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Forza Motorsport 4 - The Floodgates Have Opened...

I

Iknos

Junior Member
soundscream said:
Maybe its a bug, can't see how it would jive with what they said earlier.
Click to expand...

He did word it oddly in another interview. That the initial steering inputs would be linear. That hints that in other situations it wouldn't be.

Which is exactly what this sounds like. Sounds like a countersteering assist that changes the characteristics of steering when the car is oversteering.

Now I'm not against assists I just wonder why isn't there a mode where they turn them all off. More than that why would you call something "simulation" steering mode when it isn't.

Don't know if this is a question of thinking that with only 10K wheel owners out there that they don't need to do this...or if its a matter of appealing to everyone to get more sales. Either way there is a console sim that sells millions of copies that doesn't have to resort to these things to get those sales.

Its not like I don't believe or trust you Yoritomo but I need to see this for myself. I might drive over to my cousin's tomorrow and try it with a Fanatec P911TS.
 
S

skyfinch

Member
Maybe someone with the full version could comment about this. Could be that the demo is old. Not that I care but it's evident even using a controller.
 
eso76

eso76

Member
Slayer-33 said:
Don't worry ;)
Click to expand...

good, game needs it badly on my setup.


as for linear steering, i did point out there was still some assist going on, but i only noticed when launching.


skyfinch said:
Maybe someone with the full version could comment about this. Could be that the demo is old. Not that I care but it's evident even using a controller.
Click to expand...

well, steering assist is mandatory on a controller.
Maybe the demo doesn't properly support 900° wheels ? feels great anyway
 
H

H3rTz DoNuT

Member
I just don't get it, how the F#@$ people feel the assist with the controller? I understand you can feel it with the wheel but how do you do that with the controller? I've been playing with the controller today and really can't tell if there are any assists on. It just feel so much different and better than FM3, I can finally feel I have full control over the car and if I make a mistake I pay consequences. It is really easy to lose control, or spin out or anything else on simulation steering and I don't see game correcting anything for me, cause it always ends the race for me. I play with everything off on simulation steering and professional difficulty and really can't see any assists, but it might be just me. I tried the demo with the Normal steering and after one race I changed it back to simulation, cause it was too much of FM3 feel to it.

I know that there are some problems with assists with the Fanatec wheels that people complain about, but I really don't know about controller.
 
S

Shaneus

Member
eso76 said:
well, steering assist is mandatory on a controller.
Maybe the demo doesn't properly support 900° wheels ? feels great anyway
Click to expand...
I'm gonna go ahead and say that this is probably the case. Given that the demo misses some pretty basic features like volume control and doesn't support Kinect at all, thinking about it now I'd actually be surprised if it fully supported a 900 degree wheel.
 
P

p3tran

Banned
Diablohead said:
guy is saying that he is playing around with the "demo" but who knows, could be a jtag kid with a downloaded rip.
Click to expand...
I dont know how he does it, but I have subscribed to his channel since last year.
in forza 3 he could load full poly model in the game, make strange wheel transitions, remove the blurring of the spinning wheels, change camera angle, lighting, and a shit load of other things.

look at some forza 3 by this dude:

lexus lfa
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNROFkiC7SQ&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL

lambo countach
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uFccgt2MRHs&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL

merc sls
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18aXwaN2CoY&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL

f40 comp.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9MeiUh-Bjg&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL

high res liveries and lots of smoke
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tSRxJVY9Qwk&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL

nurb f1 forza 4 vs forza 3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fW-1bsFvsGo&feature=related

etc

jolly good guy, this pictureghost guy. I like him 8)
 
M

Mascot

Member
p3tran said:
I dont know how he does it, but I have subscribed to his channel since last year.
in forza 3 he could load full poly model in the game, make strange wheel transitions, remove the blurring of the spinning wheels, change camera angle, lighting, and a shit load of other things.

look at some forza 3 by this dude:

*snip*

etc

jolly good guy, this pictureghost guy. I like him 8)
Click to expand...

Wow, thanks for sharing. Those videos are great. I'd also love to know how he does this.

Classical music is always a great fit when viewing car porn.
 
S

Shaneus

Member
Mascot said:
Wow, thanks for sharing. Those videos are great. I'd also love to know how he does this.

Classical music is always a great fit when viewing car porn.
Click to expand...
I'm actually thinking I might try some classical music in-game for driving games, see how I go. Given I get fairly tense during these (especially doing a clean lap amongst traffic in the demo is hardcore) so maybe having that as background music might help.

Anyone have any suggestions for some quick-fix classical shit, like a compilation CD?
 
Hawk269

Hawk269

Member
Have not seen any post it nor anyone talking about it but if you load the demo and let it sit on the title screen after a while a video will play and damn is it really good. They have some parts of some footage we have seen, but there is alot more. Very impressive and not as compressed to hell as the attract video of Forza 3.
 
