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Correctomundo · Jul 13, 2014

Still my most replayed Resident Evil. I could write reams on the reasons why it's better than RE2, but time is short. Still, I'm thoroughly thrilled to see all the love the game is getting here. I've never been able to fathom how anyone could find RE2 a better game than RE3, so this thread is a nice breath of fresh air.

Good on you, people who recognize 3 for the brilliance it is.

KnockOneOff · Jul 13, 2014

For me resident evil 3 was the best in the series

That nemesis chasing me kept me on my toes and the pressure there.

I was soooo happy to get in save rooms where he couldn't get me

badcrumble · Jul 13, 2014

Correctomundo said:
Still my most replayed Resident Evil. I could write reams on the reasons why it's better than RE2, but time is short. Still, I'm thoroughly thrilled to see all the love the game is getting here. I've never been able to fathom how anyone could find RE2 a better game than RE3, so this thread is a nice breath of fresh air.

Good on you, people who recognize 3 for the brilliance it is.

RE2's still fantastic but RE3's absolutely up there with it, and possibly above it (though I gotta love that zapping system and everything it adds). RE3 definitely has the feel of greater polish and confidence (and dat Mercenaries).

I find it kind of a bummer that RE1/2/3 are the only games in the series ever to try to have some real variability in the way the game plays out.

RE1 had the first draft of the zapping system, as well as ways to affect the ending based on saving Barry/Rebecca.

RE2 had the Scenario A/B zapping system (though, IIRC, there's no way to make Leon A/Leon B/Claire A/Claire B have further variability in terms of plot or enemy spawning).

RE3 loses the ability to choose your protagonist, but has an *immensely complex* system of triggers (based on your choices in the freeze-frame cutscenes, based on which areas you visit first to trigger certain cutscenes, and based on whether you decide to kill or run from Nemesis in every single encounter with him), each of which affects future plot/cutscenes, future enemy spawns, and even where you find certain puzzle items and what type of healing/ammo you'll find in which places. It's absolutely the most variable game in the series, but most people never knew that because they only played it once.

It's a bummer that RECV has absolutely no way to affect things in this fashion (outside of deciding to heal that one jailer dude and leaving the fire extinguisher so you can get the Magnum) - the plot only plays out in one way every single time. Likewise, RE4 onward has absolutely no ability to affect the way things play out in that fashion.

Correctomundo · Jul 13, 2014

badcrumble said:
RE2's still fantastic but RE3's absolutely up there with it, and possibly above it (though I gotta love that zapping system and everything it adds). RE3 definitely has the feel of greater polish and confidence (and dat Mercenaries).

I find it kind of a bummer that RE1/2/3 are the only games in the series ever to try to have some real variability in the way the game plays out.

RE1 had the first draft of the zapping system, as well as ways to affect the ending based on saving Barry/Rebecca.

RE2 had the Scenario A/B zapping system (though, IIRC, there's no way to make Leon A/Leon B/Claire A/Claire B have further variability in terms of plot or enemy spawning).

RE3 loses the ability to choose your protagonist, but has an *immensely complex* system of triggers (based on your choices in the freeze-frame cutscenes, based on which areas you visit first to trigger certain cutscenes, and based on whether you decide to kill or run from Nemesis in every single encounter with him), each of which affects future plot/cutscenes, future enemy spawns, and even where you find certain puzzle items and what type of healing/ammo you'll find in which places. It's absolutely the most variable game in the series, but most people never knew that because they only played it once.

It's a bummer that RECV has absolutely no way to affect things in this fashion (outside of deciding to heal that one jailer dude and leaving the fire extinguisher so you can get the Magnum) - the plot only plays out in one way every single time. Likewise, RE4 onward has absolutely no ability to affect the way things play out in that fashion.

To be fair, I like RE2. But it wasn't really much more than a decidedly action oriented rehash of the original. There was some really good stuff in there (the OST is still the best in the series, aside from maybe Code Veronica), but where I see most people likening RE3 as an expansion to RE2, I see RE3 as the final version of what RE2 should have been. At least from a gameplay standpoint.

