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Jay-Z takes to Twitter to damage control Tidal rollout

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Nibel

Member
I'm a rap fan. I'm just not a rap stan in the same way I am with Pop, where you're actively keeping track of artists and their positions within the industry over time. I always thought the general consensus these days was that Jay was respected, but his new shit was terrible and he stopped caring about actually being good years ago.

Hmmm, maybe I need to put on my flame shield and start diving into the hip-hop boards more often...:/

Esch is just spreading misinformation about his fave.
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If he drops something, sure, people will listen to it, but he doesn't shutdown anything anymore. Besides, it's not like his musical output has been any good recently, from features to full-fledged albums.
 

Floridian

Member

There's an article about that actually.
Music-industry sources say Apple is interfering with Jay Z’s music-streaming service Tidal in an attempt to crush it ahead of the relaunch of Apple’s Beats Music, set for June.

Robert Kondrk, vice president of iTunes Content, has also declared war on artists who sign up with Tidal. A source told us, “Robert told execs at Universal Music Group that Rihanna and other Tidal artists’ music would not be promoted as featured artists on iTunes if they put exclusive music out on Tidal.”

Another source confirmed ­Kondrk’s threat that Tidal artists would not promoted on iTunes: “That is normal operating procedure. If an artist chooses to market content exclusively with another rival retailer, no company is going to market or push content from that artist that hard.” Tidal reps did not respond to requests for comment.
 

cDNA

Member
Tidal starts at $10 the same price as Spotify Preimum. With more features(videos) and a higher percentage going towards artists.
I assume the 20 dollar option subsidize what they loss with the 10 dollars. So if nobody subscribe to higher tier they will lose money.
 

DECK'ARD

The Amiga Brotherhood
That's not the same as going to publications and paying them to write bad articles about the company.

Yeah, the bad press is entirely Tidal's making.

Other companies didn't even have time to organise a smear campaign, it hit an iceberg as soon as it launched.
 
He'll drop a terrible feature and it's a 5-20+ page thread on thecoli or ktt. #facts

Eh couldn't you say that about a variety of dudes? Nas isn't on Hov's popularity level and garners the same response on thecoli. Jay is popular, he's just not making good music. MCHG is largely him trying and failing to replicate the sound of the kids, plus a couple pop rap songs for the masses.
 
"My cousin just moved to Nigeria to discover new talent. Tidal is a global company."

The fact that he would post that on the internet without realizing why it's so funny is emblematic of Tidal completely fucking up their marketing at every possible chance.

My guess would be, his PR told him, "dude, not sure about tweeting that one, I am not sure we'll get any traction from that..."

Jay Z was like.."Fuck it, it's funny, who cares."
 

VaLiancY

Member
My two issues with Tidal was there was nothing to distinguish itself from the competitors but the price tag. I don't care much about exclusivity because it will make its way to the public someway or another.

Second, less of an issue with the actual product but how it was presented. I think they shouldn't have placed a bunch of established musicians on stage with the topic of "supporting the artist". You should've kept J. Cole and placed other younger budding artist on stage to reinforce that idea. Not only musicians but producers too.

I don't think Tidal is a total wash, there is always room for improvement and more competition but the first impression was very poor and I hope the business rebounds because I would personally like to see new artist make bank of their material.

How much Tidal % does Jay donate to communities he helped destroy by selling crack?

Stop. I won't defend his past but the man has done a lot philantopic work in his career as a musician, it's not heavily publicized unless you look deep.
 

JABEE

Member
I don't think Jay Z understands what people are talking about when they say their business is about the rich getting richer.

When you pretend to be a social movement/business that is sold and marketed as being about "helping" artists make money again, it's not about the size of the business. It's about where the money goes when the company potentially grows beyond the need to be marketed as a humanitarian project. How much of that money goes to popular musicians that did nothing other than lend their name to the project versus how much is distributed among aspiring musicians.

75% royalty rate sounds like a percentage that is distributed to rights holders before it is split between song writers, publishers, producers, and the mechanical royalties, most of which is swallowed up by the music publisher.

There isn't that big of a difference between Spotify and Tidal, except Spotify has more market share and charges less.

This business is dependent on people caring about artists being paid marginally better, while if this takes off, Jay-Z stands to benefit greatly.

Their extended marketing and value creation appears to come from blocking off access to videos and concerts from the general public. I don't understand how they believed this business would be successful.

I guess Jay-Z thought he could get some of his rich buddies together and their egos and reputation would just make people flock to a business built around patronage of disposable art that is becoming less and less important in the lives of young people.

