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Angry Joe gets called out by IGNs review editor for misquoting their Titanfall review

L

LostOne428

Banned
BenouKat said:
If this (the 8.9 different of 9) wasn't a poor damage control (And I think the guy was just doing damage control), I hope IGN understand that their scale are completly stupid. Right ?

You can't dealing with number if you don't follow rules of fucking maths. Distance between 8.8 and 8.9 is the same of between 8.9 and 9.0. Period. IGN can take the scale they want, but they can't redefine the meaning of numbers.

If this not how they see their score, so they need to take another mark system, some websites gets stars, some gets graphics, or some get a whole number plus a mention when the game deserve "more than that but not one point more". Dunno what.

This twitter conversation is creepy as hell.
Click to expand...

Dude you're super right. their scoring system is super arbitrary, and flawed.

But they made it and they have the right to go "thats not what we are trying to say"

because in the end their scale was made by people. (and i hope, not math)
 
U

unbias

Member
MYeager said:
Saying the campaign is background noise isn't a complaint?
Click to expand...

Context? He softballed it as much as possible.

Trying to stay alive in a brawl with human-controlled bad guys is too distracting, and without controllable lulls in the fighting, most of the story is reduced to background noise.

That reads just a little bit different, that way. He doesn't actually mention that the campaign is bad, but that he was so busy playing the game, that the story became background noise.
That is a distinction with a difference.
 
U

unbias

Member
MYE said:
The saddest part is that this is giving the Angry Joe show more undeserved exposure
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Compared to who? IGN? Not sure what the effective difference between them is. I know the press around here loves to say the difference is they have oversight, but from my perspective the difference from watching and reading them is non existent.
 
M

maltrain

Junior Member
I'm 100% with Joe here.

An 8.9 review is fucking stupid. Just put an 8, a 9 or a 8,5 if you want, but an 8,9 is "great" and 9,0 is "amazing"? Are you serious?
 
B

Balb

Member
Exploratory said:
Then I guess you haven't seen much Joe. His reviews are far more in depth than IGNs. Not that IGN reviews are bad they just don't get down to the nitty gritty.

On the whole though this conversation if it had to be had shouldn't be done on twitter. It makes everyone look ridiculous. Also Joe as much as I like him and his reviews has gotta be more professional even when he is clearly in the right (especially when he is clearly in the right).
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More in-depth or just longer? I've seen a couple of his review videos and there isn't much actual analysis.
 
D

Deified Data

Banned
hawk2025 said:
I agree completely, don't misrepresent your source.

That includes misrepresenting someone's video review by implying malice was involved. It really is that simple.
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Impossible to judge whether malice was involved - taking IGN's score and reporting another certainly wasn't done in good faith. Very easy to judge whether you're outright misrepresenting a source to make for a more sensational story, though.

Anyway I'm glad we're in agreement.
 
U

unbias

Member
Balb said:
More in-depth or just longer? I've seen a couple of his review videos and there isn't much actual analysis.
Click to expand...

Uhh, by comparison to who exactly? What is this "analysis" that you expect or that is met on a regular basis compared to other reviewers? Reviews are nothing more then an opinion and perspective on a game, typically used to make a more informed decision. Angry does just as good of a job(if not better) then everyone else, plus you normally can watch him play the game outside of his review(a lot of the times before it) so you get an even more informed decision in a purchase.
 
U

unbias

Member
Deified Data said:
Just don't misquote your source, malicious or not. And when you're called on it, apologize and move on. It really is that simple.
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That wasnt a misquote. There is nothing there that you can call a misquote. You can claim he tried to give the impression that "believe the hype" was in regards to the review, but that would be due to preconceptions, even ignoring the fact that "believe the hype" is less offensive on a review then a fucking preview.
 
M

MYeager

Member
unbias said:
Context? He softballed it as much as possible.

Trying to stay alive in a brawl with human-controlled bad guys is too distracting, and without controllable lulls in the fighting, most of the story is reduced to background noise.

That reads just a little bit different, that way. He doesn't actually mention that the campaign is bad, but that he was so busy playing the game, that the story became background noise.
That is a distinction with a difference.
Click to expand...

