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Fighting Framerates - Help with Sega Rally Revo

MaLDo

Member
I love videogames and I enjoy a lot playing them. But I enjoy a lot fixing game problems too. People use to mix both concepts in arguments about how pc gamers can't enjoy games without fraps or how console games have the advantage because can be played without messing with config files. Ok, I see playing games and messing with config files as two different kind of "games". Messing with config files is more alike playing something like sudoku or doing few hundred pieces puzzles. It's a game on his own.

One of my main requeriments to enjoy a game is perfect framerate. It's more important for me than everything else. Graphics, resolution, lighting are less important. But same for every other aspect as plot and gameplay elements. That's because framerate problems can break my experience so every other aspect turn out not enjoyable. It would be like listening a great symphony through a sound system with regular interference or clicks. It's surely my problem, but I can't. It could be an awesome symphony and it does not become a bad symphony because of the sound system quality, but those interferences prevent my enjoyment. My ears would be more concerned with the percentage of time that sound interference is present or unconsciously calculating the clicks frequency.

So I like to find a way to smooth framerate for every installed game in my system. I have many hundreds installed games so sometimes could be a problem.

In the last steam sale I pick up Disney Mega Pack with a lot of games for my children. I found a fix from Insane to put Split/Second from 30 fps to 60 fps, another one bring 60 fps to Epic Mickey 2, and a new way to eliminate the loading time bug in Pure without messing with vsync or alt+tab. But was the fix for Epic Mickey 2 that openned a new door in framerate fixing for me. It uses CheatEngine speedhack. I was owned when write in another thread about how to play Super Mario 64 at 60 fps. Disabling framerate limit in Project64 emulator, SM64 goes unlimited framerate but game speed rises accordly. Locking framerate with RTSS you can achieve 60 fps with double speed. Then SpeedHack at 0.5 reduces the game speed in half, but (and that's the part I didn't know before) reduces the framerate too. That's why you can fix Epic Mickey 2 after editing a file that makes the game run at 30 fps but at half speed. Using speedHack at x2 the game runs at the correct speed and 60 fps.

This new info for me did wonders when found that another game in the Disney Pack, Toy Story 3, was locked to 50 fps without possibility to run at 50 hz resolution. The game not only is a judder festival, is floaty and slow too. Being a Wii game port, I guess someone used part of the PAL version code in the game but in the wrong way. Using speedhack with 1.2 value, the game is a perfect and smooth experience at 60 fps. And using AutoHotKey, you can create an exe than runs CheatEngine, start the game, change the speedhack value, start a x-padder profile that enables mouse cursor with your gamepad in the main menu without controller support and finally close X-Padder and CheatEngine after closing the game. Clean.

With this new weapon in my hands, I went over my game list again. DeadPool is another game with framerate problems. This game has a framerate lock at 59 fps. 59 fps into 60 hz is one of the worse experiences because every second there is a framerate jump. It's regular and there is nothing worse in terms of framerate or sound problems that regularity. If you're using a pc monitor, a way to fix DeadPool is to use a 59hz resolution. You can't select refreshrate in the game, so you have to create a new custom resolution with only this refreshrate available. Months ago I changed my monitor to a TV through DVI, so 59hz resolutions are a no go anymore. The only way to fix DeadPool in a DVI conection is to create a 50 hz resolution and use it. Until now, because if you use a 60 hz resolution and set speedhack to 1.02, the game is perfectly smooth.

And finally I came to my nemesis. The big one. Sega Rally Revo. A game I really like but can't enjoy fully because its framerate problems. SRR has a severe issue with framepacing. The only way to play a race without this problem is using the "restart race" option. Unfortunately, this option is only available in "Quick Race" category so there is no way to play championship mode and unlock new tracks without framerate problems. Using CheatEngine speedhack I found out that the game renders exactly 62.5 frames every second. But it then draws them in the incorrect order. You can't fix the problem limiting framerate with RTSS, neither using antilag D3D9 library. But, surprisingly, using speedhack with 0.96 value (that converts 62.5 into 60 frames per second) the game is perfectly smooth. Why I need help then? Because this fix, unlike any other game, is inconsistent in Sega Rally. Sometimes works for the full race. Sometimes only for the first lap. Sometimes you have to speed up to x2 before going to 0.96 to fix the problem. Sometimes the framerate is perfect but every tree on the sides of the track collapses when your car moves along the road, without touching them, it is worth seeing.

