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Earthpainting · Dec 23, 2014

Most of Paper Mario 1's cast joins you for HOLY SHIT ITS MARIO reasons. The only exceptions I can think of are Lady Bow, who carries you through Tubba Blubba's mansion, and Sushi whom you join forces to find the yoshi children. Character motivations are the biggest thing they upgraded in its sequel.

Alavard said:
Does Gogo count in FFVI? It joins you in order to 'copy' you by saving the world as well. I love the character and clearly that fits his theme of mimicry, but it was pretty silly all the same.

It's silly enough that it makes me crack a smile, so it's all right in my book.

jay · Dec 23, 2014

Since when has motivation been important for characters?

That's a joke, the answer is always.

Magnus said:
Something from Suikoden I or II. For all the games' merits, there are some laughably stupid characters and justifications for joining up in those games.

I'm playing Suikoden II again after some 15 years and this does seem to be the case.

You found my squirrel thing? Guess I'll come with you forever.

panzone · Dec 23, 2014

DiipuSurotu said:
Chrono Trigger.

The game's pacing is so good that the characters stick around in your party for no reason and you don't even realize it unless you stop to think about it:

- Frog technically doesn't join your party; YOU join him in HIS quest to defeat

Magus

. But after the latter is defeat, Frog just keeps following you throughout time for absolutely no explicit reason.

- Ayla is the same. You join her in her quest to rescue her boyfriend Kino, but after said rescue and subsequent defeat of

Azala

, she follows in the future, leaving her village, Kino and chief position behind for absolutely no reason given.

Well:

Frog joins because

after Magus failed the invocation of Lavos he learned its existence and, believing it's a Magus creature that destroyed the world he wants to stop it

Ayla

joins because at that time Lavos was thought to be something called from Azala for eliminate the humans

Uthred · Dec 23, 2014

Sometimes I think people can get hung up too much on things "making sense", while there are truly nonsensical "because its a game" reasons, several excellent ones mentioned in the thread, people dont always operate logically. Sometimes people join causes, even to the point of giving up their lives, for poorly or undefined reasons, for random emotion or because of a charismatic leader (which the protagonist in these games often is portrayed as).

Falk said:
Exactly. They're so self-aware that it'd be criminal not to mention them in any thread about JRPG tropes.

I suppose theyre stupid in "absolute terms", just not really within the paradigm of the games universes (or legitmately stupid because theyre written as such). Just a difference in opinion on "what counts" I guess

SliceSabre · Dec 23, 2014

bomblord1 said:
Got one
Desco Disgaea 4

She joins you because the main character Valvatorez promises to maker her into a

final boss

But this is an excellent reason to join the hero's party!

jay · Dec 23, 2014

Uthred said:
Sometimes I think people can get hung up too much on things "making sense", while there are truly nonsensical "because its a game" reasons, several excellent ones mentioned in the thread, people dont always operate logically. Sometimes people join causes, even to the point of giving up their lives, for poorly or undefined reasons, for random emotion or because of a charismatic leader (which the protagonist in these games often is portrayed as).

So then why not convey these characters as having not much else going on or not much to live for, or as being completely swept away by the protagonists cult of personality?

That some people behave illogically is not a good defense for half-assed writing. Real life is full of random, uncontrollable occurrences but that does not mean characters should randomly have strokes or get cancer or get hit by buses in video games if the narrative doesn't call for those things.

Uthred · Dec 23, 2014

jay said:
So then why not convey these characters as having not much else going on or not much to live for, or as being completely swept away by the protagonists cult of personality?

That some people behave illogically is not a good defense for half-assed writing. Real life is full of random, uncontrollable occurrences but that does not mean characters should randomly have strokes or get cancer or get hit by buses in video games if the narrative doesn't call for those things.

It wasnt a defence, it was an observation, I thought I made that clear by acknowleding that there are plenty of poor examples. And often people joining up randomly is how they convey someone getting swept up by the heros charisma. Again I'm not defending shoddy writing, I was just observing that for a lot of people unless A connects directly to B they consider it "stupid"

Off-Kilter · Dec 23, 2014

I hope you realize JRPG is a subset of RPG. Seems weird to separate them like that.

