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[belushy]

The combat areas do look pretty big, and this was indoors.

 

[Karl2177]

The combat areas do look pretty big, and this was indoors.

I'd bet that the interior areas are going to be larger than the outdoor ones. You don't have to worry about the fidelity of skyboxes for indoor areas, while you do for outdoors.

 

[Fahzgoolin]

I'd bet that the interior areas are going to be larger than the outdoor ones. You don't have to worry about the fidelity of skyboxes for indoor areas, while you do for outdoors.

I actually doubt that due to the scale of the Warzone maps.

 

[Foolishfellow]

Sure there are short clips of what appear to be open ended, our door levels, but no demonstrations...

Much of the developer commentary mentions that open areas were a focal point of development... The amount of distance one can have between himself and his squadmates (and the number of enemy AI that would need to be processed as a result of this distance) was mentioned as one of the reasons split screen didn't make it in...

Those comments coupled with this video leaves me pretty confident, that we'll see some Silent Cartographer-esque levels...

I sure hope so. Still seems like an odd choice though, if there are big open campaign levels why not show them? It's pretty obvious to me that the big levels are what most Halo fans want.

 

[watership]

Holy shit at the 3:00 mark when your squadmate appears out of nowhere and charges the tagged elite. Playing with the squad controls is gonna be cool.

(squints) how the hell can you tell?? We need a real video.

 

[Foolishfellow]

The combat areas do look pretty big, and this was indoors.

Same case could be made for Halo 2's High Charity. It's still not what most people want. It's not just about level size, it's also about having multiple angles of approach and (optional) vehicular combat. The fact that we're this close to release and haven't seen a single level that looks like the prototypical ideal Halo level is very concerning.

 

[Vire]

*See people flipping burgers over the new footage*

*Watches video*

Oh... it's another corridor space station mission. Okay I guess? I mean it looks fine, but I'm not exactly losing my shit over here.

Kinda was expecting some huge open environment like The Silent Cartographer based on the reactions.

 

[Poodlestrike]

*See people flipping burgers over the new footage*

*Watches video*

Oh... it's another corridor space station mission. Okay I guess? I mean it looks fine, but I'm not exactly losing my shit over here.

Kinda was expecting some huge open environment like The Silent Cartographer based on the reactions.

Space station yes, corridor no; there's some great play spaces in there.

 

[Foolishfellow]

Holy shit at the 3:00 mark when your squadmate appears out of nowhere and charges the tagged elite. Playing with the squad controls is gonna be cool.

I hate to be raining on everyone's parade all the time when it comes to Halo, but this squad stuff is in just about every FPS since the early Xbox 360 days. I'd much control all of the action solo then when a scripted event play out after tagging an enemy with my aiming reticle.

It has been nearly a decade since Xbox 360's release, and I don't feel like I'm alone when I say that this style of gameplay isn't fresh anymore. It might have been fun and innovative in Brothers in Arms: Road to Hill 30 (2005), but since then nearly every FPS has had a similar mechanic and it's just getting old.

 

[Fata1moose]

*See people flipping burgers over the new footage*

*Watches video*

Oh... it's another corridor space station mission. Okay I guess? I mean it looks fine, but I'm not exactly losing my shit over here.

Kinda was expecting some huge open environment like The Silent Cartographer based on the reactions.

According to the GI article, this level is the most linear one in the game and it's not even a corridor as there's alternate routes and areas with a lot of verticality, that's a good indication that the other levels will be pretty open.

 

[Foolishfellow]

Space station yes, corridor no; there's some great play spaces in there.

I don't think anyone is saying that this is necessarily a bad level. It just doesn't look particularly memorable when compared to levels in past games.

 

[Foolishfellow]

According to the GI article, this level is the most linear one in the game and it's not even a corridor as there's alternate routes and areas with a lot of verticality, that's a good indication that the other levels will be pretty open.

