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[Jay Sosa]

So ridiculous they had to respond to this idiotic criticism. It's as though people have never played a game released in the last 10 years. There is always normal gameplay with the occasional set piece.

"I saw a QTE so that must be the entire game."
"I saw four areas in Mario Odyssey so that must be the entire game."

That is literally the thought process of a small infant who doesn't understand that things it doesn't see still exist.



Yes you absolutely can blame people for thinking this. Unless the intelligence of the gaming audience does not deserve even the slightest modicum of respect.

eh, just as infantile as believing someone whose sole interest is to sell you his game.

 

[Servbot24]

This is not the argument, and I wish people would stop trying to wave this whole thing away by pretending this is what people are saying. The argument is that these sorts of QTEs are not fun in any amount. You might feel differently, but I loathe these sorts of QTEs, and I'm not kidding when I say this has severely lessened my anticipation of this game. Personally, I would rather watch a cutscene than have to watch for button prompts and potentially fail a section like that. Failing and having to do it over again completely destroys the momentum and intensity they're trying to create.

- Potentially failing within normal gameplay seems as though it can "kill momentum" just as well
- Many people enjoy having some interactivity with the cutscene. It's not about skill or great gameplay, it's just about participating at key moments that normal gameplay wouldn't allow. That's why they're almost always very easy.
- Honestly I think you can deal with a couple minutes of not experiencing your very favorite thing.

eh, just as infantile as believing someone whose sole interest is to sell you his game.

It would be infantile to assume that just because someone is offering a product for purchase, they must be lying scheming scumbags.

"Nintendo says the next Mario game has jumping. Well they can't fool me that easily, they're just trying to sell the game! I'm on to them! I bet they're packaging it as a Mario game but it's actually the Leon vs Kaiser knife fight on repeat 50 times! Cracked the case."

 

[TS-08]

I get that people are defensive about this game but guys you don't have to cape for QTEs of all things. They're still bad, even if they're rare in the game.

The idea that QTEs are inherently bad in any form is among most asinine and useless opinions that can be found among the gaming community. You don't have to be defensive of the game to defend the idea that using QTEs in some certain way is not an issue in and of itself.

 

[CJY]

I really couldn't disagree more.

Let me clarify that by just saying that of course, not all cutscenes should be interactive with QTEs, but considering the flow of this particular trailer and set pieces in AAA games in general, QTE is most certainly a preference, and I'm certain that had that crane sequence been a purely passive cut-scene, it would be less enjoyable to a vast majority of players.

 

[Ladekabel]

I'm excited for this game but even if it are just QTEs in cutscenes I'm not a fan of it. Haven't played a lot of AAA games recently but I thought they moved past QTEs. I guess Uncharted 4 was the last AAA game with QTEs that I played.

 

[kobu]

QTEs suck until they're in a game you like and actually care about

 

[Boke1879]

I have no horse in this race, but I disagree somewhat with this. The devs chose a certain sequence of events to show off a chunk of what to expect in the final product, it's completely fair to criticize what's there and express concern over certain things as long as people don't go nuts about it.

And most of what they showed in the demo was you fully controlling your character and swinging around a city.

This being the internet are latching on to small part of it and pretty much acting like the fully game is one QTE fest.

For a forum that prides itself on knowledge and "common sense" It's funny to see how often many people echo talking points/behavior that are filled with hyperbole.

 

[HardRojo]

I'm not going to act like Spider Man didn't have a poor showing at Sony's conference but with Insomniac at the helm I feel like the gameplay will be there and will be good

What? That's your opinion, but from reactions and everything it hardly was a "poor showing".

 

[Bunta]

Even the walking sim UC4 gave you full control over the chase setpiece. This is just some on rails bs

I wasn't aware Nathan Drake was a superhero that can web sling, etc. This is a terrible comparison. Set pieces happen around you in Uncharted as you drive, run, climb, etc.

 

[Fbh]

I never worried the game would be a QTE fest but I still think the abundance of QTE's is dissapointing.

Games like Uncharted, several stuff from Platinum, or Horizon have shown how you can have cool cinematic setpieces while still giving the player some degree of control.

The E3 demo just left me worried that instead of something like the Train sequence in U2, the car chase in U4 or the Poseidon fight in Gow 3 we will be getting a big QTE.


But I guess time will tell and the rest of the game still looks fantastic.

