra num acidente do que apareça com um bigodudo por aí. Para mim ele vai ter morrido mesmo"
"(I) would be incapable to love a homossexual son. I won't be hyproct here: I would want my son die in an accident than bring someone with mustache here. To me he would be dead"


"O próximo passo será a adoção de crianças por casais homossexuais e a legalização da pedofilia".
"The next step will be children adoption by homosexual couple and legalization of pedophilia"


If he is against civil rights of LGBTQ community what you call him?


This is the your candidate. It's say a lot about you.

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.
 

Cynar

Member
I'm interested in the part about people going to the right and becoming more evangelical.

Why do they believe being conservative is the way to go? Taking the US into consideration, or Canada with Harper, it is usually the conservatives who fuck up the country. I seriously doubt a conservative president will help them; in fact, they will continue stealing money and leave people even more poor and uneducated than before they rose to power.
Pretty much. It's kinda sad but you're dead on. Especially when fringe Conservatives like Harper get power.
 
D

Deleted member 80556

Unconfirmed Member
He said such things in response to other shitty people who were provoking him.

So what? You understand that he, as a head of state, must keep his head cool, no? When a racist is provoked to talk shit about minorities, would you justify that person? Ask yourself: who is the truly shitty person in this context? Hint: It's your favorite candidate.

I mean the whole world shivered when Trump won because the guy has the thinnest skin and has the power to begin WW3.

You want that kind of person for your country? You want that kind of person to be an example for your country's youth? To represent you in front of the international community and be seen like a Venezuela-lite? Do you even understand the plight of minorities would find themselves in if this man were to win presidency?
 
The colonization process was entirely different, English settlers in the US came to make a new living and start anew, motived mostly by religion. Spain and Portugal came to exploit and grow their empires. The "everyone for themselves" mentality in all of Latinamerica comes from this, it's even cultural, it is expected people will take advantage of you and you should take advantage of them. Brazilians call this the "jeitinho brasileiro", in Colombia we call it the "papaya", we all think this is unique to our respective countries but it's actually widespread in the whole continent. The result is crippling, endemic corruption with no solution, at least in the short term.

I'm actually surprised thry haven't found anything on Bolsonaro yet, you cannot make it into politics in Brazil without having to bribe someone.

Thank you for this. I appreciate the perspective and education.
 

JJD

Member
I just don't think we're anywhere close to having a death squad for LGBTQ people on Brazil. I understand you being worried about Bolsonaro's election, it's definitely not positive, but an actual death squad just for being trans didn't exist even during the military dictatorship.

We don't need death squads to kill LGBT people over here. They are already being killed left and right by ordinary"people" for absolutely no reason. There is no need to organize death squads.

In an article published by The New York Times in early July, Brazil is depicted as the epicenter of an ”epidemic of anti-gay violence" and a country that kills the largest number of LGBT people worldwide, in absolute numbers.

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/06/world/americas/brazil-anti-gay-violence.html?_r=1 (great article about LGBT rights on Brazil right now. We are not a tolerant nation.)

Anyone who supports a guy like Bolsonaro is complicit to this slaughter.

Just so that foreigners know who we are talking about Bolsonaro is a guy that thinks it is OK to say to a congresswoman that she didn't even deserve to be raped by him.

The guy is an absolute shitstain.
 

Madness

Member
Crazy that the BRIC countries that will determine the future political, economic and military might of the world are all becoming nationalistic and jingoistic in a sense. Modi in India, China we've seen what they're saying and doing. Putin and Russia and the annexation of Crimea and fomenting discord and nationalism in other European states. And now Brazilians increasingly also want regimented military rule and not democracy.
 

JJD

Member
He said such things in response to other shitty people who were provoking him.

Also his promises as President are to make the market more open and improve security, while fighting corruption.

I'm sure as hell that the way things are *right now* they aren't good.



Poor Lula, the most honest person in that country.

What the fuck has Bolsonaro done to make you even consider that he is telling the truth or going to fulfill his promises???

Certainly it's not his track record on congress. Dumbass has only managed to turn into law 2 bills he proposed in fucking 26 years of service. And none of then have anything to do with causes he identifies with.

Wake up man.
 
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