"Verticality" is a marketing term that Microsoft should officially retire. Every time Microsoft uses this term to sell a game, it almost always ends up being a bad thing. Gear's Judgment, I'm looking at you.

 

[Fahzgoolin]

I hate to be raining on everyone's parade all the time when it comes to Halo, but this squad stuff is in just about every FPS since the early Xbox 360 days. I'd much control all of the action solo then when a scripted event play out after tagging an enemy with my aiming reticle.

It has been nearly a decade since Xbox 360's release, and I don't feel like I'm alone when I say that this style of gameplay isn't fresh anymore. It might have been fun and innovative in Brothers in Arms: Road to Hill 30 (2005), but since then nearly every FPS has had a similar mechanic and it's just getting old.

It all comes down to how well it works. Yes, a lot of games have had the "target that enemy" mechanic, but rarely is it pulled off very well. From what I have seen, the squad seems to actually be effective.

Halo's greatness isn't just about one single mechanic or gimmick, it's a cohesive whole that works really well together. This new squad mechanic could add a lot to the replay value and unique approach of each player.

 

[HTupolev]

I'd bet that the interior areas are going to be larger than the outdoor ones. You don't have to worry about the fidelity of skyboxes for indoor areas, while you do for outdoors.

Really depends on how fancy the skies are. Throwing a few texture layers across a sky can sometimes be dirt cheap, compared with a complex ceiling which has to be lit and whatnot.

 

[Foolishfellow]

It all comes down to how well it works. Yes, a lot of games have had the "target that enemy" mechanic, but rarely is it pulled off very well. From what I have seen, the squad seems to actually be effective.

Halo's greatness isn't just about one single mechanic or gimmick, it's a cohesive whole that works really well together. This new squad mechanic could add a lot to the replay value and unique approach of each player.

I disagree, it's simply not an enjoyable mechanic for me. The squad can never be truly effective otherwise the game would just play itself, and it would never be designed as such.

Usually this squad based stuff is typically designed around the philosophy that they may not be particularly useful or accurate, but they'll occasionally do something cool. i.e. they'll do something scripted or occasionally save your ass from an already weakened opponent. I've yet to play a game where this isn't the case, and if you're expecting anything different from Halo 5 you're nuts.

 

[jem0208]

*See people flipping burgers over the new footage*

*Watches video*

Oh... it's another corridor space station mission. Okay I guess? I mean it looks fine, but I'm not exactly losing my shit over here.

Kinda was expecting some huge open environment like The Silent Cartographer based on the reactions.

Are you sure you watched the video?

Didn't look much like a corridor to me.

 

[SenjutsuSage]

I couldn't disagree with this more, Halo 3 is GOAT Halo. I don't understand how you can look at moments like the Scarab encounters, or levels like The Ark and the Covenant, and call it a step down from Halo 1/2 in terms of presentation. The earlier games are fantastic too, but Halo 3 hit a whole new level in terms of scale.

Scale, yes, but it was a big step back in ways that I felt the previous, and following, games much better.

I hate to be raining on everyone's parade all the time when it comes to Halo, but this squad stuff is in just about every FPS since the early Xbox 360 days. I'd much control all of the action solo then when a scripted event play out after tagging an enemy with my aiming reticle.

It has been nearly a decade since Xbox 360's release, and I don't feel like I'm alone when I say that this style of gameplay isn't fresh anymore. It might have been fun and innovative in Brothers in Arms: Road to Hill 30 (2005), but since then nearly every FPS has had a similar mechanic and it's just getting old.

Your mistake is in comparing Halo to every other FPS out there like it's the same thing. It isn't. Squad Commands like this in a Halo campaign is a very big fucking deal, and it represents a big change for the way Halo is played. A lot of other major FPS games have, at best, the illusion of actually commanding your troops. Most, if not all, of it is done automatically with very little interaction from the player, or through cutscenes. And showing another game with Squad Commands (which I know you probably will to try and prove a point) still doesn't make that game anything like Halo. This being a Halo game is what makes this a big deal. Not just that, for people who love the books, there's a level of meaning attached to blue team's involvement in Halo 5 that won't be there in quite the same way for other games. Halo's universe separates it from other first person shooters, period.

