ashecitism
Member
http://www.engadget.com/2015/02/23/steamvr-valve-virtual-reality-gdc/
interesting conclusion to reach from that snippet
interesting conclusion to reach from that snippet
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Steam Machines, final Steam Controller, new living room devices, and SteamVR at GDC
- Thread starter thebigmanjosh
- Start date
alexandros
Banned
It makes sense. Outside of Alienware's device the rest of the Steam Machines range from 'meh' to 'ugh'.
R10Neymarfan
Member
I just want the case and case components. I can buy and the build other stuff by myself
Boombox On
Member
It's plausible, but it could also mean other manufacturers are joining in, too.
alexandros
Banned
Me too, but we do need an affordable pre-built Steam Machine for the masses. The only thing PC gaming lacks to really explode in popularity is a 'hero' device.
Zeyphersan
Banned
I could justify spending a little premium on a great pre-built steam machine, honestly. I'm extremely interested in what they have to say
The living room in the picture is made of cardboard. Maybe it's related to Google Cardboard somehow?
GuitarAtomik
Member
Curious to see what the plans for VR are and if they actually plan to release a consumer version (it sounds like it).
ashecitism
Member
That has been like that ever since Big Picture Mode was announced, I think.
BlastProcessing
Member
Seems like I picked a good year to go to my first GDC.
Thought it was known Valve would have their own Steam Machine. I remember reading this when they even announced Steam Machines.
ashecitism
Member
No, they stated afterwards that they won't release one, only sent it out to testers as they were focused on that, but didn't rule out the possibility.
Dreamwriter
Member
Well, Oculus Rift is going to require a solid 90fps in its games/apps. So sure, a low end machine can handle VR... as long as the user doesn't mind dropping the video quality quite a bit.
SneakyStephan
Banned
But it's missing 95 percent of the keys that a keyboard has (it has less inputs than many gaming mice alone do)
What do you think this is going to do to the design of games that want to support that thing if it ever becomes some pc wide standard?
(hint, think how shooters went from freely switching between 10 different weapons to pistol +rifle+power weapon + grenade type because that is what can fit on a d pad)
Wana play arma? Can't bind all the stances, fire rate switching, leaning, hold breath, walk etc
Play dota? (lololol do I even need to explain)
Look at what control limitations have done to multiplatform versions of traditional pc genres (shooter, rts, wrpg and their UIs)
Now explain why you think the same will not happen to pc exclusives if the steam controller becomes a standard that games want to support.
Imagine quake 3 released in 2020 and not in 1999, and the only difference between 1999 and 2020 is that the steam controller is a standard.
Do you think it would have strafe jumping in it? No ofcourse not as steam controller players would not have half the mobility that a k/m player does. What about the weapons?
Because that is what is always said , people say it's for a particular audience (that the steam controller supposedly could allow to grow bigger), aka people pc gaming on their couch and who don't wana use a k/m.
It's not suggested to only be for a very niche amount of games , no , it's supposed to be for an audience, for all games.
Regular controllers can be a thing on pc because they are only supported in games where it makes sense, it's dependant on the genre not on the audience.
Say the steambox becomes hugely popular (50+ million steamboxes in homes) and somehow the steam controller becomes what the proponents of it want it to be, a success that a ton of people use and brings all those steambox people to the living room with their pc.
Now you make pc exclusive games, and suddenly a good percentage of your former audience now plays at their TV and uses that controller...
They aren't going to say no fuck that we'll just make it k/m only game and not sell any copies to the tv+steamcontroller audience.
Nothing good can come from this.
I'm not seeing the issues you are seeing. Ghost mode is the apparent solution to binding lots of keys and is the reason the touch screen idea was made redundant (admittedly the details on this a scarce, along with mode switching). Of course, the controller is not going to be as versatile as a keyboard and mouse by the nature of a controller format, but it really doesn't need to be. It's for a more casual audience, not high level competitive gaming
It is supplementary, not default. The idea isn't to move gaming to the lounge or controllers, but simply to increase the versatility and freedom to play wherever. The controller may well have novelty in native support by indies and a few others, but that doesn't usurp traditional PC games, mice, keyboards and all the genres that people might get into PC gaming for
Boombox On
Member
Idk about you, but I don't normally use all 101 keys on my keyboard when playing a game, and definitely not at the same time. Watch the video.
Here's 20 at once while playing Borderlands. Watch this video again. The advantage of using trackpad is that they basically act as their own platform when natively supported, giving developers more room to do what they want.
You do realize 50 million is still less than half of steam's userbase, right?
You also know that most games on steam don't only support one input as well, right? Sure, there are some games in which one is optimal, but no one is claiming the Steam Controller will replace keyboard and mouse, not even Valve themselves say that.