Why to put this here? I remember some Sega Rally Revo dev posting here not long ago and found here about the possibility of a re-launch of Sega Rally in steam. Maybe someone with better CheatEngine skills can find memory values that dance with game tics or trees gravity and finally this game can be played without problems. The game deserves it.
 

Tizoc

Member
MaLDo, do you have PURE? I have the game but being an old game it refuses to run on Windows 8.1. I've tried reducing my screen size, adding in compatibility options but nothing works. I'd need the game to be forced to run in Windowed so I could even play the thing but nothing I do works, it just goes black and crashes on Start up.

SEGA Rally Revo's Steam page showed up again recently, we'll see if that game is getting a re-release thta might fix up its issues :X
 

LeMaximilian

Alligator F*ck House
Wishing good luck on your venture. As a long time fan of Sega Rally, I've always wanted Revo to run at 60 fps. Really great game.
 

PantsuJo

Member
MaLDo, do you have PURE? I have the game but being an old game it refuses to run on Windows 8.1. I've tried reducing my screen size, adding in compatibility options but nothing works. I'd need the game to be forced to run in Windowed so I could even play the thing but nothing I do works, it just goes black and crashes on Start up.

SEGA Rally Revo's Steam page showed up again recently, we'll see if that game is getting a re-release thta might fix up its issues :X
Can I suggest you to upgrade to Win10?
I've noticed huge (really huge) improvements with back-compatibility. A lot of games that didn't run on 8.1 runs fine/perfect on 10, even some ancient Win95 executables like ChoRenSha68K and the old MS Fortran compiler.
So there is good chance that you will be able to run the game on Win10.
Good luck!
 

MaLDo

Member
MaLDo, do you have PURE? I have the game but being an old game it refuses to run on Windows 8.1. I've tried reducing my screen size, adding in compatibility options but nothing works. I'd need the game to be forced to run in Windowed so I could even play the thing but nothing I do works, it just goes black and crashes on Start up.

SEGA Rally Revo's Steam page showed up again recently, we'll see if that game is getting a re-release thta might fix up its issues :X

Hi, Pure just works perfect in Win7 and Win10 in my case. I don't know what's the problem in 8.1, sorry.
 

MaLDo

Member
How do you do that ?

I think I found it. God bless modders.

Edit: I answered another question, sorry. I will post the link.


On topic, shame for random trees bug in some levels because other than that, I played Sega Rally Revo for one hour in Championship Mode with perfect framerate and is an AWESOME game. Being able to see beyond Quick Race Mode is incredible.
 

MaLDo

Member
The last version of this did not have this problem according comments in the video.

And you don't need to wait to the race start to unlock the framerate. The autohotkey script can do the send key a few seconds after launching the game.
 

wazoo

Member
I tried Sega Rally Revo last night on my g sync monitor.

I think this is the only way to play the game without any framerate problems.

And the framerate goes way above 60 fps, which is nice too (according to my gsync built-in-monitor fps counter).
 

MaLDo

Member
I tried Sega Rally Revo last night on my g sync monitor.

I think this is the only way to play the game without any framerate problems.

And the framerate goes way above 60 fps, which is nice too (according to my gsync built-in-monitor fps counter).

Is it really smooth?

I can't test in a gsync monitor, but testing without vsync, the problem seems present even with higher framerates because how the game sorts the rendered frames. If you can compare using a locked vsynced 60 fps at 60 hz with speedhack at 0.96, share your results.
 
