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[CloudyTuba]

Am I having a Friday moment, or is Eccleston not 10?


9 - Hurt
10 - Eccleston
11 - Tennant
12 - Smith
13 - Capaldi

Oh god, you've done it now! Can we just skip ahead?

DAE think Eccleston is the real 10th Doctor?
DAE think David Tennant should be the 13th Doctor?
DAE think that the Metacrisis Doctor is the Valeyard?
DAE think hack fraud Moffat has irreparably ruined Doctor Who forever?
DAE think Clara is a mary sue?
DAE think Captain Jack should come back?
DAE think God-Emperor RTD is underrated?
DAE miss David Tennant?
DAE miss David Tennant?
DAE miss David Tennant?

John Hurt played the 9th body of the Timelord whose real name is unknown. Of those many forms, Chris Eccleston played the 9th of those to use the name 'The Doctor.' Peter Capaldi plays the 12th Doctor. Carry on.

 

[Broken Joystick]

Oh my God lol. Regarded as a doctor, has a TARDIS, sonic screwdriver, regenerates from 8 and into 10...

But he's not a Doctor haahahaa.

This show.

He was the Doctor for like two minutes and then he regenerated.

 

[Apzu]

The War Doctor would've been named the Ninth Doctor if it weren't for the fact that his immediate successors all remember him committing genocide of his own people. The Doctors never really refer to themselves as numbers anyway, though.

They usually don't, but Moffat did make a scene where Smith is looking in a mirror and says he is the eleventh.

Edit: If I remember that correctly, I'll have to look which episode this happened.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

I have seen that this show is popular but upon watching some of it yesterday it seems more like a kids show that you needed to watch when you were younger or something. Definitely not what I was expecting. I had only seen the art people make for it before ever seeing anything about the show. Art is what made me curious about it. Just felt super disappointed to see what it was. Guess I should try the older part of it.

 

[ClivePwned]

I have seen that this show is popular but upon watching some of it yesterday it seems more like a kids show that you needed to watch when you were younger or something. Definitely not what I was expecting. I had only seen the art people make for it before ever seeing anything about the show. Art is what made me curious about it. Just felt super disappointed to see what it was. Guess I should try the older part of it.

It started off as a kid show that older people also enjoyed. The modern version is pitched as a family show so it's meant to appeal to young and old.

 

[DeathyBoy]

The War Doctor would've been named the Ninth Doctor if it weren't for the fact that his immediate successors all remember him committing genocide of his own people. The Doctors never really refer to themselves as numbers anyway, though.

It's clear the original goal was Chris E from
before Rose with Smith and Tennant. So this is all moo

 

[CloudyTuba]

I have seen that this show is popular but upon watching some of it yesterday it seems more like a kids show that you needed to watch when you were younger or something. Definitely not what I was expecting. I had only seen the art people make for it before ever seeing anything about the show. Art is what made me curious about it. Just felt super disappointed to see what it was. Guess I should try the older part of it.

Family show going for wide appeal. It goes back and forth, sometimes dipping more into the childish, other times into more serious themes.

Like, sometimes you're watching silly robots bicker with funny voices, sometimes you're watching the Doctor leave time travel duplicates of his friends to die alone. It's a very flexible show that doesn't shy away from a little cheese for the sake of fun.

What exactly did you end up watching? Not every episode of the show is a golden egg.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

For all the complaining I see here about Moffat he certainly made the show feel more grounded and tangible. A little more grown up.

Go back and watch any serial from season 1 or 2 and you'll find yourself cringing at weird pop culture references and wink wink sex references. Between the iffy camera work, grading and editing you'll find that his era looks and feels much better than anyone gives it credit for.

Watch Age of Steel. That's a good example.

I've just been rewatching the 9th (and just started the 10th) and I find you may be right visually, but emotionally and plot-wise the old stuff is way more grounded. Things have a logical flow of action/consequence and it feels like there's actually a timeline for future history that somehow matters.

The game show stuff in the future is a bit off, but that was a standout. Otherwise, it actually feels like stuff is happening in a coherent universe.

 

[Apzu]

Tennat will forever be the 10th Doctor, he even has "ten" in his name. Any other number is just madness.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

I have seen that this show is popular but upon watching some of it yesterday it seems more like a kids show that you needed to watch when you were younger or something. Definitely not what I was expecting. I had only seen the art people make for it before ever seeing anything about the show. Art is what made me curious about it. Just felt super disappointed to see what it was. Guess I should try the older part of it.