 

[SenjutsuSage]

double post.

 

[Karl2177]

Really depends on how fancy the skies are. Throwing a few texture layers across a sky can sometimes be dirt cheap, compared with a complex ceiling which has to be lit and whatnot.

That's fair. If 343i's previous skyboxes are anything to go by there will be a 3mb jpg slapped in the air.

 

[mchiodo1]

anyone have a link to the video or a download link, since all the ones that were up are now taken down... saw the video earlier but had to watch it on mute, everybody's talking about the music so i have to watch it again

 

[AllIsOneIsNone]

I disagree, it's simply not an enjoyable mechanic for me. The squad can never be truly effective otherwise the game would just play itself, and it would never be designed as such.

Usually this squad based stuff is typically designed around the philosophy that they may not be particularly useful or accurate, but they'll occasionally do something cool. i.e. they'll do something scripted or occasionally save your ass from an already weakened opponent. I've yet to play a game where this isn't the case, and if you're expecting anything different from Halo 5 you're nuts.

I saw the squad killing a lot of enemies in the gameplay. It doesn't have to be a game changer for it to be a nice addition. The question is what does it take away from the gameplay by being there (as long as the squad does its job and keeps up with you)?

 

[JaggedSac]

I don't think anyone is saying that this is necessarily a bad level. It just doesn't look particularly memorable when compared to levels in past games.

Yeah, doesnt hold a candle to the Library.

 

[kittens]

I regret watching.

Cuz now I can't wait. I hate feeling this excited this far in advance.

I feel ya. I think it's time for me to go on black out when it comes to campaign stuff.

 

[JaggedSac]

I saw the squad killing a lot of enemies in the gameplay. It doesn't have to be a game changer for it to be a nice addition. The question is what does it take away from the gameplay by being there (as long as the squad does its job and keeps up with you)?

Ideally, they would be killing just as many enemies in single player as 3 co-op partners would kill in multiplayer. That way, the levels are balanced for 4 competent players regardless of online or offline. I think that makes for better level design.

 

[Trup1aya]

I sure hope so. Still seems like an odd choice though, if there are big open campaign levels why not show them? It's pretty obvious to me that the big levels are what most Halo fans want.

Trying to understand 343i's marketing plan for this game is like trying to find the meaning of life...

This particular gameplay segment was also shown at e3, but to the press only... Clearly it would have garnered a much more positive response than the segment they chose to show... Why they went with something that makes Halo5 look like a corridor shooter is anyone's guess... But if you pay attention to the details, it seems like they've got a pretty awesome game brewing.

 

[jem0208]

Yeah, doesnt hold a candle to the Library.

I assume you're being sarcastic...?

 

[Fata1moose]

"Verticality" is a marketing term that Microsoft should officially retire. Every time Microsoft uses this term to sell a game, it almost always ends up being a bad thing. Gear's Judgment, I'm looking at you.

Or it's just an adjective I used to describe the combat when the player is above enemies who are then jump packing up to where he is. Your cynicism is probably right though.

 

[ViewtifulJC]

I assume you're being sarcastic...?

jem you are the worst b

 

[MightyHedgehog]

Watched just enough to appreciate the addition of clambering and ground pound being integrated into the Halo sandbox. I hope the AI commands are more meaningful than they seem in that video, even if it only really comes alive in Legendary.

 

[AllIsOneIsNone]

Ideally, they would be killing just as many enemies in single player as 3 co-op partners would kill in multiplayer. That way, the levels are balanced for 4 competent players regardless of online or offline. I think that makes for better level design.

That's very true. They could go even further and base the difficulty on how shitty your squadmates AI is and keep the enemy difficulty/density the same. Put it on easy and your squad are all Masterchief level badass, put it on Legendary and they're all grunt levels of stupid.

