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Gamezone · Feb 5, 2015

I know this doesn`t affect most people, but 4-5 months each year im either working in the military or on a boat. These months I have very limited access to the internet, if any access at all. This isn`t something new. I`ve been working like this for many years, and was always very satisfied with using Xbox 360 "semi" offline. This was never any problem, because I rarely play online.

If Xbox 360 OS required any update, the update was always on the game disc. If I try to run a new game on Xbox One, I usually get this message:

"You need to update your console"

If this happens, there`s usually one solution. Wait months so I can update the OS.

At launch I wasn`t going to buy an Xbox One. But then Don Mattrick said:

An internet connection will not be required to play offline Xbox One games.

After a one-time system set-up with a new Xbox One, you can play any disc based game without ever connecting online again.

This was obviously a bunch of PR bullshit.

I also know that some games have massive day one patches, but this hasn`t been a big issue so far. Halo MCC 20 GB update is only for the multiplayer mode, so it didn`t affect me much. But happens when single player games doesn`t fit on one single Blu Ray disc? Will I have to download huge single player portions of games as well? Most of the games i`ve played so far have runned well without them. Dealing with bugs and low FPS is way better than a game that doesn`t function at all.

As I said. This doesn`t affect many of you, but im a bit frustrated at the moment.

his is Xbox One. (Took it from another angry user at the official feedback page)

It requires the internet for creating a profile
It requires the internet for look at your pins
It requires the internet for download the Blu-ray app, just to watch your movies.
It requires the internet for to look and customize your Avatar .
It requires the internet to change your gamer pic (which is dumb).
It requires the internet to change your achievement wallpaper.
It requires the internet to look at your achievements!!! .
It requires the internet to download the CD player app, Media player app and etc.

thewhitehawk · Feb 5, 2015

I don't they think they care about people who can't connect consoles online. They want to shift the industry down digital distribution and people who use their consoles offline are an antithesis to that.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think Sony or Nintendo care a lot more than Microsoft, they've just been less aggressive in the way they implemented their systems but I expect most future consoles to suffer from similar issues. Personally though, I just don't want to support the platform that leads the charge in anti-consumer measures and lying while it's doing so.

Gamezone · Feb 5, 2015

thewhitehawk said:
I don't they think they care about people who can't connect consoles online. They want to shift the industry down digital distribution and people who use their consoles offline are an antithesis to that.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think Sony or Nintendo care a lot more than Microsoft, they've just been less aggressive in the way they implemented their systems but I expect most future consoles to suffer from similar issues but I don't want to support the platform that leads the charge in anti-consumer measures while at the same time lying about it with corporate bull.

They don`t have to care, but it was wrong of them to tell people that their console would function offline when it doesn`t unless you update it.

A.D. Skinner · Feb 5, 2015

I wouldn't go as far as saying it was PR bullshit, new games need an updated consoles to work. Especially in the case of games that turn off the Kinect and run better. (The SDK update that gave X1 1080p Destiny rather than 900p, etc)

As for games with day one patches, there are no games that NEED it to work. They wouldn't dare do that. They are only fixes and stuff.

The only reason I could see games not having updates for the console on them, is that the X1 literally gets updated every month. I'd assume changing the basics of what is on a disc would take time.

foxbeldin · Feb 5, 2015

They should send update/patchs disks for free to anyone who asks.

Laconic · Feb 5, 2015

thewhitehawk said:
I don't they think they care about people who can't connect consoles online. They want to shift the industry down digital distribution and people who use their consoles offline are an antithesis to that.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think Sony or Nintendo care a lot more than Microsoft, they've just been less aggressive in the way they implemented their systems but I expect most future consoles to suffer from similar issues. Personally though, I just don't want to support the platform that leads the charge in anti-consumer measures and lying while it's doing so.

And such a future for the industry, is a future without me as a customer.

If enough follow, then it shall be the end of the industry.

Yet the industry shall blame us.

So be it.