And finally I came to my nemesis. The big one. Sega Rally Revo. A game I really like but can't enjoy fully because its framerate problems. SRR has a severe issue with framepacing. The only way to play a race without this problem is using the "restart race" option. Unfortunately, this option is only available in "Quick Race" category so there is no way to play championship mode and unlock new tracks without framerate problems. Using CheatEngine speedhack I found out that the game renders exactly 62.5 frames every second. But it then draws them in the incorrect order. You can't fix the problem limiting framerate with RTSS, neither using antilag D3D9 library. But, surprisingly, using speedhack with 0.96 value (that converts 62.5 into 60 frames per second) the game is perfectly smooth. Why I need help then? Because this fix, unlike any other game, is inconsistent in Sega Rally. Sometimes works for the full race. Sometimes only for the first lap. Sometimes you have to speed up to x2 before going to 0.96 to fix the problem. Sometimes the framerate is perfect but every tree on the sides of the track collapses when your car moves along the road, without touching them, it is worth seeing.
Just finding your thread MaLDo. Honestly the situation in this game sounds terrible and makes me wonder if anyone deving the game knew of this oddity, because it seems pervasive.

Why does the "restart race" option fix the frame pacing? Does it change the amount of rendered frames from 62.5 to 60?
 

MaLDo

Member
Just finding your thread MaLDo. Honestly the situation in this game sounds terrible and makes me wonder if anyone deving the game knew of this oddity, because it seems pervasive.

Why does the "restart race" option fix the frame pacing? Does it change the amount of rendered frames from 62.5 to 60?


I really don't know where the problem starts. I guess the problem is about some kind of round of the frametime float value. For 60 frames per second, frametime is 16,6667 but for 62.5 frames, is 16. Maybe in the intro sequence before the race, this value is rounded to 16 by error. And is reset to the correct 16.6667 value when you use the restart race option because there is no intro in this case.

The problem is the game doesn't really sends those frames every 16 ms, but every 16,6667 ms. It means the first frame showed at 16,6667 ms was rendered 0,6667 ms ago. This cadence results in an lack of smoothness and every 26/27 frames, you will miss a frame because 16 * 27 = 432 ms while 16,6667 * 26 = 433,3 ms, so when you see the 26th frame in screen is in fact the 27th rendered frame. You missed the real 26th and you will have stutters too.


Is there a way to compare the full memory map using CheatEngine? Comparing the start race will be enough.
 
I always knew there was something up with the frame rate on Revo whenever I played it on my machine. Just thought I was going mad. Glad to see I'm not totally blind after all.

Id be really happy to find a fix for this. Played some rally 3 back in the summer, a buttery smooth version of this game at home would be great.
 

wazoo

Member
Is it really smooth?

Yes, it is. i did not played the game extensively, so do not take this as a truth.

I can't test in a gsync monitor, but testing without vsync, the problem seems present even with higher framerates because how the game sorts the rendered frames. If you can compare using a locked vsynced 60 fps at 60 hz with speedhack at 0.96, share your results.

I do not much about speedhack. What you describe is not happening with a gsync monitor, since frametimes can be anything. The only thing I found curious is what you describe as frames not sent in the correct order. I wonder if this is some artefact of the built in game vsync storing the frames for display or just the engine being fucked, because in that case this would also happen in gsync context.

we would like more expert gsync user to test the game.
 

bee

Member
gsync definitely doesn't fix the stutter, only race restart in quick race mode does, tried 4k, gsync, 60fps, 60hz with speedhack 0.96, when it actually runs right it's smooth (i.e fixed) but every 3 or so seconds there's this huge stutter/weirdness, makes it unplayable, could be gsync or me using cheat engine
 

MaLDo

Member
gsync definitely doesn't fix the stutter, only race restart in quick race mode does, tried 4k, gsync, 60fps, 60hz with speedhack 0.96, when it actually runs right it's smooth (i.e fixed) but every 3 or so seconds there's this huge stutter/weirdness, makes it unplayable, could be gsync or me using cheat engine


Yes, I found this in my first test but the stutter was there every two minutes, not 3 seconds. My workaround now is a bit complicated, but I've simplified a bit using autohotkey.

Needed programs: Autohotkey, X-Padder, CheatEngine.