 

[Wereroku]

I'm not going to act like Spider Man didn't have a poor showing at Sony's conference but with Insomniac at the helm I feel like the gameplay will be there and will be good

not sold on the feel of the world yet though, they're going to have to convince me that they get the Spider Man universe because what I've seen so far hasn't convinced me, though that's almost 100% on the character designs and art style not really being to my liking.

nitpicks aside this game looks primed to be the best Spider Man game in years even with my concerns so :shrug:

It's such a poor showing that it has the most watched trailer of the entire event. Going by those metrics every other game trailer must have been a trash fire.

 

[Hendrick's]

The cynical part of me thinks a lot of these complaints are coming from haters who's mad that this game is exclusive.

I would tend to agree.

 

[phanphare]

What? That's your opinion, but from reactions and everything it hardly was a "poor showing".

of course it's my opinion lol

 

[AndrewDean84xX]

I get that people are defensive about this game but guys you don't have to cape for QTEs of all things. They're still bad, even if they're rare in the game.

Yeah, I'm not sure why QTE's of any kind could be ok in 2017-2018. Either make it a cutscene, or full gameplay. I'm not going to go out and say QTE's are lazy development, but they're definitely half-assed, at least from my point of view as a gamer since 1989.

 

[xenorevlis]

The idea that QTEs are inherently bad in any form is among most asinine and useless opinions that can be found among the gaming community. You don't have to be defensive of the game to defend the idea that using QTEs in some certain way is not an issue in and of itself.

Agreed.

The thing is that you literally go from a mini-boss fight to the crane situation during gameplay, enter a QTE, then immediately chase after the helicopter in the open-world so the entire time is interactive. Going to a non-interactive cutscene for the whole crane thing and then suddenly being back in control would absolutely kill momentum.

 

[J-Tier]

This was an issue? How? It was so obvious.

 

[Jay Sosa]

why did you change your post? D:

meh

 

[MKIL65]

And what if I fail the button prompt? Do I have to watch the cutscene again? Or will something alternatively happen?

The former wouldn't be fun.

 

[Shredderi]

And most of what they showed in the demo was you fully controlling your character and swinging around a city.

This being the internet are latching on to small part of it and pretty much acting like the fully game is one QTE fest.

For a forum that prides itself on knowledge and "common sense" It's funny to see how often many people echo talking points/behavior that are filled with hyperbole.

True but let's be honest, the hyperbole is on both sides a lot of the times. You got people looking at a small bit of the game and damning it to be "this" or "that" because they saw an above average amount of specific thing in a trailer, and then you got people who looked at that same small bit hail it to be GOTY etc.

 

[HardRojo]

The idea that QTEs are inherently bad in any form is among most asinine and useless opinions that can be found among the gaming community. You don't have to be defensive of the game to defend the idea that using QTEs in some certain way is not an issue in and of itself.

Yep, and I hate it. As I said before, some people just hate QTEs outright, it doesn't matter if they improve, evolve, make sense or anything, the word QTE simply is a synonym of terrible for them.

 

[KyleCross]

I think that's just patently absurd. I'm not trying to defend QTE as I believe sometimes they are done badly... but I think if anything, the phraseology of "QTE" needs to die, because if you break it down, every press of a button in certain genres of games are QTEs. Take Fighters for examples, you need to input a series of commands in quick succession to make your character do something.

Bottom Line: Saying QTEs need to go means that you want games to cease to exist as a medium. Maximal Absurdity.

You... Hahaha, you can't be serious? You're comparing combos which you perform from memory in strategic gameplay to Simmon Says prompts that come up on screen?

Go lay down, man.

 

[Unspeakable Evil]

Guess we'll know when we get to play it.

 

[theWB27]

They presented a gameplay segment of the game that they feel is representative of the final product. Like most games (like UC ) you increase linearity and remove player control as the stakes increase. this game does it till you are essentially watching a cutscene with button prompts. UC at least integrates gameplay mechanics into its superlinear moments so that they aren't reduced to having to show button prompts. instead its much more intuitive as you feel like you are making use of regular gameplay to still control the player despite it being heavily scripted.

How often its used doesn't make it not a potentially bad design decision

And they had a segment with Spidey jumping through the building with ish collapsing around him that was fully in player control. Not only that during the helicopter chase you were in control while having to get through a tight spot.

That was very uncharted like in its set piece. As per usual...the vocal community likes to latch on to that one thing and ignore the ish that looks just like the stuff they claim they want.

By the way....Drake isn't doing the stuff Spiderman is doing in those set pieces. The complexity of showing your character doing what people expect Spiderman to do isn't the same as showing Nathan Drake doing what he does.

 

[AndrewDean84xX]

So you rather watch a cutscene instead of engaging with it? What ever suits you I guess.