And you're absolutely right about the decision variants. How can the fantastic advances brought about in RE3 be completely ignored by future games in the series?

badcrumble · Jul 13, 2014

Correctomundo said:
To be fair, I like RE2. But it wasn't really much more than a decidedly action oriented rehash of the original. There was some really good stuff in there (the OST is still the best in the series, aside from maybe Code Veronica), but where I see most people likening RE3 as an expansion to RE2, I see RE3 as the final version of what RE2 should have been. At least from a gameplay standpoint.

And you're absolutely right about the decision variants. How can the fantastic advances brought about in RE3 be completely ignored by future games in the series?

I think one original design goal for the RE series was to have an interactive action/horror movie with actual choose-your-own-adventure elements, in which your choices would affect your path and outcome. That eventually got abandoned, I suspect because of the increased costs/effort of cutscene production and because it turned out that people want more of a cinematic roller coaster ride than the ability to get different/multiple endings.

Fancy Clown · Jul 13, 2014

badcrumble said:
I think one original design goal for the RE series was to have an interactive action/horror movie with actual choose-your-own-adventure elements, in which your choices would affect your path and outcome. That eventually got abandoned, I suspect because of the increased costs/effort of cutscene production and because it turned out that people want more of a cinematic roller coaster ride than the ability to get different/multiple endings.

I feel like they sort of tried to bring it back in a really limited fashion in 5 and 6. In 5 you get to play as either Sheva or Chris, and in 6 you just have the 4 campaigns. It's not nearly the same scope and doesn't offer the same replayability as the zapping system or RE3's choice system.

badcrumble · Jul 13, 2014

Fancy Clown said:
I feel like they sort of tried to bring it back in a really limited fashion in 5 and 6. In 5 you get to play as either Sheva or Chris, and in 6 you just have the 4 campaigns. It's not nearly the same scope and doesn't offer the same replayability as the zapping system or RE3's choice system.

5 felt less like variability and more like an advance of RE0's system, which itself felt like an attempt to advance RE2's zapping system. They did multiple-character stuff well, sure, but it really missed out on the part where it all feels like additional content. (The way RE2 keeps each character restricted to a different set of weapons, all of which function pretty differently outside of the handguns, goes a really long way to making it feel like it's four games in one).

Fancy Clown · Jul 13, 2014

badcrumble said:
5 felt less like variability and more like an advance of RE0's system, which itself felt like an attempt to advance RE2's zapping system. They did multiple-character stuff well, sure, but it really missed out on the part where it all feels like additional content. (The way RE2 keeps each character restricted to a different set of weapons, all of which function pretty differently outside of the handguns, goes a really long way to making it feel like it's four games in one).

Absolutely. I'd really like them to return to the variability in the future. I have no problem replaying games that essentially have no variability (I've replayed the Uncharted games dozens of times), but I really appreciate when developers put extra effort into changing the experience. I feel that system lends itself particularly well to the survival horror genre because it adds a later of unpredictability and surprise--both of which are really crucial to help foster an atmosphere of horror.

badcrumble · Jul 13, 2014

One particular encounter with the Nemesis makes me curious - when you first see him at the police station, you can fight him in the courtyard outside of it (and if you're playing on Hard, which is the only difficulty you should ever play RE3 on, you're only armed with the handgun and shotgun, and the only way to do significant damage is to get up close and aim upward with the shotgun). That's a RIDICULOUSLY GODDAMN HARD FIGHT, but for "nemesis drop" purposes (kill the Nemesis once and get handgun parts, kill him a second time and get the other handgun parts, kill him a third time and get a first aid kit 3-pack, and so on)it's the same fight as when he busts through a police station window (i.e. both of them count as the first encounter with the Nemesis and killing him both times only gets you the one drop). The time when he busts through the window is right after you picked up either the grenade launcher or the Magnum in the weapons locker, depending on choices made earlier in the story (whichever one the game gives you at this point, you get the other one when you visit the underground power plant, I believe) so it's far more beatable.

