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Speculating about a Nintendo Switch mini

Seik

Banned
Somehow I don't think that will be an issue for people interested in better portability. To me, the detachable joycons are not a positive or something that entices me to buy a Switch.

I honestly feel like the motion controls will one day be an afterthought when the Switch starts to get the big 3DS franchises. Hardly anyone will care.

You got me thinking about something since my previous post.

I don't see Nintendo making a new iteration of a same line-up that will make previous softwares incompatible, that's out of their motto, AFAIK they never did that. As relevant as 1-2 Switch/Just Dance can be to an individual.

I can understand that some people don't care about the joycons and the multiplayer advantage they offer. Those are part of the Switch's logo itself, the OS is built around them, too. It's part of the console's DNA and I don't think that's going to change in the console's lifetime. Even for future iterations of the Switch I think it's going to have this modular design around it in some form.

The only scenario I can see this is on Nintendo's next generation console, that is if it's going to have backward compatibility.
 

Jaruru

Member
Smaller size overall probably can't fit into current dock

And the bigger problem would be not compatible with many games. To name a few

Arms
1-2 Switch
Mario Kart (joycon wheel? Kids love that)

And those are the big games by Nintendo
 

NimbusD

Member
I can see it happening, not for a long while though. And not 4 inch either. 5 inch at the smallest, but most likely 5.5-6 inch, just without the detatchable joycons and less bezel.

Or maybe that's just a redesign with less bezel that sitll uses joycons. I dunno man.
 
How would it be compatible with the current dock? The only way it works the way it does is because the joycons stick out of the sides so that you can slide it in/out easily. The proposed smaller switch would be completely hidden inside the dock.
 
Smaller size overall probably can't fit into current dock

And the bigger problem would be not compatible with many games. To name a few

Arms
1-2 Switch
Mario Kart (joycon wheel? Kids love that)

And those are the big games by Nintendo

If it happen, what are the alternatives to play games like 1-2 Switch or Snipperclip (except saying to buy a switch) ?

It says right in the picture it would be joycon compatible. You'd buy joycons if you *really* want to play a party game on a 4" screen.
 

The Real Abed

Perma-Junior
They wouldn't need a dock. Just make it have TV output, i.e. HDMI or some other standard with an adapter that could (optionally maybe) disable the built-in display when plugged in. It would still "switch" but it wouldn't have the Joy-Cons, but could still come with compatibility with them (Even though they wouldn't be included.)

I know I'd buy one even if I already had a Switch.

And only if it allows for downloaded games to be synced between devices... which would mean never because Nintendo.

Obviously don't put it out until a few years from now when Switch sales are slumping.
 

jdstorm

Banned
Wont happen until Nintendo stop needing all their manufacturing bandwidth to push out current Switch consoles.

I'd say we are much more likely to see a Switch 2 with slightly better/newer hardware (like a mobile phone revision) then a different SKU.
 
I'd kind of like to see a clamshell design for a smaller portable only version of Switch hardware. Sort of like a widescreen modern version of the GBA SP, or a non ugly version of the Nvidia Shield Portable. You'd be able to have a 5.2 inch screen while maintaining an n3DS XL sized profile width wise and the screen wouldn't be exposed. With a 16nm version of the X1, no fan, no need to clock to higher speeds due to no docking, and no need to have the joycons require their own batteries, there could be a better use of space within the machine too. It'd also be clearly differentiate itself from the normal version of the Switch.

Idk I think a 4 inch screen is too small for a mini because many of the on screen elements in games are designed for a 6.2 inch screen currently and wouldn't scale well to smaller sizes well I feel.
 

ggx2ac

Member
VNAUS7z.png

That is so small, I'd be surprised if they can fit everything in there, still have decent battery power and for it to not have thermal throttling.

I'll repost what I said in that Superdata thread.

First, the consequences of what might become a barebones Switch making it the equivalent of the Vita TV. Removing features from the Vita to create the Vita TV such as the touchscreen caused a large number of games to be incompatible. The Vita TV was cheaper but was not a good substitute for a Vita when you couldn't play all games available.

Hence, any attempts to remove features that people may like about the Switch to create a smaller or cheaper Switch may become undesirable.

If you remove the kickstand? No tabletop mode.
If you remove the Joy-Cons? No local multiplayer on the go.

Etc etc.

For now, it's more preferable to see how cheap the current Switch can become. It uses a stock Tegra X1 SoC, USB-C port and adapter etc. Those things will get cheaper over time including USB-C as it is becoming the new standard.

