For me I enjoyed Hunters in the Dark, but had a couple of serious issues with it:-
1. 000 Tragic Solitude - Monitor of the Ark. Missing for the whole of Halo 3. Why? Seems very inexplicable to me and coupled with...
2. It is set before the events of Halo 4, and involves a possible firing of the Halo Array, and an near catastrophic invasion of Earth by Tragic Solitude's Retriever fleet. But obviously there was no mentioned of this near miss in any other Halo media up until this point to my knowledge. Sure, it was over relatively quickly, but seemed incongruous enough to bug me
For me I enjoyed Hunters in the Dark, but had a couple of serious issues with it:-
1. 000 Tragic Solitude - Monitor of the Ark. Missing for the whole of Halo 3. Why? Seems very inexplicable to me and coupled with...
2. It is set before the events of Halo 4, and involves a possible firing of the Halo Array, and an near catastrophic invasion of Earth by Tragic Solitude's Retriever fleet. But obviously there was no mentioned of this near miss in any other Halo media up until this point to my knowledge. Sure, it was over relatively quickly, but seemed incongruous enough to bug me
000 Tragic Solitude has a limited presence in Halo 3's Terminal where you can see him arguing and trying to stop 343 Guilty Spark from accessing The Ark's systems.
000 Tragic Solitude has a limited presence in Halo 3's Terminal where you can see him arguing and trying to stop 343 Guilty Spark from accessing The Ark's systems.
For me I enjoyed Hunters in the Dark, but had a couple of serious issues with it:-
1. 000 Tragic Solitude - Monitor of the Ark. Missing for the whole of Halo 3. Why? Seems very inexplicable to me and coupled with...
2. It is set before the events of Halo 4, and involves a possible firing of the Halo Array, and an near catastrophic invasion of Earth by Tragic Solitude's Retriever fleet. But obviously there was no mentioned of this near miss in any other Halo media up until this point to my knowledge. Sure, it was over relatively quickly, but seemed incongruous enough to bug me
He actually is in Halo 3. Sort of. The prologue to the third terminal shows a dialog between the then unnamed 000 and Guilty Spark. He informs Spark of some of the Ark's purposes and warns him to not interfere. As for why he doesn't present himself to those on the Ark in Halo 3, presumably he was busy with the building of Installation 04B. He also probably felt he had no real reason to be concerned with the fighting as he likely felt the Ark to be secure. At least until the Flood arrived, at which point he would have been busy sending the Sentinels in to control the outbreak. Plus, he was already crazy long before this point, so there's that.
Re: #2
Simple explanation was that it just didn't come up. There's a couple places where it could have potentially come up in chronologically later releases, but it's not completely unbelievable that it wasn't. It could also be explained away with a large enough exclusion zone around the site that civilians didn't observe the event and ONI/UNSC secretiveness both externally and internally but the massive losses to ships and military personnel incurred make that pretty damn implausible.
What little we know is that 000 Tragic Solitude was present in 2552 during the Battle of Installation 00, but was being an obstruction for 343GS, who was trying to gain access to the Ark's systems. 000TS denied him access, on the grounds of lack of authority given the importance and security of what the Ark was and housed (Librarian's archives).
000TS was in Halo 3- he just hadn't been named directly. From the 3rd terminal:
(edit: while i was typing this I see others have beaten me but I'll keep the text anyway haha)
Warning: Your intrusion has been logged.
04-343 (errant): Excuse me?
Your intrusion has been logged. And now it has been halted.
04-343 (errant): On whose authority?
Advice: Any further attempt to access [insects under stones] will result in your immediate addition to the local Sentinels' targeting ledger.
04-343 (errant): Vexation! I am the Monitor of--
Judgment: Your authority means nothing here.
04-343 (errant): Impatience!
04-343 (errant): I have told you who I am. Who are you?
All our makers once held dear.
[Alexandria before the Fire].
04-343 (errant): Sincere apology. But how--
Explanation: This facility is host to the [Librarians] final--
04-343 (errant): The archive is intact?! Then our makers' plan--
But also contains [bellows, crucible, castings]
04-343 (errant): A what?
[bellows, crucible]--
04-343 (errant): A foundry?
04-343 (errant): For what purpose?!
Warning: Your intrusion has been logged.