My question is: if killing him outside the police station is purely optional from a kill-Nemmy-seven-times-to-get-all-the-prizes perspective, does it also affect the way the story plays out? I have to presume that it does because most of the stuff like that ends up affecting a cutscene or a weapon drop or a creature spawn down the road.

Dragon1893 · Jul 13, 2014

I'll have to replay these on Vita one day.
Man, I still remember RE2's intro blowing my fucking mind.
You just had to be there.

Fancy Clown · Jul 13, 2014

badcrumble said:
One particular encounter with the Nemesis makes me curious - when you first see him at the police station, you can fight him in the courtyard outside of it (and if you're playing on Hard, which is the only difficulty you should ever play RE3 on, you're only armed with the handgun and shotgun, and the only way to do significant damage is to get up close and aim upward with the shotgun). That's a RIDICULOUSLY GODDAMN HARD FIGHT, but for "nemesis drop" purposes (kill the Nemesis once and get handgun parts, kill him a second time and get the other handgun parts, kill him a third time and get a first aid kit 3-pack, and so on)it's the same fight as when he busts through a police station window (i.e. both of them count as the first encounter with the Nemesis and killing him both times only gets you the one drop). The time when he busts through the window is right after you picked up either the grenade launcher or the Magnum in the weapons locker, depending on choices made earlier in the story (whichever one the game gives you at this point, you get the other one when you visit the underground power plant, I believe) so it's far more beatable.

My question is: if killing him outside the police station is purely optional from a kill-Nemmy-seven-times-to-get-all-the-prizes perspective, does it also affect the way the story plays out? I have to presume that it does because most of the stuff like that ends up affecting a cutscene or a weapon drop or a creature spawn down the road.

I only best the game once on hard and I remember trying to fight him a couple times there until I just got so frustrated I never attempted fighting him again haha. I always ran.

Dragon1893 said:
I'll have to replay these on Vita one day.
Man, I still remember RE2's intro blowing my fucking mind.
You just had to be there.

You should! They look and play great on vita. Except the only version of RE1 on PSN is the one with fart music, so I've never played the original yet.

badcrumble · Jul 13, 2014

Fancy Clown said:
I only best the game once on hard and I remember trying to fight him a couple times there until I just got so frustrated I never attempted fighting him again haha. I always ran.

Considering that you've barely got any weaponry at that point and that you need to get up close to do any kind of significant damage, I'd call it possibly the toughest boss fight in all of classic RE (though this is to discount the three kinda broken encounters with the Tyrant, Steve, and Nosferatu, each of which is very poorly designed). You pretty much need to get astonishingly good at dodging in order to have a shot against the Nemesis at this point (and, at close range, expect lots of having to slip out of his grab move).

Fenderman89 · Jul 13, 2014

I absolutely love the RE trilogy, with 2 being the best overall and 1 being my favourite.
I put RE3 in third position simply because I started to feel a little "RE fatigue" at the time, at least for what I can recall.
Still a beautiful game though.

shmoglish · Jul 13, 2014

Cause I shit my pants when I see Nemesis

Somnium986 · Jul 13, 2014

I thought everyone liked RE3? While I don't agree that it's the scariest( that's the REmake), I did love all the environments we got to explore. The live selection sequences that changed the outcome of the story were also cool. If the REmake didn't come out it would be my second favorite after RE2.

I'm more surprised by all the hate RECV gets on GAF nowadays. I also think RE0 gets a lot less love.

HF2014 · Jul 13, 2014

First and Second where the best. Nemesis is not bad, they are just trying to scare you too often and its not a good thing, you are no more surprise after sometimes. And it was too much action . Not saying it bad or average, it was really good, but its my least favorite of the first three.

Fancy Clown · Jul 13, 2014

Somnium986 said:
I thought everyone liked RE3? While I don't agree that it's the scariest( that's the REmake), I did love all the environments we got to explore. The live selection sequences that changed the outcome of the story were also cool. If the REmake didn't come out it would be my second favorite after RE2.