Even in the larger context of everything you've quoted it sounds like at best the campaign is forgettable and at worse a mess with no flow to it. While he might have tried to be respectful of the studio's efforts of including the mode by not outright saying 'it's garbage' I don't see how that's not a criticism.
 
old

old

Member
Angry Joe needs to grow up. He can't defend his actions. He can only insult anyone who criticizes him. That might impress teenagers but adults see through it.
 
D

DocSeuss

Member
Deified Data said:
Just don't misquote your source, malicious or not. And when you're called on it, apologize and move on. It really is that simple.
Click to expand...

Words to live by.

Seriously, this conversation should have gone:

"things"
"you misquoted us last time, how do we know you won't do it again, misquoter?"
"what? I'm pretty sure I got it right."
"no you got the score wrong and implied something that wasn't in the article."
"Oh, I didn't realize that a .1 difference was important, and it's a bit more awkward to say than a single number. My bad, bro, didn't mean to misquote."

What we've got here is the stereotypical "angry/annoyed/flustered/abitdiscontented" type, someone with bog standard opinions ("IGN sucks, so edgy"), holding to those opinions ("because IGN sucks, I don't need to have any integrity!") rather than not acting like a douche.

That's the root problem with these type of guys. They're idiots who live inside their schtick.
 
G

GamingIsDead

Member
Balb said:
More in-depth or just longer? I've seen a couple of his review videos and there isn't much actual analysis.
Click to expand...

He goes way more in depth into mechanics and gameplay nuances than almost anyone else. I don't care for his personality or even his opinions but he does give good reviews.

His dragons dogma review is easily the best out there for that game.
 
L

LostOne428

Banned
maltrain said:
I'm 100% with Joe here.

An 8.9 review is fucking stupid. Just put an 8, a 9 or a 8,5 if you want, but an 8,9 is "great" and 9,0 is "amazing"? Are you serious?
Click to expand...

Could you expand on this a little?

AJ is reviewing a game as well, so why would he care about other reviews then?
(I'm just saying this as a person that doesn't really follow AJ)

And if he's complaining about how others review games, doesn't that undermine his review as well? IGN went with 8.9 because that what they feel and AJ said something about the game( I don't know because i haven't watched it yet)

Its all relative

Not objective
 
H

Hypereides

Member
R_thanatos said:
Unless i'm wrong , wasn't Believe the hype written by IGN ?
Review, preview or news is not the issue. Was this said or not ?
Didn't Angry joe show the final review score untouched in his video ?
I'm not sure what is his problem when he is complaining about the game coverage by critics and showing BOTH parts of what happenned.

Ign made a preview with Believe the hype , and a review with a 8.9 score .. unless i've missed something those can't be denied.
Now the whole twitter exchange could have been MUCH better if both side were more calm but when you're going hyperbole during months , you kinda have to assume that, IGN.
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Per definition a "review" and a "preview" are two, entirely, completely different things. One covers the initial impressions, the other is a formulation of the overall quality. They're distinctively different. Categorising them into the same group is an error and wrong doing by Angry Joe. Angry joe uses his media platform to falsely represent the two as the same. Thats the incorrect method of dispatching information to a demographic.
 
N

Not Spaceghost

Spaceghost
Jesus christ, Angry joe argues like a fucking child.

He's in the right but he lost his temper so he automatically looks worse. He was generalizing "reviewers" while an IGN screencap was super imposed in the background, it does not mean he was directly referring to IGN.

But man Joe does not speak well, he comes off really childish, meanwhile the IGN dude really reminds me of a little kid saying Why? Why? Why? Why? to everything their parents say.

The whole argument really is cringworthy to read.
 
U

unbias

Member
MYeager said:
Even in the larger context of everything you've quoted it sounds like at best the campaign is forgettable and at worse a mess with no flow to it. While he might have tried to be respectful of the studio's efforts of including the mode by not outright saying 'it's garbage' I don't see how that's not a criticism.
Click to expand...

Yes, that is exactly what was happening...yup, he was just being respectful(are you serious?). It was a pass by criticism done in a way to mitigate the actual critique. The "mess with no flow" is impossible to get from just that quote, that would be your preconceptions. He parsed words in regards to the campaign and/or he didnt think it mattered all that much(a valid opinion, but one that should be properly expressed if you mention the campaign imo) but one that still minimized the fact that titanfalls campaign is terrible to non existent, not simply "forgettable". That little quib about the campaign isnt helpful much at all to people who actually cared about a campaign nor did it make the game look bad with the way he worded it and with the flow of the review.
 
