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Uncharted 4 New Character Trailer: Nadine Ross (Laura Bailey)

P

perineumlick

Member
I think people are overreacting; it's just voice work. If it was a visual role I would agree, but black people don't have an exclusive speech pattern. You have to know which battles to fight; this one is stretching it quite a bit.
 
F

Footos22

Member
Alienous said:
I could see that being the case. But, then, how many black actors got to read for Nathan "Johnny Knoxville" Drake, or Sully, or Elena?

It tends to be a one-sided thing.
Click to expand...

Does it matter, its voice acting. your not supposed to see the person behind the character on screen. Did anyone complain when clementine was voiced by a white girl?
 
H

HMD

Member
plasmawave said:
The beauty of VO and mocap is that people can play ANY characters. Black people can play white people. Asian people can play black people. White people can play asian people.
It's where as long as you can act, your race doesn't matter at all.
It's really not that difficult.
Click to expand...

Agreed, VA's looking like their characters is a recent thing because of mocap and celeb status, it's usually only about the best fit for the characters regardless of the actor's body/race/gender, most children in video games are played by adult women. This shouldn't be an issue and I'm surprised that people find it an issue.
 
Drac84

Drac84

Member
SomedayTheFire said:
Representation is important, characters should be played by people of their ethnicity.
Click to expand...

I disagree. The role should go for whoever does the best performance. Dave Fennoy absolutely nailed the voice of Blue Beard in TWAU. The idea that he should be ineligible from auditioning for that role because he's not the same ethnicity as his fictional character is backwards, unimaginative, and dismissive of the talent that actors in this industry possess.

This isn't limited to video games. This attitude is also found in film. People rage that the role of Heimdall didn't go to a white person. It doesn't matter to them that the role goes to an actor like Idris Elba who puts in a great performance. I say bring on a black James Bond if the actor nails his audition, bring on Scarlet Johansson in Ghost in the Shell if she was the best person for the role. Don't be constrained by myopic, narrow minded people that can't see past the colour of skin.
 
J

Jobbs

Banned
Are people really upset that a white actress is playing a black character? Seriously? Really? Seriously?

One of the fun things about making games and casting voice actors is that anyone can be anyone. The imagination is the limit. This is bullshit.
 
S

Stone Ocean

Member
perineumlick said:
I think people are overreacting; it's just voice work. If it was a visual role I would agree, but black people don't have an exclusive speech pattern. You have to know which battles to fight; this one is stretching it quite a bit.
Click to expand...
It's such a silly rabbit role to go down through. Was she modeled by a black person? Mocap actor was black? Animator? Where does it end?

Not everything needs to be a social issue, people.
 
S

SomedayTheFire

Member
Ashes said:
Please refrain from insults. I understand that you are passionate about this. I am simply trying to understand your argument.
Do you think black voice actors should get more black animated character roles only?
Click to expand...

It's not an insult, it was a question. I explained the problem already. Black people and other POC are woefully underrepresented in all forms of media, TV, movies and especially gaming. There is a major problem in these industries that even when a company goes out of their way to include a black character, they're not getting a black actor to play them. In many years gone by TV and movies have included black characters, played by white people. Unfortunately this is not a phenomenon that has disappeared, as we can see from recent Japanese adverts. Before I go on, please note I am not saying the casting of Laura Bailey is akin to Blackface, before you get that idea.

Moving on to more modern and western reasons. There was a film recently called Exodus, about Egyptians and their gods. The major parties of this film were all white. Why? Are Egyptians white? Sure they descend from the Caucasoid race, but they're not the same complexion as a Welshman. Non white actors and actresses are continually being passed up for roles, due to studios picking white people ahead of them. There is a dearth of opportunities for non white people in the media, because studios would rather go for "names" instead.

This brings us to gaming, and voice acting in general. Voice acting seems to be a very insular media. This was highlighted when the Powerpuff Girls VA's were changed. The "popular" old VA's complained on twitter to an embarrassing degree and getting a huge reponse and backing from fans and other people in the VA community. This was potentially very harmful for the new VA's because they didn't have a "name", they didn't have much history in the media, they were new and they got their first big break, which was closely followed by big name VA's calling them out for getting a shot.

