roadrunn3r
Member
That makes sense. As always in these type of threads UWP defenders are hmm.. not that much into PC gaming, they care a lot about MS though.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Kotaku: 98% of PC Copies of Rise of the Tomb Raider Were Bought on Steam
- Thread starter dancrane212
- Start date
That makes sense. As always in these type of threads UWP defenders are hmm.. not that much into PC gaming, they care a lot about MS though.
8-Bit Sunset
Banned
Windows 10 store.
They didn't listen to us the gamer's and now we have spoken through our wallets!
Boycott Windows 10 store y'all, til they give in and release on other stores!
E3 will be interesting, to say the least.
They didn't listen to us the gamer's and now we have spoken through our wallets!
Boycott Windows 10 store y'all, til they give in and release on other stores!
E3 will be interesting, to say the least.
8-Bit Sunset
Banned
Why not just release on both rather than having to go through the Windows Store!
I want my bank details spread across as few stores as possible.
Not surprised at all.
The Windows Store is incredibly feature deficient compared to Steam, and less stable than Steam. Your game library, social features, recorded clips/screenshots are in the separate Xbox app, and adjustments to your Xbox controller require the Xbox Accessories app...these could all just be tabs.
The damn store doesn't even run in the background or load at startup, you can't designate separate drives or folders where you want your game installs to go (just a global setting), downloads don't even estimate the time they'll take to finish, and I had to go to the Quantum Break page to enable an update instead of it just updating automatically in the background. The categories, recommendations, genre tags, and interface for it all is a joke of minimalist nonsense. Game pages only have screenshots, no streaming video to see what the actual gameplay experience or story is like.
The problem with Windows Store isn't that it's not as Steam, but that it's not even as good as uPlay.
The Windows Store is incredibly feature deficient compared to Steam, and less stable than Steam. Your game library, social features, recorded clips/screenshots are in the separate Xbox app, and adjustments to your Xbox controller require the Xbox Accessories app...these could all just be tabs.
The damn store doesn't even run in the background or load at startup, you can't designate separate drives or folders where you want your game installs to go (just a global setting), downloads don't even estimate the time they'll take to finish, and I had to go to the Quantum Break page to enable an update instead of it just updating automatically in the background. The categories, recommendations, genre tags, and interface for it all is a joke of minimalist nonsense. Game pages only have screenshots, no streaming video to see what the actual gameplay experience or story is like.
The problem with Windows Store isn't that it's not as Steam, but that it's not even as good as uPlay.
It's the usual M.O. in these threads.
I'm sorry I didn't join the echo chamber. Nothing more productive in a forum than a bunch of people saying how they all agree about how much something is shit.
What the store is now does not mean it will remain as is. Software can change. So go ahead keep "shitting" on me, I'm not affended I don't usually align with the negatvity of the internet so I'm used to it.
We've been here before. We heard literally this same justification for Microsoft's fucking garbage Games for Windows Live/Marketplace service last generation. Considering that we're dealing with the same company, one that already tried its hand at the PC digital distribution thing, I don't think that Microsoft does or should get the benefit of the doubt in this situation.
They've had a decade to shape up. They haven't. It's long past time to write this shit off.
Also, they aren't competing with Steam as it was when it launched 10 years ago. They're competing with Steam as it is now. And it's not as if Microsoft is asking less of the consumer in order to offset the fact that their stuff is still kind of busted "at the beginning of their service", they're asking for more - more restrictions, more control in their hands and out of the consumer's- and completely ignoring the standards of the platform.
And while competition in general is a good thing, Microsoft's particular brand of competition sucks. You want to support competition? Buy from Origin. Buy from GOG. Buy from Battle.net. Buy from Uplay. Buy from Amazon, or Green Man, or Gamersgate, or Itch.io, or whatever. There's no shortage of places to buy PC games.
You don't have to go buy shitty spoiled food from a mom and pop store just because you don't like Wal-Mart, when there's five other grocery stores on the block.
KingGreasy
Member
Windows Store or Xbox on Windows have yet to give any good enough reason for people to switch. I don't care for cross buy with the Xbox One or Windows 10 mobile. That hasn't resulted in many games showing up on PC that otherwise wouldn't have and I'm guessing most PC gamers don't have an Xbox One as well. No ones making desktop ARM processors so I don't care about portability of applications between x86 and ARM. I have no reason to buy games off the Windows Store. UWP is more appealing to those with Windows mobile phones hoping to get apps by piggybacking off desktop and Xbox.