In CheatEngine I added "Sega Rally" and "Sega Rally_SSE1" in the executables list for automatic hook. Then defined CheatEngine hotkeys too:

F7 - Enable/disable speedhack
F8 - Set speedhack to 1.0
F9 - Set speedhack to 1.2 (I use this hotkey for Toy Story3)
F10 - Set speedhack to 2.0 (I use this hotkey for Epic Mickey 2)
F11 - Set speedhack to 0.96 (I use this hotkey for Sega Rally Revo)
F12 - Set speedhack to 1.02 (I use this hotkey for DeadPool)

Create a X-Padder profile named SegaRallyRevo with:

Left Trigger: F11 with autofire
Right Trigger: F11 with autofire
D-Pad Up: F9 -> 40 ms pause -> F11
D-Pad Down: F8 -> 40 ms pause -> F7

Then you can use Autohotkey to create a script that launch X-Padder with this profile, starts the game, starts CheatEngine and waits the game closes for close X-Padder and CheatEngine, or you can launch every program manually.

What you have to do playing the game is press D-Pad Up in the race intro until you have perfect smooth framerate (normally one time is enough) and press D-Pad Down in the results screen after finishing a race. Having Speedhack 0.96 in the triggers is a workaround for the problem you're describing because the timer is being adjusted to perfect frametime few times every second.

Yeah, that's a bit complicated to setup, but that's the reason I started this thread. I hope someone can use this info to create a table for CheatEngine and then compile a complete fix.
 

MaLDo

Member
Another one.

Last time I bought Grow Home I found the framerate is atrocious. Like lots of Unity Engine games, frametimes are inconsistent and then I asked for a refund.

With those new weapons yesterday I bought Grow Home again and found that this game is rendering 50 frames every second but then creating 60 new ones with only 50. In a similar way that Sega Rally Revo fits 62.5 fps in 60, Grow Home stretches 50 in 60 repeating a few.

Using vsync to 60 hz and CheatEngine to 1.20, Grow Home is smooooooth. The difference is night and day. And being 0.2 faster makes the game more enjoyable too, because is still floaty but not so much.
 

Shaneus

Member
Only thing I can suggest is to see if all versions of the game do this? I bought it on Direct2Drive, I'm sure there are a few patches for it and there's a chance the Steam version may be different again. And if there's a demo, that might help too?

Or look into who ported it (if it wasn't SRS themselves), because they may have ported other console games to PC as well. IIRC around the same time Sega released The Club, so that might be in the same boat/by the same people.

Edit: I haven't read it yet, but this thread might be useful? Is recent, too.

Edit #2: PS. I think the developer/user you're thinking of is KennyLinder. (fake edit:
Having worked on this game, it was quite a nice surprise to wake up this morning to see an article written about it! Some very happy and sad memories (for obvious reasons) about that time in my life.

http://uk.ign.com/articles/2015/07/15/the-sega-rally-reboot-that-nobody-bought

SEGA-Rally-Revo-IGN_07-720x405.jpg


SEGA-Rally-Revo-IGN_05-720x405.jpg



Some quotes
 

nkarafo

Member
I just found this thread. this game has been in my collection for so many years and went through 3 different PCs, yet i can't play it because of this problem.

Maybe i'll try this fix of yours i don't know. Looks hard to do but if it's the only way for this shit to be fixed, maybe it's worth it.

Edit: Nope, 0.96 speedhack doesn't work for me, what a surprise.
 

MaLDo

Member
I just found this thread. this game has been in my collection for so many years and went through 3 different PCs, yet i can't play it because of this problem.

Maybe i'll try this fix of yours i don't know. Looks hard to do but if it's the only way for this shit to be fixed, maybe it's worth it.

Edit: Nope, 0.96 speedhack doesn't work for me, what a surprise.


How do you apply the speedhack?
 
I've been bashing my head against this game recently, so I'd like to compile a list of what has been tried, what works, what doesn't work and what sort-of-works. Ideally I would like to find a fix and update the PCGWiki, because this game is awesome and its current status is a shame.

Current specs: (This is SUPER DUPER IMPORTANT for the purposes of trying to find out what's going on, please post your specs if you try stuff and especially if the game works fine for you)

i5 4690k OC@4.2GHz
8GB DDR3 (2x4) 1600MHz
RX 470 Nitro+ (5% core clock boost, 2100MHz memory clock)
Most recent hotfix drivers as of the date of this post for AMD graphics, most recent drivers for cpu/chipset from Intel's auto-detecting tool