H

H3rTz DoNuT

Member
Shaneus said:
I'm actually thinking I might try some classical music in-game for driving games, see how I go. Given I get fairly tense during these (especially doing a clean lap amongst traffic in the demo is hardcore) so maybe having that as background music might help.

Anyone have any suggestions for some quick-fix classical shit, like a compilation CD?
Click to expand...


Well, for the first FM4 race take a Hammer H1 and race against some Minis and other cute little toys and play this, +100 to fun factor :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V92OBNsQgxU


Me and my friends use to play this on PGR4 during heavy rain on Nurburgring, it just went so good with everyone spinning all the time :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1aEBEKg-4l8
 
S

Shaneus

Member
H3rTz DoNuT said:
Well, for the first FM4 race take a Hammer H1 and race against some Minis and other cute little toys and play this, +100 to fun factor :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V92OBNsQgxU
Click to expand...
Bahahahaha. That mental image is AMAZING. I hope they let you use all Hummers in Top Gear soccer.

Me and my friends use to play this on PGR4 during heavy rain on Nurburgring, it just went so good with everyone spinning all the time :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1aEBEKg-4l8
Click to expand...
That's the sort of stuff I'm talking about. If it calms me down then I'll think clearer and (in theory) play better.

Fake edit: This should do the trick!
 
J

Jube3

Member
Work in progress, I pulled together the reach and ODST cars. I need to trim excess layers and finish the planet background.

6201898957_20777844dc_b.jpg
 
H

H3rTz DoNuT

Member
Jube3 said:
Work in progress, I pulled together the reach and ODST cars. I need to trim excess layers and finish the planet background.

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6148/6201898957_20777844dc_b.jpg
Click to expand...

Looking great Jube, but I got to tell you man, you know how to make people feel bad ;) We want to paint too!!! Well not only that but we also want to race, tune, take pics and other stuff, so hurry up and deliver that game to the stores now!!! :D
 
Hawk269

Hawk269

Member
Jube3 said:
Work in progress, I pulled together the reach and ODST cars. I need to trim excess layers and finish the planet background.

6201898957_20777844dc_b.jpg
Click to expand...

Jube,

That looks great. Hey since you are posting right now maybe you can answer some questions for me.

I just got that new MS Steering Wheel and I think it is great, but it is missing the LB/RB buttons. I noticed in the F4 demo that there is no way to get the telemetry up, hitting the d-pad does nothing. I am just wondering if there is a custom configuration to map what I need. I dont use rewind, so I would sacrafice the button for that if I could.

Thanks!
 
J

JustEscaped

Neo Member
So I was reading about early access to the demo a few pages back. Is that still an option? And how would one (read: me) obtain such early access? :)

It's all looking very good from the clips and screens.
 
E

erahk64

Member
Gek54 said:
Yeah, there was interview or something where they said it would be linear in simulation mode, though I think the wording was a little odd. "initial turn-in is direct and linear" ???

I still feel it the autocorrection going on when I get the car lose.

I also just found the hud mode that shows the car's steering moving outside of your direct input just as it did in FM3.



I am using my Fanatec wheel in 900 degree mode btw.
Click to expand...

I found the interview:

Dan Greenawalt said:
Finally, we added the “simulation steering” option. This option removes all of the controller aides. There were very few of these aides on the wheel controller, but there were several on the console controller. With these aides removed, you will no longer get help finding the right counter-steering angle. If you over-countersteer (meaning you overcorrect by steering into the angle of the slide), the wheels do as commanded. This usually results in a wicked tank-slapper. Also, initial turn-in is direct and linear. This can feel very twitchy. When you command the game to go lock to lock-to-lock, it assumes you mean it and lets you live with the consequences.
Click to expand...

http://forzamotorsport.net/en-us/underthehood2/

I will wait for comments about the steering assists/linearity in the retail version before buying the game.
 
B

Blimblim

The Inside Track
Hawk269 said:
Jube,

That looks great. Hey since you are posting right now maybe you can answer some questions for me.

I just got that new MS Steering Wheel and I think it is great, but it is missing the LB/RB buttons. I noticed in the F4 demo that there is no way to get the telemetry up, hitting the d-pad does nothing. I am just wondering if there is a custom configuration to map what I need. I dont use rewind, so I would sacrafice the button for that if I could.

Thanks!
Click to expand...
Dpad on my ms wheel does show the telemetry in the demo here.
 
S

saladine1

Junior Member
Some are saying that these little assists will be removed in the full game.
It doesn't make sense. If their intentions were to make simulation steering 'easier' for the casual audience, then why have the 'assisted' or 'normal' steering in the first place?
If it's just the demo then fine, but if the full game still features these assists, then it'll not be good. People have invested a lot of money into expensive racing wheels and rigs in the hope to race in an unassisted manner, close to reality as possible.
We've read so many times that ALL assists will be removed in the sim steering mode. I really do hope this is true for the retail version...
 
S

saladine1

Junior Member
Fortinbras said:
Who is saying this?
Click to expand...
A few guys who have green discs. They say that they have tried 900 deg steering and behaves nicely. Speed sensitive steering is also fine...they say. But who knows...?
 