Advice: Any further attempt to access will result--
04-343 (errant): Indignant!
--immediate addition to local Sentinels' targeting ledger.
Mendicant Bias wouldn't have had authority over Spark or the ability to deploy Sentinels. The AI talking with Spark also had his own Forerunner glyph, distinct from Mendicant Bias. Regarding the quote, he's referring to the Ark's purpose as a catalog and safe haven of all sentient life in the event of the firing of the Array, as well as archives it housed, equating it to the Library of Alexandria, which was one of the world's largest libraries before it burned down.
Mendicant Bias wouldn't have had authority over Spark or the ability to deploy Sentinels. The AI talking with Spark also had his own Forerunner glyph, distinct from Mendicant Bias. Regarding the quote, he's referring to the Ark's purpose as a catalog and safe haven of all sentient life in the event of the firing of the Array, as well as archives it housed, equating it to the Library of Alexandria, which was one of the world's largest libraries before it burned down.
I know about 000 Tragic Solitude being in the terminals, what I was referring to (which I agree I should have made clear) is that all the Installation monitors (with the exception of Abject Testament who is assumed missing) have made an active appearance in game both as part of the plot and gameplay. Obviously you have 343 Gulity Spark on Installation 04, and Penitent Tangent on Installation 05. I just find it very odd for Tragic Solitude to be relegated to a terminal in Halo 3, but then given his own villain show in an extended universe novel.
That said...
WhiteRabbitEXE:-
Re: #1
As for why he doesn't present himself to those on the Ark in Halo 3, presumably he was busy with the building of Installation 04B. He also probably felt he had no real reason to be concerned with the fighting as he likely felt the Ark to be secure. At least until the Flood arrived, at which point he would have been busy sending the Sentinels in to control the outbreak. Plus, he was already crazy long before this point, so there's that.
I think the rampant arrogance that the Ark could not be harmed is the best explanation - although the Flood I'd say should mandate his prescence. But we could say that he was shy and retiring until the Ark got damaged
Re: #2
Simple explanation was that it just didn't come up. There's a couple places where it could have potentially come up in chronologically later releases, but it's not completely unbelievable that it wasn't. It could also be explained away with a large enough exclusion zone around the site that civilians didn't observe the event and ONI/UNSC secretiveness both externally and internally but the massive losses to ships and military personnel incurred make that pretty damn implausible.
Yeah, it's the implausability I find difficult to countenance. Why not just I know the Vale/Spartan thing messes with the timeline, but I'd be happier that it was concurrent with the events of Halo 4, or slightly after, the lack of info on it could be explained away. In Halo 4 / Spartan Ops the fact that Lasky, Halsey, Cortana, Del Rio and so forth have no mention of a near miss Halo Array firing, or the casualties incurred is a pretty big hole IMO
Yeah, it's the implausability I find difficult to countenance. Why not just I know the Vale/Spartan thing messes with the timeline, but I'd be happier that it was concurrent with the events of Halo 4, or slightly after, the lack of info on it could be explained away. In Halo 4 / Spartan Ops the fact that Lasky, Halsey, Cortana, Del Rio and so forth have no mention of a near miss Halo Array firing, or the casualties incurred is a pretty big hole IMO
Well... In Halo 4, a lot of the characters seem to have a blasé attitude towards things. Chief has just woken up, and is approaching a Forerunner world... Which is a huge reveal for him. But at this point for everyone else, it's been 4 years of post-Ghosts of Onyx and 2yrs post-HitD. Humanity has engineers. They discovered other Halo locations. They went back to the Ark. They survived a sentinel attack on earth.
ONI and the UNSC has weathered quite a lot, and have grown bolder and stronger. Not to mention, they had no obligation to tell Chief any of this during the events of Halo 4 as he'd been lost for so long. He doesn't get debriefed until he returns to earth at the end of Halo 4, so I'm assuming he's going to have been brought up to speed post-events of the game.
Yeah, it's the implausability I find difficult to countenance. Why not just I know the Vale/Spartan thing messes with the timeline, but I'd be happier that it was concurrent with the events of Halo 4, or slightly after, the lack of info on it could be explained away. In Halo 4 / Spartan Ops the fact that Lasky, Halsey, Cortana, Del Rio and so forth have no mention of a near miss Halo Array firing, or the casualties incurred is a pretty big hole IMO
Guys, the whole point of the Lore Thread is that you don't have to make everything spoiler-tagged...