That on a superficial level does not have much to do with the topic at hand but it does show how insular the VA community is, it's hard to get a shot. It's even harder to get a clean shot at something without big names in the VA community chiming in. The big names in VA can abuse their power to get roles. This then in turn exacerbates the tough position non white VA's are in. They already have the history of black acotrs and actresses being passed up for white characters and the have that kind of industry to wade through.

Basically my point is there is a dearth of black or non white roles in media, and when they do come up they can be given to white people. This to me is unacceptable. Media needs more representation, we need more than jsut white characters. Uncharted having a non Pirate black character is good. Having a white person voice them is not.
 
N

Nibel

Member
1. this thread is a mess
2. seems like they've created a "cinematic" fighting system and I really hope they know what they are doing

ninjablade said:
Looks fun, can't wait to fight that chick up into the game, lol.
Click to expand...

So you enjoy punching women, that's a new low ninjablade but I'm not surprised tbh
 
H

hesido

Member
Best curly hair.

It'd OK for Naughty Dog to choose a black actor for the job, it's OK for them to choose Laura Bailey.
 
J

Jobbs

Banned
idonteven said:
damn the outrage...

i'm pretty sure if it was the other way around nobody would care
Click to expand...

In my little indie game, a white character is voiced by a black actress... Because I thought she was good for the role. I never thought twice about the ethnicity of the actor in a voiceover part. Who the FUCK cares.

Less discussion of this and more discussion of the gif I spent 20 minutes making for a joke reference probably almost no one understands.
 
S

Stone Ocean

Member
SomedayTheFire said:
It's not an insult, it was a question. I explained the problem already. Black people and other POC are woefully underrepresented in all forms of media, TV, movies and especially gaming. There is a major problem in these industries that even when a company goes out of their way to include a black character, they're not getting a black actor to play them. In many years gone by TV and movies have included black characters, played by white people. Unfortunately this is not a phenomenon that has disappeared, as we can see from recent Japanese adverts. Before I go on, please note I am not saying the casting of Laura Bailey is akin to Blackface, before you get that idea.

Moving on to more modern and western reasons. There was a film recently called Exodus, about Egyptians and their gods. The major parties of this film were all white. Why? Are Egyptians white? Sure they descend from the Caucasoid race, but they're not the same complexion as a Welshman. Non white actors and actresses are continually being passed up for roles, due to studios picking white people ahead of them. There is a dearth of opportunities for non white people in the media, because studios would rather go for "names" instead.

This brings us to gaming, and voice acting in general. Voice acting seems to be a very insular media. This was highlighted when the Powerpuff Girls VA's were changed. The "popular" old VA's complained on twitter to an embarrassing degree and getting a huge reponse and backing from fans and other people in the VA community. This was potentially very harmful for the new VA's because they didn't have a "name", they didn't have much history in the media, they were new and they got their first big break, which was closely followed by big name VA's calling them out for getting a shot.

That on a superficial level does not have much to do with the topic at hand but it does show how insular the VA community is, it's hard to get a shot. It's even harder to get a clean shot at something without big names in the VA community chiming in. The big names in VA can abuse their power to get roles. This then in turn exacerbates the tough position non white VA's are in. They already have the history of black acotrs and actresses being passed up for white characters and the have that kind of industry to wade through.

Basically my point is there is a dearth of black or non white roles in media, and when they do come up they can be given to white people. This to me is unacceptable. Media needs more representation, we need more than jsut white characters. Uncharted having a non Pirate black character is good. Having a white person voice them is not.
Click to expand...
That sounds more like an industry problem than a representation problem. The VA industry is closed off to anyone wanting to start, not just POCs.
 
S

SolidSnakex

Member
SomedayTheFire said:
That on a superficial level does not have much to do with the topic at hand but it does show how insular the VA community is, it's hard to get a shot. It's even harder to get a clean shot at something without big names in the VA community chiming in. The big names in VA can abuse their power to get roles. This then in turn exacerbates the tough position non white VA's are in. They already have the history of black acotrs and actresses being passed up for white characters and the have that kind of industry to wade through.

