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[orthodoxy1095]

It's MMO-ish.

I think it's important to note that Bungie staying away from the term "MMO" doesn't mean it won't be one at some point. Beyond the fact that it's not yet a true MMO as most people would define it, that genre also carries certain expectations and perhaps stigmas around it. Better to carve out your own niche and genre title.

 

[Jarmel]

No. Because aside from a handful of similar features/concepts, it's really nothing like an MMO.

There are only two key differences, one being the player driven economy(which we don't know yet) and the other being the raw number of players. Other than that, it's without a doubt a MMORPG.

 

[ShinMaruku]

See, I've been playing MMOs for a very long time now, and I disagree with you that PSO2 isn't an MMO. Just because it doesn't fit the typical genre-norm of "big empty field full of players hitting things on the head and gathering flowers" doesn't disqualify it from being an MMO, in my mind.

I say it's not a MMO because it's not massively muliplayer. You only see a bunch of people in the lobbies, but most of my game time is outside of the lobbies where I see 4- 12 other people, that is coop not massively multiplayer.

That is my sticking point to not calling it an MMO. Unless I am in the game world fighting stuff with many people with me it's not an MMO.

 

[AndyD]

No.

The mmo elements of phase in, hubs, and instances are awesome, but it's not "massive".

More and more games should do this. Calling them all massive multiplayer online games would be silly and is misleading compared to tradition mmo's.

It's not massive enough for me to call it an MMO. Although the random social interactions skew that way, it needs the Tower and other similar social hubs to have hundreds of players at once and be "bustling".

 

[Izayoi]

What? Why?

Your characters are stored on a remote server (another thing that makes it very much like an MMO).

 

[Ape]

There's probably a reason why the game forces you online for single player that I'm missing but right now I don't get it.

 

[pokeystaples]

No.

Massively multiplayer implies that you are playing in a massive, persistent world with many, many people. Massive, at least to me, amounts to more people than you'd have at a really big personal LAN party.

Destiny is a multiplayer shooter with MMORPG-like features, including persistent progression and small scale organic public questing.

.

 

[perfectsil]

what's the maximum number of players that can play together at once? 12? no not massive

 

[Izayoi]

I say it's not a MMO because it's not massively muliplayer. You only see a bunch of people in the lobbies, but most of my game time is outside of the lobbies where I see 4- 12 other people, that is coop not massively multiplayer.

That is my sticking point to not calling it an MMO. Unless I am in the game world fighting stuff with many people with me it's not an MMO.

What would define PSO2, Vindictus, Destiny, etc. as, then?

Hub-RPGs? MMO-likes? MMO light? Co-op action RPGs with persistent online worlds?

It seems to me that the most elegant definition for them would be MMO, no?

 

[Shrennin]

We don't necessarily know that.

I thought I heard Bungie say you couldn't trade weapons or armor with other players because those weapons and armor are supposed to emphasize what the player had to personally go through to acquire it. As a result, I don't believe there's any real economy at all. Unless there's crafting where players can sell whatever they craft to other players for glimmer.

 

[Jarmel]

I thought I heard Bungie say you couldn't trade weapons or armor with other players because those weapons and armor are supposed to emphasize what the player had to go through up acquire it. As a result, I don't believe there's any real economy at all. Unless there's crafting where players can sell whatever they craft to other players for glimmer.

There does seem to be a crafting system as you can break down items for parts. I just don't know if we can trade based on that or not.

Come on. It was coined in an era where the not-so-massive games had 32-64 players. It's pretty clear it means something upwards of that.

Doesn't matter when it was coined or how the term was originally used. What matters is how it's used now.

 

[Pai Pai Master]

Where is the "massively"?

It's clearly MMO-inspired like PSO and Borderlands are. But it's not a massively-multiplayer online game.

 

[Leafhopper]

That is my sticking point to not calling it an MMO. Unless I am in the game world fighting stuff with many people with me it's not an MMO.

That's my definition of an MMO.

Guild Wars 2, Maplestory and WoW - MMOs
Vindictus, PSO1 and 2, Guild Wars 1 - Not MMOs but they do have multiplayer and a "lobby"

 

[JLeack]

No. Because it's not massively online.

 

[Azuardo]

Can't you just make up a new genre like LMO - "Light Multiplayer Online" - or some shit, instead of trying to throw obviously non-massive online games into the MMO bracket? If it's not massive, it's not an MMO. Make up a new one if you want.

 

[Doombacon]

Come on. It was coined in an era where the not-so-massive games had 32-64 players. It's pretty clear it means something upwards of that.

When it was coined there were 4 player peer2peer lobby based games listing it as one of their genres.

The number of players in a single instance is not part of the genre.