I'm more surprised by all the hate RECV gets on GAF nowadays. I also think RE0 gets a lot less love.

Yeah, I'm playing REmake for the first time now. It's pretty creepy so far--nothing outright terrifying has happened so far---but I'm not that far into it. The sense of atmosphere in it is insane though.

MrMephistoX · Jul 13, 2014

Seik said:
Nemesis fucking gave me nightmares for week because I was a kid when it came out, yet I was still playing it in the dark late at night.

Fuck ESRB.

Kind of a love/hate relationship, Nemesis can still make me jump my shit because I just went through the game once, so I don't remember all of his spots.

I prefer RE2 because it introduced Racoon City first, RE3 felt like an expansion at some point, especially to my young eyes from back then, so RE2 kept the top place.

Plus motherfucker stalks you and opens doors! Totally wasn't expecting that the first time and I hadn't played through the Tyrant parts of RE2 yet.

badcrumble · Jul 13, 2014

Somnium986 said:
I'm more surprised by all the hate RECV gets on GAF nowadays. I also think RE0 gets a lot less love.

CV stood out at the time because it was a big leap forward in production values and it did a lot to move the overall story forward (even if it moved it Forward Into Shit by resurrecting Wesker, trying to introduce romantic interests, having ridiculous JRPG villains, et cetera).

People don't really give a shit about the overarching Biohazard plot anymore (RE4 was totally correct to say "fuck it" and just kill off Umbrella/have a hilariously funny standalone story), and *all* of the old games have poor graphics, so all that's left is for the games to stand on is their actual game design (where CV falls very very short) and their atmosphere (where it's generally inferior to Raccoon City).

Also all of the really stupid John Woo shit in CV is no longer fashionable or cool.

Fancy Clown · Jul 13, 2014

badcrumble said:
Considering that you've barely got any weaponry at that point and that you need to get up close to do any kind of significant damage, I'd call it possibly the toughest boss fight in all of classic RE (though this is to discount the three kinda broken encounters with the Tyrant, Steve, and Nosferatu, each of which is very poorly designed). You pretty much need to get astonishingly good at dodging in order to have a shot against the Nemesis at this point (and, at close range, expect lots of having to slip out of his grab move).

Even by the end of the game I still hadn't mastered dodging. Most of the time I would do it totally by accident.

Somnium986 · Jul 13, 2014

Fancy Clown said:
Yeah, I'm playing REmake for the first time now. It's pretty creepy so far--nothing outright terrifying has happened so far---but I'm not that far into it. The sense of atmosphere in it is insane though.

Well to be fair I really don't consider RE to be all that scary in the first place. The REmake though as you said has really great atmosphere, and you're given even less supplies than the original game. There is one or two new enemies that may give you a jump though. Glad you're enjoying it. :]

Ninjimbo · Jul 13, 2014

I, for one, would like to hear from Riposte in this thread.

As for RE3, I don't think it's underrated at all. When it came out, it reviewed well and most fans recognized it for the solid game it was. The disappointment (which is slight one) comes from the fact that the game isn't a 'story' sequel. Canonically it's like set a few hours before RE2 and people were dying to find out what happened to Clair and Leon and Umbrella. I can't really blame people for feeling some disappointment in that regard. The story of RE was one of the reasons it got popular in the first place, so when you have this game that doesn't even try to expand the mythos, you can't help but feel a little slighted.

Also, keep in mind the games that are put above RE3 are legit masterpieces: REmake, RE2, and RE4 are near perfect. Saying RE3 isn't as good as those games, it's not even an insult. Being in the mid-tier after those games is no shame.

Fancy Clown · Jul 13, 2014

Somnium986 said:
Well to be fair I really don't consider RE to be all that scary in the first place. The REmake though as you said has really great atmosphere, and you're given even less supplies than the original game. There is one or two new enemies that may give you a jump though. Glad you're enjoying it. :]

Yeah, I agree RE is more 'spooky' than really scary. I actually think RE4 is the scariest to be honest.