Basically my point is there is a dearth of black or non white roles in media, and when they do come up they can be given to white people. This to me is unacceptable. Media needs more representation, we need more than jsut white characters. Uncharted having a non Pirate black character is good. Having a white person voice them is not.
Click to expand...

While it may be insular, one of the beautiful things about voice acting is that it's the one form of acting where your gender and race really don't matter (as plasmawave noted earlier). Kratos is a white character, yet he's voiced by a black man. Naruto, Luffy, Goku are some of the most popular characters ever, they're also all male yet all of their voice actors are women. Phil Lamarr receives a ton of roles in which he's not portraying someone that's black. Clementine in The Walking Dead was played by a white woman. None of those people would've even been able to tryout for their roles if the casting directors followed the belief some seem to have in that you should only portray characters of your own race/gender.
 
Auto_aim1

Auto_aim1

MeisaMcCaffrey
The writing is exceptional as usual. Did this scene remind anyone of John Wick. That fight in the room?
 
T

Tatsumi Oga

Banned
It definitely is true that ND are just wizards when it comes to understanding how graphics work. No other game, absolutely none looks this amazing. As great as Ryse still looks now and how great QB will look....this is out of this world. And i thought Rise of the TR was at times very impressive, sure it is now....but in March another game will take that crown.

It's crazy tbh.
 
P

PartTimeWarrior

Banned
ViewtifulJC said:
I mean I like Laura Bailey as much as the next person but they really didn't have no black voice actresses huh
5I5s8.png


couldn't even spring for Merle "Alex Vance" Dandridge? She was in your last game did ya'll lose her number
fantasia2.png




fantasia2.png
fantasia2.png
fantasia2.png
Click to expand...

I wish we could ban coli smilies from gaf, this shit is annoying
 
G

Ghost Slayer

Member
Tatsumi Oga said:
It definitely is true that ND are just wizards when it comes to understanding how graphics work. No other game, absolutely none looks this amazing. As great as Ryse still looks now and how great QB will look....this is out of this world. And i thought Rise of the TR was at times very impressive, sure it is now....but in March another game will take that crown.

It's crazy tbh.
Click to expand...

Well ND has a team in their studio that response for PS4 development tools so it's not surprised that they know how to push it to limit :3
 
Y

YankeeDonB

Member
Motion capture and detail are definitely impressive. Somewhat uncanny valley for me though. Not just the faces but the movements too. They have all these great and realistic little details, but the gross movement seems somehow floaty and low-friction. May be just this scene, didn't notice it in the earlier demo footage.

As for white actors portraying black characters, I do think it's a bit odd. No not everything needs to be over-analyzed, but with this level of visual fidelity and this degree of investment and focus on character acting it does begin getting uncomfortably close to the old Hollywood practice of having white stars in makeup play POC. Not a major issue, but elicits an eye roll.
 
S

SomTervo

Member
SomedayTheFire said:
It's not an insult, it was a question. I explained the problem already. Black people and other POC are woefully underrepresented in all forms of media, TV, movies and especially gaming. There is a major problem in these industries that even when a company goes out of their way to include a black character, they're not getting a black actor to play them. In many years gone by TV and movies have included black characters, played by white people. Unfortunately this is not a phenomenon that has disappeared, as we can see from recent Japanese adverts. Before I go on, please note I am not saying the casting of Laura Bailey is akin to Blackface, before you get that idea.

Moving on to more modern and western reasons. There was a film recently called Exodus, about Egyptians and their gods. The major parties of this film were all white. Why? Are Egyptians white? Sure they descend from the Caucasoid race, but they're not the same complexion as a Welshman. Non white actors and actresses are continually being passed up for roles, due to studios picking white people ahead of them. There is a dearth of opportunities for non white people in the media, because studios would rather go for "names" instead.

This brings us to gaming, and voice acting in general. Voice acting seems to be a very insular media. This was highlighted when the Powerpuff Girls VA's were changed. The "popular" old VA's complained on twitter to an embarrassing degree and getting a huge reponse and backing from fans and other people in the VA community. This was potentially very harmful for the new VA's because they didn't have a "name", they didn't have much history in the media, they were new and they got their first big break, which was closely followed by big name VA's calling them out for getting a shot.

