You don't even have to look down. Just move your thumb or let go quickly to hit one of the large icons for your team mates. The large icons are placed right where your thumb would hit at the side of the screen.
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Should Nintendo have dropped the gamepad back in 2013 to reduce console price?
- Thread starter VertPin
- Start date
You don't even have to look down. Just move your thumb or let go quickly to hit one of the large icons for your team mates. The large icons are placed right where your thumb would hit at the side of the screen.
TheGreatMightyPoo
Banned
Little kids seem to use it fine.
And what if the teammate you're trying to tap is dead? Then you end up fumbling trying to tap one that isn't and you're dead.
Alex_Mexico
Member
There's no way it would've helped tremendously but it would've helped for sure. Maybe to at least sell as much as the GC did instead of looking like its about to become Nintendo's shittiest selling console ever this side of the Virtual Boy.
Astral Dog
Member
no it would not be the Wii U without the Upad.
My 10 year old nephew is an example as he likes Splatoon a lot haha.
Yeah, again I don't believe it would sell Gamecube numbers within this same amount of time. Like I posted earlier I think it would boost it 1 or 2 million worldwide but in the grand numbers game that doesn't mean much.
Poltergust
Member
That would not be faster than touchscreen controls. Worst case scenario (see below for more on this), you would have to click on the D-Pad 8 times. With touch-screen controls, the process of selecting a jump point is the same regardless of the number of potential points to jump to.
This is not even taking into account human error. People would be likely to skip over the jump point they wish to go to in the heat of the moment.
That would be an awful design decision. Not only would it clash with the colorful aesthetic of the game, but it would completely cover enemies and ink if they are behind the black background. It would be worse than just having the mini-map be transparent.
Not at all. Good game design (and software design in general) is always centered around the worst-case scenario. Having 12 Squid Beakons active at the same time is the worst-case scenario in this instance. What's flawed is the list system you proposed.
Yes, I've yet to see it improve gameplay for any of the games I play. All its done is add an inconvenient reason for me to look away from my TV. I bought a console to use it on my TV, not to switch between the two . I think it should have been optional with the pro controller being the standard.
In some cases it would be and other it wouldn't. If you want to talk about human error there are tons that could happen when two elements on a tiny touch screen are placed next to each other. "Shit I accidentally tapped the squid beacon next to the guy just standing there, now he lost his ink for nothing"
Just like how the black border around the clock is an "awful design decision"? Have you ever played the game?
Nah, good game design is not fucking up everything else just to fix one part.
People not using something to its full potential is not a reason to remove it. Not to mention that I've gotten use out of it myself. Being able to run from an enemy, turn a corner, and disappear by the time they get there is so satisfying.
I'm sorry but your ideas are worse than the current system. We might as well stop talking now because you're not going to change your opinion and neither will I.
Ironic, then...
No, but it's good to have options, and those options are easier to use with a touchscreen. : )
Being able to run from an enemy, turn a corner, and disappear does not require 16 beacons on the map.
Poltergust
Member
The list for the touchscreen works because the number of teammates is static and the icons can be tapped immediately. It is incorrect to assume that the list will be accessed the same way without touchscreen controls because you would need to scroll though the list to select what you want.
This comparison is intellectually dishonest because you are not taking into account the amount of time to actually select the jump point you want with the menu method, which will undoubtedly on average take up more time than touching a point on the map.
Furthermore, "look back up" is not part of the equation as you have already tapped a point.
Doesn't matter. This wouldn't change whether you are selecting a jump-point with or without touchscreen controls. It is, however, less likely to happen with touchscreen controls as you can select a particular jump-point more quickly. Touchscreen controls also make it easier to switch between points on the fly in case one gets destroyed.
I guess people only play Smash and Mario Kart. Wii U has TONS of awesome games that use the PAD in really novel ways, both from Nintendo (Nintendoland, Wario, Splatoon, Wii Fit U, Wii Sports U, Kirby), Third Parties (Zombie U, Scribblenaugts, Lego, Rayman), and Indies (Affordable Space Adventures, Swords and Soldiers II, Castlestorm, etc.)