Jay-Z's business model sounds like a total sell-job to old, withering artists that knew people who remembered the good old days when any kid with long hair and spandex could sell a half a million records. Remember the days when selling music and profiting off recorded music was that easy. I can imagine business people and artists being mesmerized by that ideal.
 

Laz-E-Boy

Member
Jay-Z makes like a single tweet every 6 months.

He's got multiple tweets defending Tidal in a span of an hour.

lmao, dat damage control
 

lednerg

Member
Wait, why do I have to hate Tidal? I feel like I'm missing out on all the hoopla. All I know is they laid off the CEO early on and Madonna fucked a table for Chris Martin. Otherwise, it seems to be a music service.
 

gogosox82

Member
Jay wouldn't even have to do this if he didn't have that horrible presentation of it when it first announced. And lol @ smear campaign. You did that to yourself. Only thing you can do now is try to recover from it.

On the service itself, it sounds fine but nothing that would make me switch from spotify. I've been with spotify for 3 years now and they have a bigger library where all my playlists and favorite songs are organized and its cheaper than Tidal ($10 vs $20) so why would I leave? I want to see artists get paid (which is why I'm a subscriber) but the model seems exactly the same as spotify expect Tidal pays 5% more which I don't see how that is going to make a huge difference for an artist if they think spotify pays too little.
 

malfcn

Member
Started in 2014. Acquired in 2015.

Most companies play up his long they have been around. If you're claiming how new toy are, that's because you're blowing up and proud... Or damage control.
 
It probably isn't. It's probably perfectly adequate. I don't need to switch from Spotify to Tidal for adequacy at twice the price though.

For what it's worth it's only twice the price if you want the high quality streams. It's the same price as spotify for the same quality. The service itself seems perfectly fine, it's just that they've done an awful job of telling consumers why we should want it without coming off like gigantic assholes.
 

MercuryLS

Banned
Jay's biggest mistake was how they revealed this service. If they were we just humble and more low key about it, just talking about how Artists wanted to build something great and have a better direct connection with the users without the middle man, it would have gone over a lot better.
 

faridmon

Member
Honestly there really isn't a great deal for artists anywhere unless you're a gigantic name. I think streaming has just made this fact much clearer to the average consumer.

Yet they all embrace it.

Do you know how many of those smaller artist have actually sold CDs based on people knowing about them on Spotify and go see them live?
 

reKon

Banned
Jay's biggest mistake was how they revealed this service. If they were we just humble and more low key about it, just talking about how Artists wanted to build something great and have a better direct connection with the users without the middle man, it would have gone over a lot better.

Agreed. And as other mentioned, it just shows how out of touch he was. Maybe the other artists should have spoken up, unless they're all out of touch.
 
Jay's biggest mistake was how they revealed this service. If they were we just humble and more low key about it, just talking about how Artists wanted to build something great and have a better direct connection with the users without the middle man, it would have gone over a lot better.

Plus if they had content ready to go. Instead it took awhile for them to release some #gamechanging content as...Beyonce (allegedly) playing the piano, Rihanna releasing a timed exclusive song, etc. If every artist had some type of content ready to go during the launch period Tidal would be in a better position. You have to show people why they need your service. Drinking champagne and telling people to get on your level isn't a good look.
 

Staccat0

Fail out bailed
So are people still shitting on this because bandwagons are fun? I mean the marketing push was embarrassing, but 75% for artsists - if true - is a big fucking deal and would actually get me to switch...

Yet they all embrace it.

Do you know how many of those smaller artist have actually sold CDs based on people knowing about them on Spotify and go see them live?

like... 4. What the fuck is a CD?
 
So are people still shitting on this because bandwagons are fun? I mean the marketing push was embarrassing, but 75% for artsists - if true - is a big fucking deal and would actually get me to switch...

http://business.time.com/2013/12/03/heres-how-much-money-top-musicians-are-making-on-spotify/

Spotify has paid out $500 million in royalties to rights holders so far in 2013 and $1 billion total since 2009, about 70 percent of its total revenue.

It's an old article but I believe the point still stands. 75% isn't much more than what's already being offered.
 

CoolOff

Member
So are people still shitting on this because bandwagons are fun? I mean the marketing push was embarrassing, but 75% for artsists - if true - is a big fucking deal and would actually get me to switch...

A 5% difference would make you switch?
 

MercuryLS

Banned
Plus if they had content ready to go. Instead it took awhile for them to release some #gamechanging content as...Beyonce (allegedly) playing the piano, Rihanna releasing a timed exclusive song, etc. If every artist had some type of content ready to go during the launch period Tidal would be in a better position. You have to show people why they need your service. Drinking champagne and telling people to get on your level isn't a good look.