Next, I'll repost about whether people actually prefer something to be cheaper as opposed to being smaller.

We know that Nintendo can make a cheaper Switch, what we don't know is if the audience wants a smaller Switch rather than a cheaper Switch.

Referencing Nintendo's worldwide LTD shipment numbers for 3DS Hardware:

There are 19.64 million (old)3DS XL units LTD although that is very likely being discontinued considering how low shipments were recently.

7.1 million 2DS units.

2.49 million New 3DS units.

9.82 million New 3DS XL units.


Total LTD is 65.3 million currently.

The 2DS has been around for longer than the New 3DS/New 3DS XL and has sold the most in their Other territories which excludes Japan and The Americas.

This was pretty apparent when I saw Fire Emblem Echoes Shadows of Valentia on the recent Nintendo Direct for Europe, they showed only the 2DS model and the New 3DS XL model.

What I am getting at is that the 2DS is bigger and bulkier than a New 3DS but it is cheaper.

I don't think people care too much about wanting a small size as opposed to it being cheap. We can see that even the bigger New 3DS XL greatly outsells New 3DS and, in Japan there is a 3.6:1 ratio of New 3DS XL to New 3DS units using LTD numbers.

If anyone could buy what the current Switch is but cheaper, they would definitely do that. Making it smaller will of course make it cheaper but most people don't care about making a portable smaller than what it is as opposed to just getting it cheaper.

Now, the Switch Mini could have no Joy-Cons to reduce cost, no Grip, no Dock, no HDMI cable, smaller screen, smaller battery, mono speaker instead of stereo like 2DS etc.

The question is how barebones can it be before it will start getting affected by sales figures due to lack of desirability? Will it be more like the 2DS sales figures above? Or the New 3DS?

The handheld market is declining due to smartphones. The Switch has some neat features that a dedicated handheld or a dedicated stationary console can't do.

The reason Nintendo hasn't released a new handheld already when the 3DS is at the end of its life is that they haven't figured out how to deal with the declining handheld market due to smartphones.

That's​ why the went third party and are releasing smartphone games, they couldn't figure it out. A barebones Switch Mini would probably just provide them extra sales but would not be the preferred​ unit by consumers for the Switch. There are features on there that aren't as unnecessary as the 3D screen on the 3DS.
 

DocSeuss

Member
Given all the things Nintendo's doing with the joycons, and the fact that the Switch is basically the best size/perf tradeoff then can do right now, I don't forsee a Switch mini happening.
 
It's a possibility, but it's far from the easy sell some people are making it out to be.

-It can't have Switch anywhere in the name. A Switch that can't, well, switch is a terrible idea that wrecks the branding of the console. "But the 2DS doesn't have 3D, and it did fine!" True, but 3D was a meaningless gimmick that wasn't a necessity for the actual games and gameplay. It was a visual enhancement, nothing more. The Switch concept goes far beyond something like 3D, no matter how much people try to pass it off as a novelty.

-Game functionality will be a problem. Anything that thrives on using the Joy-cons separately, Wii-style or otherwise, will suffer, if not flat-out become unplayable. Multiplayer also takes a hit, as you no longer have instant two-player right out of the box. Some games will suffer on a smaller screen, text could quickly become illegible. Tabletop-mode games are out of the picture. The library of compatible games with as few sacrifices as possible will absolutely have to be there in order for a smaller system to work.

-Tech is also a concern. Sure, chips will continually get more powerful/cheaper/smaller, but what's going to power that thing? It's been repeated over and over again that battery tech has been making baby steps at best. The Switch already has a massive battery powering it, it's hard to imagine a smaller, longer-lasting alternative suddenly popping up.

I think a "Switch Mini" could eventually pop up, but there's a lot of things that could very easily go wrong. Just like dock-only/portable-only games, the Switch will really have to take off and mature as a platform in order for games/systems to exist that cater specifically to one part of the market. Also, the games themselves will have to be branded not as "Switch games", but as "Nintendo games," able to play (or not be played) in a number of ways. The marketing will have to shift from the traditional "console-first" mentality to a "games-first" mentality, where the systems are the accessories to the games, and not the other way around.

At the end of the day, just waiting until the time is right for a price drop is probably much smarter than rushing out alternate systems to cater to the handheld-only and console-only crowds.
 

antonz

Member
Why would Nintendo abandon everything that made the Switch the Switch? Things like the 2DS were just cash in attempts at an already failed gimmick. Losing 3D didn't change things up as the games etc. remained the same.