Fuck them.

fcobento · Feb 5, 2015

Or at least put the version that complies with the game in the disk...
You need version 3 to play Alien Isolation? Put the version 3 on the disk...

BrokenIcarus · Feb 5, 2015

How does PS4 handle this? That seems like such a pain, OP.

Hope Sony's more conservative on this. :/

Sinfamy · Feb 5, 2015

fcobento said:
Or at least put the version that complies with the game in the disk...
You need version 3 to play Alien Isolation? Put the version 3 on the disk...

Exactly.
MS should know, nearly all games on PC come with the programmed version of DirectX, or Visual C++.

nelchaar · Feb 5, 2015

I think there are grounds to sue for this false advertising, especially after the precedent was set in the PS Vita case where Sony advertised features that did not exist or function as advertised. They had to pay a settlement for $15 mill, so who knows if MS gets prosecuted by individuals/class-action/FCC for such statements.

gruenel · Feb 5, 2015

A.D. Skinner said:
I wouldn't go as far as saying it was PR bullshit, new games need an updated consoles to work. Especially in the case of games that turn off the Kinect and run better. (The SDK update that gave X1 1080p Destiny rather than 900p, etc)

The point is they should just put the necessary updates on the game disc.

But the X1 OS is probably too big, and BDs are already becoming too small for games.

Do PS4 game discs contain necessary OS updates?

superNESjoe · Feb 5, 2015

A.D. Skinner said:
I wouldn't go as far as saying it was PR bullshit, new games need an updated consoles to work. Especially in the case of games that turn off the Kinect and run better. (The SDK update that gave X1 1080p Destiny rather than 900p, etc)

As for games with day one patches, there are no games that NEED it to work. They wouldn't dare do that. They are only fixes and stuff.

The only reason I could see games not having updates for the console on them, is that the X1 literally gets updated every month. I'd assume changing the basics of what is on a disc would take time.

It is PR bullshit, because it implied that after the Day 1 console update you'd never need to connect to the internet again to play new games offline. That isn't true if console updates are required for some games and those updates aren't also stored on the game disc like 360 games were.

For day one patches you're right, none of the games need it to work but some of them sure suck without it. It's a horrid practice.

GHG · Feb 5, 2015

Irs a bit of a joke really. Can't even play videos using the Xbox video app (using the play to function from a windows PC) without a connection to Live.

I'd love for somebody at Microsoft to be able to give the a straight answer as to why that is.

Solaire of Astora · Feb 5, 2015

fcobento said:
You need version 3 to play Alien Isolation? Put the version 3 on the disk...

That's how things worked on the PS3. Was a godsend for those of us without internet in the early days of the PS3. No idea if it's the same on the PS4, as I've gone digital.

Definitely agree that there needs to be some way to update the OS offline if the update is required to play the game. If not on the game disc, then they should be available on request, or even provided to retailers to be given away on request with the purchase of a game.

LukasTaves · Feb 5, 2015

"But happens when single player games doesn`t fit on one single Blu Ray disc?"

Easy, that won't happen. And if it does the game will ship with multiple discs.

thewhitehawk · Feb 5, 2015

Gamezone said:
They don`t have to care, but it was wrong of them to tell people that their console would function offline when it doesn`t unless you update it.

Yes it was wrong of them to do so, but what did that actually "cost them"? You bought their lie and bought their console, they made money with a simple lie and there's not much you can do about it alone.

If you want to take away something from it, and it is something which I learned a while ago, but apply it very strongly to Microsoft, is that you can not trust corporate PR crap. And Microsoft has a long history of announcing great new platforms, features and promising things and not delivering on them.

With that said, they did make a surprising number of changes to make the Xbox One a much better product than they originally announced, but the number of lies and confusion they caused along the way just sickens me. All of the lies from "you can't operate the Xbox without Kinect" to "It's not easy to just turn off a switch to make games playable offline" just made me sick to my stomach. Whatever Microsoft is selling on the Xbox One, I'm not interested in it.