N30RYU · Dec 23, 2014

Cait Sith's I stole your materia and you'll have no choice but keep me in the party without explanation.

IdreamofHIME · Dec 23, 2014

JNA said:
To answer the question, I thought Zaeed from Mass Effect 2 was pretty stupid.

The guy is a very well known and feared Bounty Hunter that makes good money for what he does. He can go and be anywhere he wants, but suddenly, he joins you in a huge potentially suicidal mission.

Plus as a party member, the guy hardly talked or did much of anything noteworthy during his time with you. I felt like he was just thrown in.

His reason is awesome.
He's a paid bounty hunter.
If you buy the game used and cheap, you can't get him. If you buy the game new and pay more, he's a downloadable character.
His reason for joining your party is because you literally paid him to. Bioware were really breaking the 4th wall with him. It's awesome.

TheSpoiler · Dec 23, 2014

N30RYU said:
Cait Sith's I stole your materia and you'll have no choice but keep me in the party without explanation.

Also because of his fortune reading. He's useful battle wise, so they saw that, and therefore took him along.

His real reasoning is much better, but when you are saving the planet, you take what you can get.

Quina had a good reasoning too - her whole existence is eating, so why not travel with people who are sightseeing the world? Apparently she needed far more practice and experience than she had before.

Cornbread78 · Dec 23, 2014

C'Mon OP, Beryl was lonely and wanted some friends, besides, the visit to her hometown kind of explains her sticking around..

DigtialT · Dec 23, 2014

Naix said:
Came to say this. Recruited her yesterday.

Wish there was an option : Who the fuck are you and why do you want to join me ???

You can ask her that, though I'm not sure if its when you first meet her or just later at the hold.

She stays around because she wants to stop the breach.

bomblord1 · Dec 23, 2014

SliceSabre said:
But this is an excellent reason to join the hero's party!

Don't ask me why but I read that in Desco's voice.

shark sandwich · Dec 23, 2014

In FF XII, Penelo's whole reason for joining is basically "no fair, if Vaan is going then so am I!!"

What a great reason to go around butchering faceless soldiers by the dozens and putting your life in extreme danger.

Mman235 · Dec 23, 2014

I guess "stupidest" is the important part here, given all the games where characters basically join after a line of dialogue, but that's technically not always stupid, and there's enough that they're kind of equal in how bad they are.

IdreamofHIME said:
His reason is awesome.
He's a paid bounty hunter.
If you buy the game used and cheap, you can't get him. If you buy the game new and pay more, he's a downloadable character.
His reason for joining your party is because you literally paid him to. Bioware were really breaking the 4th wall with him. It's awesome.

KeanuReevesWoah.jpg

Ishida · Dec 23, 2014

Karsticles said:
You beat me to it, Ishida.

Had to be said!

IntelliHeath · Dec 23, 2014

Magnus said:
Don't they want to help you after you've helped them? And don't they have a line or two somewhere about wanting to save the planet from Lavos too?

I mean, that alone puts them miles ahead of other characters in other games. lol

NeonZ said:
In both of those cases they learn about Lavos at the end of their personal stories, so they stick with the main party for the same reason they were traveling around in the first place - stop Lavos from destroying the world's future.

Bingo.

FrontalMonk said:
Penelo, though? Yeah, I got nothin'.

shark sandwich said:
In FF XII, Penelo's whole reason for joining is basically "no fair, if Vaan is going then so am I!!"

What a great reason to go around butchering faceless soldiers by the dozens and putting your life in extreme danger.

It's all about Hormones.

Red Mage · Dec 23, 2014

Desi said:
Like this guy? Pesmerga aka "You fought Yuber, I want to kill Yuber!" then you never run into Yuber again...oh and that is all his dialogue in 1

The most commonly accepted theory is that he's somehow tied to the Eight-Fold Rune (which Yuber bears), and isn't even human (II reveals he doesn't sleep and apparently has no sense of taste). So, he's basically a shade that's hunting Yuber down as best he can. Since Yuber is drawn to chaos, his best option is to always involve himself where the True Runes are involved. BTW, he was just thrown into Suikoden II at the end because they didn't have enough time to work out a scenario for Lucia to join you.