Honestly I don't see it being that implausible, especially since Halo 4 (and Spartan Ops, for that matter) don't really deal with the Halos at all. If anything, you could say the events of Hunters in the Dark explain why humanity's best ship is given the task of running around to the known Halos for decommissioning.*
*Although I'm still interested in what exactly that means. Obviously you remove the Index, but what else? We don't really know of those phase pulse generators could be permanently disabled, and we also don't know if they have any function beyond the actual activation.
Guys, the whole point of the Lore Thread is that you don't have to make everything spoiler-tagged...
Honestly I don't see it being that implausible, especially since Halo 4 (and Spartan Ops, for that matter) don't really deal with the Halos at all. If anything, you could say the events of Hunters in the Dark explain why humanity's best ship is given the task of running around to the known Halos for decommissioning.*
*Although I'm still interested in what exactly that means. Obviously you remove the Index, but what else? We don't really know of those phase pulse generators could be permanently disabled, and we also don't know if they have any function beyond the actual activation.
Guys, the whole point of the Lore Thread is that you don't have to make everything spoiler-tagged...
Honestly I don't see it being that implausible, especially since Halo 4 (and Spartan Ops, for that matter) don't really deal with the Halos at all. If anything, you could say the events of Hunters in the Dark explain why humanity's best ship is given the task of running around to the known Halos for decommissioning.*
*Although I'm still interested in what exactly that means. Obviously you remove the Index, but what else? We don't really know of those phase pulse generators could be permanently disabled, and we also don't know if they have any function beyond the actual activation.
There's a scene in Halo 4 where they're talking about "the other installations". They could've mentioned "oh yeah, they almost got activated once again before we shut them down".
There's a scene in Halo 4 where they're talking about "the other installations". They could've mentioned "oh yeah, they almost got activated once again before we shut them down".
There's a scene in Halo 4 where they're talking about "the other installations". They could've mentioned "oh yeah, they almost got activated once again before we shut them down".
I only have one problem with the Halo setting right now and that is the Didact. Why did the Forerunners have such a huge problem with the Flood when the Didact could vaporize a planet of all biological life? Yes, it is one against many, but the assumption I got from the last Halo game was that the Didact was not the only one, but one of a large group of Forerunners that rebelled against the others and the direction they were leaning.
I only have one problem with the Halo setting right now and that is the Didact. Why did the Forerunners have such a huge problem with the Flood when the Didact could vaporize a planet of all biological life? Yes, it is one against many, but the assumption I got from the last Halo game was that the Didact was not the only one, but one of a large group of Forerunners that rebelled against the others and the direction they were leaning.
The Ur-Didact was taken out of the game by the Librarian and locked up in his Cryptum on Requiem. The IsoDidact did indeed fire the Halos, and purged the entire galaxy of all life, both Flood and non-Flood.
He's still presumably buried under the surface of the Ark somewhere. Drifts alludes to there being another intelligence other than 000TS, but that's about it so far haha.
He's still presumably buried under the surface of the Ark somewhere. Drifts alludes to there being another intelligence other than 000TS, but that's about it so far haha.
So where's Offensive Bias? From what I remembered he delivered the remains of Mendicant Bias to the Ark for his sentencing, but.. then what? Perhaps he went with the IsoDidact and Chant-to-Librarian?
I imagine if we end up seeing MB again we'll have to get some OB action as well.
Did we ever figure out where the final batter between MB and OB take place? It had to be somewhere outside of the Ark, but how far? That many ships being destroyed.. seems like there would be wreckage floating around even now.
So where's Offensive Bias? From what I remembered he delivered the remains of Mendicant Bias to the Ark for his sentencing, but.. then what? Perhaps he went with the IsoDidact and Chant-to-Librarian?
I imagine if we end up seeing MB again we'll have to get some OB action as well.
Did we ever figure out where the final batter between MB and OB take place? It had to be somewhere outside of the Ark, but how far? That many ships being destroyed.. seems like there would be wreckage floating around even now.