A

alba

Little is the new Big
saladine1 said:
A few guys who have green discs. They say that they have tried 900 deg steering and behaves nicely. Speed sensitive steering is also fine...they say. But who knows...?
Click to expand...

We will see sooner or later anyways, if the issue is still the case in the full game, I'd hope for T10 to do something about it this time around and patch it, it was so annoying in FM3 :(
 
K

kamkor

Neo Member
saladine1 said:
A few guys who have green discs. They say that they have tried 900 deg steering and behaves nicely. Speed sensitive steering is also fine...they say. But who knows...?
Click to expand...

Or maybe they are just not bothered by speed sensitive steering.

Jube, please say if we can have 100% unassisted linear steering with fanatec wheels in forza 4.
 
O

op_ivy

Fallen Xbot (cannot continue gaining levels in this class)
anyone with a wheel try switching back and forth from the pad? driving with the controller feels FAR more forgiving. are there assists for pad users too? i mean, it would make sense to have it stay playable, but possibly another assist we as users have no control over changing
 
X

Xanadu

Banned
saladine1 said:
Some are saying that these little assists will be removed in the full game.
It doesn't make sense. If their intentions were to make simulation steering 'easier' for the casual audience, then why have the 'assisted' or 'normal' steering in the first place?
If it's just the demo then fine, but if the full game still features these assists, then it'll not be good. People have invested a lot of money into expensive racing wheels and rigs in the hope to race in an unassisted manner, close to reality as possible.
We've read so many times that ALL assists will be removed in the sim steering mode. I really do hope this is true for the retail version...
Click to expand...

shit i really hope they are gone for the final game. although i sold my MS wheel after FM3 i was thinking of either buying another one or borrowing my friends in time for forza 4s release, but this has put me off big time. i thought they had fixed it ffs!
 
S

skyfinch

Member
Wow, kick ass designs, Jube and m0dus. I'm so used to using my tablet and don't have the patience to create anything using a controller. Have a lot of respect for the artists who create liveries in FM.
 
S

skyfinch

Member
p3tran said:
I dont know how he does it, but I have subscribed to his channel since last year.
in forza 3 he could load full poly model in the game, make strange wheel transitions, remove the blurring of the spinning wheels, change camera angle, lighting, and a shit load of other things.


jolly good guy, this pictureghost guy. I like him 8)
Click to expand...


Some more from this jolly good guy.

Pontiac Trans AM 1973
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYF9P1NXovQ&feature=feedu

Mercedes SL 65 AMG Black Series
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKWVIiLDuxw&feature=feedu

Aston Martin DBS 2008
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2ukOmYc8wo&feature=feedu

Nissan GT-R SpecV 2010
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3CZWggQwKXE&feature=channel_video_title

Oldsmobile Hurst/Olds 442 1969
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ECEZx0OYTHs&feature=channel_video_title


Edit, so if this is from the demo, I'm guessing these are all the AI cars he has access to.



And someone with too much time on their hands.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cF4yRlLC4-o
 
S

Snubbers

Member
I'm having a bit of chuckle at the meltdown of the 'steering assist'..

Firstly, I'd like to say I don't think any obvoius assist/wobble is a good thing, I'm not defending it.. For all I know T10 are trolling us..

But..

I remember in FM3, it was discussed on GTPlanet, Gek's video shown to the everyone etc, and I did an analysis of it myself, to see how it affected things.. It was obvious from some simple tests that it didn't fit the M.O. of some really obvious high level auto-assist as the oscillation of the wheel made little sense.. The high grip levels and resistance to pendulation all seemed inherent in the physics model to my engineering eye.. but much debate ensued..

Now fast forward to FM4, another video appears, steering wobble still present, and T10 claiming that all steering assists have been removed..

Now the funny thing is, whilst I myself can see a little softness in the physics, the cars will swap ends and oversteer a degree more then FM3, yet the steering wobble is still present and looks the same as FM3.. I am starting to think that the wobble is (as I suspected) not the assist people think it is..

What is obvious is the inverse non-linearity in the steering, it's very direct around centre, but it's rate reduces towards each end.. I can only think that this is to speed up steering at centre due to the new tyre data model thing not play testing too well with 1:1 input..

No engine is perfect, but I can say that I'm v.impressed with the physics as a whole.. it's a huge step up from FM3, the weight transfer and tendency to swap ends in so many situations or slide/understeer so readily makes the M5/Zonda/Eliminator a challenge to drive fast.. But I do agree that it isn't iRacing vicious and has this wide/explorable progressive limit.. How much is artificial and how much is closer to real life, I don't know yet.
 
S

Seanspeed

Banned
Xanadu said:
shit i really hope they are gone for the final game. although i sold my MS wheel after FM3 i was thinking of either buying another one or borrowing my friends in time for forza 4s release, but this has put me off big time. i thought they had fixed it ffs!
Click to expand...
Xanadu's like:

"YES! Finally some stuff to complain about!"
 
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