Afrit · Dec 23, 2014

Corgi said:
i have no clue why most of my party is around in tales of graces.

Or why we keep accepting han solo back in Xillia even though he betrays you every other hour.

Tales games

oh you mean Alvin..

His entire act of being a traitor is flat out showcased everytime you see him, and still accepted back in party : /

Lord of Castamere · Dec 23, 2014

eternalb said:
May not be the stupidest, but I met Sera in Dragon Age Inquisition last night and two minutes later she was on the team.

Have no reason to care about her...

She's there to help, and has a spy network + reputation. A leader of leaders is what you are and she 'leads' the common folk, sort of.

djtiesto · Dec 23, 2014

Any game with a large cast, the Suikoden series in particular. Suikoden 4, which I just got finished playing, had characters join you with minimal dialogue, just by talking to them... "Oh you have a ship! Want me to join you?". At least in other Suikoden games, you may have to do something a tad more involved to get some characters to join - whether by giving them a chochky, or having people already in your party convince them to join, or doing mini sidequests.

The Horror the horror · Dec 23, 2014

Dad said:
I'm playing through Suikoden for the first time, and I have people tripping over themselves trying to join my party with maybe 1 or 2 lines of dialogue for justification. I guess that's just what happens when there are 108 recruitable characters.

This.

It's actually a bit disappointing, because it trivializes my Liberation Army by making it seem like a Mickey Mouse club for everyone to join.

Parfait · Dec 23, 2014

FrontalMonk said:
Let's not forget, the family Vaan does have is killed by the empire in the intro. I'd say that's a pretty solid motivation.

Penelo, though? Yeah, I got nothin'.

Penelo gets kidnapped just for Balthier talking to her

I don't think she was very safe at Rabanastre or whatever that's spelled, so after she got rescued she stuck around at the safest place she could be: with the rest of the party.

Bladenic · Dec 23, 2014

Fat Goron said:
Every single returning character in Tales of Xillia 2.

Not really, since their reason is "we saved the world once, gotta do it again."

Solid Samus · Dec 23, 2014

Pokemon games are getting reeeeally fucking stupid with this

"Ah, my Lucario thinks you look like the shit. He wants to come with you because heart friendship Pokemon Mega Evolution love journey friends Pokemon strong heart Champion. Good luck!"

"Oh, Player, this Latias saw you just walking around and decided "Hey, I really like his hat, it kind of looks like hair. I wonder if he'd like to ENSLAVE MY SIBLING"

Camisado · Dec 23, 2014

XtaLarge said:
"Oh, Player, this Latias saw you just walking around and decided "Hey, I really like his hat, it kind of looks like hair. I wonder if he'd like to ENSLAVE MY SIBLING"

Ok, that got an actual laugh out of me. Well played

Timeaisis · Dec 23, 2014

Quina actually has the best reason.

SerTapTap · Dec 23, 2014

Afrit said:
oh you mean Alvin..

His entire act of being a traitor is flat out showcased everytime you see him, and still accepted back in party : /

At least they made a big deal of the betrayal in Symphonia, Xilla made it more like a running gag.

Mr_Zombie · Dec 23, 2014

Markitron said:
There were some weird ones in Dragon Age 2 IIRC.

Actually, I think DA2 does it right. All the people from your party you simply meet at one point in the game:
- Aveline joins you during your escape from Feralden and since she has nowhere else to go, she goes to Kirkwall with you
- Varric offers you being a part of the Deep Road expedition;
- Anders gives you plans for Deep Roads, but first asks you for a little favour (helping his mage friend held by templars)
- Merrid is required for the ritual you promised Flementh to do;
- Fenris and Isabella offers you a job (this all happens in the first year, when you have to collect a certain amount of money for the expedition)

And then they are just people you know (or even become a friend with) and live in Kirkwall. And since there's no big "save the world" mission in the game, they are just helping you with your tasks when you need them. Their relationships with you feel very natural (at least when you treat them well).