Come on bro, QTE.....engaging...?

 

[Equanimity]

Back when RE4 came out someone brought up a pretty good point in criticizing the QTE parts of that game. He said they frustrated him because during the QTE Leon is doing flips and all this acrobatic shit, then when you actually control him he moves like a tank. That's my only issue with QTEs and it's pretty nitpicky.

It depends on the game as well. A dramatic cutscene that plays a pivotal role in the story should just let the story be the focus. A set piece that's just for show, fine do a QTE if you must.

You can't really use that argument for Spider-Man because he doesn't move like a tank.

Come on bro, QTE.....engaging...?

Engage with the cutscene bro lol

 

[SolidSnakex]

This was an issue? How? It was so obvious.

Yeah, go check the main Spider-Man threads where you have people insisting that it was a QTE fest. A 9 minute demo in which 35s of it features QTE button presses (including the animations that go with them) is now a QTE fest.

 

[Wereroku]

And what if I fail the button prompt? Do I have to watch the cutscene again? Or will something alternatively happen?

The former wouldn't be fun.

I think they said some would have a fail state so you would have to restart and others would just make the fight play out differently.

 

[Kickz]

Shouldve just made Sunset Overdrive 2 and packed in 1 for those that missed it Insomniac..

 

[phanphare]

It's such a poor showing that it has the most watched trailer of the entire event. Going by those metrics every other game trailer must have been a trash fire.

I guess it's a good thing I don't base my opinions on trailer views

 

[Soul of the Beast]

You can't blame people for being concerned. Just because you are OK with everything you see doesn't mean others should be.

Don't forget about The Order 1886, after the E3 showcase the developers also said QTE is only a small portion of the game and the game will have lots of gameplay and stuff.

Let's be honest here, a lot of gamers are burned by The Order 1886, and ever since then they absolutely hated triple A games that focus on cool ''press X to do badass stuff'' moments rather than a good, consistant gameplay experience.

I'm not saying Spiderman is or isn't one of those games, only time will tell.
But for now, people absolutely have rights to express their opinion, no matter positive or negative.

You absolutely loved everything you saw about the game and you can't wait to play it? GOOD!
You are concerned that the game might have too much QTE and you want developers to hear your voice before it's too late? Also GOOD!

Both crowds are not wrong.
No need to insult others just because you think their concerns seems unjustified in your eyes.


For me, the game looks amazing and I am blown away by the action scenes. I am not concerned about the QTEs at all.
This is Insomniac Games, not fucking Ready At Dawn.
Insomniac makes fun games, I have faith in them.

 

[DeathoftheEndless]

Usually I'd be against QTEs, but Spider-Man's abilities are too extensive to be fully controllable.

 

[AgentLampshade]

I agree with that, but you'd have to also agree that people have taken this "Spiderman is nothing but QTEs!" thing overboard. There's nothing in the demo that supports that.

Oh absolutely. It's on the devs to put their best foot forward, but the audience to keep a clear head and understand what's being shown isn't 100% representative of the final product.

 

[hodgy100]

And they had a segment with Spidey jumping through the building with ish collapsing around him that was fully in player control. Not only that during the helicopter chase you were in control while having to get through a tight spot.

That was very uncharted like in its set piece. As per usual...the vocal community likes to latch on to that one thing and ignore the ish that looks just like the stuff they claim they want.

Yeah totally and that was a cool moment of the set piece!

By the way....Drake isn't doing the stuff Spiderman is doing in those set pieces. The complexity of showing your character doing what people expect Spiderman to do isn't the same as showing Nathan Drake doing what he does.

i agree, i just wish there was a better solution

 

[Primethius]

You can't blame people for being concerned. Just because you are OK with everything you see doesn't mean others should be.

Don't forget about The Order 1886, after the E3 showcase the developers also said QTE is only a small portion of the game and the game will have lots of gameplay and stuff.

Let's be honest here, a lot of gamers are burned by The Order 1886, and ever since then they absolutely hated triple A games that focus on cool ''press X to do badass stuff'' moments rather than a good, consistant gameplay experience.

I'm not saying Spiderman is or isn't one of those games, only time will tell.
But for now, people absolutely have rights to express their opinion, no matter positive or negative.

You absolutely loved everything you saw about the gmae and you are super hyped? GOOD!
You are concerned that the game might have too much QTE and you want developers to hear your voice? Also GOOD!

Both crowds are not wrong.

No need to insult others just because you think their concerns seems unjustified in your eyes.
Don't you think ''Cry me a river.'' seems a bit too immature?