The teammate list can easily be static on the TV as well.
It is nowhere near being dishonest, the looking down method requires finding someone that isn't dead or a beacon, or the spawn point all while diverting your attention. The selection process can automatically hover over something that is capable of being super jumped to with two button presses, without taking a hand off of the analog sticks.
Lol, wtf are you talking about, it totally matters because if you're trying to escape you need 100 percent certainty that what you're about to try to press is actually going to work.
GustyGardens
Banned
If think you know as well as I do that choosing a teammate to use a super jump wouldn't be that simple.
At it's easiest, it'd be more like this:
Select to bring up menu.
Choose team mate with analog stick.
Press A to select team mate.
Select to put away the menu.
We're talking about a fast escape here, if we are comparing selecting a random teammate to escape on the gamepad vs selecting a random teammate via a select button it's clear what would always result in certainty when teammates are dead.
Easier? Again depends on what you're trying to do.
You forgot Pikmin 3 and having the gamepad available as your map and able to route everything on the spot.
Poltergust
Member
In such cases, it would be better to simply tap the icon of the player, rather than the player on the map. Having two options for the same point actually provides some nice flexibility in these specific instances.
Just like how the black border around the clock is an "awful design decision"? Have you ever played the game?
Three things:
1. The icon is on the top of the screen. The entirety of the UI is sectioned off to the top of the screen so that as much of the playing field can be seen at once. The mini-map would contrast the rest of the UI.
2. The black background for the mini-map would be many, many times larger than that for the clock.
3. The map you shown earlier is not rectangular. Having a black background behind it would produce a lot of empty space, making it stand out more. Look at how little empty space there is in your picture.
I have no idea what you are referring to. What about the squid beakons needs fixing the way they work now? The only way they would become broken is through the list idea you proposed.
GustyGardens
Banned
If a fast getaway is the subject here, then there's nothing faster than moving your finger slightly to the left to press on your team mates icon. I think what you may have in mind is more of a heads up display, think COMMAROSE in Battlefield.
Allow to explain its function for those that aren't familiar. It works by holding down a button on the controller, I believe it's L1. Once held, this contextual menu appears, while the action is still happening behind it, and a choice is picked by simply moving the Right Stick to that position and releasing the L1 button
I think something like this could work for Splatoon. Personally, I would prefer the Gamepad option if given the choice, but I could adapt to COMMAROSE style menu.
The gamepad was a terrible idea, but even mid-2013 was way too late for Nintendo to kill it. First off, the gamepad wasn't the worst thing about the Wii U - that comes from the console itself being undesired by the vast majority of gamers out there. Next, there were lots of discounts world-wide in 2013, and they barely helped the Wii U at all. Finally, it doesn't even save Nintendo any money. They already had lots of fully assembled gamepads and tons of gamepad parts from their suppliers so if they canceled the product then they would have to eat all the unsold inventory.
Again, the player you try to tap could be dead.
Nah bro, it would look fine.
Fixing as in adjusting, basing your argument off of the fact that 16 squid beacons can be placed is not a good argument.
JinjoUnchained
Member
No way. By 2013, PS4 and XB1 had already been announced and were breaking pre-order records. Consumers had made up their minds to wait for "next gen".
Wii U's only chance to sell was with a killer app and a $250 or below price at launch before the next gen created mindshare. Once that ship sailed, their best bet was to exactly what they did: produce great games to keep their IP strong and find other revenue sources (hi Amiibo and DeNA!). Stay in the black and execute better with future hardware.
Wii U's only chance to sell was with a killer app and a $250 or below price at launch before the next gen created mindshare. Once that ship sailed, their best bet was to exactly what they did: produce great games to keep their IP strong and find other revenue sources (hi Amiibo and DeNA!). Stay in the black and execute better with future hardware.
Poltergust
Member
And...? What about the Squid Beakons? There can be a variable number of them, and you need to cycle through them since they must be included on the list.
Touchscreen controls avoid this problem altogether as the number of beakons placed on the map has no bearing on the selection process.