I never played the original Resident Evil either so I'm going into REmake totally blind with nothing to compare it to! All I knew about going in are the crimson heads, and apparently there's some really scary lady named Lisa Trevor. Also, I keep waiting for dogs to jump through windows and it's stressing me out. At one point a window broke and nothing came through; it really fucked with me.

Y2Kev · Jul 13, 2014

I thought (and think) RE3 is actually the best looking of the classic RE games. RECV obviously has more detailed character models and zombies, but the environments are a bit sparse as a result of the shift to full 3D. The CG in RE3 is also much better than RE2.

I think the music in RE3 is also very underrated and appropriately conveys a sense of desperation present in the city at the time of the game.

Bergerac · Jul 13, 2014

I honestly think this question is better aimed at RE0, I'd say that 3 was largely fondly remembered if not as much as RE2.

Man God · Jul 13, 2014

Y2Kev said:
I thought (and think) RE3 is actually the best looking of the classic RE games. RECV obviously has more detailed character models and zombies, but the environments are a bit sparse as a result of the shift to full 3D. The CG in RE3 is also much better than RE2.

I think the music in RE3 is also very underrated and appropriately conveys a sense of desperation present in the city at the time of the game.

Not wrong there. RE 3 has some of that late gen PSX juice that the other two just don't. I generally find the art better than CV as well despite the more detailed models in the Dreamcast game.

Alkastelca · Jul 13, 2014

How's RE1, RE2 and RE3 on PSVita ?
Is it playable ?
Does it look good on OLED screen ?

I'm thinking of buying and playing all three on my vita.

Fancy Clown · Jul 13, 2014

Alkastelca said:
How's RE1, RE2 and RE3 on PSVita ?
Is it playable ?
Does it look good on OLED screen ?

I'm thinking of buying and playing all three on my vita.

2 and 3 look and play amazing on vita, I highly recommend them. The only version of 1 on PSN is the one with the terrible soundtrack so I haven't played it (it's also twice as much $ as 2 and 3).

andshrew · Jul 13, 2014

Fancy Clown said:
2 and 3 look and play amazing on vita, I highly recommend them. The only version of 1 on PSN is the one with the terrible soundtrack so I haven't played it (it's also twice as much $ as 2 and 3).

If you have access to a UK account our version has the original soundtrack, but unfortunately has other issues due to it being 50hz.

Fancy Clown · Jul 13, 2014

andshrew said:
If you have access to a UK account our version has the original soundtrack, but unfortunately has other issues due to it being 50hz.

I don't want to deal with reformatting my vita every time I switch accounts unfortunately. I'll just have to hope that one day they update the US PSN with the right version. I'd love to see how it compares to REmake once I finish it.

Jaeger · Jul 13, 2014

RE 1-3 are GOAT.

Aizu_Itsuko · Jul 13, 2014

News Bot said:
It is basically an (expanded) expansion pack. That's what it was initially designed as. That's not a bad thing in itself. It is most definitely not poorly designed or lacking in vision, though. The levels are some of my favorite in the series (the streets remind me of my own city) and the atmosphere, while different from the previous two games, is still on a pretty high-level of its own.

As a main entry in the series, being an expanded expansion pack is bad thing. That's what I would expect from a spin-off.

As for the levels, I loved the atmosphere and how open it all seemed at the beginning, but a great portion of the game seems the result of someone messing around with a level editor. The lack of compelling characters and situations results in just you running around, mindlessly shooting at things, contextless. Just look at the section with the trolley puzzle, where you just go back and forth and the game just tosses a few more zombies at you every time you pass certain areas. Still fun to play, but it could have been much better. In fact, some parts of the game are much better for this very reason.

News Bot said:
How is Nemesis going after S.T.A.R.S. dumb? The point of B.O.W.s was that they could be ordered to act out certain commands and accomplish certain objectives. Nemesis isn't being used to "distract" you, he's being used to keep you on your toes. It's fine if you don't like the theme of the game, but don't make things up to try and justify it. That's just poor.

