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[Pathfinder]

Downloading is not the only way to get a video file but also how long will that cap be 1TB & how long will 50 - 100GB be a lot? I remember when 1GB was a lot & now it's nothing.

You're absolutely right. How long will that cap be 1TB before Comcast, in their infinite wisdom, decides to lower it to 500GB because they feel 1TB is too generous?

Not a strong argument at all for streaming vs. physical media.

 

[Head.spawn]

You're absolutely right. How long will that cap be 1TB before Comcast decides to lower it to 500GB?

Not a strong argument at all for streaming vs. physical media.

It was 300mb, then they removed it while they were experimenting with the market, then they put 1Tb.

I highly doubt they're going to ever low it again.

 

[Pathfinder]

It was 300mb, then they removed it while they were experimenting with the market, then they put 1Tb.

I highly doubt they're going to ever low it again.

This is Comcast we're talking about. Don't think for a second that they won't start introducing tiers.

 

[Panajev2001a]

If you're paying someone to calibrate your TV you're not watching your movies on your games console! You're buying a 4K Oppo or Panasonic

TV calibration, THX certified sticker and all, is about £230 and you may get it cheaper looking around. When you are spending £900+ for a TV, it may be worth it as what you get out of the box is usually not nearly close to what you want it to be... There are also a lot of suggested calibration settings from trusted review sites, reference images, and guides on DIY calibration which can already help things out a lot.

PS4, Xbox One, etc... are all good Blu-Ray players enough that the bottleneck will be your A/V receiver, your TV, and your speakers. Dolby Atmos and DTS-X support are likely just a FW update away too.
PS3's Blu-Ray player and SACD support classified it as a high-end player whose 1.5x playback with full video and audio quality playback and constant stream of upgrades made it one of the best Blu-Ray players around... Sony knows that dedicated Blu-Ray players allow you to overcharge... I mean have higher profit margins and decided it was not worth pushing UHD Blu-Ray playback on PS4 Pro... maybe PS5 if the format is not dead by then (hint: it won;t be, but of course it will be even cheaper and people with lots of income to spend on A/V... I mean early adopters will have already gotten a much more expensive Blu-Ray player). Next you will be asking me why Apple will not push the iPhone SE a lot harder marketing wise too (they like where it is positioned, they do not want to highlight how close to the higher end iPhone devices it is...).

PSOne was also quite a good CD player for its time: https://www.destructoid.com/playstation-1-the-audiophile-s-dream--32269.phtml

 

[family_guy]

Then whatever anyone says in regards to better standalone features is pointless because everyone else has already made their minds up on the Xbox. It now becomes a matter of quantity vs quality.



And to add, that's not even going into the negatives of the Xbox, such as the console being louder, slow and cumbersome interface, needing to buy a remote on the side, etc.

There is such a thing as diminishing returns. It's like paying $600+ for a GTX 1080 that's about 20-30% more powerful than a 1070. Is there a difference? Yes? Is that difference worth $200 more? That's debatable. The photos posted above compared the first 4k player ever made that came out around March and sells now for around $200 to a $500 high end Oppo that came out a few weeks ago. I see a difference, but it's not significant enough to make the Samsung a bad investment. Additionally the difference could come down to something as simple as a configuration setting that needs to be done on the TV or the player. In any case I was asking for comparisons between the Samsung and the Xbox, not a comparison between the Samsung and the Oppo.

I can't speak to the Xbox being louder. It was fairly quiet on the Blurays that I played in it. For the act of playing movies, I didn't find it cumbersome at all and I got by just find using the regular controller or by using my phone as a controller through the Xbox app. I certainly don't mind paying $20 for a remote when it's saving me hundreds when compared to the Oppo player mentioned.

 

[Hex]

I am honestly surprised that this is still going.
I know that they lost a sale from me due to not having a UHD drive, that ship has sailed and they made their choice.
I will wait until spring when there are a few choices to pick from.
And because I am a spiteful asshole I will make sure that I do not buy a Sony UHD stand alone even though I have a fantastic Sony TV.
The small performance bump in the pro is not worth it to me, until they prove that it is.

 

[Aske]

Exactly. The Oppo player is clearly superior, but the Sbone is near enough the Samsung in terms of quality that if you care about games even slightly, it's the obvious choice. Like it or not, the Sbone is this gen's PS1/2/3 when it comes to solid playback of physical media in an all-in-one gaming box for a great price.