What I've experienced:
- Restarting a Quick Race always fixes the problem for that race
- When playing with the i5 integrated graphics, the game seems to stutter literally every single time from the start, in every race, except for those that have been restarted
- When playing with the RX 470, the game starts off at a perfect 60FPS without stutters without needing any kind of fixes, even in championship mode. After a random (but usually small) number of races, it'll start stuttering. It's not always in the same championship, it's not always in the same track... If a certain track from a certain championship stutters, I might get lucky and be able to play that exact same championship again by restarting the game at a perfect, stutter-free 60.
- Sorry, can't try Freesync or GSync, since I don't have the required display
- Compatibility modes, tried every single one of 'em, they don't seem to do much of anything (Win7 mode seems to have better frame pacing vs native Win10 mode during the times in which the game actually works at 60, but this may well be subjective)
- Capping frames with Radeon drivers and generally experimenting with Radeon driver settings (force vsync, enable/disable/refresh shader cache), no luck
- Capping frames with external tools like RTSS or antilag DLL, no luck
- MaLDo's suggested CheatEngine tricks, they work but they cause in-game bugs like falling trees, birds that become static on the track... Not very pleasant.

Next on my list:
- Full system format (needed this anyway, been through 4 different graphics cards from both nV and AMD on the same Windows install...)
- VirtualBox with XP/Vista/Win7 (Currently on Win10, will experiment with this)

Wazoo, does the game work smoothly for you with regular old Vsync disabling all the Gsync stuff? Could you please post your specs, OS, drivers etc.? Thanks!
 

DonMigs85

Member
Would be real glad if Pac-Man and the Ghostly Adventures was made to run at 60FPS. Does this RTSS trick work on it?
 

Boney

Banned
How noticeable is the stutter for you? I've been playing it recently and while I do get some hiccups here and there I chalk them to my PC being bad. It doesn't happen very often so it doesn't really bother me but maybe I'm expecting less of it.

I'm using a I-5 6200 8gb ram and a amd radeon m5 335.

Best of luck and sorry for not being very helpful. But yes it's awesome
 
How noticeable is the stutter for you? I've been playing it recently and while I do get some hiccups here and there I chalk them to my PC being bad. It doesn't happen very often so it doesn't really bother me but maybe I'm expecting less of it.

I'm using a I-5 6200 8gb ram and a amd radeon m5 335.

Best of luck and sorry for not being very helpful. But yes it's awesome

The problem for me is that once they start, they are continuous, at regular 1-second or so intervals and they are pretty huge.

For what it's worth, I did a clean install of Windows 10 Pro yesterday, set the game to Windows XP SP3 compatibility mode and forced 8X MSAA from within the game's launcher (I usually use FXAA with nV and MLAA with my current AMD card).

Like that, I was able to play 4 entire 3-race championships straight with no issues and without restarting any race (nor the game itself).

Unfortunately my testing was cut short due to Windows 10 being complete garbage. Apparently changing the OS language completely breaks Cortana's search feature, displaying Modern UI-related search results in your old language and not actually launching them when you click them. Sigh. I haven't punched a keyboard in years, but I did yesterday. Lost the entire dang day to it.

I'll format AGAIN today (about 9 and a half hours from now) and keep testing. If any of you guys wants to try the set-up I did before, I'd really appreciate it if you posted your results and full system specs.
 
So, after formatting again (thanks Microsoft):

I set the game to Windows XP SP3 compatibility mode once again, and I'm feeling pretty confident that my issue has been resolved. I've been able to complete several championships in a row without any of the regular stutters I used to have. Man, this game is FUN with a G27!

Now, I'm not gonna lie to you: The game does skip the ocassional frame here and there, irregularly. It has frame-pacing issues that I don't think can be fixed, but they are extremely minor and honestly barely noticeable for me.

As far as I'm concerned, consider this issue fixed for me. You guys should give it a try and report back.
 
Just read through the thread.

SRR always required a fucking BEAST of a PC to run well and even with that it struggled. That was way back then.

When we did the SR3 arcade port, we managed to further optimise the crazy deformation which massivley helped with performance. We always wanted to - and really, really tried - to run the game at 60fps on PS3 and 360, but we couldn't achieve it :(

We could of hit 60 EASILY without the deformation, but by then the marketing had started and it wasn't something we could simply remove; it was one of the key USPs about the title.