Think about the xenomorphs in Alien or the white shark in Jaws and why they are scary. They are scary because they are powerful, uncontrollable and merciless predators. Same for zombies or any other similar creature. You can't reason with them. Nothing kills the sense of fear from such a creature than taking from them what makes them scary in the first place.

B.O.W.s should be used to wreck havok and they should be dangerous. not some remote controlled military toy.

SixFourMike said:
You can't be mad at a game for not living up to what you made up in your head. That's like being mad at not being given a sword so you can play it like Onimusha (which would have been awesome).

First, I'm not mad at it, just disappointed. I still think the game is pretty enjoyable, visually amazing and has a great soundtrack. Some parts of it are among the best on the system.

I'm not disappointed at the game for not living up to something I made up in my head, either. I'm disappointed that it has such wasted potential and because it could have been much better with just a few changes and a little extra attention. Mikami and Kamiya could have done a much better job than Aoyama in that sense.

badcrumble said:
You're upset that it turned out to have the same essential game design as all other classic REs? Huh.

Just because it has similar elements, it doesn't mean it has the same quality. Plenty of examples.

News Bot · Jul 13, 2014

It's not an expansion. It's a main game. It only started off as an expansion, but was expanded into a main game. Your statements don't make much sense without any actual examples. Just seems like you're throwing out generic complaints. The trolley "puzzle" is fine. The game throws enemies at you because otherwise it would be dull. It's the same as BIO1 and BIO2 in that regard.

They already used uncontrollable monsters in the previous two games. Considering the issue you seem to have with supposed repetition, it's odd that it's all you expect from the enemies.

Nemesis isn't "remote controlled" in any way. It is trained and given orders. Then it is set loose to carry them out however it sees fit. It's just as much a powerful, uncontrollable and merciless predator as any other enemy. It only responds to certain individuals within Umbrella, exactly as the Cerberus, Hunter and Tyrant do. They all wreak havoc and they are all dangerous. At the same time, the purpose of their existence is to function as weapons.

Funny that you mention Mikami, considering he was partially responsible for the game's direction in many ways. He held meetings with Aoyama and Kawamura to decide the main character, the increased focus on action, the increased difficulty (he wanted it to focus on hardcore gamers while BIO2 focused on casuals) and so on.

Fornaximus · Jul 13, 2014

It's the last RE that I really liked. Of course I haven't played REmake yet. Even though a copy of it and a fully functional GameCube are sitting in my closet and have been for many years.

King Boo · Jul 13, 2014

only game on gaf that gets little to no love is code veronica. or maybe resident evil 6.

well anyway, i like re3. but then again i like all the re games. nemesis made the game a lot of fun

Fancy Clown · Jul 13, 2014

Fornaximus said:
It's the last RE that I really liked. Of course I haven't played REmake yet. Even though a copy of it and a fully functional GameCube are sitting in my closet and have been for many years.

I'm not very far in REmake yet but it's already fantastic. If you liked the original 3 I suggest you hook it up.

encephalon · Jul 13, 2014

Out of the three PS1 games, RE1 and RE2 both "needed" remakes. RE1 for being the somewhat clunky 1996 game it was (as well as everything else). RE2 for being a little sparse after the police station and for being a little too easy and improperly balanced for the horror game that it is. But RE3 at least has a "hard" mode that delivers such a solid experience, it doesn't really have much to "fix" aside from graphical improvements and maybe better writing. The more I think about it, the more I start to think the gameplay in RE3 is really only second to the REmake.

The only thing that really remains in my mind is that Nemesis feels like an attempt to out do relentless pursuers Mr. X and Birkin were in 2. And gameplay wise, yeah, it was an improvement. But at the end of the game when you're fighting an amorphous blob, well, it had been done in the game directly prior to 3. The latter half of 3 could have been a more interesting scenario.

PhantomZone · Jul 13, 2014

It was a good game, i missed out on playing the playstation version but i do own the pc version. Still think RE 2 is the best in the series though.