On Steam or GOG I know that if I buy a game on Windows, if a Linux or Mac version comes out, I can play on those platforms. With GOG I know it's DRM free. Origin supports Macs as well. With Steam and Battle.net they're the services with the most history, Valves Steam being the one with that isn't just for their games. Steam has the most users. It plays well with other desktop utilities. The community is primarily on Steam.
Windows Store has GFWL baggage. It's like their mobile phones. Why would I buy into their service when it comes off as halfhearted? Forza games are supposed to come out on desktop as well now. I'll wait until Forza 7 and Horizon 3 come out same day for desktop as Xbox. I'll wait for when Halo 6, Gears of War 4, and Fable 4 come out same day desktop and console. Then I'll start feeling like this time Microsoft is actually providing a service that won't die and won't burn me.
I don't care what good Microsft has done with C#, Visual Studio, SQL Server, Azure and Office. They're history there is good but they're history in PC gaming is not blank and it's bad. It's GFWL with a paywall to play online and then it's eventual abandonment. It's Halo 2 years late and tied to Vista and GFWL. It's GFWL install limits and annoyances in games like Fallout 3 when it would just crash or fail to connect to their service. It's making DX versions tied to OS upgrades. They're fundamentally tied to the operating system that's why but OpenGL and Vulkan aren't so I don't consider that an excuse to absolve the criticism. Black and White is dead, Flight Simulator is pretty much dead as is Age of Empires. FASA is dead. Ensemble is dead. They have consistently failed to provide incentive to PC gamers to support their stores. Their history of angering PC gamers is longer than Ubisoft. Of course people aren't going to rush to their store.
UWP fails to give appeal to developers. Windows Store isn't being used and like OSX's store has to compete with a fully featured internet browser. Windows mobile doesn't even offer the best mobile Microsoft experience and the last flagships they pushed out didn't even get a big marketing push. Windows on mobile phones has been near silent for two years. An Xbox is primarily a gaming and video consumption device. Being strong in the console space doesn't help for the vast majority of applications and the PS4 sells better. The appeal of UWP applications is their portability on Windows 10 across multiple form factors yet the phone is floundering, the Xbox is a game console, and on desktop people would rather use their internet browser and other stores. For portable applications people would probably just continue with C# sans UWP, Java, Python, or web apps.
It's not that PC gamers aren't willing to buy from other stores or use other clients. There's Battle.net, GOG, and Origin. Before then there was Impulse but Stardock didn't want to be a digital retailer and Gamestop bought it to eventually do nothing with it. Yet Steam is the only one that has nearly every new release. Battle.net doesn't even offer non Blizzard games. Origin is the closest thing to a competitor yet they too have a really limited catalogue of non-EA games. GOG's strength in being DRM free keeps most new releases away. If Blizzard decided they wanted to compete with as a storefront with Steam I'm sure Battle.net can provide a strong fight. World of Warcraft, Hearthstone, Overwatch, Diablo, Heroes of the Strom, and Starcraft provide a huge userbase in that client.
edit: Also the Windows 8 store has been around for years and it never got better. It got a better UI eventually but developer support never ticked up. We're talking years of developers wasting money to develop Zune HD, Windows Phone 7, Windows Phone 8, and Windows 8 applications with little show of growth in comparison to normal desktop applications, web apps, Android, and IOS. I don't see how Windows 10 is going to improve things when it's another reset from Windows 8/Phone 8 yet has once again floundered out the gate. This isn't Steam in 2004 with no competition. This is 2016 with plenty of competition that continues to make them look like a startup that would have folded within a year of release.
On Steam or GOG I know that if I buy a game on Windows, if a Linux or Mac version comes out, I can play on those platforms. With GOG I know it's DRM free. Origin supports Macs as well. With Steam and Battle.net they're the services with the most history, Valves Steam being the one with that isn't just for their games. Steam has the most users. It plays well with other desktop utilities. The community is primarily on Steam.
Windows Store has GFWL baggage. It's like their mobile phones. Why would I buy into their service when it comes off as halfhearted? Forza games are supposed to come out on desktop as well now. I'll wait until Forza 7 and Horizon 3 come out same day for desktop as Xbox. I'll wait for when Halo 6, Gears of War 4, and Fable 4 come out same day desktop and console. Then I'll start feeling like this time Microsoft is actually providing a service that won't die and won't burn me.