It will take a few years for them to earn any trust back from me, and so far I have to say, they've earned back nada of it.

DD · Feb 5, 2015

thewhitehawk said:
Personally though, I just don't want to support the platform that leads the charge in anti-consumer measures and lying while it's doing so.

Same. I had bought three Xboxes before owning my first ever Playstation as a combo breaker, and except for the lack of games, I'm really satisfied with the PS4. Being able to, for example, take screenshots, copy them via USB (something so f*ckin' simple!) without having to pay for it feels awesome. Microsoft can go to hell.

Allforce · Feb 5, 2015

Along the same lines I'm sort of salty about the flip side of the coin. They said I could keep this Xbox One console in standby and never have to worry about having to manually download the latest updates and patches for my games. I've got every setting ticked for the console to do this yet I fired up Killer Instinct the other day for the first time in about 5-6 weeks and was greeted with "Hey there's an update! 1.9 GB".

What the fuck? Isn't this stuff supposed to be seamlessly downloaded as it's released behind the scenes?

SpotAnime · Feb 5, 2015

foxbeldin said:
They should send update/patchs disks for free to anyone who asks.

Yep. There needs to be an offline solution.

Final Verdict · Feb 5, 2015

I feel you. My internet connection is not the best either.

But if the console is not connected to online, then how does it know it needs an update, and did game disc for the 360 really carry OS updates on them?

Final Verdict · Feb 5, 2015

DD said:
Same. I had bought three Xboxes before owning my first ever Playstation as a combo breaker, and except for the lack of games, I'm really satisfied with the PS4. Being able to, for example, take screenshots, copy them via USB (something so f*ckin' simple!) without having to pay for it feels awesome. Microsoft can go to hell.

huh? PS4 can do screenshots on games?

And what do you mean about 'paying' for it?

DD · Feb 5, 2015

thewhitehawk said:
With that said, they did make a surprising number of changes to make the Xbox One a much better product than they originally announced, but the number of lies and confusion they caused along the way just sickens me. All of the lies from "you can't operate the Xbox without Kinect" to "It's not easy to just turn off a switch to make games playable offline" just made me sick to my stomach. Whatever Microsoft is selling on the Xbox One, I'm not interested in it.

It will take a few years for them to earn any trust back from me, and so far I have to say, they've earned back nada of it.

Same again.

Final Verdict said:
I feel you. My internet connection is not the best either.

But if the console is not connected to online, then how does it know it needs an update, and did game disc for the 360 really carry OS updates on them?

Yes.

Gamezone · Feb 5, 2015

BrokenIcarus said:
How does PS4 handle this? That seems like such a pain, OP.

Hope Sony's more conservative on this. :/

The PS4 doesn`t need the mandatory OS update in order to run games, and they ship their bundles with physical games. I would say that Sony cares more about offline gamers than Microsoft does.

danowat · Feb 5, 2015

Do we know ALL xbox one games don't contain any OS updates?

Flappy · Feb 5, 2015

You can't actually set up the console without an internet connection. When you turn it on for the first time, you need to create an XBL account or you literally can't start using it. There is no other option. It locks.

I found out the hard way.

You can go offline once you create one, but before you do, your fucked.

Gamezone · Feb 5, 2015

GHG said:
Irs a bit of a joke really. Can't even play videos using the Xbox video app (using the play to function from a windows PC) without a connection to Live.

I'd love for somebody at Microsoft to be able to give the a straight answer as to why that is.

No video, no achievements, no pins, no guest account.

Gamezone · Feb 5, 2015

danowat said:
Do we know ALL xbox one games don't contain any OS updates?

Pretty much. I don`t think the Xbox One was built to support this like the 360 was.

User 73706 · Feb 5, 2015

I'm surprised they haven't considered releasing an Xbox One Local console that has firmware dedicated to running stuff without an internet connection at all - has localized pins, achievements, etc. Uses a simpler UI that doesn't need to be constantly updated. As a bonus, you could have some kind of guarantee that if you want to buy a regular XBO the XOL has a high exchange rate (like 50%-75%) so you wouldn't be paying in full to get the online experience.

danowat · Feb 5, 2015

Doesn't the offline diag tool enable you to update offline?