 

[Foolishfellow]

Scale, yes, but it was a big step back in ways that I felt the previous, and following, games much better.



Your mistake is in comparing Halo to every other FPS out there like it's the same thing. It isn't. Squad Commands like this in a Halo campaign is a very big fucking deal, and it represents a big change for the way Halo is played. A lot of other major FPS games have, at best, the illusion of actually commanding your troops. Most, if not all, of it is done automatically with very little interaction from the player, or through cutscenes. And showing another game with Squad Commands (which I know you probably will to try and prove a point) still doesn't make that game anything like Halo. This being a Halo game is what makes this a big deal. Not just that, for people who love the books, there's a level of meaning attached to blue team's involvement in Halo 5 that won't be there in quite the same way for other games. Halo's universe separates it from other first person shooters, period.

I completely agree that it represents a big change in the way Halo campaigns are played, however the change it represents is that it will be like most other FPS on the market.

Call of Duty has a squad mechanic. Battlefield has a squad mechanic. Gears has a squad mechanic. Kill Zone has a squad mechanic. And this is just a list that I came up with off the top of my head, I know there are more. There's your list.

I really don't understand the point you're trying to make, it's different for you because you're talking about how the squad will function within narrative (although it's also derivative of other game/movie plots). I'm talking about squad as a gameplay mechanic.

 

[jem0208]

jem you are the worst b

I guess The Library is memorable, but for all the wrong reasons.

Easily one of the worst levels in Halo.

 

[Fata1moose]

I guess The Library is memorable, but for all the wrong reasons.

Easily one of the worst levels in Halo.

I like the run and gun approach to the Library, Cortana on the other hand is a fairly shit level.

 

[Trup1aya]

Same case could be made for Halo 2's High Charity. It's still not what most people want. It's not just about level size, it's also about having multiple angles of approach and (optional) vehicular combat. The fact that we're this close to release and haven't seen a single level that looks like the prototypical ideal Halo level is very concerning.

Well, there are pretty clearly, multiple angles of approach... You can pretty easily see routes that the demoer chose not to take... And with co-op, that will presumably lead to some nice tactical options...

Secondly we should note that this particular level ends

Spoiler

in a space battle, with blue team battling from the ground and/or air

. The variety is present.

Also, let's not pretend that every level in Halo 1-3was like Silent Cartographer... It's always been a mix of linear, open, vehicular and "you decide" type levels...

 

[Foolishfellow]

I guess The Library is memorable, but for all the wrong reasons.

Easily one of the worst levels in Halo.

I used to hate The Library too, and it will never be my favorite level, but I still prefer it over most Halo 4 levels.

 

[kittens]

I guess The Library is memorable, but for all the wrong reasons.

Easily one of the worst levels in Halo.

It's the best Flood level there is. Which isn't saying much, but I genuinely love it.

 

[RedSparrows]

No way for me.

 

[AllIsOneIsNone]

No way for me.

Not even that one way with the thing?

Spoiler

huh?

 

[Fahzgoolin]

I disagree, it's simply not an enjoyable mechanic for me. The squad can never be truly effective otherwise the game would just play itself, and it would never be designed as such.

Usually this squad based stuff is typically designed around the philosophy that they may not be particularly useful or accurate, but they'll occasionally do something cool. i.e. they'll do something scripted or occasionally save your ass from an already weakened opponent. I've yet to play a game where this isn't the case, and if you're expecting anything different from Halo 5 you're nuts.

I have a dream that one day GAF posters won't miss your point entirely.

I have a dream that one day GAF posters don't shit on other people's excitement for Halo.

I have a dream that one day I can be a fan of Halo on GAF without constantly needing to hold my tongue from all the shit slinging.

I have a dream that one day HaloGaf will be allowed to enjoy themselves again.

I have a dream today!

~ Master Chief Jr.

I guess The Library is memorable, but for all the wrong reasons.

Easily one of the worst levels in Halo.