Calm down. Plenty good can happen with more types of input for PC games, something it has historically lacked.
ashecitism
Member
Would it make sense if "new living room devices" would be the small streaming solutions?
That's what I was thinking earlier. I could see Valve revealing something similar to Razer's new Android TV box, preferably with an update to the Android version of Steam.
ashecitism
Member
If only
Boombox On
Member
If only
I hope so, and it's at least plausible. Valve has talked about spreading Steam into mobile, and Occam's razor tells me they'll start selling Android games somewhere down the line.
I'm still skeptical about the Steam controller. Comfy couch gaming aside, I just feel that it cannot possibly compare to the precision of a m/kb setup, and perhaps not even to a typical 360 gamepad in terms of simplicity. Will it be setup in a kind of way that its buttons automatically correspond to keyboard keys, so it natively works in games that don't have 360 gamepad support?
Yes, that's actually the main scenario it's being designed for.
ashecitism
Member
The only issue with that, looking at testers' impressions, there's no button overlay change. So, game prompts you for "E", but you have assigned it to left_pad_click, or prompts you for "Tab" and you have assigned it for one of the regular buttons. If you don't memorize these, it can be uncomfortable. I wonder if Valve found something for this. Multiple testers and even devs at SDD have pointed this out.
And there's the UI issue. It might work well with a non-controller supported game, but its UI might not translate well for the big screen.
I don't think anything short of a mouse an dkeybaord can be as accurate as a mouse and keyboard.
But that's not what they're trying to do. You're never going to be playing CS GO competitively with a "comfy couch" device, but that doesn't mean a device can't be made that at least allows you to have fun with a game on the couch. Right now, you NEED a mouse and keyboard ot play a total war game, or home world. This pad is supposed ot allow you to play those games from the couch in a way that is still fun. Not necessarily super accurate and fast.
It would require the developer to fix it, at which point they may as well implement native Steam controller support.
0.1.1.2.3.5.8.13.21.34.55
Banned
This is all fine and well, but my interest in Valve "reveals" will continue to wane until they actually get around to announcing SOMETHING about Half-Life 3...
Yeah that's always been an issue, even with gamepads, for exmaple using a Ps4 pad and getting Xbox prompts.
There should be a universal API that you can use to facilitate mapping to a gamepad and where the actual button images can be used to properly aid the player.
Right now I think Valve is basically going to rely on developers to make the gamepad work correctly.
Games like Elite: Dangerous have built in profiles for severla types of joysticks, so that you get proper images like the trigger, the right POV hat, etc, instea dof generic : Joystick button #24.
Obviously older games are SOL, and you'd just have to memorize the mappings.
afternoon delight
Member
You and me both. Really looking forward to a compliment/replacement of these X360 pads I've been rocking.
Save us Valve!
Can't think of what else it could be. There was talk ages ago about using something like miracast for more reliable streaming or something. Perhaps that is a thing.
Same. My 360 controllers left stick is broke after 10 years now. More importantly though, just want to play PC games on my TV without the mouse and keyboard. Really hope they've nailed it, otherwise my lounge PC idea is going out the window
I'd love for them to announce an Android streaming client along with a $100 or less Android TV box.
I don't think it's going to be for games that require competitive precision, but more so you can easily play games like Papers, Please, P&C adventure games, strategy games, etc. I think the idea is that games will have profiles for the controller so the user will just download a profile that does the mapping and native support isn't necessary.
ashecitism
Member
That was a hoax put up by either some russian or spanish people lol
I think it was russians.
And the spaniards were who put up HL3 trademark.
lol
There are still going to be plenty fo games that just won't work as TV experiences though, even with a great pad bridging the mouse and keyboard devide.
I couldn't imagine playing something like Civ V at 1080p from 10 feet away:
Some games you just need to be able to see the detail in order to play.
I know it's a subjective thing, but for me, at least, there is also a completely different experience and level of engagement playing in front of my 27" 2560x1440p monitor and 10 feet away from my TV on the couch.
I am infinitely more immersed on my monitor because:
1. More detail as mentioned.
2. Feeling of being much more engaged in what I'm doing (imagine tlakign to someone who is standing in front of you intently looking into your eyes, vs someone just laying back on a couch. There's just a natural difference in terms of how much they are engaged in the conversation).
3. Richness of UI can be much better.
4, more FOV is taken up by my 27" monitor at 3 feet than my 48" TV from 10 feet.
5. Some games are just more fun with fast and accurate controls, and others are oly fun playing competitvely where fast and accurate controls are a must.
It's always nice to have options though.
Not true in my case. I use a laptop in the lounge now and then, but have wanted an mitx build for a long time. There are so many issues though, input being the primary problem, followed by UI and being able to control things without having to get up close to the screen and fiddle with the OS. BPM sorts a fair few issues out but there is still much improvement needed.