Gamezone · Feb 5, 2015

danowat said:
Doesn't the offline diag tool enable you to update offline?

You still have to download it.

AkelisRain · Feb 5, 2015

danowat said:
Doesn't the offline diag tool enable you to update offline?

How would you update offline? Don't you need to download the necessary firmware?

DD · Feb 5, 2015

Final Verdict said:
huh? PS4 can do screenshots on games?

And what do you mean about 'paying' for it?

Yes, you can take screenshots of every game at anytime, and copy them to an USB drive, or upload them via Twitter and Facebook (unless the game forbids you, to stop you from posting heavy spoilers, for example). Hell it even save videos of your gameplay automatically, and it's very easy to deal with this stuff, copy, upload it, edit it, etc.

And what I mean "paying for it" it's because some games on the Xbox 360 have a photomode, in which you can take pictures of the game (Forza, for example). But the problem is: you can't upload them if you don't pay for a Xbox Live subscription. And you can't even copy them to an USB drive to see those pics on you PC. F*ck, you can't even have a Netflix subscription on the Xbox without having to pay for a Xbox Live Gold account. It really sux having basically everything behind a paywall.

whatevermort · Feb 5, 2015

Can you update with a USB? Because maybe Gaf could send you a cheap stick with the update on every time this is a huge issue.

BrokenIcarus · Feb 5, 2015

Gamezone said:
The PS4 doesn`t need the mandatory OS update in order to run games, and they ship their bundles with physical games. I would say that Sony cares more about offline gamers than Microsoft does.

Well then it's just fucking bullshit! Fix that shit, MS!

AkelisRain · Feb 5, 2015

whatevermort said:
Can you update with a USB? Because maybe Gaf could send you a cheap stick with the update on every time this is a huge issue.

That is a nice gesture bit it shouldn't have to come to that. Usually when I was over seas and my wife sent a package, I was looking at 1.5 months minimum before I got it delivered to me.

danowat · Feb 5, 2015

so the only options are

1) Make microsoft send you a disc

or

2) Make games manufacturers ship the latest OS on disc.

I expect option 2 is now not an option (unlike the 360) due to the original digital only pathway.

I don't think either of the next gen consoles is an option without a half decent net connection

MrTroubleMaker · Feb 5, 2015

:O wow I didn't know about the os update not on the disk, I just assumed it would be like last gen and be there.

SighFight · Feb 5, 2015

A.D. Skinner said:
I wouldn't go as far as saying it was PR bullshit, new games need an updated consoles to work. Especially in the case of games that turn off the Kinect and run better. (The SDK update that gave X1 1080p Destiny rather than 900p, etc)

As for games with day one patches, there are no games that NEED it to work. They wouldn't dare do that. They are only fixes and stuff.

The only reason I could see games not having updates for the console on them, is that the X1 literally gets updated every month. I'd assume changing the basics of what is on a disc would take time.

I would call it bullshit because if you don't connect it to update the OS you cannot play any new games. I didn't know about this and it is ridiculous! Is it the same with PS4?

Three · Feb 5, 2015

GHG said:
Irs a bit of a joke really. Can't even play videos using the Xbox video app (using the play to function from a windows PC) without a connection to Live.

I'd love for somebody at Microsoft to be able to give the a straight answer as to why that is.

It does but it tries to force you to connect or jump through hoops. Windows 8 does the same. Sometimes when I try to play a local video it says "You are offline, connect to the internet" with no obvious way of exiting and starting the video. What the f**k is it to you if I'm offline or not MS. Completely unnecessary.

Gamezone · Feb 5, 2015

MrTroubleMaker said:
:O wow I didn't know about the os update not on the disk, I just assumed it would be like last gen and be there.