Yeah exactly, they fucked up the execution completely. If you try to launch your service like the multi-millionaire artists are suffering under the oppression of Spotify and iTunes, what do you expect to happen? The backlash was completely justified and it's going to be hard (if not impossible) to wash the stink off this service.
 

DECK'ARD

The Amiga Brotherhood
So are people still shitting on this because bandwagons are fun? I mean the marketing push was embarrassing, but 75% for artsists - if true - is a big fucking deal and would actually get me to switch...



like... 4. What the fuck is a CD?

Spotify is 70%, Tidal is 75%.

He's being disingenuous again. The majority of your $10/$20 will go to the labels no matter who you listen to. The problem isn't the money being paid out it's how it gets divided up, and Tidal's model is the same.
 
Spotify is 70%, Tidal is 75%.

He's being disingenuous again. The majority of your $10/$20 will go to the labels no matter who you listen to. The problem isn't the money being paid out it's how it gets divided up, and Tidal's model is the same.

It's not even a problem he can fix. Jay-Z, Jack White, Beyonce, etc. can do what they want and will probably stand to make a ton of money from this but it will be business as usual for the small guys.
 

Armaros

Member
It's not even a problem he can fix. Jay-Z, Jack White, Beyonce, etc. can do what they want and will probably stand to make a ton of money from this but it will be business as usual for the small guys.

Which is why everyone that knows anything about the industry was scratching their heads and Tidal's PR campaign against other streaming services, as if they are the ones that decide how much each artist gets from their label.

But tidal was counting on the ignorant general population to create a ground well of support based on misinformation.
 

Yaboosh

Super Sleuth
Could a site like Spotify or Tidal eventually become the record companies themselves?

In the age of digital distribution, what does a record company do for an artist, especially a smaller artist?
 

Pavaloo

Member
artists weren't speaking out against spotify until they changed their streaming model. that 5% must something if it got a bunch of artists speaking out around the same time (2012-13 i think?). it had a lot to do with how the new model underpaid new material/artists. favoring huge back catalogues over new artist and material (the type of catalog each of the tidal conference members would be making the most off of on spotify. like seriously the people who would literally be making the MOST off of spotify spoke out against it) also the idea of record labels owned by artists versus the ones of old. yes there are 3 major labels with major stakes in tidal, but they're labels owned by artists #tidalfacts. if your argument is "well all the streaming services are involved with labels!" you should think about the difference. why do you think spotify is essentially able to offer their entire service for free? i have far more faith in roc-a-fella records as a label than i ever did with atlantic or emi (labels known for sabotaging their own artists and material) #tidalfacts. yes even though roc is a subsidiary of universal it doesn't stop roc from being its own label. just like young money gets to do their own thing, aftermath, etc. not a new concept.

apart from that the thing about owning all the music you'll release is a big deal too. thom is against spotify so he pulled all his personal records from there, but there's a big catalogue of old radiohead hits that just make bank and he doesn't have control over taking down. he doesn't make shit off it cause its all going to emi. owning your own material means a hell of a lot, but this point is going to get glossed over cause fuck those rich phonies right?
Could a site like Spotify or Tidal eventually become the record companies themselves?

In the age of digital distribution, what does a record company do for an artist, especially a smaller artist?

i'm 100% sure this what tidal was going for in the first place
Can't small guys sign up directly with Tidal by passing the record labels?
ye
Jay-z's mistake was thinking the public gives half a shit about artists getting money. If anything it subconsciously makes people guilty for endless piracy that people feel entitled to. All those years of using the "well piracy only affects the label" excuses as BS. Same with "piracy groups make better rips than MP3 stores." Probably the top 2 excuses used over the years for music piracy. You address those 2 things and still get shit on? Because nobody means it, they are just nasty and entitled.

There is certainly some other "out of touchness" going on but the piling on of hatred is something else entirely.

for real, anyone who had been paying attention to the industry and what artists having been saying about distribution for the last few years would know that something like Tidal has been a very long time coming. Is it much of a coincidence trent reznor and dre are developing Beats music within the same time frame?

everyone wants to get up in arms about how they're coming into the competition at twice the price, but that ignores the $10 tier entirely. let's be real there's no competing with free, but no one wants to outright say it.
So not caring about lossless music then turns into shitting on this product from up on your high horse?

There's more going on here than people just not wanting the service. IMO at least; they are challenging an entire generation of twerps who want everything digital for free.

no doubt
 
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