Correction: a minimum of two button presses. Most likely you are going to need to cycle a bit to select the jump point you wish to go to. This cycling is what causes normal controls to be slower than the touchscreen.
If escaping is your only concern, then read below.
People typically tend to escape to the spawn point for defensive super-jumping, as it provides guaranteed security upon landing. In this case, the touchscreen is actually faster than the menu system, as the spawn point button on the Gamepad is always active and always in the same place. This requires only 1 input, in comparison to the 2 you need for the menu. You don't even need to take your eyes off the TV to select it!
GustyGardens
Banned
I look forward to future threads, 10 years from now where people gather around and praise Nintendo on its gamepad revelation. They'll say it was ahead of its time or something along those lines. I remember when people thought the Gamecube controller was horrendous, and now we call it one of the best controllers ever.
ugh_the_boot
Banned
Haven't played Splatoon sorry as it just doesn't look like my kinda game. I'm sure it is a good game (for some people) but I unfotunately do not see myself playing it....ever.
Also Mario Maker....as much as I do love Mario I am really burned out on it (especially 2d ones) and really do not feel like playing anymore. Galaxy was amazing however and unless they come up with a completely original idea I have no desire to play any more Mario games.
Gamer @ Heart
Member
No. That would not have solved the issue.
Why do people believe there is some magical price for success?
Being $199 would not have solved their fucked up positioning and market strategy.
Why do people believe there is some magical price for success?
Being $199 would not have solved their fucked up positioning and market strategy.
DJ_Lae
Member
Yeah, my five year old daughter handles the gamepad without any issue. You'd have to have insanely small and girly hands to struggle with it.
Poltergust
Member
What does that have to do with the point of selecting between a player and a beakon that are close to each other...?
Nah bro, it would look fine.
That looks about as bad as I thought it would be. It is both too big (taking up a ton of screen space; look at how little of the right border is unoccupied!) and too small (I can't read any info on that. Where is my team? The arrows are blending with the ink trails).
So what do you suggest? Reduce the number of squid beakons a player can place? That would drastically lessen their utility.
The list was one idea, since you keep bitching about it you could cycle through them via highlighting on the minimap. There are so many different ways that it could work.
You could also actively watch where the squid beacons are being placed, another benefit you get from having the minimap.
Again you miss the point, the person I was responding to said fast escape without looking down at the GamePad. If you are trying to fast escape and you try to press a player that is dead you will die. If you press select (which would default to an alive player) then press a fast you will be guaranteed escape.
Having to super jump to the spawn point when you don't have to is a waste of time.
I did this in 5 seconds and didn't change anything, it's a small image. It would be perfectly fine on a big TV just like Mario Kart 8's map.
Sure, there is no need to have 16 squid beacons, and sure enough you've yet to post a video of people using that many squid beacons.
This would've removed the main feature of the Wii U.
...which is still a valid point. On a side note, I can't even create an account with my username, because they censored "bash".
...which is still a valid point. On a side note, I can't even create an account with my username, because they censored "bash".
Wouldn't the library be the same without the gamepad?
Dying before its time in the sun. Just like the VirtualBoy.
No
-Off tv play
-Games as mario maker, nintendo land, splatoon.
(Splatoon is better without your screen f$ckt with ui interfaces)
-multiplay
-a reason to use internet browser on tv, watching/streaming movies
Best thing ever. Still use it instead of my wii u pro controller. Feels comfotable for me. Haters goung to hate.
Besides, releasing another gamecube will hurt nintendo even more. They need to come up with something different. Mainly because of the 3th party issue.
-Off tv play
-Games as mario maker, nintendo land, splatoon.
(Splatoon is better without your screen f$ckt with ui interfaces)
-multiplay
-a reason to use internet browser on tv, watching/streaming movies
Best thing ever. Still use it instead of my wii u pro controller. Feels comfotable for me. Haters goung to hate.
Besides, releasing another gamecube will hurt nintendo even more. They need to come up with something different. Mainly because of the 3th party issue.
Poltergust
Member
I keep bringing up the list idea because you have yet to successfully propose a system that would work more efficiently than the Gamepad touchscreen, and the list was your only attempt at doing so.