I saw my first episode just a few years ago, in my late 40s.

I dunno, I was hooked by the crazy comic-book-ness of it all.

 

[APZonerunner]

I have seen that this show is popular but upon watching some of it yesterday it seems more like a kids show that you needed to watch when you were younger or something. Definitely not what I was expecting. I had only seen the art people make for it before ever seeing anything about the show. Art is what made me curious about it. Just felt super disappointed to see what it was. Guess I should try the older part of it.

The good starting points are either 2005 (Series 1, Episode 1 - Rose) which is very cheesy and has aged very poorly now (but it has its charm) or 2010 (Series 5, Episode 1 - The Eleventh Hour), which is more modern. A new ideal jumping on point will be coming next year - every few years the show 'resets' to a degree, though it is one massive continuity, unbroken, going back to 1963.

Ultimately, Doctor Who isn't really a kids show or an adults show; it's a family show. The best comparison I can make is to the best sort of work Pixar does - where kids love the swashbuckling heroics and the silly bits, but its full of nods and jokes that only adults will understand. Doctor Who actually does like to dabble in higher-end science fiction concepts here and there, too.

If you want a good example of the more adult end of the show, look up 'Blink' (Series 3, Episode 10) or 'Midnight' (Series 4, Episode 10). The show varies, and it's a different thing every week - so yes, you get slapstick kid-friendly stuff, but also stuff that terrifies kids and gives them nightmares, and also deeper emotional stuff for adults. It's a weird show that sort of defies proper categorization.

One thing that's worth saying is that it's more science fantasy (IE - Harry Potter with a science fiction bent, where wand-waving magic is mixed with true science and history, or like a lot of Marvel Comics) than it is hard science fiction ala Star Trek.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

The closest it gets to science fiction is a few of the concepts behind the stories. It's pretty heavily fantasy. As somebody one said, of course it's fantasy, it stars a wizard with a magic wand.

Other than the budget, I don't think the 2005 show has aged badly, btw. But then again, I only saw it for the first time a few years ago.

 

[Ceej]

I have seen that this show is popular but upon watching some of it yesterday it seems more like a kids show that you needed to watch when you were younger or something. Definitely not what I was expecting. I had only seen the art people make for it before ever seeing anything about the show. Art is what made me curious about it. Just felt super disappointed to see what it was. Guess I should try the older part of it.

What did you watch exactly? I think this "kids show feel" was certainly more true during the 9th-10th Doctor era, but Steven Moffat, particularly with the 12th Doctor, steered the show in a thematically more mature direction and this thematic clash IMO is what contributes to the debate between which era of the modern show is better based on what you're expecting to get out of the show.

 

[APZonerunner]

What did you watch exactly? I think this "kids show feel" was certainly more true during the 9th-10th Doctor era, but Steven Moffat, particularly with the 12th Doctor, steered the show in a thematically more mature direction and this thematic clash IMO is what contributes to the debate between which era of the modern show is better based on what you're expecting to get out of the show.

I honestly don't know that Moffat's Doctor Who is actually more mature, it's just more glib and more complicated, things that are often mistaken for maturity. I think the show's maturity hasn't really shifted since 2005.

The closest it gets to science fiction is a few of the concepts behind the stories. It's pretty heavily fantasy. As somebody one said, of course it's fantasy, it stars a wizard with a magic wand.

Other than the budget, I don't think the 2005 show has aged badly, btw. But then again, I only saw it for the first time a few years ago.

I think the scripts are magnificent, but as an introduction to the show if you're not a kid I think the Nestene Consciousness CGI and all The End of the World CGI makes the show look extremely cheap and kiddy, and then of course there's Aliens of London/World War Three which you either get or don't.

I do think it's the best place to start, but when I've inducted people to the show I've told them to start at The Eleventh Hour and then if they like that, skip back to Rose and just keep the quality you know it reaches in mind to help you push through the rough early years. By Series 3 the rough stuff has stopped and stuff just looks of its age, whereas a lot of the Series 1/2 stuff looked bad and cheap even at the time.

