• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Gran Turismo creator expected a ‘more incredible’ PSVR

ArtHands

ArtHands

Thinks buying more servers can fix a bad patch
https://venturebeat.com/2017/06/21/gran-turismo-creator-expected-a-more-incredible-psvr/


Gran Turismo's VR support is rather underwhelming, but he claims they have tried their best with the given current vr tech like PSVR. I am not sure how to feel about the statement because on the other hand, the VR support for DiRT Rally and Driveclub is more robust

While racing games like Gran Turismo Sport and Forza Motorsport 7 are reaching new levels of photorealism thanks to 4K resolutions and high-dynamic range (HDR) contrast ratios on state-of-the-art displays (and upgraded hardware like Xbox One X), VR doesn’t look nearly as beautiful. That’s because the headsets (like Vive, Oculus Rift, and especially PSVR) use relatively low resolution displays, but they also require a higher framerate that is more demanding on hardware. So when I got into Gran Turismo Sport in VR, I experienced a blurry, unrefined mess — visually speaking.

And you know who agrees that Gran Turismo Sport doesn’t look as great in VR? Gran Turismo creator and director Kazunori Yamauchi.

“The first head-mounted display was created before I was born, around 1962,” Yamauchi told GamesBeat during an interview at Sony’s showcase event in Los Angeles. “I’ve been waiting for more than 50 years. After all that time, I’d hoped it would be something more incredible than it is today. But we’ve done the best we can with what’s currently available.”
Click to expand...

"Once we get to dual 8Ks, it’ll be pretty nice,” he said. “Dual 8K and about a 200Hz refresh rate. Maybe in another 50 years?"
Click to expand...
 
T

Trace

Banned
KHlover said:
He's not wrong, but from a PR point of view this statement is a bit bizarre.
Click to expand...

Seriously. VR is really neat atm, I mean will it be better when you physically can't tell the difference between it and reality? Sure. But is that the point when it becomes "incredible"? No way.
 
L

LightOfTruth

Member
Kaz has always been straightforward when it comes to how he feels about PS hardware. I recall him saying that he was disappointed in the PS3 as well.
 
R

Ragelink26

Member
darkside31337 said:
Another 50 years means it'll be just in time for GT7.
Click to expand...

This guy lol

Honestly hearing this has me really disappointed. I thought GT's VR mode was going to turn out great. I'm still going to buy it because I'm sure the rest of the game is great, but I was really looking forward to using my headset
 
V

VindicatorZ

Member
What an idiot. Do better Japanese devs. Driveclub and Dirt VR are both great VR experiences. It's not the fault of the PSVR. The PS4 just isn't powerful enough to deliver their game engine in VR.
 
H

HomerSimpson-Man

Member
So what is it with racing games looking at Driveclub that makes it so pixelated and blurry compared to many other PSVR games. It felt like night and day in terms of how poor the IQ was in Driveclub compared to other titles, even worse on a Pro with games rendering higher resolutions.


Edit: I just realized the original game is 30fps, so it would be a lot of compromised and lower resolution. Well that and the dev was more or less gone.
 
G

Gestault

Member
ArtHands said:
"Gran Turismo Sport's ‘best' is a VR tour mode offering around a third of the game's tracks in which every car can be driven in one-on-one races. If you want to race with more cars then, sadly, you'll have to take the headset off."
https://uploadvr.com/gran-turismo-creator-hoped-something-incredible-psvr/
Click to expand...

Fuck. Earlier in the dev process, they had talked about hoping to have VR in GTS across all modes, because 3D had some limitations in the PS3 games. This sounds like less than even that had been.
 
P

polyh3dron

Banned
I played the VR mode for this at E3 and was blown away by how immersive and fun it was. Had no idea it was limited to 1 on 1 racing and to certain cars and tracks in the final game though. That's a letdown.
 
R

Rice-Eater

Member
I'm one of those dudes that wants VR, but I don't want NES or Atari VR. I want at least PS2 or PS3 VR and I really hope that doesn't take 50 years because I'm not sure I'll be alive by then or even if I am I wouldn't really be able to enjoy it the way I would want to. What Kaz is talking about is 1080 ti VR from the sound of it. But something like 4k per eye and 100+ Hz is definitely doable within the next 10 years, right? I figure that'd be reaching a point where everything starts looking pretty nice.
 
M

MyleMan1010

Member
I don't understand why he thinks dual 8K's at 200Hz is gonna take 50 years. We were playing at 480i 15 years ago. 1440p/1600p was impressive in PC gaming not that long ago. We are making huge leaps in gaming horsepower. The majority of the GTX 1100 series should handle 4K 60 just fine. I would think in 10 years dual 8K at 200Hz would be doable at the enthusiast level. For sure not 50.
 