 

[Shrennin]

There does seem to be a crafting system as you can break down items for parts. I just don't know if we can trade based on that or not.

I honestly hope we can -- I totally get Bungie's reason for not trading weapons and armor (which is why everyone gets their own personal loot; otherwise, that would be a nightmare) but trading is fun and it can be strategic so I hope crafting is apart of that.

 

[ShinMaruku]

What would define PSO2, Vindictus, Destiny, etc. as, then?

Hub-RPGs? MMO-likes? MMO light? Co-op action RPGs with persistent online worlds?

It seems to me that the most elegant definition for them would be MMO, no?

I would call them Cooperative online action RPGs on the part of Vindictus,PSO2,DFO. For destiny I'd call it an online FPS with RPG elements.

We don't need this massive MMO umbrella. More over if you bring in a traditional MMO player to any of those games they would feel had. "Where are my macros in destiny?!"

These games are something different let's put them in their own category.

I also find the term roguelike something stupid too. Call them what they are.

 

[Izayoi]

There's probably a reason why the game forces you online for single player that I'm missing but right now I don't get it.

My post right above yours explains why. Your character is stored on Bungie's servers.

Come on. It was coined in an era where the not-so-massive games had 32-64 players. It's pretty clear it means something upwards of that.

How often do you see more than 64 players in one place in any MMO outside of the hub cities? Even the largest raids in WoW were only 40 players. You almost never see that many players on the field unless you're doing some kind of realm PvP, which usually has a dedicated space outside of the normal questing field.

 

[Jarmel]

I honestly hope we can -- I totally get Bungie's reason for not trading weapons and armor (which is why everyone gets their own personal loot; otherwise, that would be a nightmare) but trading is fun and it can be strategic so I hope crafting is apart of that.

We'll see. We don't even know how bad the microtransactions are going to be.

 

[Humpernator]

The only way it really resembles a MMO to me is the third person view while at the Tower. Other than that I just seems like a Borderlands/Halo hybrid.

 

[Carcetti]

It's an MMO for people who are afraid to admit to themselves that they're playing an MMO. Deep down you know it to be true. Accept it, and love yourselves again.

 

[Meneses]

The age of the MMO-like

 

[_woLf]

It's pretty much GW1 in sci-fi FPS form.

And that's a fantastic thing.

 

[Jarmel]

In which case this thread probably wouldn't be recurring as it is. Some people want to use it one way, many others don't.

Second Life is an MMO. EVE is an MMO. Ultima Online is an MMO. Planetside 2 is an MMO. None of these games have much gameplay in common. Which is why it seems silly to slap MMO on any game that uses any form of gameplay connected to WoW, even when it is just in a bunch of co-op instances.

Is Diablo an MMO?

Honestly I haven't played Diablo enough to really comment on that game. People would seemingly argue that Phantasy Star Online is a MMO (Hell it's even listed as such on the Wiki page).

 

[Tiops]

It's not an MMO.

It doesn't have a massive number of players interacting at the same time in the world. It's an online game with RPG elements, but not an MMO. Skill trees, loot and dance emotes doesn't define a game as an MMO.

 

[Orayn]

I'm going to shy away from the binary "IS IT OR ISN'T IT?" side of this, because it's a discussion that usually comes to a screeching halt due to there being no firm definition of the term in question. (Kind of like asking if Dark Souls is a JRPG.)

What I will say is that Destiny falls firmly into the category of games like Path of Exile, Guild Wars 1, Vindictus, Huxley, and the online portions of PSO and Monster Hunter: You've got fully connected in-game lobbies that hold more than one party's worth of players, which connect players and their parties to instanced areas meant exclusively or primarily for them.

Destiny takes this concept in a more connected direction by making parts of those areas serve as "lobbies" themselves, mixing multiple groups of players together as a part of the normal gameplay loop and also having them phase in and out of each others' games like the "mingleplayer" side of Journey or the Souls series. Moving further away from the wide-open parts of an area will often take you into a Darkness Zone, which is a true instance containing only you and your fireteam.

So yeah, Destiny is pretty similar to whatever you consider the bolded games to be.

 

[border]

Is Diablo an MMO?

Nope. Neither is Destiny.

 

[Jarmel]

I'm going to shy away from the binary "IS IT OR ISN'T IT?" side of this, because it's a discussion that usually comes to a screeching halt due to there being to firm definition of the term in question. (Kind of like asking if Dark Souls is a JRPG.)

What I will say is that Destiny falls firmly into category of games like Path of Exile, Guild Wars 1, Vindictus, Huxley, and the online portions of PSO and Monster Hunter: You've got fully connected lobbies that hold more than one party's worth of players, which connect players and their parties to instanced areas meant exclusively or primarily for them.