That on a superficial level does not have much to do with the topic at hand but it does show how insular the VA community is, it's hard to get a shot. It's even harder to get a clean shot at something without big names in the VA community chiming in. The big names in VA can abuse their power to get roles. This then in turn exacerbates the tough position non white VA's are in. They already have the history of black acotrs and actresses being passed up for white characters and the have that kind of industry to wade through.

Basically my point is there is a dearth of black or non white roles in media, and when they do come up they can be given to white people. This to me is unacceptable. Media needs more representation, we need more than jsut white characters. Uncharted having a non Pirate black character is good. Having a white person voice them is not.
Click to expand...

I think I agree with all of this.

The only time it's OK to have an actor who is not the race/gender of the character they're playing is when it is a thematic point of the work. EG Cloud 9, where in the second act all of the actors swap roles, so the husband is played by the woman who played the wife in the first act, etc.

However there is a slightly grey area when it comes to voice acting and motion capture. Because in many cases (not every case) you can't tell what race a person is based on their voice or body shape. And if there is no physical difference (at least 99% similarity) between certain aspects of two human beings of different ethnicities, then why do other aspects of the ethnicity act as a marker for what is or isn't representative - ie who they can and can't voice?

TL;DR: in cinema/TV, there is a marked difference between white and black actors, so it's problematic to cast white actors in black roles, etc. However in aural/non-visual mediums, there is often no difference between white and black voices. So arguably it is a prejudice to cast people based on this, when it's actually an even footing.

Tough debate, though.
 
A

Alienous

Member
The casting hit me as strange, but moreso because they didn't pick a South African actress. I suppose Salim was like that too, though.
 
T

Twookie

Member
this thread is quite something, good lord

on topic:

I love the design of this character, especially how she is not a generic scrawny defenseless girl, but a woman with muscles and realistic bodyfigure

can't wait for this game honestly
 
B

Blackthorn

"hello?" "this is vagina"
I'm sure if Naughty Dog had felt a black actor would have suited the role better, they would have chosen one.

DappYfq.jpg


While I get why situations like this are a problem in a broader context, in this specific incidence I fail to see an issue.
 
A

Alienous

Member
KORNdoggy said:
i think it does. it only lasts a split second though before your brain catches up. but there are very small instances where it looked real.
Click to expand...

Not one moment, for me. It might be that environment but it didn't look convincingly real to me for even a second.
 
K

Kinyou

Member
It's relatively normal in the VA world that white actors play black characters, black actors white characters etc. etc. Why is it a big deal now?
 
A

Alienous

Member
Twookie said:
this thread is quite something, good lord

on topic:

I love the design of this character, especially how she is not a generic scrawny defenseless girl, but a woman with muscles and realistic bodyfigure

can't wait for this game honestly
Click to expand...

I dislike the character for those same reasons. The flirty banter + "Oh wait, she can actually kick my ass" + 'Glad I can get out of these stupid high-heels and fight' thing is so done.

It's that typical, trope-ish way of showing her to be not your ordinary girl.

Maybe it'll make more sense in context, but I liked the character more as the military leader Nadine appeared to be in the concept art.
 
O

Owensboro

Member
Hahahahahah. Hahaha. Oh god guys, stop it, you're killing me. What's next? Mario should only be voiced by an actual Italian? Kratos can only be voiced by an actual Greek and not a black man? Can you believe they have grown adults do the voices of kids! How sick. I was completely offended when they had Jonathan Taylor Thomas be an African Lion.
 
F

FunkyPajamas

Member
Kojirospath said:
James Earl Jones was Darth Vader...
Click to expand...

Keith David voiced Goliath in Gargoyles and The Arbiter in Halo 2/etc.
Owensboro said:
Hahahahahah. Hahaha. Oh god guys, stop it, you're killing me. What's next? Mario should only be voiced by an actual Italian? Kratos can only be voiced by an actual Greek and not a black man? Can you believe they have grown adults do the voices of kids! How sick. I was completely offended when they had Jonathan Tayor Thomas be an African Lion.
Click to expand...
I LOL'd.
 
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