The Library is an intense romp through darkness and overwhelming odds. It's about feeling isolated in a mysterious alien dungeon. Just you, your guns, and a whole lot of horrific space zombies.

I love the Library and it's amazing in co-op.

 

[Dyson Industries]

I don't understand why people keep uploading to Youtube knowing they'll bend over for Microsoft immediately and remove the video. Use Liveleak, Vimeo and Dailymotion. It takes longer to remove.

 

[kittens]

I'm really curious to see how the squad / co-op campaign design and the ability to drop in / drop out will effect the campaign's popularity. I could see myself playing it a lot more than past campaigns due to those things alone.

I really hope 343 adds in Firefight DLC eventually. It's sad how much that mode has been neglected by both 343 and Bungie in Destiny.

 

[Exploratory]

I have a dream that one day GAF posters won't miss your point entirely.

I have a dream that one day GAF posters don't shit on other people's excitement for Halo.

I have a dream that one day I can be a fan of Halo on GAF without constantly needing to hold my tongue from all the shit slinging.

I have a dream that one day HaloGaf will be allowed to enjoy themselves again.

I have a dream.

Stop holding your tongue and call people out for their bs. As long as you aren't flinging personal insults and getting crazy bombastic or attacking people who are expressing legitimate criticism it's fine.

 

[Bread]

I will never understand the Halo 3 hate that seems to have accumulated over the last couple of years. I still think it's the most well rounded and feature rich Halo. There's some shitty weapon balancing, but I still prefer its multiplayer over 2, shitty BR and all.

seems like you understand it just fine!

the BR ruins any good that Halo 3 brings to the table.

 

[Defect]

New link? I would like to watch it.

 

[Einchy]

*See people flipping burgers over the new footage*

*Watches video*

Oh... it's another corridor space station mission. Okay I guess? I mean it looks fine, but I'm not exactly losing my shit over here.

Kinda was expecting some huge open environment like The Silent Cartographer based on the reactions.

343 keeps talking about these huge new levels that will be in Halo 5 and yet we're about a month away from release and all we've seen are two small levels.

I'll be extremely surprised if there actually are any big levels in the scale of Halo 1.

 

[krang]

I'm really curious to see how the squad / co-op campaign design and the ability to drop in / drop out will effect the campaign's popularity. I could see myself playing it a lot more than past campaigns due to those things alone.

I really hope 343 adds in Firefight DLC eventually. It's sad how much that mode has been neglected by both 343 and Bungie in Destiny.

I wouldn't hold your breath. 343i have themselves said that Warzone is there to partially fulfil FF.

 

[TheOddOne]

That's fair. If 343i's previous skyboxes are anything to go by there will be a 3mb jpg slapped in the air.

Oh god, you reminded me of Harvest and Wreckage.

Those were some Elzar tier JPG skyboxes.

 

[RedSparrows]

343 keeps talking about these huge new levels that will be in Halo 5 and yet we're about a month away from release and all we've seen are two small levels.

I'll be extremely surprised if there actually are any big levels in the scale of Halo 1.

The test comes when we play it. They can withold those levels if they so wish. The proof is only in the pudding.

 

[jem0208]

I used to hate The Library too, and it will never be my favorite level, but I still prefer it over most Halo 4 levels.

The lowest of the lows of H4's campaign don't come even close to how bad the library is.

It's the best Flood level there is. Which isn't saying much, but I genuinely love it.

Eh, I prefer 343 Guilty Spark. The atmosphere is far better.

The Library is an intense romp through darkness and overwhelming odds. It's about feeling isolated in a mysterious alien dungeon. Just you, your guns, and a whole lot of horrific space zombies.

I love the Library and it's amazing in co-op.

It's one long slog through ridiculously repetitive environments and dull encounters against extremely boring enemies. Just so bad...

Also HaloGAF is dead.

Spoiler

Long live HaloENT.

 

[sir_dany12]

New link? I would like to watch it.

This.