I only have one problem with the Halo setting right now and that is the Didact. Why did the Forerunners have such a huge problem with the Flood when the Didact could vaporize a planet of all biological life? Yes, it is one against many, but the assumption I got from the last Halo game was that the Didact was not the only one, but one of a large group of Forerunners that rebelled against the others and the direction they were leaning.
Perhaps. You'd think he'd (she'd? it'd? I guess there isn't really a gender) monitor the Keyships to make sure everything got seeded correctly (and no MB sneaking away to Janjur Qom...).
I hope they touch on that at some point, I can see them just leaving it alone forever at this point.. but I sure hope not.
Ooooh.. maybe Offensive Bias resides in the
Absolute Record
! Seems like a good place to hole up for all eternity..
Also, it looks like that Saint's Testimony excerpt was released by mistake.
- that's a solid theory! No better or worse than anything else, with the lack of available information. I guess we'll find out more about what's in the Absolute Record soon enough.
- I figured as such, which is why I didn't want to read it. I'll endure these next seven days and go in fresh
So where's Offensive Bias? From what I remembered he delivered the remains of Mendicant Bias to the Ark for his sentencing, but.. then what? Perhaps he went with the IsoDidact and Chant-to-Librarian?
I imagine if we end up seeing MB again we'll have to get some OB action as well.
Did we ever figure out where the final batter between MB and OB take place? It had to be somewhere outside of the Ark, but how far? That many ships being destroyed.. seems like there would be wreckage floating around even now.
I dunno. I don't remember them giving us any more info on OB. I assume he went with the IsoDidact, but I don't think Silentium makes that clear.
With space being so vast and faster-than-light travel involved, I always assumed that the final battle took place over a fairly large area that we wouldn't really comprehend being "one battle", except that it was basically all being coordinated by dueling intelligences and ships got close for boarding or ramming actions.
As to the wreckage... again, if we think about them firing weapons from kilometers or even thousands of kilometers away and only getting close for boarding/ramming, then you could think of the debris as like an asteroid belt—not the belts we see in Star Wars, full of rock everywhere, but like our own solar system, where all those asteroids spread out across that huge area still only comprises an estimated 4% of the Moon's mass.
Plus, there's nothing slowing down the acceleration of debris from an explosion in deep space. If a piece of shrapnel exploded out from a Forerunner ship at a the incredibly leisurely pace of 10 miles an hour, in the roughly 100,000 years since the battle, that piece of shrapnel has travelled 8.77 billion miles in that time—almost 2.5x the distance from the Sun to Pluto. You wouldn’t have any vast wreckages of fleets hanging in space if they fought with what weapons we know they’ve employed.
I suppose I just thought maybe with the 4.8+ million ships involved, we'd have some cool ship graveyard somewhere. But I guess with all the slipspace warping and ship ramming there might not be much left, even less-so if it wasn't happening over any planet in particular.
Would have been cool to visit a planet just strewn with 100,000 year old ship relics.
On a related note, did we ever find out where the Keyship went on the Ark? It had to land somewhere.. thought that may have been brought up in Hunters in the Dark but didn't see it mentioned.
I suppose I just thought maybe with the 4.8+ million ships involved, we'd have some cool ship graveyard somewhere. But I guess with all the slipspace warping and ship ramming there might not be much left, even less-so if it wasn't happening over any planet in particular.
Would have been cool to visit a planet just strewn with 100,000 year old ship relics.
On a related note, did we ever find out where the Keyship went on the Ark? It had to land somewhere.. thought that may have been brought up in Hunters in the Dark but didn't see it mentioned.
Presumably there would be multiple locations for a Keyship to land, given what we see in Origins and its sheer scale. But yeah was a shame they didn't cover it (or even mention trying to recover it, as it's gotta' still be there and I would presume it would be mostly intact.)
Presumably there would be multiple locations for a Keyship to land, given what we see in Origins and its sheer scale. But yeah was a shame they didn't cover it (or even mention trying to recover it, as it's gotta' still be there and I would presume it would be mostly intact.)
mean that they could be searching for it, and have it show up down the road. Would also be a good reasoning for finding (and releasing) Mendicant Bias.
Presumably there would be multiple locations for a Keyship to land, given what we see in Origins and its sheer scale. But yeah was a shame they didn't cover it (or even mention trying to recover it, as it's gotta' still be there and I would presume it would be mostly intact.)