Switch Mini as presented would not be related to the Switch at all.
 

joesiv

Member
i would probably trade straight up for the OPs concept! the dock hasn't left my box and i only play at lunch breaks at work. this would fit far better into my life.
 

Chris R

Member
This would work PERFECTLY for a 2nd wave of hardware in 2018.

You have the Switch Mini as described in the OP and a SCREENLESS "permanently docked" SwitchTV or something for those of us who only want to play on TV.

3 flavors, 1 100% mobile, 1 100% stationary, and the classic switch that offers the mixed mode for a $50 premium or something.
 

Cipherr

Member
Yeah, make into a Vita. That thing sold great.

Life isnt fair.

I don't think Nintendo will do a Switch Mini, but I do see them launching another handheld. 3DS did far to well not too.

And Ill bet it resembles something in the OP or the Vita in general, and goes on to be successful unlike the Vita. Shit just works that way sometimes /shrug.
 

HF2014

Member
Funny i was thinking about this thenother day. A smalller form, with small detachable smaller joycon, and by being small, it could be use as a phone.
 
I'm expecting something like this to appear around the time of 8th Gen Pokemon's launch.

A 5" screen would probably be the best bet.
 

joesiv

Member
actually they could just call it a super gameboy or something, but have switch software compatibility. that seems like the perfect solution.

just like the ds, even though it was a "third pillar" had comparability for the gba. this return of the game boy can have compatability with the switch.

we would have, switch, 3ds, and now the "game boy"...
 

ggx2ac

Member
Life isnt fair.

I don't think Nintendo will do a Switch Mini, but I do see them launching another handheld. 3DS did far to well not too.

And Ill bet it resembles something in the OP or the Vita in general, and goes on to be successful unlike the Vita. Shit just works that way sometimes /shrug.

I think not. As in my earlier post on this page, the handheld market is declining. A new handheld will likely do worse than the 3DS.

The reason being that Nintendo haven't released a new handheld already is that they haven't figured out how to stop the decline of dedicated handhelds due to smartphones.

Both Nintendo and now Sony are making smartphone games because they haven't figured out how to make dedicated handhelds sell well again.

If they had figured it out already, it would have already appeared and be more successful than the 3DS.
 

antonz

Member
3DS is dead man walking. Nintendo is keeping it on life support in the event the Switch turned into Wii U 2.0. Nintendo should consider their options very carefully.

Switch as a Hybrid realistically performs at its best in Handheld mode. So if Nintendo wants to establish another Pillar they would be better off coming up with an affordable console that is just plain jane minimal gimmicks. Switch can be their elaborate Hybrid and they can have a dedicated console that is affordable and reasonably powered.
 

Cipherr

Member
I think not. As in my earlier post on this page, the handheld market is declining. A new handheld will likely do worse than the 3DS.

You only think that because you have a one dimensional view of the business that seems to equate not being able to sell more than the previous hardware as immense failure not worth pursuing business wise. The 3DS has sold like 65 million units, and would probably be near 70 million worldwide by the time a successor came out. Even if a successor sold HALF of that number it would still easily be worth it in terms of ROI and revenue generation.

Nothing about Sonys handheld division, attempts or trending have anything to do with Nintendo. Sony isn't Nintendo, and their effort with the Vita was trash and got exactly what it deserved considering how quickly they gave up on it. A new Nintendo handheld sporting new Pokemon Flagships alongside other traditional entries of Monster Hunter and the like would still easily pull its weight and be worthwhile in terms of business, despite the fact that Sony couldnt dream of doing so in this climate.

Not selling as much as your best or previous console != unmitigated failure. The PS3 was no PS2 but it was still very much worthwhile in terms of business.
 

Crayon

Member
Looking at this again, I think it's too small to hold and effectively use 4 shoulder buttons and two analog sticks. The switch is already pushing it with the full controller layout in a portable design.
 
This would work PERFECTLY for a 2nd wave of hardware in 2018.

You have the Switch Mini as described in the OP and a SCREENLESS "permanently docked" SwitchTV or something for those of us who only want to play on TV.

3 flavors, 1 100% mobile, 1 100% stationary, and the classic switch that offers the mixed mode for a $50 premium or something.