Just because someone buys an expensive TV and wants to pick up some Blu-rays, it doesn't follow that they're all desperate to purchase the most expensive standalone player so they can watch Sausage Party while snorting powdered diamonds on a chaise longue made of caviar.

 

[SolidusDave]

Every UHD Blu-ray isn't 100GB & there is audio files & so on that isn't needed for these files.

We should know from history that we will be able to get these files just give it time.

'time"

1080p movies on Blu-ray with just one audio track and no extras are 20-30 GB.

Even 4K streaming is maximum 10-14 GB per movie, with 1080p being less than half of that. So yeah, one "gen" later and we still haven't reached streaming/downloading that is anywhere close to the quality of the respective disc format.

Not sure how much waiting you intend to do.

 

[Marty Chinn]

Every UHD Blu-ray isn't 100GB & there is audio files & so on that isn't needed for these files.

We should know from history that we will be able to get these files just give it time.

You're confusing technically possible and feasibly possible. Technically you're right, but feasibly you're wrong.

 

[Lady Gaia]

1080p movies on Blu-ray with just one audio track and no extras are 20-30 GB.

Even 4K streaming is maximum 10-14 GB per movie, with 1080p being less than half of that. So yeah, one "gen" later and we still haven't reached streaming/downloading that is anywhere close to the quality of the respective disc format.

Bit rate is not the same thing as quality. You have to take into account the quality of the codec and other factors like color space and dynamic range. NetFlix UHD content uses H.265 which is a clear improvement over H.264, alongside the Rec.2020 color space and occasionally HDR. Variable bit rate encoding can also mean that key moments get bit rate closer to physical media.

So while I'd agree that physical media still has the edge, it's not as simple as X > Y. I've been very pleased with casual viewing of 4K streaming content.

 

[SolidusDave]

Bit rate is not the same thing as quality. You have to take into account the quality of the codec and other factors like color space and dynamic range. NetFlix UHD content uses H.265 which is a clear improvement over H.264, alongside the Rec.2020 color space and occasionally HDR. Variable bit rate encoding can also mean that key moments get bit rate closer to physical media.

So while I'd agree that physical media still has the edge, it's not as simple as X > Y. I've been very pleased with casual viewing of 4K streaming content.

Obviously UHD Blu-rays are using HEVC, HDR and 2020 as well... just at a much higher bitrate.

 

[Theonik]

If you don't have a receiver capable of passing 4K HDR you're even more likely to want to get an XB1S as your UHD player since 4K TVs generally only have a single input that accepts 4K HDR signal so you couldn't have 3 different devices using the same port and you'd want a single console that can also act as your media player.

That point is actually not true. Most decent TVs this year have at least 4 HDMI 2.0 ports with HDCP 2.2 which makes this a non issue. Receivers that can pass 3K HDR signals on the other hand are quite rare, and TOSLINK is not necessarily enough anymore for audio output hence every dedicated player on the market now is doing dual HDMI.

 

[Lady Gaia]

Obviously UHD Blu-rays are using HEVC, HDR and 2020 as well... just at a much higher bitrate.

Sure, but my reply was to your post comparing Blu-ray movie sizes to streaming — explicitly including HEVC 4K content. NetFlix's own comparisons achieved comparable quality at less than half the bit rate when switching from H.264 to H.265 for 1080p content.

 

[Theonik]

Sure, but my reply was to your post comparing Blu-ray movie sizes to streaming — explicitly including HEVC 4K content. NetFlix's own comparisons achieved comparable quality at less than half the bit rate when switching from H.264 to H.265 for 1080p content.

H.265 is about 2x more efficient compared to H.264 yes. BDs have more than 2x the effective bitrate of Netflix though and UHD BDs use H.265 so any argument of Netflix using more efficient encoding goes out the window.

 

[Izuna]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mtzEKmiqU7A

LinusTechTips did a video called: "4K HDR Blu Ray - Is it worth it?"

 

[Aske]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mtzEKmiqU7A

LinusTechTips did a video called: "4K HDR Blu Ray - Is it worth it?"