K

Kintaro

Worships the porcelain goddess
Dan is technically right here. Joe calls out review scores, then cites "believe the hype" which not from IGN's actual review. I don't think it was malicious, but it was incorrect. Also, it's really poor form and corny to attempt to make yourself look better but putting others down to make a point in your own review of something. If you want to criticize outlets for overly high scores, there is always a time and place for that. Inside your own review of a game is not that place.

Both acted like brats though. However, Joe needs to grow up. He was in the wrong.
 
G

GoaThief

Member
unbias said:
Context? He softballed it as much as possible.

Trying to stay alive in a brawl with human-controlled bad guys is too distracting, and without controllable lulls in the fighting, most of the story is reduced to background noise.
Click to expand...
See, this is where opinion comes into play. I don't believe it was softballed and it appears pretty damming to me. You disagree and that's fine. The point is this; the claim is there was no criticism of the campaign. There clearly and factually was criticism of the campaign. Therefore IGN has been misrepresented, and let's not pretend Joe's video is anything but vitriolic too.
 
W

wildfire

Banned
Balb said:
More in-depth or just longer? I've seen a couple of his review videos and there isn't much actual analysis.
Click to expand...


You are either lying or skimmed because your brain couldn't handle listening to someone that got under your skin for vapid reasons.

Kintaro said:
Dan is technically right here. Joe calls out review scores, then cites "believe the hype" which not from IGN's actual review. I don't think it was malicious, but it was incorrect.
Click to expand...

Why are you supporting IGN's double standard? You do know there is a video with a collection of review quotes and "Believe the hype" is one of them?
 
K

Ken Masters

Banned
Not Spaceghost said:
Jesus christ, Angry joe argues like a fucking child.

He's in the right but he lost his temper so he automatically looks worse. He was generalizing "reviewers" while an IGN screencap was super imposed in the background, it does not mean he was directly referring to IGN.

But man Joe does not speak well, he comes off really childish, meanwhile the IGN dude really reminds me of a little kid saying Why? Why? Why? Why? to everything their parents say.

The whole argument really is cringworthy to read.
Click to expand...

It's really surprising , both came from esteemed schools of journalism and are well respected in the journalism world, often called to speak at various New York Times, Washington Post and other media gatherings
 
U

unbias

Member
highluxury said:
Per definition a "review" and a "preview" are two, entirely, completely different things. One covers the initial impressions[/B], the other is a formulation of the overall quality. They're distinctively different. Categorising them into the same group is an error and wrong doing by Angry Joe. Angry joe uses his media platform to falsely represent the two as the same. Thats the incorrect method of dispatching information to a demographic.
Click to expand...

The kind of praise previews get, to me, signify they need to be treated like reviews a hell of a lot more. If you can be so strong in recommendations and hype through a preview, then you should be able to condemn it as well, based on initial impressions. Beyond that, angry didnt categorize them as the same, he used a preview quote(that is meme like in its popularity) in regards to the hype the reviews got.
 
I

Imm0rt4l

Member
Joe seems really unlikable, so unprofessional. Dan is making a mountain out of a mole hill though he isn't really wrong.
 
N

Nokagi

Unconfirmed Member
This is embarrassing for both parties but least the IGN guy speaks like an adult. Joe sounds like a child.
 
N

Not Spaceghost

Spaceghost
Ken Masters said:
It's really surprising , both came from esteemed schools of journalism and are well respected in the journalism world, often called to speak at various New York Times, Washington Post and other media gatherings
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Especially when you consider that they're both Harvard educated you'd think they'd have some prose instead of tarnishing their own reputations with senseless backlash over social media.
 
K

Kintaro

Worships the porcelain goddess
wildfire said:
Why are you supporting IGN's double standard? You do know there is a video with a collection of review quotes and "Believe the hype" is one of them?
Click to expand...

A collection from who? IGN? If so, they're wrong for doing that as well if they stated that it was all from reviews.

Doesn't make Joe any less wrong either though. <shrugs>
 
J

jacksepticeye

Member
Both parties get a bit cringe worthy reading down through all of that but IGN more so. The fact that the guy basically said 9.0 is amazing and 8.9 is great is beyond comprehension.