I don't care what good Microsft has done with C#, Visual Studio, SQL Server, Azure and Office. They're history there is good but they're history in PC gaming is not blank and it's bad. It's GFWL with a paywall to play online and then it's eventual abandonment. It's Halo 2 years late and tied to Vista and GFWL. It's GFWL install limits and annoyances in games like Fallout 3 when it would just crash or fail to connect to their service. It's making DX versions tied to OS upgrades. They're fundamentally tied to the operating system that's why but OpenGL and Vulkan aren't so I don't consider that an excuse to absolve the criticism. Black and White is dead, Flight Simulator is pretty much dead as is Age of Empires. FASA is dead. Ensemble is dead. They have consistently failed to provide incentive to PC gamers to support their stores. Their history of angering PC gamers is longer than Ubisoft. Of course people aren't going to rush to their store.
UWP fails to give appeal to developers. Windows Store isn't being used and like OSX's store has to compete with a fully featured internet browser. Windows mobile doesn't even offer the best mobile Microsoft experience and the last flagships they pushed out didn't even get a big marketing push. Windows on mobile phones has been near silent for two years. An Xbox is primarily a gaming and video consumption device. Being strong in the console space doesn't help for the vast majority of applications and the PS4 sells better. The appeal of UWP applications is their portability on Windows 10 across multiple form factors yet the phone is floundering, the Xbox is a game console, and on desktop people would rather use their internet browser and other stores. For portable applications people would probably just continue with C# sans UWP, Java, Python, or web apps.
It's not that PC gamers aren't willing to buy from other stores or use other clients. There's Battle.net, GOG, and Origin. Before then there was Impulse but Stardock didn't want to be a digital retailer and Gamestop bought it to eventually do nothing with it. Yet Steam is the only one that has nearly every new release. Battle.net doesn't even offer non Blizzard games. Origin is the closest thing to a competitor yet they too have a really limited catalogue of non-EA games. GOG's strength in being DRM free keeps most new releases away. If Blizzard decided they wanted to compete with as a storefront with Steam I'm sure Battle.net can provide a strong fight. World of Warcraft, Hearthstone, Overwatch, Diablo, Heroes of the Strom, and Starcraft provide a huge userbase in that client.
edit: Also the Windows 8 store has been around for years and it never got better. It got a better UI eventually but developer support never ticked up. We're talking years of developers wasting money to develop Zune HD, Windows Phone 7, Windows Phone 8, and Windows 8 applications with little show of growth in comparison to normal desktop applications, web apps, Android, and IOS. I don't see how Windows 10 is going to improve things when it's another reset from Windows 8/Phone 8 yet has once again floundered out the gate. This isn't Steam in 2004 with no competition. This is 2016 with plenty of competition that continues to make them look like a startup that would have folded within a year of release.
grosvenor_92
Member
Considering the bad rap the window store had/has I'm not surprised by this
Windows 10 is much better than the crap that came before it, but still completely lacking as an OS. That is why I have Macs everywhere in the house - a moron could use with little issue. It's getting closer and closer to me not bothering with gaming anymore at this time outside of retro gaming on my phone. I love my PS4, but I just don't have the wish to sit in front of the TV anymore for extended periods of time.
I game with Steam on my laptop, because it is simply convenient - too bad most of the games still require Windows to run decently. Maybe I'm just getting too old for gaming these days. Too much else going on in my life
I game with Steam on my laptop, because it is simply convenient - too bad most of the games still require Windows to run decently. Maybe I'm just getting too old for gaming these days. Too much else going on in my life
ThaiGrocer
Member
I am the 2%. Ukraine forever!
The entire experience is janky, at best, and devs treat you like an afterthought once Steam customers are taken care of. It will be my first and last purchase from Windows Store.
The entire experience is janky, at best, and devs treat you like an afterthought once Steam customers are taken care of. It will be my first and last purchase from Windows Store.
Amauri14
Member
Of course they were. I know Microsoft is trying to improve their store front, but with "features" like this that for the moment are only part their beta, instead of been there right from the the beginning really makes me doubt if they are even trying.
You know, I actually wanted to try, not to buy from it, just try to play Forza that it is free, from that store, but I don't have space on drive C) while I have around 1.68 TB free on drive D) and another 1.00 TB on drive T) so even though at that time I had way more than enough space for that game their store didn't have the "feature" that allows me to download games directly to another drive unit.
I know that they are trying to improve, but I believe that at least one person didn't buy that game from the store due to lack of space on drive C). But I also believe that the fact that everything there is an UWP is a much greater factor, because even if they improve that platform, it will never be as flexible as an Win32 application.
You know, I actually wanted to try, not to buy from it, just try to play Forza that it is free, from that store, but I don't have space on drive C) while I have around 1.68 TB free on drive D) and another 1.00 TB on drive T) so even though at that time I had way more than enough space for that game their store didn't have the "feature" that allows me to download games directly to another drive unit.