Entirely fair; good synopsis. Like anything else that boils down to quality vs cost, everyone's going to have a different perception of what's reasonable. But even now prices of discs are dropping to a point at which they're comparable to standard Blu-rays. Transfers will only improve, and the library of stunning titles will only increase. For these guys, Life of Pi was the jaw dropping HDR experience. For me, it was Lucy. Bottom line, the most impressive content anyone can put on their 4K HDR TV is a great looking UHD Blu-ray; and as the video points out, streaming - which will be fine for plenty of people - still doesn't come close in terms of quality.

 

[AngelOFDeath]

Something inside of me is glad that I don't have a way to play UHD movies because I don't want to replace my 300 blu ray collection teehehee

 

[StoOgE]

It was 300mb, then they removed it while they were experimenting with the market, then they put 1Tb.

I highly doubt they're going to ever low it again.

Net neutrality is dead under Trump though. I have little confidence.

 

[Aske]

Something inside of me is glad that I don't have a way to play UHD movies because I don't want to replace my 300 blu ray collection teehehee

The nice thing is that unlike with DVD, your 1080p Blu-rays will upscale beautifully on your 4K display. You won't feel compelled to replace most of your old discs with 4K Blu-rays, but when you do watch a UHD BD that's really stunning, you will be genuinely wowed. Unlike DVD vs BD, this leap in tech really is the best of both worlds.

 

[onQ123]

H.265 is about 2x more efficient compared to H.264 yes. BDs have more than 2x the effective bitrate of Netflix though and UHD BDs use H.265 so any argument of Netflix using more efficient encoding goes out the window.

AV1 is supposed to be about 50% more efficient than HEVC




It aims for state of the art performance with a noticeable compression efficiency advantage at only slightly increased coding complexity. The performance target is about 50% efficiency improvement over HEVC and VP9. At the beginning of June 2016 its performance was already comparable to HEVC as measured using the objective metric PSNR-HVS-M.[4]
It is specifically designed for real-time applications (especially WebRTC) and higher resolutions (wider color gamuts, higher frame rates, UHD) than typical usage scenarios of the current generation (H.264) of video formats where it is expected to achieve its biggest efficiency gains. It is therefore planned to support the color space from ITU-R Recommendation BT.2020 and 10 and 12 bits of precision per color component.

 

[knightfolk]

My One S cost £200 with a game. That's £150 less than my Pro which didn't come with a game. Where are you getting a $50 price difference from?

A place where the sun has clearly never shined.

 

[knightfolk]

This is Comcast we're talking about. Don't think for a second that they won't start introducing tiers.

I will probably get murded for this, but I think tiers might be a good thing, but only if they dropped the speed tiers. My family burns data with all the streaming/gaming, and I should have to pay more than, say my dad who might struggle to use a gig a month. Why should he have to wait for "the YouTube" to load on the rare occasion he uses it. We should pay for what we use, not for how fast we get it.

 

[gtj1092]

So people who buy 4K TVs want a premium console and are so discerning they want the highest quality image that streaming can't provide but they can't tell the difference in quality between 4K players.

The one S has short comings when it comes to 4K but those are hand waved away. Some products have different features. Not everyone is required to check every box.

If you wanted a cheap 4K player from sony just say that it doesn't need to be wrapped in "anticonsumer fatal mistake" diatribe.

 

[Panajev2001a]

So people who buy 4K TVs want a premium console and are so discerning they want the highest quality image that streaming can't provide but they can't tell the difference in quality between 4K players.

What is the phenomenon of diminishing returns Alex?

.

 

[mitchman]

You're aware that Comcast is rolling out 1TB per household per month bandwidth caps across the country, and charging a big chunk of money for households that go over that cap, yes?

Most western countries do not have data caps and have far higher average bandwidth than the US. The US is becoming a bit of a developing country when it comes to internet due to low bandwidths in general and data caps (and a net neutrality so to be dead due to Trump).

 

[StudioTan]

I will probably get murded for this, but I think tiers might be a good thing, but only if they dropped the speed tiers. My family burns data with all the streaming/gaming, and I should have to pay more than, say my dad who might struggle to use a gig a month. Why should he have to wait for "the YouTube" to load on the rare occasion he uses it. We should pay for what we use, not for how fast we get it.

Do you also feel the same way about TV? Someone who watches 5 hours a week should pay less than someone who leaves the TV on all day for their cats?

 

[johnny956]

Do you also feel the same way about TV? Someone who watches 5 hours a week should pay less than someone who leaves the TV on all day for their cats?

I mean seriously we had hourly time with the internet back in the 90's we don't need to go back to that. Companies can handle the bandwidth. They've admitted it has nothing to do with congestion.