As far as all the Steam Machines go, success isn't going to be known for years. I highly doubt they are going to sell in droves, and that doesn't seem to matter to them, from all that has been said thus far.
Haunted
Member
checkles yourself before you wreckles yourself
ashecitism
Member
I wonder if Firaxis will implement an optional tenfoot UI. I know people from Paradox and CA have commented on the UI issue. Will anyone do something about it though? Can they?
I agree with this. This is a long term, bit by bit growth affair. Just like it's always been. Unless Dell and ASUS, and Nvidia and AMD, and Valve, etc, etc get together and market the hell out of these things, they're never going to take off like consoles.
But that's fine. They don't have to do that, and it's better for everyone that way, IMHO.
Just like last gen, PC's will continue to advance and offer more and more cool stuff that consoles don't, and more and more people are going to continue to look at gaming PC's as alternatives. And unlike last gen, the alternatives will be small, cheap, powerful, and just "work out of the box".
And PC will continue to grow as it always has, and these manufacturers will continue to make money without having to spend a medium size countries budget on marketing.
Win, win.
Well that's the thing. For some games, you surely could. But other's not really, unless you are willing to either dumb down the experience for everyone, or make it cumbersome for people on a TV.
The latter is the better option of two evils, I think we can agree, but who knows where devs will go with it.
There are still going to be plenty fo games that just won't work as TV experiences though, even with a great pad bridging the mouse and keyboard devide.
I couldn't imagine playing something like Civ V at 1080p from 10 feet away:
Some games you just need to be able to see the detail in order to play.
I know it's a subjective thing, but for me, at least, there is also a completely different experience and level of engagement playing in front of my 27" 2560x1440p monitor and 10 feet away from my TV on the couch.
I am infinitely more immersed on my monitor because:
1. More detail as mentioned.
2. Feeling of being much more engaged in what I'm doing (imagine tlakign to someone who is standing in front of you intently looking into your eyes, vs someone just laying back on a couch. There's just a natural difference in terms of how much they are engaged in the conversation).
3. Richness of UI can be much better.
4, more FOV is taken up by my 27" monitor at 3 feet than my 48" TV from 10 feet.
5. Some games are just more fun with fast and accurate controls, and others are oly fun playing competitvely where fast and accurate controls are a must.
It's always nice to have options though.
I just move my couch closer to my TV.
Ok, well yes, that can work, I guess, but before rearranging the entire living room, why not a monitor on a desk with a comfy chair?
I actually have a G-sync ROG swift and a nice comfortable chair, I much prefer playing on the plasma though.
I just need a 60" 4k OLED TV freesync, steam controller and I can finally be content.
I just need a 60" 4k OLED TV freesync, steam controller and I can finally be content.
Yeah I'll take some of that
magnumpy
Member
GDC + VR:
http://www.fudzilla.com/news/graphics/37105-amd-works-on-virtual-reality-too
sounds like this is about the software rather than the hardware. but that's good, we've got no shortage of VR headsets but the software to support it has some ways to go. hopefully this will be another "directx for VR" type of deal.
http://www.fudzilla.com/news/graphics/37105-amd-works-on-virtual-reality-too
sounds like this is about the software rather than the hardware. but that's good, we've got no shortage of VR headsets but the software to support it has some ways to go. hopefully this will be another "directx for VR" type of deal.
I just need a 60" 4k OLED TV freesync, steam controller and I can finally be content.
That sounds really nice.
Just need a couple more years for GPUs to get cheap enough for 4K and OLED yields to become more reliable for consumer pricing.
I kind of wonder what the next-generation consoles are going to do with 4K becoming more ubiquitous over the next several years.
I've long assumed that Valve has (had?) been hesitant to throw its own hat into the ring because, in an effort to make a compelling machine, it could afford to sell systems at cost price or even loss-lead to a degree thanks to Steam, an approach that wouldn't sit well with companies that need its systems to be profitable from the off, but I'm sure Valve's acutely aware of that potent disinterest in the systems that have been announced thus far and so it wouldn't surprise me to learn that Valve feels as though its hand has been forced.
ashecitism
Member
The iBuyPower guy even said they recommended Valve to come out with their own model, so that could be the main model, but to their surprise they (back then) said no.
Sorcerer
Member
So Valve designs their own prototype for the Steam Machine, but will not release it.
Then all the third party vendors are waiting around for Valve to finish the OS/Controller so they can release their own boxes.
Now Valve may come out with their own box.
What kind of relationship is Valve fostering with their partners with all these delays and broken promises?
Then all the third party vendors are waiting around for Valve to finish the OS/Controller so they can release their own boxes.
Now Valve may come out with their own box.
What kind of relationship is Valve fostering with their partners with all these delays and broken promises?
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