A PC Steam re-release would be amazing, I wonder if Sega got the licences back? That is what would of caused the removal previously.

I still play the game now and again, and I still think it plays beautifuly. It's easily my favourite game I've ever worked on.
 

Shaneus

Member
Any idea on why there's the odd dropped frame in the PC port of Revo, Kenny? I doubt it's a spec issue as we're all pretty much running what would be considered "beasts" compared to when the game was released ;)
 

Boney

Banned
Having the licenses expire is the most depressing thing. Publishers need to have a back up plan to tweak a few models here and there to get generic cars and keep it on the market if the license expires.

But gosh yes this game is awesome
 
Any idea on why there's the odd dropped frame in the PC port of Revo, Kenny? I doubt it's a spec issue as we're all pretty much running what would be considered "beasts" compared to when the game was released ;)

Honestly got no idea :/ A lot of us are in touch still, so I'll ask people who might be familiar on the matter.

Having the licenses expire is the most depressing thing. Publishers need to have a back up plan to tweak a few models here and there to get generic cars and keep it on the market if the license expires.

But gosh yes this game is awesome

Yeah it is a real issue. It seems its a huge problem for other industries too. De La Soul are having a nightmare getting their old music on Spotify because they use so many samples etc that are owned by lots and lots of different people.

I do wonder if an idea of close-but-not-quite car models would satisfy everyone? It's certainly a solution to get the game out again without licensing issues. Looking back, the main issue for SR would be the WRC licence, which was required for the Integrale and Stratos (I can't actually remember if they were in Revo, or just SR3). WRC licence is very expensive :/ But either way, it has licenced cars so they'd all need to be cleared.
 

Tailzo

Member
I'd love to play Sega Rally Revo at 60fps, I loved it even on ps3. I think it's an mazing game, and it deserves a solution to the 60fps problem :)
 

kinn

Member
Yes, yes it would. Literally nobody plays Sega Rally Revo for realism.

Ditto for Outrun and, really, every single SEGA game including Afterburner.

So true. And I guess on pc, real cars could always be modded in.

This game was ace. The track deformation was a great feature. Spent literally hours just spinning my car around one piece of the track.

Cannot believe Sega was so shortsighted with the developer. Shutting them down after one game...

Kenny, was it true that you guys where working on a tornado storm chasing racer after revo?

How hard would it be to change the car models in something like Outrun 2 to avoid licensing issues?
 

Shaneus

Member
Honestly got no idea :/ A lot of us are in touch still, so I'll ask people who might be familiar on the matter.
Awesome. It might be something very simple most of us are overlooking.

Yeah it is a real issue. It seems its a huge problem for other industries too. De La Soul are having a nightmare getting their old music on Spotify because they use so many samples etc that are owned by lots and lots of different people.
Ohhh, *that's* why! Figured there was a reason I couldn't find most of their stuff on there.

I do wonder if an idea of close-but-not-quite car models would satisfy everyone? It's certainly a solution to get the game out again without licensing issues. Looking back, the main issue for SR would be the WRC licence, which was required for the Integrale and Stratos (I can't actually remember if they were in Revo, or just SR3). WRC licence is very expensive :/ But either way, it has licenced cars so they'd all need to be cleared.
Worked for Outrun in Shenmue, as well as the Saturn and 3DS releases which I suspect weren't licensed either. Maybe there's just not the fanbase to support re-releasing/patching these older titles for us to play them again.

However, Sega *did* get back the license for the music in Crazy Taxi for iOS after the horrid mess of the PC release, so maybe they care a little?

Kenny, was it true that you guys where working on a tornado storm chasing racer after revo?
That was going to be a thing? Holy shit, I'd never heard of it before but it sounds like a very "Sega"-type game. I'd have lapped that up.
 

Boney

Banned
A big problem that can come up with dropping the license update is that while the game keeps from being lost in limbo, owners who owned it before hand, who enjoy the license are screwed from updating the game. It's not the biggest deal here, but what if there was online element that needs it to be the same version?

GTA SA had a new updates a few years ago that deleted a lot of the licensed songs. Sure they pushed it without informing people about it, so many ended up being screwed and while you do it responsibly you can throw a heads up with a window, some current owners won't probably be happy about it either way.
 