Holy shit.

No, if your using Order as a defense, you are absolutely in the wrong.

 

[mlclmtckr]

The idea that QTEs are inherently bad in any form is among most asinine and useless opinions that can be found among the gaming community.

Like I said, defensive.

Anyway I'm sure the game will be good, but it will be in spite of the use of this antiqued crutch, not because of it.

 

[entremet]

Game looks amazing. Very much looking forward to it.

 

[Little Mons†er]

I mean it's the section of the game they decided to show off. So you can't blame people for extrapolating this from what they chose to show off. Glad to see that it won't be a prominent part of the game though.

Yeah it reminds me of the same people thinking ARMS would have 5 characters and Mario Odyssey only having 4 worlds lol

 

[Servbot24]

You can't really use that argument for Spider-Man because he doesn't move like a tank.

Yeah, that criticism makes sense for RE4 (as a minor criticism, not something to get outraged about). It breaks your perception of the player character for that moment. In Spider-man however, his movements during the QTE make sense in the context of expectations built through normal gameplay.

 

[Hibiki Kurosawa]

The QTEs were awful, but before we saw those I was already a little bitter because the game seemed to borrow too much from the Arkham games.

 

[Guymelef]

I really don't understand how somebody can have something against this kind of QTE, it's this vs simply viewing a cutscene...

 

[Puruzi]

Stupid that this even had to be addressed. People freaking out about a QTE fest when under a minute of the presentation had QTEs

 

[____]

Oh absolutely. It's on the devs to put their best foot forward, but the audience to keep a clear head and understand what's being shown isn't 100% representative of the final product.

Agreed 100%

 

[heringer]

I would rather watch an animation instead of QTE. Kind of hate most of QTE's because you are forced to pay attention to a button on the screen instead of the action itself. What's the point?

 

[iFirez]

I'm almost positive they'll show us a less cinematic but equally fun traversal segment at PSX.

 

[CJY]

Yeah, I'm not sure why QTE's of any kind could be ok in 2017-2018. Either make it a cutscene, or full gameplay. I'm not going to go out and say QTE's are lazy development, but they're definitely half-assed, at least from my point of view as a gamer since 1989.

Wow. Let's dump any semblance of nuance and granularity from this medium. Sure. LOL

 

[RichiRamjag]

There you go.

QTE in set pieces only.

Much better than just sitting and watching a cutscene.

People are going to still keep bringing it up though.

eh, just as infantile as believing someone whose sole interest is to sell you his game.

What reason would we have to not give them the benefit of the doubt? They're a pretty straightforward company.

Infantile is a bit much for what you're describing.

 

[TS-08]

Like I said, defensive.

Anyway I'm sure the game will be good, but it will be in spite of the use of this antiqued crutch, not because of it.

I know! I'm being defensive! Now what?

 

[Servbot24]

The QTEs were awful, but before we saw those I was already a little bitter because the game seemed to borrow too much from the Arkham games.

Yeah now this is something actually worth being concerned about. I hope Spider-man combat requires more much more skill and thought than Arkham, which was mainly just braindead punching.

 

[The God]

I never worried the game would be a QTE fest but I still think the abundance of QTE's is dissapointing.

Games like Uncharted, several stuff from Platinum, or Horizon have shown how you can have cool cinematic setpieces while still giving the player some degree of control.

The E3 demo just left me worried that instead of something like the Train sequence in U2, the car chase in U4 or the Poseidon fight in Gow 3 we will be getting a big QTE.


But I guess time will tell and the rest of the game still looks fantastic.

The setpieces in Uncharted pretty much only involve mechanics you've been doing the entire game (running, jumping, climbing, shooting) and nothing that's exclusive to that scene. Same goes for Horizon even though that game barely had setpieces.

With the crane scene in Spider-Man, it's no comparison. He's doing things Insomniac couldn't allow you to do in normal gameplay with complete control.

Either way with a scene like that, it's either going to be a cutscene or something slighty interactive. I don't see the big deal tbh.

 

[HardRojo]

Ok, mark QTE discussions as another topic I should never engage in again, the hatred some people have for them is unbelievable.

Yeah now this is something actually worth being concerned about. I hope Spider-man combat requires more much more skill and thought than Arkham, which was mainly just braindead punching.

If Asylum were the only game, then yeah, but the sequels relied on your past experience and grasp of the system with Asylum and added more variables to the mix to make it more dynamic. "Brainlessly" punching in later levels in both City and Knight will most likely result in barely finishing the fight or not finishing at all.