 

[knightfolk]

Do you also feel the same way about TV? Someone who watches 5 hours a week should pay less than someone who leaves the TV on all day for their cats?

Television is push technology, so your example is pretty bad. It does not cost your cable company or sat provider anything extra to deliver content to a high demand household. It does however cost you internet provider more to serve 2TB of data to a home vs a couple gigs.

 

[digitalrelic]

I will probably get murded for this, but I think tiers might be a good thing, but only if they dropped the speed tiers. My family burns data with all the streaming/gaming, and I should have to pay more than, say my dad who might struggle to use a gig a month. Why should he have to wait for "the YouTube" to load on the rare occasion he uses it. We should pay for what we use, not for how fast we get it.

Television is push technology, so your example is pretty bad. It does not cost your cable company or sat provider anything extra to deliver content to a high demand household. It does however cost you internet provider more to serve 2TB of data to a home vs a couple gigs.

If cable/internet companies could be trusted, and people who use very little data could possibly save money, I might be inclined to agree with you.

However, this clearly won't be the case. The pricing for the average consumer will undoubtedly point straight up if net neutrality is eliminated.

 

[StudioTan]

Television is push technology, so your example is pretty bad. It does not cost your cable company or sat provider anything extra to deliver content to a high demand household. It does however cost you internet provider more to serve 2TB of data to a home vs a couple gigs.

Where is the extra cost coming from? How much extra does it cost the cable company? How is delivering a digital TV signal over cable different than delivering Netflix over cable internet?

 

[BlitzerRadic]

User looking for inexpensive 4k Bluray player buys Xbox One. That user who didn't even want an Xbox might start buying Xbox One games. That user gets invested in the Xbox ecosystem and buys less games on PS4. That user later gets a Scorpio. That user cancels their PS+ subscription in favor of Xbox Live. That user probably would have gladly paid an extra $50 for the functionality. Sony didn't even need to eat the cost themselves.

Sony was determined to hit a $400 price point but really they would have been fine for at least the next year at $450 until Scorpio launches. Or they could have eaten the cost with the knowledge that PS+ subscriptions would offset the loss over time.

Not buying this theory as this scenario has already played out with PS3. In 2009, PS3 slim launched at $299, standalone player about $50 - $100 more. Inexpensive BD player with PS3 built in didn't do jack against 360.

 

[Mr. Wonderful]

DOCSIS 3.1, the AV1 codec, and HLG HDR are what will bring UHDP to the masses, probably through "cable" because of the death of net neutrality.

In the meantime, all Netflix/streaming companies need to do is bump their bitrate by like 5Mbps for UHDP content, and they'll be in the realm of diminishing returns for most viewers.

 

[Marty Chinn]

Do you also feel the same way about TV? Someone who watches 5 hours a week should pay less than someone who leaves the TV on all day for their cats?

Well oddly enough, people are begging for ala carte for TV so they can pay for what they use...

 

[StudioTan]

Well oddly enough, people are begging for ala carte for TV so they can pay for what they use...

Sure, per channel, because right now you have to get bundles which might only have a couple of channels you'd watch. Not based on how many hours you watch though.

 

[Marty Chinn]

Sure, per channel, because right now you have to get bundles which might only have a couple of channels you'd watch. Not based on how many hours you watch though.

I find the two concepts at odds though. One they want the companies to nickel and dime you over your usage behavior while the other they don't want you to nickel and dime you over your usage behavior.

 

[DirgeExtinction]

So Sony didn't want to raise the price too much while adding more powerful parts/increasing power, so they didn't change the Blu-ray player in it. It's apparently identical to the one in the base PS4 and Slim.

 

[Theonik]

I find the two concepts at odds though. One they want the companies to nickel and dime you over your usage behavior while the other they don't want you to nickel and dime you over your usage behavior.

This is a question of semantics surely. If a company charges $20 for 30 channels but you only want 5 of them and the other 10 are on the $50 package, surely it's not people wanting to be nickel and dimed but the opposite. TV bundle upselling does not benefit subscribers at all. People do not really want usage based billing. Though shorter contracts are favourable for some consumers. Especially sports fans that might only want to pay for channels in season.