Deified Data · Dec 23, 2014

Mudo said:
Recently - in Dragon Age: Inquisition, Iron Bull joins you cause uhhh errrr...he's ummm just on a beach fighting and oh you're the Inquisition? Ok I'll join you. I thought it was super abrupt and was confused like I had missed something important or done things out of order.

Sounds like it. Iron Bull is a mercenary who sent an emissary to you so you'd hire him. You don't just randomly meet him on a beach.

Lumpy Onion · Dec 23, 2014

Timeaisis said:
Quina actually has the best reason.

She/He is the Anthony Bourdain of the Final Fantasy IX world. Sounds like a noble enough reason to join IMO.

redcrayon · Dec 23, 2014

In Star Ocean 4, your party starts off as spacefaring explorers and then morphs into a mobile creche as a variety of the most naive, tedious and useless creatures in the galaxy, with a combined mental age of about 12, start following you around.

Deified Data · Dec 23, 2014

Mr_Zombie said:
Actually, I think DA2 does it right. All the people from your party you simply meet at one point in the game:
- Aveline joins you during your escape from Feralden and came to Kirkwall with you
- Varric offers you being a part of the Deep Road expedition;
- Anders gives you plans for Deep Roads, but first asks you for a little favour (helping his mage friend held by templars)
- Merrid is required for the ritual you promised Flementh to do;
- Fenris and Isabella offers you a job (this all happens in the first year

And then they are just people you know (or even become a friend with) and live in Kirkwall. And since there's no big "save the world" mission in the game, they are just helping you with your tasks when you need them. Their relationships with you feel very natural (at least when you treat them well).

The reason it feels so natural in DA2 is because the whole game takes place in one city. So when someone joins you they're not putting everything in their life on hold to adventure with you, so much as putting themselves on retainer. Aveline is still the guard captain, Anders is still healing the sick, Varric is still a merchant prince. The only one that feels forced is Merrill. She's kicked out for being a blood mage, but following Hawke around isn't really a great way of achieving her goals.

ShockingAlberto · Dec 23, 2014

Afrit said:
oh you mean Alvin..

His entire act of being a traitor is flat out showcased everytime you see him, and still accepted back in party : /

At one point there is a long cutscene in which is he trying to actively murder two of the main characters but then he says he's sorry and they let him back in.

dakkumauji · Dec 23, 2014

Blue-kun said:
Well, I'm not going to try very hard to defend the others, but at least people would join because they knew another member of your army and had any sort of connection to them. And not because... I don't know, "you're Chrom, so now I'm going to join you even though I've no idea who you are!", lol.

Maybe it just shows that talking to the enemy sometimes work?

Then again, Awakening really isn't that bad with it since like half the cast is already a part of the initial group or somehow related to someone in it.

KingV · Dec 23, 2014

JNA said:
To answer the question, I thought Zaeed from Mass Effect 2 was pretty stupid.

The guy is a very well known and feared Bounty Hunter that makes good money for what he does. He can go and be anywhere he wants, but suddenly, he joins you in a huge potentially suicidal mission.

Plus as a party member, the guy hardly talked or did much of anything noteworthy during his time with you. I felt like he was just thrown in.

He also looks exactly like a disfigured Elon Musk

mdzapeer · Dec 23, 2014

Most suikoden chars stories are fleshed out by using the detective character, which runs investigations into the backgrounds of the chars, and like most things in suikoden things are not what they appear to be on the surface level.

Most members joining have ulterior motives than just fighting for your army, the ending blurbs also sometimes spell that out.

Chef spoilers from Suikoden II, even though he 'just' join.

But actually, Hai Yo has an entire sidequest to his name, and explains why he joins. Him running from the black dragon group and some secret recipe.

There are quite a few chars in the game with this kind of backstory.

Heck, George Prime, just joins as well, and in Suikoden 5 he is a pivotal character.