MaLDo

Member
There may be hope for Sega Rally Revo on PC. KennyLinder has told me that he works with one of the game's original programmers and they have been talking about it. Let's cross our fingers.

Meanwhile, I recently bought the Saints Row Gat out of Hell and I ran into two framerate issues. The first, more typical, is that the framepacing was incorrect depending on where the camera was pointing. This was solved easily with our savior RTSS and a 60 fps cap.

The second problem, fucker, is that every time the game makes a checkpoint, there is a jump in the framerate. Many games are programmed in this way (badly programmed, allow me to add), but in this case is terrible because the game saves every time we do a small action, like picking an orb. And we collect orbs continuously. If you fly and want to concatenate 5 orbs floating in the sky, you will have 5 jumps in the framerate that will give you problems handling the character. The problem is described in several forums including steam.

To avoid this problem, I created a 30 MB virtual disk in ram and then made a symbolic link for the game to save checkpoints in ram. I've done an autohotkey script that automates the process, creating the virtual disk, moving save data to that disk, creates the symbolic link and then waits the game to be closed to undo the work and put the save data in the game folder as a backup.

This is the script
#NoTrayIcon
Run, c:windowssystem32imdisk.exe -D -m S:
Sleep 1000
Run, c:windowssystem32imdisk.exe -a -f "%A_WorkingDir%Savegame_backupSAVE.img" -m S:
Sleep 400
Run, mkdir S:206420
FileRemoveDir, F:JuegosSteamuserdata10660454206420", 1
Run, xcopy /s %A_WorkingDir%Savegame_backup206420 S:206420 /Y
Sleep 300
Run, %comspec% /c mklink /D "F:JuegosSteamuserdata10660454206420" "S:206420"
Sleep 300
Run, SaintsRowGatOutOfHell.exe
Sleep 4000
Process, WaitClose, SaintsRowGatOutOfHell.exe
Run, xcopy /s "S:206420" "%A_WorkingDir%Savegame_backup206420" /Y
Sleep 2000
Run, c:windowssystem32imdisk.exe -D -m S:
FileRemoveDir, F:JuegosSteamuserdata10660454206420", 1

Script + autohotkey to put in game folder: https://ufile.io/xjr9t

If you want to use it, you need "ImDisk Virtual Disk Driver". Is a fantastic tool for gaming because you can play games directly in RAM if you have enough. It's free and I have 1.6.0 version from here http://www.ltr-data.se/files/imdiskinst_1.6.0.exe

You need to change your steam path in the script too. Create a Savegame_backup folder in your game folder and put there your savegame (206420 folder from your userdata steam folder) and this image file: https://ufile.io/bohst

Edit: the script in the file is ok but the one in the quote missed some slash because the forum has deleted them.
 

Shaneus

Member
There may be hope for Sega Rally Revo on PC. KennyLinder has told me that he works with one of the game's original programmers and they have been talking about it. Let's cross our fingers.

Meanwhile, I recently bought the Saints Row Gat out of Hell and I ran into two framerate issues. The first, more typical, is that the framepacing was incorrect depending on where the camera was pointing. This was solved easily with our savior RTSS and a 60 fps cap.

The second problem, fucker, is that every time the game makes a checkpoint, there is a jump in the framerate. Many games are programmed in this way (badly programmed, allow me to add), but in this case is terrible because the game saves every time we do a small action, like picking an orb. And we collect orbs continuously. If you fly and want to concatenate 5 orbs floating in the sky, you will have 5 jumps in the framerate that will give you problems handling the character. The problem is described in several forums including steam.

To avoid this problem, I created a 30 MB virtual disk in ram and then made a symbolic link for the game to save checkpoints in ram. I've done an autohotkey script that automates the process, creating the virtual disk, moving save data to that disk, creates the symbolic link and then waits the game to be closed to undo the work and put the save data in the game folder as a backup.