 

[Izuna]

sony showed their uhd player

http://www.theverge.com/circuitbreaker/2017/1/4/14167924/sony-4k-uhd-blu-ray-player-ubp-x800

The company is calling the X800 its “first” UHD player, but it did previously announce a similar device last September, the UBP-X1000ES. But, the latter product was part of Sony’s professional ES series, available only through custom installations, while the X800 will be sold to a wider market. You know, through shops.

 

[Caayn]

sony showed their uhd player

http://www.theverge.com/circuitbreaker/2017/1/4/14167924/sony-4k-uhd-blu-ray-player-ubp-x800

https://www.flatpanelshd.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=1483583548

X800 will be available this spring for £400 / €520.

 

[Izuna]

https://www.flatpanelshd.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=1483583548

I tried to find the price but couldn't.

fm at that price

 

[Based_legend24]

yeah guys this post or thread whatever you call it is pretty cool and stuff but the way people tend to think of fantasy movies is that the stuff isn't real. Needs pirates or something most poles don't think alike. The sock isn't in the right foot well does it matter since it still fits the same. Who is there to tell America what's right what's wrong. Ps4 pro 4k blu ray support on the way. Way back like Travis Scott and his last album which was pretty good. Close source told me that it wa gonna happen but who knows with that mat Damon is saying to his agent.

 

[5taquitos]

yeah guys this post or thread whatever you call it is pretty cool and stuff but the way people tend to think of fantasy movies is that the stuff isn't real. Needs pirates or something most poles don't think alike. The sock isn't in the right foot well does it matter since it still fits the same. Who is there to tell America what's right what's wrong. Ps4 pro 4k blu ray support on the way. Way back like Travis Scott and his last album which was pretty good. Close source told me that it wa gonna happen but who knows with that mat Damon is saying to his agent.

Is this diarrhea supposed to be funny?

Lock this shitty thread already.

 

[Vault Dweller 111]

What the fuck did I just read?

 

[onemanasylum]

yeah guys this post or thread whatever you call it is pretty cool and stuff but the way people tend to think of fantasy movies is that the stuff isn't real. Needs pirates or something most poles don't think alike. The sock isn't in the right foot well does it matter since it still fits the same. Who is there to tell America what's right what's wrong. Ps4 pro 4k blu ray support on the way. Way back like Travis Scott and his last album which was pretty good. Close source told me that it wa gonna happen but who knows with that mat Damon is saying to his agent.

man I read that and think I got a seizure.

 

[malfcn]

yeah guys this post or thread whatever you call it is pretty cool and stuff but the way people tend to think of fantasy movies is that the stuff isn't real. Needs pirates or something most poles don't think alike. The sock isn't in the right foot well does it matter since it still fits the same. Who is there to tell America what's right what's wrong. Ps4 pro 4k blu ray support on the way. Way back like Travis Scott and his last album which was pretty good. Close source told me that it wa gonna happen but who knows with that mat Damon is saying to his agent.

A year old account with 20 posts spits this out, compromised?

 

[FyreWulff]

yeah guys this post or thread whatever you call it is pretty cool and stuff but the way people tend to think of fantasy movies is that the stuff isn't real. Needs pirates or something most poles don't think alike. The sock isn't in the right foot well does it matter since it still fits the same. Who is there to tell America what's right what's wrong. Ps4 pro 4k blu ray support on the way. Way back like Travis Scott and his last album which was pretty good. Close source told me that it wa gonna happen but who knows with that mat Damon is saying to his agent.

markov chains, not even once

 

[potatohead]

It's funny how long this thread is and yet how irrelevant it was to sales.

It's almost as if Sony knew what they were doing

And Xbox continues to chase the ghost of ps2 trying the Trojan horse approach with 4k bluray except they forgot it's 16 years later and Netflix is king now

Classic Microsoft

 

[bunbun777]

Well I'm not buying another pro, that ship had sailed, Elvis...fat lady...

 

[Shambala]

yeah guys this post or thread whatever you call it is pretty cool and stuff but the way people tend to think of fantasy movies is that the stuff isn't real. Needs pirates or something most poles don't think alike. The sock isn't in the right foot well does it matter since it still fits the same. Who is there to tell America what's right what's wrong. Ps4 pro 4k blu ray support on the way. Way back like Travis Scott and his last album which was pretty good. Close source told me that it wa gonna happen but who knows with that mat Damon is saying to his agent.

Wth is this. I'm legit confused by reading this

 

[makingmusic476]

Attempting to be cboat?