You can blame chrono cross and other of 'just cause' characters joining. But suikoden chars always have depth to them if you care to look.

Edit: Suikoden 1 is guilty for this.

The Horror the horror · Dec 23, 2014

mdzapeer said:
Most suikoden chars stories are fleshed out by using the detective character, which runs investigations into the backgrounds of the chars, and like most things in suikoden things are not what they appear to be on the surface level.

Most members joining have ulterior motives than just fighting for your army, the ending blurbs also sometimes spell that out.

Chef spoilers from Suikoden II, even though he 'just' join.

But actually, Hai Yo has an entire sidequest to his name, and explains why he joins. Him running from the black dragon group and some secret recipe.

There are quite a few chars in the game with this kind of backstory.

Heck, George Prime, just joins as well, and in Suikoden 5 he is a pivotal character.

You can blame chrono cross and other of 'just cause' characters joining. But suikoden chars always have depth to them if you care to look.

I'm playing suikoden 1, and most of their excuses are downright absurd.

RedBoot · Dec 23, 2014

Technically, you can justify any Suikoden character due to them all being Stars of Destiny. That one lady in Suikoden 1 may have joined you because you got her a bar of soap, but she was also fated to join you as a Star. The group only reaches its full potential when all 108 gather.

That's silly, of course, but it's there.

ErasureAcer · Dec 23, 2014

Ishida said:
Chrono Cross, the thread.

Almost the whole cast.

Yup...utter garbage.

mdzapeer · Dec 23, 2014

The Horror the horror said:
I'm playing suikoden 1, and most of their excuses are downright absurd.

Suikoden 1, ye forgot to add Suikoden 1 is guilty as well.

ShadowElliot · Dec 23, 2014

XtaLarge said:
Pokemon games are getting reeeeally fucking stupid with this

"Ah, my Lucario thinks you look like the shit. He wants to come with you because heart friendship Pokemon Mega Evolution love journey friends Pokemon strong heart Champion. Good luck!"

"Oh, Player, this Latias saw you just walking around and decided "Hey, I really like his hat, it kind of looks like hair. I wonder if he'd like to ENSLAVE MY SIBLING"

I understand the free Lapras you get from a hostage in Pokemon Red, but the recent games are just "Look, my/this rare Pokemon wants to go with you for no reason!".

Green Mamba · Dec 23, 2014

ShockingAlberto said:
At one point there is a long cutscene in which is he trying to actively murder two of the main characters but then he says he's sorry and they let him back in.

He literally shoots one of them in the back, and they still bring him along. I hated him along with the entire rest of that game's miserable cast.

Lutherian · Dec 23, 2014

I'm 5 years old and I'm going to help Edge, kay ?

RM8 · Dec 23, 2014

Gaius in Fire Emblem Awakening

joins in exchange for candy

. But that's cool, he's my favorite character

Akuun · Dec 23, 2014

ShadowElliot said:
I understand the free Lapras you get from a hostage in Pokemon Red, but the recent games are just "Look, my/this rare Pokemon wants to go with you for no reason!".

And then of course, 90% of the time you chuck him in the PC and don't look back.

stuminus3 · Dec 23, 2014

IdreamofHIME said:
His reason is awesome.
He's a paid bounty hunter.
If you buy the game used and cheap, you can't get him. If you buy the game new and pay more, he's a downloadable character.
His reason for joining your party is because you literally paid him to. Bioware were really breaking the 4th wall with him. It's awesome.

Whoa, this changes everything.

ethanny2 · Dec 23, 2014

You ignore her, so she wants to join you

Well maybe it seemed like that at first, but she actually just wanted to steal your materia in her side arc

The Horror the horror · Dec 23, 2014

Part of the reason why I enjoy the Zelda games.

Link meets a bunch of characters, most of whom cheer him on and help in their own way, but none of them tag along. They all think, "This mofo is crazy. Go at Gannon? lol hell no, let me give him this here boomerang and some rupees and show him the exit." Fallout aside, I'd enjoy a traditional RPG that did that.

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