Aizu_Itsuko · Jul 14, 2014

News Bot said:
It's not an expansion. It's a main game. It only started off as an expansion, but was expanded into a main game.

You said it was basically an expansion pack one post ago.

News Bot said:
It is basically an (expanded) expansion pack. That's what it was initially designed as. That's not a bad thing in itself.

News Bot said:
Your statements don't make much sense without any actual examples. Just seems like you're throwing out generic complaints.

They are not statements, they are my personal impressions on the game and I know there are plenty of people who loved it. I'm fine with that, but I'm not one of them. I only enjoyed some parts of it.

News Bot said:
The trolley "puzzle" is fine. The game throws enemies at you because otherwise it would be dull. It's the same as BIO1 and BIO2 in that regard.

I don't think it's fine at all.

It basically stalls you while nothing happens, then makes you go back and forth from a central point. You take exit #1, get piece #1 and go back. Then you take exit #2, get piece #2 and go back. Then you take exit #3, rinse and repeat. I found that to be an absolute chore and took me completely out of the game.

News Bot said:
It only responds to certain individuals within Umbrella, exactly as the Cerberus, Hunter and Tyrant do. They all wreak havoc and they are all dangerous. At the same time, the purpose of their existence is to function as weapons.

I don't remember Cerberus or Hunters following any orders in RE1/2 and Tyrant literally breaks loose and attacks everyone in sight. If you are talking about T-103, I already thought that was lame but he was better designed and much more imposing than Nemesis. Only used sparingly as well, which made it much better.

Anyway, I have already said what I liked about the game and what I did not like, as well as how I thought it could have been much better. Your main issue seems to be that I don't share your opinion. I can't change that.

News Bot · Jul 14, 2014

"Stalls you while nothing happens"? Is that really how you're going to describe basically 90% of the series? Running around collecting keys and backtracking are pretty pivotal to the early games. That entire trolley segment is essentially equivalent to the sword/armor etc keys of BIO1 and heart/diamond etc based keys of BIO2.

Aizu_Itsuko said:
I don't remember Cerberus or Hunters following any orders in RE1/2 and Tyrant literally breaks loose and attacks everyone in sight. If you are talking about T-103, I already thought that was lame but he was better designed and much more imposing than Nemesis. Only used sparingly as well, which made it much better.

There are reasons they don't. Namely that the people meant to train and command them are dead at the time. But following commands is what they're for. It doesn't make much sense for them to only ever use the "out of control" angle. Again, considering your other complaints about supposed repetition, it's odd that you'd prefer that as the exclusive MO for the enemies.

T-103 and Nemesis are pretty different. The latter is the only one that actively pursues you outside of scripted sequences and some encounters are actually determined entirely by the player's actions. Its increased moveset, ability to run, ability to use weapons, ability to open doors, ability to damage other enemies in its way... make it pretty unique.

funkypie · Jul 14, 2014

I find it funny nemesis bangs on the police station door like he can't get in.

How does killing or not killing nemesis affect the story. I've cleared re3 many times both avoiding and fighting him. And how do you force the magnum early.

DodgyGeezerFella · Jul 14, 2014

Resi 3 is great, same mechanics although sped up a bit, plenty of jump scares, still a cruel atmosphere, and The Nemesis, the guy that broke all the traditional rules from previous games.

And that Winchester .....

Correctomundo · Jul 14, 2014

Fornaximus said:
It's the last RE that I really liked. Of course I haven't played REmake yet. Even though a copy of it and a fully functional GameCube are sitting in my closet and have been for many years.

I recommend fixing this problem immediately.

klee123 · Jul 14, 2014

It's the most mechanically advanced of the traditional REs.

180 Turn
Dodge
Exploding Barrels
Ammo Creation
Enhanced Ammo
Custom Special Weapons
Live Selection Mode

REmake had a few exclusive features such as self defense items and zombie burning, but doesn't compare to the gameplay improvements which RE3 had.