I know it's not really Joe's style to be the most immature guy around but he really could have reacted a bit better at times too
 
A

Anion

Member
As much as everyone thinks that arguing over 0.1 is insane (which does seem insane), there is an interesting things to take from this.
Angry Joe should have wrote that IGN gave it an 8.9 not a 9. This is a matter of principle. Also, from a marketing perspective isn't that why things are sold at $3.99 rather than $4.00?
 
K

Ken Masters

Banned
Not Spaceghost said:
Especially when you consider that they're both Harvard educated you'd think they'd have some prose instead of tarnishing their own reputations with senseless backlash over social media.
Click to expand...

It would be sad if the weren't invited to the White House Correspondents’ Dinner this year, especially when they've been a regular for so many years
 
Kagoshima_Luke

Kagoshima_Luke

Gold Member
I'm with Joe.

Dan's accusations were weak at best. His arguing over the .1 was ridiculous.

I've seen Dan's responses in the IGN comments sections before, and he comes across as someone who thinks they've got it all figured out and doesn't have the self awareness to see when he's just plain wrong.
 
U

unbias

Member
GoaThief said:
]See, this is where opinion comes into play. I don't believe it was softballed and it appears pretty damming to me. You disagree and that's fine. The point is this; the claim is there was no criticism of the campaign. There clearly and factually was criticism of the campaign. Therefore IGN has been misrepresented, and let's not pretend Joe's video is anything but vitriolic too.
Click to expand...

He didn't focus on the campaign at all(which is what joe mentioned, in regards to the lack of critisism, in fact he specifically says that). Also, he didnt say they didnt mention the campaign(he saidm any of them didnt mention it), he didnt even specifically mention IGN. If you think that is "damning" well more power to you, but that, to me, is overly dramatic, based on how little he talked about the campaign. If all you say about a FPS's campaign is that it is forgettable, you just described 90% of most video games in general, congrats on being so very helpful, because that clearly explains that the campaign in that game is near non existent, and not simply "forgettable". I'm sorry but just calling it forgettable is misleading, imo.
 
M

MYeager

Member
unbias said:
Yes, that is exactly what was happening...yup, he was just being respectful(are you serious?). It was a pass by criticism done in a way to mitigate the actual critique. The "mess with no flow" is impossible to get from just that quote, that would be your preconceptions. He parsed words in regards to the campaign and/or he didnt think it mattered all that much(a valid opinion, but one that should be properly expressed if you mention the campaign imo) but one that still minimized the fact that titanfalls campaign is terrible to non existent, not simply "forgettable". That little quib about the campaign isnt helpful much at all to people who actually cared about a campaign nor did it make the game look bad with the way he worded it and with the flow of the review.
Click to expand...

He said the human combatants don't allow for the pauses in a typical campaign, which to me translates as an issue with how well it flows. I haven't played the game so I don't have any preconception, only what you've posted from his review. Personally I'd consider saying a campaign was background noise is saying it mostly non-existent. I don't know how else that could be interpreted.

I haven't read the full IGN review, only what you've posted so maybe it's clearer there but what you've quoted sounds like criticism to me. Whether you feel it was not critical enough doesn't detract from the fact that it was a complaint about the campaign. To what degree it was critical of it is just splitting hairs.
 
G

GobFather

Member
antitrop said:
I just want him to make any video. His channel has been remarkably void of interesting content since the whole YouTube content ID fiasco.
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agreed.. I just want reviews, and lately it has been full of "let's play" and random stuff. I know he tries to make each reviews interesting and put alot of effort into it but... still... lol
 
W

wildfire

Banned
Agent AA1 said:
As much as everyone thinks that arguing over 0.1 is insane (which does seem insane), there is an interesting things to take from this.
Angry Joe should have wrote that IGN gave it an 8.9 not a 9. This is a matter of principle. Also, from a marketing perspective isn't that why things are sold at $3.99 rather than $4.00?
Click to expand...

For those who don't know or are probably still too young too know Agent is referring to psychological manipulation. By taking out the decimal sellers know enough people will be tricked into thinking a product is a dollar cheaper to make the loss in a penny worthwhile.
 
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