This is the script


Script + autohotkey to put in game folder: https://ufile.io/xjr9t

If you want to use it, you need "ImDisk Virtual Disk Driver". Is a fantastic tool for gaming because you can play games directly in RAM if you have enough. It's free and I have 1.6.0 version from here http://www.ltr-data.se/files/imdiskinst_1.6.0.exe

You need to change your steam path in the script too. Create a Savegame_backup folder in your game folder and put there your savegame (206420 folder from your userdata steam folder) and this image file: https://ufile.io/bohst

Edit: the script in the file is ok but the one in the quote missed some slash because the forum has deleted them.
Just spitballing here, but could it be the same with Sega Rally? Maybe it's trying to save replay data?

Apologies if this is way off, need to re-read the thread, it's been a while!

Nice work with that script, btw.
 

MaLDo

Member
Just spitballing here, but could it be the same with Sega Rally? Maybe it's trying to save replay data?

Apologies if this is way off, need to re-read the thread, it's been a while!

Nice work with that script, btw.

No, I think the problem is the game rounds the physics frametime to 16 ms in the intro part.
 

nkarafo

Member
Bumping this because i discovered the same problem most likely exists in the actual arcade version of Sega Rally 3.

Recently, a loader was released that let you play some slightly more recent Sega arcades on your PC. This isn't emulation since those games were running on Windows PCs anyway (RingEdge, Europa-R, etc). Even without the loader the games can run by just hitting the .exe. But you need the loader to make them controllable. Also, the games run full speed since the PC hardware they are supposed to run is from the mid 00's.

Anyway, i tested Sega Rally 3, since i have the game on PC and 360. This version of the game supposedly runs at 60fps. And during my test i used RTSS to see the actual numbers. And indeed, the numbers show steady 60fps. But my eyes tell differently. It's not really 60fps, it doesn't run nearly as smoothly. It looks closer to a game running at unlocked 30+fps to me, or at least a game with very bad frame pacing.

So it seems there is no way to play any version of Sega Rally 3 at smooth 60fps. Thanks Sega.


There may be hope for Sega Rally Revo on PC. KennyLinder has told me that he works with one of the game's original programmers and they have been talking about it. Let's cross our fingers.
Wonder how did that go.
 

MaLDo

Member
Bumping this because i discovered the same problem most likely exists in the actual arcade version of Sega Rally 3.

Recently, a loader was released that let you play some slightly more recent Sega arcades on your PC. This isn't emulation since those games were running on Windows PCs anyway (RingEdge, Europa-R, etc). Even without the loader the games can run by just hitting the .exe. But you need the loader to make them controllable. Also, the games run full speed since the PC hardware they are supposed to run is from the mid 00's.

Anyway, i tested Sega Rally 3, since i have the game on PC and 360. This version of the game supposedly runs at 60fps. And during my test i used RTSS to see the actual numbers. And indeed, the numbers show steady 60fps. But my eyes tell differently. It's not really 60fps, it doesn't run nearly as smoothly. It looks closer to a game running at unlocked 30+fps to me, or at least a game with very bad frame pacing.

So it seems there is no way to play any version of Sega Rally 3 at smooth 60fps. Thanks Sega.



Wonder how did that go.



tenor.gif
 

nkarafo

Member
I don't get your reaction. The game has a similar problem as Sega Rally Revo on PC. It also reports 60fps in RTSS but we know it's not the case.
 

MaLDo

Member
I don't get your reaction. The game has a similar problem as Sega Rally Revo on PC. It also reports 60fps in RTSS but we know it's not the case.

My reaction is: No way.... any hope is lost then?

Anyway, something is not clear. I remember the arcade (saw it only one time) as smooth.

In this footage from the arcade, framerate seems perfect while playing, but has frametime problems during the car presentation before the race
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8xmYSvQz0eo&t=11s

but in this footage of the same game running on a "not original arcade" pc using the launcher, the framepacing is wrong while driving too like in the PC version
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFtafW631Qk

If someone has problems seeing the framepacing issue, select x0.25 speed in the 60fps version of the video. It'll be clear enough.

So, whatever the problem is, it happens on the original game running in a different PC but not running in the PC into the arcade. We need to go deeper.....

EDIT: I'm downloading the original video source of the first youtube footage ( https://mega.nz/#!JRQ2AbQR!P_ALa38pvOR4isbNjgNrY34YPghHRMNGIgYrPK81-ek ). It seems the arcade used for this video has a modified PC, so is not the original hardware.
 
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