The active highlighting is an interesting idea, but then you have to know how you are going to structure it and then convey that system to the player. What's the order of the jump points being to be highlighted? If I press right on the D-Pad, would it be possible for a jump point to the left of what I had selected previous be highlighted? Why or why not? How would we get the player to intuitively know what is going to be next on the highlight list?
Remember, this list is not visible because we haven't pressed the - button yet to bring up the super-jump menu. All that we have is the mini-map.
Remember, this is only under the context of escaping. Under such circumstances, the best place to go would be the spawn point. Furthermore, you've implied that it doesn't matter where a player would jump, just as long as they jump to an active point, so why does it matter whether it's the spawn point or another jump point on the map? If anything, I wouldn't be comfortable with choosing to jump to the first available point I have because I can land right into the enemy's hands and waste even more time, while the spawn point prevents such a thing from affecting me.
You're missing the bigger picture here. In order to reduce the total number of jump points by removing beakons, you would need to slower the amount of beakons each individual player can place from 3 to 2 (or even 1). That is undeniably a dramatic change.
ZombiePlatypus
Member
I'm so freaking glad they didn't. WiiU's issues were marketing and messaging. Not it's features.
krizalidzero
Member
It's still the console's selling point.
I believe the name hurt the Wii U more than anything else. They went for "Brand Recognition" and they got "Brand confusion and mix-up" as a result.
I believe the name hurt the Wii U more than anything else. They went for "Brand Recognition" and they got "Brand confusion and mix-up" as a result.
I brought up highlighting before with the context of the list because it was the best of both worlds, and it would only be necessary for the squid beacons as the players and spawn point would be listed as per the image I created. The following buttons aren't necessary/have no function in Splatoon: L, A, B. Make them worth something, hold L, press A to hover a cursor over the mini map, use the B button to fast select a teammate or spawn point to jump to.
The best place to jump to is not always a spawn point when escaping. If it's the end of the game you don't want to waste your time jumping to the spawn point with 10 seconds left.
Not when looking at how they are currently used.
RichiRamjag
Member
You could have won this argument ages ago by repeating your rank over and over again. For shame.
How to shitpost when adults are discussing game mechanics 101. Please tell me what you have contributed to this discussion besides talking about playing Advance Wars on your iPhone?
Lower price points are usually a lot more attractive to certain audiences than higher ones. $200 is just about an ideal price for mass market adoption. However, the catch is that you have to get people interested in your product to begin with, and the Wii U had almost no selling points.
Footage: there is none.
Aaron Strife
Banned
No but they should have considered it before revealing the console and put the extra manufacturing costs towards beefing up the console.
Doing so after the thing already released would have just fractured the user base, pissed off more fans (after they pulled a similar stunt with the 3DS' price drop) and weakened their brand. I think the best thing to do after launch unfortunately was stick to their guns.
Doing so after the thing already released would have just fractured the user base, pissed off more fans (after they pulled a similar stunt with the 3DS' price drop) and weakened their brand. I think the best thing to do after launch unfortunately was stick to their guns.
Poltergust
Member
The brings up the precision problem you talked about earlier. Also, having to hover a cursor over the mini-map would undoubtedly be slow. What if you want to jump to one side of the map and your cursor is at the other?
In such a situation I would find little point in escaping through super-jumping; too much time would be lost and you have no idea if where you're landing is safe or requires your presence.. Swimming away would be a more preferable option.
You're frequently in teams where no individual player places all 3 beakons at their disposal?
The map would be a small UI element, not much for a cursor to track over and the speed of said cursor could be adjusted.
Then you get caught in enemy ink and can die. It's better to super jump to an opponent that is in the midst of the field so that you have a better chance of landing somewhere that can net you final points.
Usually there is one squid beacon on the map or no one is using squid beacons. Probably because people like sub-weapons that actually help them in combat beyond escape options that will always be available to you regardless of whether or not there are squid beacons.
ugh_the_boot
Banned
Pfft do u even lift bra? Try XXL