It was on the disc last gen. But as many of us know, Xbox One was never made to function offline. It`s a good thing that they reversed this, but the console should function offline like the 360 did.

walltowall · Feb 5, 2015

foxbeldin said:
They should send update/patchs disks for free to anyone who asks.

Agreed. But that also creates the issue of delivery. Digital is still the best method. Especially with the very frequent changes they have been making.

To Gamezone's point: That may have been Mattrick's plan, along with less frequent updates. I do think that the reliance/expectation/hubris that everyone have an active internet connection needs to be addressed in some fashion.

DD said:
Same. I had bought three Xboxes before owning my first ever Playstation as a combo breaker, and except for the lack of games, I'm really satisfied with the PS4. Being able to, for example, take screenshots, copy them via USB (something so f*ckin' simple!) without having to pay for it feels awesome. Microsoft can go to hell.

MS charges for screenshots? Someone tell Miles it's been hidden behind a paywall all this time!

On a serious note it's all about prioritization and impact. For example I find suspend resume to be a much more useful feature than taking a screenshot, though I want them both, on both systems.

R_thanatos · Feb 5, 2015

foxbeldin said:
They should send update/patchs disks for free to anyone who asks.

I'm just wondering why the update necessary to run the game isn't on the disk ..isn't that how it worked last gen ?.??

Gamezone · Feb 5, 2015

R_thanatos said:
I'm just wondering why the update necessary to run the game isn't on the disk ..isn't that how it worked last gen ?.??

This is how it worked last gen, yes.

travisbickle · Feb 5, 2015

Gamezone said:
It was on the disc last gen. But as many of us know, Xbox One was never made to function offline. It`s a good thing that they reversed this, but the console should function offline like the 360 did.

Are you sure they haven't started putting it on the disc? I'm sure I read it was only the initial launch games that were "hot off the press" which didn't have OS updates?

danmaku · Feb 5, 2015

R_thanatos said:
I'm just wondering why the update necessary to run the game isn't on the disk ..isn't that how it worked last gen ?.??

It still works like that for the WiiU. When I bought mine I put the Bayo1 disc in and it updated the OS before running the game. But the console "beta tested in the future" can't. Go figure.

Seth Enosh · Feb 5, 2015

Wii U games still contain the update on disc if it's required.

Microsoft probably didn't build the update-from-disc functionality since the console was supposed to be always online, and their stats probably show that 98 or 99% of xbox ones are connected to the Internet so they might never prioritize building this feature over adding new features to the OS. I agree that this would be a nice thing to add for people in your situation though.

josecitoxnyo · Feb 5, 2015

Gamezone said:
The PS4 doesn`t need the mandatory OS update in order to run games, and they ship their bundles with physical games. I would say that Sony cares more about offline gamers than Microsoft does.

No, you can't even check your trophies offline, it's a freaking file and you can't access to it without an internet connection. Also if you have'nt set your PSN account as primary, a lof of games don't even work or what's even worse, they keep spamming your screen with the "you need internet" message.

Both consoles, you can add the Vita too, suck offline.

Flappy · Feb 5, 2015

Gamezone said:
This is how it worked last gen, yes.

Wii-U games still have updates on the disc.

I have no idea why MS don't.

Occam · Feb 5, 2015

Three said:
It does but it tries to force you to connect or jump through hoops. Windows 8 does the same. Sometimes when I try to play a local video it says "You are offline, connect to the internet" with no obvious way of exiting and starting the video. What the f**k is it to you if I'm offline or not MS. Completely unnecessary.

It means Microsoft cares about you and wants to know what you are watching.
Real talk: The only way to keep your OS from phoning home is not to use Windows. If you don't want any privacy intrusions, then use Linux, for instance Ubuntu or Debian.

DD · Feb 5, 2015

walltowall said:
MS charges for screenshots? Someone tell Miles it's been hidden behind a paywall all this time!

Well, if you don't have a Xbox Live Gold subscription, you can't upload your pictures. They're stuck to you Xbox HD.

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