Another thing about the RTD years, especially that first one - weird as it is - is it was very grounded in its time, Iraq War references, celebrity and TV show cameos - which I think 12 years on makes it a harder watch for first-timers. Moffat's stuff will age better in that sense, but also I think the show being so absolutely of its year is something that makes it brilliant. The funny thing about this is I think it mirrors the classic series - RTD's stuff sort of maps (in public perception in the UK too) to Pertwee and Baker, and Moffat's stuff maps pretty well to Davison (Moffat's favourite Doctor) and McCoy - and Pertwee and Baker's eras also are more 'of their time' than Davison and McCoy's, which are generally more nebulous.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

If you can let the CGI and general production values slide, I think S1 is a great introduction. Yeah, Slitheen are a bit off. But you have Dalek/EmptyChild 2-parter/Father's Day-- and if that run of episodes doesn't work for you, you probably aren't going to like any Who.

 

[Tizoc]

Genesis of the Daleks really drags due to being 6 eps. long @_@

 

[DeathyBoy]

If you can let the CGI and general production values slide, I think S1 is a great introduction. Yeah, Slitheen are a bit off. But you have Dalek/EmptyChild 2-parter/Father's Day-- and if that run of episodes doesn't work for you, you probably aren't going to like any Who.

Dalek still hits home like a motherfucker. Chris E firing on all cylinders and realising he's becoming a monster is even better after all the War Doctor stuff. And makes Rose's contributions even more meaningful because she's the first person in aeons not to pre judge him.

 

[Blader]

If you can let the CGI and general production values slide, I think S1 is a great introduction. Yeah, Slitheen are a bit off. But you have Dalek/EmptyChild 2-parter/Father's Day-- and if that run of episodes doesn't work for you, you probably aren't going to like any Who.

I've been watching Who for years and did not like Dalek or the Empty Child two-parter.

Father's Day is a great episode though.

 

[tuffy]

Genesis of the Daleks really drags due to being 6 eps. long @_@

That wasn't my experience when I rewatched it last week. It helps that it has a ton of different factions bouncing off one another (the Doctor's crew, Davros and his loyalists, the Kaled opposition, the Thals, the Daleks themselves, the Mutos, etc.) in Terry Nation's usual peril-heavy style.

Contrast with "Inside the Spaceship" which is only 2 episodes but feels like an endless slog because it's just the 4 regulars getting to the bottom of a not-very-interesting mystery.

 

[tomtom94]

I honestly don't know that Moffat's Doctor Who is actually more mature, it's just more glib and more complicated, things that are often mistaken for maturity. I think the show's maturity hasn't really shifted since 2005.

They do different things. RTD was very heavily influenced by Buffy the Vampire Slayer, whereas Moffat looks more to the later years of Doctor Who, Blake's 7, and arguably Star Trek; RTD's show is a very human show - with a Doctor who is half-human in spirit if not DNA - that always had a sense of being modern (sometimes to its detriment); Moffat writes the Doctor as definitively alien and prefers a more cinematic feel to episodes, as well as more overt social sci-fi influences (most notably the first few episodes of series 10, which were very McCoy)

It's a bit like Deep Space 9 versus Voyager, they each have their moments but they're for different reasons because they're trying to do different things (even if they're both recognisable as Star Trek). I'd honestly wager one of the main reasons people get so up in arms about Moffat is the sheer gulf in style between himself and RTD.

 

[Blader]

This is apropos of nothing, but it's incredible how so many of Patrick Troughton's episodes are missing and how many full serials of his are incomplete, if not entirely gone. I know it was just the unfortunate style of the time to junk episodes without a second thought, but it seems like Troughton is way more impacted by that practice than Hartnell was.

 

[ClivePwned]

This is apropos of nothing, but it's incredible how so many of Patrick Troughton's episodes are missing and how many full serials of his are incomplete, if not entirely gone. I know it was just the unfortunate style of the time to junk episodes without a second thought, but it seems like Troughton is way more impacted by that practice than Hartnell was.

fewer of his stories were sold outside of the UK compared to Hartnell and Pertwee. when they first decided to stop wiping everything, there were a lot more missing eps than there are today and most recovered eps were found outside of the UK. uh a pity because i njoy the episode we do have of his way more than most Hartnell stories.

 

[EvilRedEye]

I finished watching the reanimation of The Power of the Daleks today, as it happens. I hope they attempt to reconstruct other completely lost stories in the future because it seems a decent way of consuming them. It was interesting to see the remaining snippets of footage afterward, it seemed very consistent with the animation.

For some reason I was expecting them, with it being the '60s, to immediately sweep the regeneration under the carpet and move on but I was pretty shocked by how they not only dwelled on it but had the companions in denial that the Second Doctor was really the Doctor, had the Doctor refer to himself in the third person as though the First Doctor was a different person... and then never resolved any of it. There's no real moment of revelation where the companions decide it really is the Doctor to reassure the viewer, they just cast doubt on whether the new regenerated form is really the Doctor and that's it.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

Oh I forgot to mention this yesterday.