Fancy Clown · Jul 14, 2014

Did Aoyama direct any other games besides 3? Or have any notable contributions to other RE games?

luka · Jul 14, 2014

News Bot said:
She was waiting for the Army/National Guard to arrive. After nearly a week she figured nobody was coming to help, so she set out on her own. The city wasn't actually in complete chaos all the time, there were lulls between the skirmishes. It wasn't completely doomed until September 28, when the game starts.

That makes sense. Is this a statement from Aoyama himself or is it mentioned in-game anywhere?

Aizu_Itsuko said:
I don't think it's fine at all.

It basically stalls you while nothing happens, then makes you go back and forth from a central point. You take exit #1, get piece #1 and go back. Then you take exit #2, get piece #2 and go back. Then you take exit #3, rinse and repeat. I found that to be an absolute chore and took me completely out of the game.

I liked the trolly fetch quest because of the way the event triggers were set up. It kept the city feeling dynamic and unpredictable, and worked for me because it finally gave you a clear goal to pursue after an hour or two of fumbling around just trying to survive. The chaotic structure for the first part of the game gave it a unique and desperate feeling compared to the others. The best parts of any Biohazard game are the ones that make you revisit areas you've previously explored with the ability to unlock and explore deeper, but changing the tone and adding new elements to play on your familiarity with the area. The trolly quest is great because you get a sense that the situation is constantly escalating and shifting as you play.

As for the story, I truly think it's one of the best in the series, as well as the most consistent and well written. Having little to no ties to the overarching 'mystery' of umbrella and focusing on a simple and straightforward plot with many braching paths and variances is one of the best kind of narratives a video game can have, and with the amount of background information and detail on every character and location made the world building and lore far more interesting than that of the previous games.

Biohazard 4 dwarfed the game in polish, ingenuity and creativity, but I'll always be disappointed that nothing in the series before or after has the same sense of consistency and believability that 3 did.

encephalon · Jul 14, 2014

The trolley was great because it gives you something to work towards that isn't simply solve puzzles to eventually make your way to point C (which is fine, but the trolley was different from what had been done in the series before). It's really a testament to how the games were fundamentally puzzle/adventure games and it took advantage of the city angle by giving you the opportunity to explore separate portions of the city in order to search for resources while working towards a single goal. RE3 wouldn't be as good as it is without it.

badcrumble · Jul 14, 2014

The trolley puzzle is actually a HUGE part of determining how things will go for you at the clock tower and through the finale of Day 1. Which pieces you go for first, whether you decide to return them to the trolley one by one or all at once after collecting them all - they do a lot to affect things at the clock tower (though your decision of how to escape the trolley plays a bigger factor).

IIRC, the game kind of hits a reset button on the story-variability stuff on Day 2 of RE3, at which point a lot of the variation pre-factory is based on the order in which you completed Carlos's objectives (this can determine, for example, whether the Hunter Gammas break out of their tanks or not, and indeed whether Claire ever encounters a Hunter Gamma in the entire game - it's entirely possible not to), and the variability at the factory itself is decided by your choice on the bridge leading to the factory and (if you take the bridge instead of jumping down) the way you handle Nikolai.

There are several slightly-varied endings you can get to the game as a result of all this stuff. It's pretty cool.

Soodanim · Jul 14, 2014

badcrumble said:
above

I really should look into finding a guide that details the choices, because while I understood that routes and choices affect Nemesis encounters after a few play throngs as a kid, it affects far more than I realised. So many variables. Thinking about it makes me want to play every possibility.

Fancy Clown · Jul 14, 2014

SixFourMike said:
I really should look into finding a guide that details the choices, because while I understood that routes and choices affect Nemesis encounters after a few play throngs as a kid, it affects far more than I realised. So many variables. Thinking about it makes me want to play every possibility.

Yeah, it's more subtle than the zapping system from RE2, but it sounds like it offers just as much--if not more--replayability due to the sheer amount of variables.

Also, I second liking the trolly puzzle. It gives you something big to work towards and then once you finish it gives you both a sense of accomplishment, and mystery as to where the game will take you next (at least for me).

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