I know that they are trying to improve, but I believe that at least one person didn't buy that game from the store due to lack of space on drive C). But I also believe that the fact that everything there is an UWP is a much greater factor, because even if they improve that platform, it will never be as flexible as an Win32 application.
BleedOrange
Banned
Because for most people playing a game they want to play is priority #1?
Some prefer to avoid Steam DRM and go DRM Free with GOG.
The new feature is a more user friendly way to do it, but you can select your drive right now.
Just go to System > Storage > New apps save to: [choose the drive of your choice]
That's been there for a long time.
Pathfinder
Member
Some of us are gamers first, and activists second.
Another vote here for GOG. I like open platforms and I don't mind paying more for that privilege.
Amauri14
Member
Is that so? Well shit, I guess I was not paying enough attention.
Well is time to try FORZA!
UWP still suck though.
In what way is GOG an open platform?
Lactose_Intolerant
Member
packy34
Member
Origin and GOG are fine.
GOG is DRM free and easy to use.
Origin actually caused Valve to make a number of much-needed pro-consumer changes, such as refunds.
there's no reason to ONLY buy on steam and boycott something like origins. Steam has security breaches and shit like 2x a year. It's ridiculous
GOG is also superior. If a game is on GOG and steam id buy it on GOG in a heartbeat.
8-Bit Sunset
Banned
Lol.Microsoft's reaction to reading the article.
But I reckon that they still won't listen.
So more like:
KinofChaos
Banned
Citation needed.
Not at all surprising, I can't imagine anyone choosing the Windows 10 store over Steam unless they could get a significant discount on the Win 10 store.
I feel really bad for Remedy, I imagine the vast majority of Windows 10 copies of Quantum Break are the free ones you got for buying the game digitally on Xbox One. They probably could of made a decent amount of money if Microsoft had let them release a Direct X 11 version on Steam.
I feel really bad for Remedy, I imagine the vast majority of Windows 10 copies of Quantum Break are the free ones you got for buying the game digitally on Xbox One. They probably could of made a decent amount of money if Microsoft had let them release a Direct X 11 version on Steam.
There are places where EA/Origin takes a massive shit on Steam, such as instant customer service.
Once did a live chat, and had the CS agent inject a preorder weapon directly into my account. Shit was bananas fam.
Microsoft's reaction to reading the article.
wow
is she having a stroke and the set piece falls on her head...?
no fucks given
rip
chromatic9
Member
Wonder what the percentage is if you exclude India and Ukraine codes.
gog is terrible
You are literally the first person I've seen say this. Care to elaborate or are all your feelings on the subject summed up in three words?
For the games about 2-5 years down the line when those newer tablets can play them. "Buy once, play anywhere." Which is a nice idea, but the restrictions hurt the UWP initiative more than anything.
You're forgetting those "generic apps" aren't even on the Store. I can't buy Instagram and run it off PC/Windows 10 because Instagram wants to be completely mobile only and most mobile developers are the same to where a bunch of mobile apps like kik aren't available on Windows 10 mobile or PC.
genuinely interested in what makes you think this
GhostTrick
Banned
I share this sentiment. While I'm all for the DRM free, I dont like GOG's policies in term of catalog and the way they're curating their store. Many indies have been rejected because there wasnt sale potential. Cook Serve Delicious has been rejected before and GOG also rejected Degica and CAVE Shmups. So yes, GOG isnt the kind of model I'd like to see gaining traction.
We probably are going to have to wait a couple of years until Microsoft gives up pushing the W10 store like they did with GfWL until we see Quantum Break on Steam.
Microsoft's reaction to reading the article.
wtf did he look at her and then sit back down looking forward? lmao
GOG is good in concept, but they have absolutely terrible curation.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
What the hell?
As someone who has been a pretty loyal GOG customer since jump, I'm pretty curious why you would say that.
GhostTrick
Banned
JoeyJungle
Banned
I think were thinking something along the lines of "More storefronts are always better for publishers/devs, and we'll accept any shit! Developers will flock to us!"
Their store is a total mess, and the whole UWP thing is probably unnecessary extra work that no non-MS funded dev will want to put in. In the early-ish 360 era the store would probably be doing pretty well (PC ports were fairly rare, 3rd party 360 exclusives were somewhat common due to PS3 being difficult to developer for. A shortcut to a PC port would probably be pretty appealing during that time), but I just don't see any reason for devs to put in extra work to develop a separate version for a storefront nobody uses.
down 2 orth
Member
orthodoxy1095
Banned
Steam can serve that purpose nicely. And GOG can be a curated storefront.
Lord knows I don't enjoy using the Steam storefront anymore.
Similar threads
- Locked
- Poll