How does that work at all? I really don't understand why people are so hellbent on splitting the Switch into two separate machines. In that case, what is even the point of offering a hybrid at a "premium"? All you're doing is fracturing your userbase based on preferences (and in which case, you'd have to consider the manufacturing costs between a TV-only and handheld-only Switch). That's far more complex than simply making one hybrid system, and giving the freedom to your users to decide how they want to play the system. Not to mention, if the handheld-only idea destroyed the concept of "Switch", your idea pretty much demolishes it to the point of absurdity (why have a switch if you can literally choose one way you want to play?).
 

ggx2ac

Member
You only think that because you have a one dimensional view of the business that seems to equate not being able to sell more than the previous hardware as immense failure not worth pursuing business wise. The 3DS has sold like 65 million units, and would probably be near 70 million worldwide by the time a successor came out. Even if a successor sold HALF of that number it would still easily be worth it in terms of ROI and revenue generation.

Nothing about Sonys handheld division, attempts or trending have anything to do with Nintendo. Sony isn't Nintendo, and their effort with the Vita was trash and got exactly what it deserved considering how quickly they gave up on it. A new Nintendo handheld sporting new Pokemon Flagships alongside other traditional entries of Monster Hunter and the like would still easily pull its weight and be worthwhile in terms of business, despite the fact that Sony couldnt dream of doing so in this climate.

Not selling as much as your best or previous console != unmitigated failure. The PS3 was no PS2 but it was still very much worthwhile in terms of business.

Yeah, the 3DS sold 65.3 million which took a drastic price cut, followed by numerous revisions to get people to double dip.

A 3DS successor separate from the Switch would have its own games, require Nintendo and third parties to split their resources between two different platforms to support causing new software droughts and have either the Switch or this handheld successor to cannibalise sales of the other.

Oh yeah, yeah, I definitely have a one dimensional view of this right?
 

Qwyjibo

Member
You got me thinking about something since my previous post.

I don't see Nintendo making a new iteration of a same line-up that will make previous softwares incompatible, that's out of their motto, AFAIK they never did that. As relevant as 1-2 Switch/Just Dance can be to an individual.

It's a good point. This one of my concerns about the Switch currently. That they are getting too attached to an aspect that, IMO, will flop. With your point in mind, that could limit any future iterations of the Switch.

I guess it will come down to sales of some of these motion-games but I'm not sure how one can be very optimistic about them. I don't see the non-gamer Wii crowd coming back for the Switch to make this a big enough deal going forward.
 

watershed

Banned
You only think that because you have a one dimensional view of the business that seems to equate not being able to sell more than the previous hardware as immense failure not worth pursuing business wise. The 3DS has sold like 65 million units, and would probably be near 70 million worldwide by the time a successor came out. Even if a successor sold HALF of that number it would still easily be worth it in terms of ROI and revenue generation.

Nothing about Sonys handheld division, attempts or trending have anything to do with Nintendo. Sony isn't Nintendo, and their effort with the Vita was trash and got exactly what it deserved considering how quickly they gave up on it. A new Nintendo handheld sporting new Pokemon Flagships alongside other traditional entries of Monster Hunter and the like would still easily pull its weight and be worthwhile in terms of business, despite the fact that Sony couldnt dream of doing so in this climate.

Not selling as much as your best or previous console != unmitigated failure. The PS3 was no PS2 but it was still very much worthwhile in terms of business.
At this point, I don't think Nintendo benefits from trying to sustain software for 2 hardware platforms with different development architectures. They have consolidated all their portable and console development divisions into one. Having a single platform also benefits 3rd party developers. Going forward, I think Nintendo will only have 1 system at a time, not counting mobile. It seems like they've been moving in this direction and the benefits/advantages are so clear.
 

Alchemy

Member
At some point there will be a Switch TV (small TV only w/ Pro Controller) and a Switch Pocket (portable focused, possibly still works in the dock) but I don't think we'll see that until maybe a year after most of the hype for the Switch has died down and Nintendo is simply looking to expand to gamers who want something more traditional and also cheaper. We'll probably see a Switch only SDK without the dock a bit earlier at a $50 price drop.

A Switch Pocket/Mini really only makes sense for Nintendo trying to push the price of the console down to $99 to become a more affordable mainstream game device. Right now they can still lean on the 2DS for that price point and they probably don't want to mix signals on what the Switch is capable of as a Console/Portable hybrid.
 

ggx2ac

Member
At some point there will be a Switch TV (small TV only w/ Pro Controller) and a Switch Pocket (portable focused, possibly still works in the dock) but I don't think we'll see that until maybe a year after most of the hype for the Switch has died down and Nintendo is simply looking to expand to gamers who want something more traditional and also cheaper. We'll probably see a Switch only SDK without the dock a bit earlier at a $50 price drop.