Destiny takes this concept in a more connected direction by making parts of those areas serve as "lobbies" themselves, mixing multiple groups of players together as a part of the normal gameplay loop and also having them phase in and out of each others' games like the "mingleplayer" side of Journey or the Souls series. Moving further away from the wide-open parts of an area will often take you into a Darkness Zone, which is a true instance containing only you and your fireteam.

So yeah, Destiny is pretty similar to whatever you consider the bolded games to be.

That's actually a really good way of describing it.

 

[SmoothRunningGun]

Why does it matter how it's categorized? It's a fun game.

 

[Spawnling]

It's a Shared World Shooter.

 

[Leafhopper]

It's a Shared World Shooter.

I like that term.

 

[Icyflamez96]

It's literally not an MMO.

Now it is similar enough to an MMORPG to where i'm probably going to continually think of it as an MMORPG

 

[Doombacon]

What? What games were those?

Phantasy Star Online.

Spoiler

I had a few more examples, mostly older NCSoft titles, but I can not find evidence online of them being branded that way so I will leave them out.

 

[Icyflamez96]

It's a Shared World Shooter.

Yes I used to dislike this term before I played it, but now I see it fits perfectly.

 

[Camp Lo]

It's a Shared World Shooter.

There you go. Crisis averted, it has a term now.

 

[SliceSabre]

No.

Destiny is simply a FPS with some features that are common in MMOs. However it still doesn't have a massive amount of players interacting with each other on a constant basis

 

[DSN2K]

its a good game.

 

[Dragonborn]

I definitely don't consider it an MMO. It takes some inspiration from MMOs, but it doesn't fit into the genre.

 

[Portugeezer]

It's a Shared World Shooter.

I like this.

 

[jerry1594]

It's not an mmo since it has matchmaking coop. That's like saying cod with a really big map is an mmo.

 

[Novocaine]

Not at all. There are other people in the tower but out in the world there are like 3 people at most.

It's first and foremost an FPS with an option for co-op.

Honestly, that basically sums up my experience with WoW, and that's considered an MMO.

 

[Orayn]

I think this is about as fair a post on this topic as we'll see.

That's actually a really good way of describing it.

Thank you.

Basically, what I'm saying is that if you have a specific term for the games I listed, whether it's "MMO" or something else, you can refer to Destiny by that term was well.

If you think those games are in different genres are simply share a common approach to multiplayer, then say Destiny is a first person shooter with RPG elements and multiplayer that works like those games.

There's no need to argue over labels that don't mean the same thing to everyone.

 

[Doombacon]

No.

Destiny is simply a FPS with some features that are common in MMOs. However it still doesn't have a massive amount of players interacting with each other on a constant basis

Outside of towns and raid instances, MMOs very rarely have more than 5-10 players interacting with each other at a time. This seems consistent with Destinys game design.

 

[border]

It's a Shared World Shooter.

But the world isn't shared. It's instanced extensively.

 

[lyrick]

[X] MMO like Bullet Sponge Bosses
[X] Random Quests where you go off and kill enemies to collect a random quantity of dropped stuff
[X] Raids, even though they're limited to 3 players
[X] What might be the worst loot drops I've even seen in any game (I'm still in disbelief that every attribute only lowers the cooldowns of abilities/specials).


I'm going to go with a poor mans MMO.

 

[Pimpwerx]

No, but its an fps with features most often associated with an mmo. So in absence of an appropriate genre, it's okay to classify it as one. Then again, I don't understand why some people care. It's like a handful of people who make it a point to correct others who label is as an mmo. The defenders of the title, apparently. PEACE.

 

[SerTapTap]

[X] MMO like Bullet Sponge Bosses
[X] Random Quests where you go off and kill enemies to collect a random quantity of dropped stuff
[X] Raids, even though they're limited to 3 players
[X]What might be the worst loot drops I've even seen in any game (I'm still in disbelief that every attribute only lowers the cooldowns of abilities/specials).


I'm going to go with a poor mans MMO.

In that case, Borderlands 2 is an MMO

 

[Steel]

Nah, it's more like borderlands. Big world, mostly focused on your party with loot. Sure, there's areas where you'll run into other people, but you'll rarely doing anything with them outside the odd public event(Which is pretty much the exact same thing as defiance's arc falls).

So it's basically borderlands with a few more mmo trappings.

 

[Hellsing321]

Outside of towns and raid instances, MMOs very rarely have more than 5-10 players interacting with each other at a time. This seems consistent with Destinys game design.

Except real MMOs have the capability to show hundreds of people in the same place even if in practice people are spread out over the game world. Destiny can't show you more people than you would find in a CoD match.