Especially since the arrival of the Keyship was what allowed both fragments of Mendicant Bias to "reunite", essentially, and work in tandem to mess with the slipspace fissure that sent MC towards Requiem.
I think that's how that happened anyway. Correct me if I'm wrong here.
Especially since the arrival of the Keyship was what allowed both fragments of Mendicant Bias to "reunite", essentially, and work in tandem to mess with the slipspace fissure that sent MC towards Requiem.
I think that's how that happened anyway. Correct me if I'm wrong here.
That's a solid working assumption. Really it seems possible firing up the Dreadnought itself in Halo 2 might have had something to do with it, but we don't know exactly how Mendicant Bias actually "works" and in what ways he was supposedly disconnected from the rest of the ship. Maybe it was actually the piece on the Ark that activated with or without the piece on the Keyship via some sort of stimulus (the portal opening, the ship docking, etc.)
Well, in the closing cutscene to Infinity, Del Rio mentions having not seen offensive reactions on the level of Requiem's on other installations. I'd say
a rampant AI, thousands of strato-sentinels, and the first appearance of armigers
would count, but arguably he was talking specifically about Infinity's interactions with Halo installations. Still, I'd say it's a little bit of a stretch, as the attacks by the Prometheans and Didact aren't so far removed from the events of the Ark that this should be particularly surprising. It's not a major issue and I'll give it a pass as midquels/prequels are pretty hard to do without making at least a little wiggle room, but I think it's at least noteworthy.
Well, in the closing cutscene to Infinity, Del Rio mentions having not seen offensive reactions on the level of Requiem's on other installations. I'd say
a rampant AI, thousands of strato-sentinels, and the first appearance of armigers
would count, but arguably he was talking specifically about Infinity's interactions with Halo installations. Still, I'd say it's a little bit of a stretch, as the attacks by the Prometheans and Didact aren't so far removed from the events of the Ark that this should be particularly surprising. It's not a major issue and I'll give it a pass as midquels/prequels are pretty hard to do without making at least a little wiggle room, but I think it's at least noteworthy.
Also comes down to how much involvement 343 had in the level of details in HitD. Usually, with novels like this, they contract a solid writer, tell them that they want a story to occur at Location A, or A and B, or A, B and C, with Characters X, Y and Z, and then kind of loosely guide them along.
For example, with HitD, Peter David was contracted to write a story taking place on the Ark. Peter came up with the how and why.
GC: Where did the idea for it come from, you or 343 Industries?
P: 343 Industries suggested I do a story set on the Ark, and I was the one who came up with the idea of why they have to go there.
GC: How different is the story in the book from your original idea?
P: Its pretty much what I came up with, though 343 Industries was wonderful in terms of coming up with ways to expand upon what was there. I literally could not have written it without their input.
GC: Along the same lines, where did the decision to set it when you did, after Halo 3, come from? Because while that's obviously not a time they'd cover in a game, it also means you don't get to have Master Chief as your hero.
P: They have other plans for the Master Chief, so he never factored into plans for the book.
GC: As you were writing it, were there ever times and no, we don't want you to spoil them when you wanted to do something but the people at 343 were like, "No, you can't do that and we can't tell you why"?
P: No, if there were things that 343 Industries didnt want me to do, they told me exactly why. I signed a non-disclosure agreement, so they knew they could trust me with story details that are currently under wraps.
Creating and crafting Halo 4- while they made mention of things happening on other installations- there's no way they could have worked in EU details that hadn't even been brainstormed yet by an author they contracted in, given how they approach things.
I'd assume that with the Forerunner trilogy being crafted at the same time as Halo 4, there was closer interaction between Bear and 343, and even with Traviss, there was likely closer interaction as well, as those 6 books tie pretty heavily into a game that was yet to come out. With Peter's, I think the "how" and "why" weren't as important as the overall context itself.
I'm not arguing at all- it is a curious thing that the Halos going into an emergency activation sequence by default and a sentinel invasion are fairly large events to not get mentioned, but Halo 4 was created long before HitD was, and the lack of details supplied to the Chief is a result of real-world timelines, not fictional discrepancies.