A Switch Pocket/Mini really only makes sense for Nintendo trying to push the price of the console down to $99 to become a more affordable mainstream game device. Right now they can still lean on the 2DS for that price point and they probably don't want to mix signals on what the Switch is capable of as a Console/Portable hybrid.

If people want a dockless SKU that badly, throw away the Grip and HDMI cable as well so that the box is smaller that people would have to buy a dock, HDMI cable and grip separately.
 

Alchemy

Member
If people want a dockless SKU that badly, throw away the Grip and HDMI cable as well so that the box is smaller that people would have to buy a dock, HDMI cable and grip separately.

I mean yeah, that would be the idea. I also don't think it would be that common a SKU (I derped on SDK oops), but it does serve a purpose in multi-Switch households. We have a Switch but will probably wait on getting a second until theres a better option than dropping $300 again. Me and my wife usually do multiple units of portable systems so we can play Pokemon/Monster Hunter together, and a dockless SKU would be nice for saving however little cash it would. Having a second Switch for Monster Hunter would basically be a requirement in my house :x
 
Have there ever been examples of multiple SKUs doing good in the gaming space? Seems like these kind of things only get in the way of consumer messaging.
 
A handheld only device basically defeats the whole point of the Switch... As an aside, I was in Target today and noticed the New 3DS XL sells for $199.99. That's only $100 less than the Switch. I was genuinely shocked lol.
 
I wouls really really really REALLY like a Switch the size of a non-XL New 3DS. Something that can comfortably fit in my pocket.

I'm not sire that's even possible on today's jardware though, unless it has like a 15 minute battery.
 

ggx2ac

Member
I mean yeah, that would be the idea. I also don't think it would be that common a SKU (I derped on SDK oops), but it does serve a purpose in multi-Switch households. We have a Switch but will probably wait on getting a second until theres a better option than dropping $300 again. Me and my wife usually do multiple units of portable systems so we can play Pokemon/Monster Hunter together, and a dockless SKU would be nice for saving however little cash it would. Having a second Switch for Monster Hunter would basically be a requirement in my house :x

I am comparing the dimensions of the Wii U Deluxe Box and the Switch Box.

The Wii U Box is so huge, while the Switch box is a little wider but almost half the height and slimmer.

Removing the Dock, Grip, and HDMI cable which leaves only the Switch, Joy-Cons, straps and AC adapter can cut a lot of space.

Basically they could probably double their shipments at the same cost as shipping regular Switches per volume amount needed to ship.

And then of course a die shrink to the SoC but no other revisions can help cut costs too.

This is one way a cheaper Switch can happen without removing features and still allow people to get a dock, grip etc if they choose to rather than a Switch Mini that might prevent the use of Joy-Cons or connecting to the TV.

This is also for my argument for why people would prefer a cheaper Switch as opposed to a smaller one which I cited sales figures for 2DS, New 3DS and New 3DS XL here earlier.
 

Cipherr

Member
Yeah, the 3DS sold 65.3 million which took a drastic price cut, followed by numerous revisions to get people to double dip.

A 3DS successor separate from the Switch would have its own games, require Nintendo and third parties to split their resources between two different platforms to support causing new software droughts and have either the Switch or this handheld successor to cannibalise sales of the other.

Oh yeah, yeah, I definitely have a one dimensional view of this right?

Indeed you do, considering you just stated a bunch of already known stuff that has literally been the case ever since they launched their first handheld. Im not sure if you were trying to be educational there or what, but you still failed to demonstrate how it wouldnt make fiscal business sense, and I know why. Because they could very clearly launch a handheld and make plenty of money with it, even if it didn't sell as good as the 3DS.

Will they? We will see. But they certainly could, and it wouldnt surprise me in the least. And they wouldn't struggle to make it financially solvent by any means.

MikeHaggar said:
A handheld only device basically defeats the whole point of the Switch... As an aside, I was in Target today and noticed the New 3DS XL sells for $199.99. That's only $100 less than the Switch. I was genuinely shocked lol.

It wouldnt be the first time they did something strange. Also the bolded takes the approach of believing that every single console from Nintendo here on out will be a Switch-esque hybrid. That's not something any of us can be sure about at all. Should any future consoles take the route of traditional set top box again, is it really expected that they may decide not to have presence in the mobile market at all indefinitely? Are you really comfortable resting assured that their next 2 consoles will be portable hybrids? I mean REALLY? This is Nintendo we are talking about.

Im surprised at the overall willingness to buy the line of Switch being the only hardware they will maintain considering how quickly they change their plans once one of their experiments (cough Third Pillar cough) is successful.
 
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