D

dracula_x

Member
SomTervo said:
On PSVR, sure.
Click to expand...

all VR products, including PSVR:

That's because the headsets (like Vive, Oculus Rift, and especially PSVR) use relatively low resolution displays, but they also require a higher framerate that is more demanding on hardware. So when I got into Gran Turismo Sport in VR, I experienced a blurry, unrefined mess — visually speaking.
Click to expand...


SomTervo said:
And 50 years? Lol. Try 30 at a big stretch. I wouldn't be surprised if it's 10-15 at current rate.
Click to expand...

If current VR products fail, then it will be another 50 years.

MyleMan1010 said:
I don't understand why he thinks dual 8K's at 200Hz is gonna take 50 years. We were playing at 480i 15 years ago. 1440p/1600p was impressive in PC gaming not that long ago. We are making huge leaps in gaming horsepower. The majority of the GTX 1100 series should handle 4K 60 just fine. I would think in 10 years dual 8K at 200Hz would be doable at the enthusiast level. For sure not 50.
Click to expand...

It's more about money rather than evolution of technology. Also, games in 50 years from now will be much complex than current titles, especially if we're talking about racing sim genre.
 
R

rjcc

Member
They're misrepresenting his comment imo.

He's talking about how he thought the technology would've progressed since he first saw it, instead of what happened, which is it was basically shelved until recently.

Yes, he thinks it should be way ahead of where it is.

That's not a controversial statement.
 
Shin

Shin

Banned
It makes me wonder what the resolution and refresh rate will be if PSVR 2.0 happens.
I'm thinking 2560x1440
 
C

Cloud7

Member
It is pretty dang bad. I played it at E3 and came away really disappointed. There were so many jaggies, it was like playing a PSone game. Plus, the camera incorrectly shifted too much when driving in the corners. The VR was so bad that I wouldn't recommend anybody even giving it a shot.
 
D

dubc35

Member
LightOfTruth said:
Kaz has always been straightforward when it comes to how he feels about PS hardware. I recall him saying that he was disappointed in the PS3 as well.
Click to expand...
Even though I don't have a gaming PC, I would love to see what PD could do on PC. I feel like he frequently makes comments about hardware limitations.
 
R

Rice-Eater

Member
Shin said:
It makes me wonder what the resolution and refresh rate will be if PSVR 2.0 happens.
I'm thinking 2560x1440
Click to expand...

The next gen of PSVR will probably happen a year or two after PS5 is out. So I'm going to assume 2021 or 2022. 2560x1440 would be incredibly disappointing by then. 4k or in other words, 3840x2160 has to be the bare minimum by then. And depending on how fast technology progresses. Maybe even that will be a bit underwhelming by then.
 
A

aspiegamer

Member
There's just not enough horsepower in the PS4 (or even Pro), but this has been known for some time. I was optimistic about VR features a year ago but I know better now, owning the headset and knowing the obvious limitations. People expect too much of GT in terms of graphical fidelity and polish for it to be doable. The PS5 (assuming 8-10TF+) will handle the PSVR's 1080/120 display in PS4-tier quality just fine.
Lifeline said:
I tried the DriveClub VR demo and yeah it doesn't look anywhere near as good as actual game.
Click to expand...
Agree entirely, but I also think it's some massive technological voodoo that they could make a 100% fully-featured VR game with everything from the original. If DC had real world tracks and dedicated racing machines I'd be entirely content with it, but sadly it doesn't.
Izuna said:
Meanwhile... Project Cars in VR is bae af
Click to expand...
I refuse to forgive that developer for stating early they'd support PSVR and later pretending like they never did and that it was never given consideration.
 
G

Gestault

Member
Even looking past the original context (of where he imagined VR being compared to the practicalities now), Yamauchi's development background would suggest incredibly high standards for something like VR in his games.

If they pull off a full-fledged VR time-attack mode (with decent detail/clarity), I'd be OK with that. VR with something like a wheel can be fucking crazy when you're in the zone.
 
S

SomTervo

Member
dracula_x said:
all VR products, including PSVR:
Click to expand...

Ah right - that was what the title said (i skimmed the text).

dracula_x said:
If current VR products fail, then it will be another 50 years.
Click to expand...

I don't think they are, though.

And when you factor in the forecasted price drops and usage improvements in the next few years alone his statement looks even more daft.

rjcc said:
They're misrepresenting his comment imo.

He's talking about how he thought the technology would've progressed since he first saw it, instead of what happened, which is it was basically shelved until recently.

Yes, he thinks it should be way ahead of where it is.

That's not a controversial statement.
Click to expand...

This makes more sense.

Damn headlines. (I still didn't really get that from the body text but hey.)
 
V

Venom.