I think, overall, HitD is a sort of answer to a lot of the displeased voices over how deeply important the Forerunner and Kilo-Five trilogies were to Halo 4 and how it sort of alienated folks who didn't read the books before playing the game, or read them at all. HitD, while very canonical, insightful into new and returning characters, and featuring locales we've seen in previous game tiles, is a kind of middle ground of being meaninfgul to EU folks but also not being a mandatory read before going into Halo 5.
I think, overall, HitD is a sort of answer to a lot of the displeased voices over how deeply important the Forerunner and Kilo-Five trilogies were to Halo 4 and how it sort of alienated folks who didn't read the books before playing the game, or read them at all. HitD, while very canonical, insightful into new and returning characters, and featuring locales we've seen in previous game tiles, is a kind of middle ground of being meaninfgul to EU folks but also not being a mandatory read before going into Halo 5.
And I HATE IT! Because of the complaining, I doubt we'll get real meaty.. mainline stuff in the EU again.
I completely understand (and basically agree) why, it just sucks, because I love getting that kind of awesome insight into the universe that you can't quite get through games.
We'll see how many loose ends from Hunters get touched on in Halo 5. Could be 1 (Vale) could be multiple..
And I HATE IT! Because of the complaining, I doubt we'll get real meaty.. mainline stuff in the EU again.
I completely understand (and basically agree) why, it just sucks, because I love getting that kind of awesome insight into the universe that you can't quite get through games.
We'll see how many loose ends from Hunters get touched on in Halo 5. Could be 1 (Vale) could be multiple..
It's frustrating, but understandable to a point. The trade-off would be if they dig a lot deeper into the heavy lore bits in Halo 5 as opposed to the previous titles (though Halo 4 already was the lore-heaviest Halo as it is- it was eclipsed by even heavier EU mediums, and that's where it drew some ire).
I hope we'll see meatier novels down the road. I really do. The Forerunner trilogy was some of the best sci-fi I've ever read, and it was a total bonus that it was also Halo-related haha.
Probably gonna be a huge troll and have to wait and see what happens in halo 5, we already know Locke and crew get sent after m'dama and Halsey near the beginning.
Probably gonna be a huge troll and have to wait and see what happens in halo 5, we already know Locke and crew get sent after m'dama and Halsey near the beginning.
Kinda the same vein as both the KiloFive and Forerunner trilogies not completing until after Halo 4 released. Nothing massively spoilery to the game itself, but their conclusions did have some bearing on events in the game and reading them beforehand may have been too insightful and taken a bit away from Dat New Lore smell of a fresh Halo game haha.
I enjoy the overlap that can occur in extended universes- connecting the dots is half the fun.
Kinda the same vein as both the KiloFive and Forerunner trilogies not completing until after Halo 4 released. Nothing massively spoilery to the game itself, but their conclusions did have some bearing on events in the game and reading them beforehand may have been too insightful and taken a bit away from Dat New Lore smell of a fresh Halo game haha.
I enjoy the overlap that can occur in extended universes- connecting the dots is half the fun.
We see Jul fighting w/ Locke in the trailer.. and Halsey is in the background, and then Halsey is on Infinity with Palmer and Laskey.. so.. I'd guess Jul bites the big one in a fight against Locke.
I guess it's possible he either gets beaten down and captured, or somehow escapes at the last minute, but I personally don't know if he'll be necessary in the story going forward.
We see Jul fighting w/ Locke in the trailer.. and Halsey is in the background, and then Halsey is on Infinity with Palmer and Laskey.. so.. I'd guess Jul bites the big one in a fight against Locke.
I guess it's possible he either gets beaten down and captured, or somehow escapes at the last minute, but I personally don't know if he'll be necessary in the story going forward.
That's what I mean. At least at this point the coming end to the Escalation/Spartan Ops Season 2 series and Halo 5 seem like they're done with Jul. I kinda' feel bad if he gets killed off thoughhe's a jerk, but he's a completely justified jerk.
That's what I mean. At least at this point the coming end to the Escalation/Spartan Ops Season 2 series and Halo 5 seem like they're done with Jul. I kinda' feel bad if he gets killed off thoughhe's a jerk, but he's a completely justified jerk.
I like his character. I thought he had a really great background in the Kilo-Five arc- it gave him a purpose and a reason to be who he is and why. In the end, he'll either be redeemed or he'll succumb to his own fanatical ideology.