Member
He is just being honest about his feelings but maybe Sony would prefer he take some PR lessons! Personally I'm so glad that VR is finally here. Of course it isn't perfect, it's first-gen technology, but it works and it will improve. Within 10 years publishers will know the control techniques to deliver the best experience and the technology will be of a suitably high level for top quality visuals and user comfort. VR is not a gimmick, it will be a big part of the future of gaming.
 
P

Paragon

Member
8K x 8K per eye is not as unrealistic as it might initially sound.
With foveated rendering and "bionic displays" it may only be a few years away.

Varjo just demonstrated a VR headset with an effective 70 megapixel resolution.
varjo-vr-resolution-2pdu3x.jpg

varjo-vr-resolution-239umd.jpg
Click to expand...
EDIT: More here: http://www.varjo.com/media/

With foveated rendering, you use eye tracking and only render the portion of the scene that the person wearing the headset is looking at in full resolution.
For the "bionic display" in this Varjo headset, it was reported that they're using a microdisplay and a mirror array with gaze tracking to effectively simulate having a much larger, higher resolution panel inside the headset.
 
C

Canklestank

Neo Member
Paragon said:
8K x 8K per eye is not as unrealistic as it might initially sound.
With foveated rendering and "bionic displays" it may only be a few years away.

Varjo just demonstrated a VR headset with an effective 70 megapixel resolution.


With foveated rendering, you use eye tracking and only render the portion of the scene that the person wearing the headset is looking at in full resolution.
For the "bionic display" in this Varjo headset, it was reported that they're using a microdisplay and a mirror array with gaze tracking to effectively simulate having a much larger, higher resolution panel inside the headset.
Click to expand...

Even with foveated rendering, I feel it will take more than a few years for two small 8K displays to become affordable enough to be a viable product. I'm not sure what the current screen sizes are, but at 8K, the PPI would be off the charts.
 
P

Paragon

Member
Canklestank said:
Even with foveated rendering, I feel it will take more than a few years for two small 8K displays to become affordable enough to be a viable product. I'm not sure what the current screen sizes are, but at 8K, the PPI would be off the charts.
Click to expand...
That's why the Varjo headset - which I believe is just a modified Oculus CV1 after reading more into it - is using a high density microdisplay with gaze tracking to display the central portion of your vision, while the CV1's displays are used to show everything outside of your central vision.
That way you don't need a panel with native 8K x 8K resolution, but you have the same effective pixel density in your central vision.
At least that's my understanding of it, from reading the limited information available right now.

EDIT: If you look at the upper edge of this image, you can see where it seems to transition from the composited microdisplay to the Oculus CV1's OLED:
psun0.jpg
Click to expand...
 
M

mcrommert

Banned
Weird it's almost like Playstation jumped the gun and released PSVR on a console that wasn't powerful enough with a terrible old piece of tech for controls

Strange
 
G

GoldenCrow

Member
Rice-Eater said:
I'm one of those dudes that wants VR, but I don't want NES or Atari VR. I want at least PS2 or PS3 VR and I really hope that doesn't take 50 years because I'm not sure I'll be alive by then or even if I am I wouldn't really be able to enjoy it the way I would want to. What Kaz is talking about is 1080 ti VR from the sound of it. But something like 4k per eye and 100+ Hz is definitely doable within the next 10 years, right? I figure that'd be reaching a point where everything starts looking pretty nice.
Click to expand...

Should be, 4K will be old technology by then. But I expect VR to step away from traditional display standards as they don't fix certain problems, Sony and Samsung have highlighted by using different LED arrangement method it significantly improves visual quality than just throwing more at it. VR (and AR) displays from the research being done seem to be gravitating towards light field technology (NVIDIA demoed a light field VR headset recently) as they solve one of the problems of focus. As well as many other technologies that companies are researching that aren't ready yet.

Current the only time you notice the resolution in VR is when you first put it on. Our brains quickly adapt to new standards, even things like screendoor effect disapear as our brains fill in the blanks just like our brain fills in the blank of our visual blind spot. The only times I will ever get pulled out of the new normal is if resolution or frame rate fluctuates.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Gran Turismo 7 PSVR2 Hands-On Impressions
3 4 5 6 7
310
20K
R6Rider replied
Polyphony Digital is “Considering” Releasing Gran Turismo on PC
Opinion Platform 2 3
134
6K
Kerotan replied
What does Sony expect from Gran Turismo (movie)
36
1K
Pelta88 replied
Gran Turismo 7 Patch 1.18: cloud save issue fixed plus more
16
2K
DeepEnigma replied
Gran Turismo 7 Update 1.29 includes PS VR2 upgrade, a race against superhuman AI, a classic GT track and 5 new cars
News Trailer 2 3 4 5
212
15K
Romulus replied
Top Bottom