My kids are watching early NuWho, and they are impatient as fuck asking questions about stuff that hasn't been revealed yet. They also have heard bits and pieces.

Torchwood is mentioned.

Son: "Dad, what's Torchwood? That's another show, right? And it's an anagram for 'Doctor Who" and Captain Jack is in it?"

<stunned silence>

Me: "Wait, WHAT?!"

I hadn't ever realized that it was an anagram before. Lord knows where my son learned that (he thought I had told him).

 

[StalkerUKCG]

I hadn't ever realized that it was an anagram before. Lord knows where my son learned that (he thought I had told him).

Torchwood was the name put on the

for Doctor Who early on under RTD. The intention was to hide them in case they fell into the wrong hands

 

[Davide]

It's clear the original goal was Chris E from
before Rose with Smith and Tennant. So this is all moo

I don't think so, 9 acted like he was a new regeneration in the beginning of Rose.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

Not sure about that, 9 acted like he was a new regeneration in the beginning of Rose.

Having just seen it, not really.

EDIT: Oh, yeah, maybe.

 

[APZonerunner]

Torchwood was the name put on the

for Doctor Who early on under RTD. The intention was to hide them in case they fell into the wrong hands

New Who's had a number of weird code names to hide scripts and tapes, which is fun. Series 5 was "Panic Moon", which began when they were casting for Amy - the companion scene scripts for auditions they sent out were titled Panic Moon, which of course is an anagram of... companion. IIRC Gillan didn't know what she was actually auditioning for until she walked into the room.

 

[Davide]

The War Doctor would've been named the Ninth Doctor if it weren't for the fact that his immediate successors all remember him committing genocide of his own people. The Doctors never really refer to themselves as numbers anyway, though.

Extremely rare, Matt Smith's referred to himself as the eleventh in The Lodger though.

 

[EvilRedEye]

Ninth Doctor is a bit weird as he acts as if he's just regenerated in Rose when he looks in the mirror but also the stuff where he pops up in photos from the past was supposed to deliberately suggest he had a bit of a past before Rose. I like to imagine that if they ever do pre-Rose Ninth Doctor media they'll have a running joke where he never quite gets to have a look in a mirror.

 

[Davide]

I think the implication is that he goes on a ton of adventures in the middle of the episode even for years after leaving Rose near the end of the episode before he comes back again.

 

[BocoDragon]

This is apropos of nothing, but it's incredible how so many of Patrick Troughton's episodes are missing and how many full serials of his are incomplete, if not entirely gone. I know it was just the unfortunate style of the time to junk episodes without a second thought, but it seems like Troughton is way more impacted by that practice than Hartnell was.

I sometimes wonder if the episodes exist somewhere in our universe. Maybe aliens recorded them and we can retrieve them by establishing contact? Or we could invent faster than light travel and go up there and catch them?

 

[DrForester]

Awesome as Hurt was, I would have loved to have seen the special with Eccleston.

 

[Vibranium]

I finished watching the reanimation of The Power of the Daleks today, as it happens. I hope they attempt to reconstruct other completely lost stories in the future because it seems a decent way of consuming them. It was interesting to see the remaining snippets of footage afterward, it seemed very consistent with the animation.

For some reason I was expecting them, with it being the '60s, to immediately sweep the regeneration under the carpet and move on but I was pretty shocked by how they not only dwelled on it but had the companions in denial that the Second Doctor was really the Doctor, had the Doctor refer to himself in the third person as though the First Doctor was a different person... and then never resolved any of it. There's no real moment of revelation where the companions decide it really is the Doctor to reassure the viewer, they just cast doubt on whether the new regenerated form is really the Doctor and that's it.

It's such an amazing regeneration, Troughton is so creepy during his post-renewal recovery, and it even unnerves the viewer as to whether this man really is the Doctor. That air of mystery works so well, it was a brilliant choice not to have Ben and Polly instantly just roll with it.

I love how he examines himself in the mirror and talks deeply in an ominous way.

Awesome as Hurt was, I would have loved to have seen the special with Eccleston.

Me too, I think a lot of the fanbase wanted it. I guess if we need to blame anyone, we should blame Keith Boak and other S1 crew members for pissing off Chris.

 

[Sheroking]

John Hurt played the 9th body of the Timelord whose real name is unknown. Of those many forms, Chris Eccleston played the 9th of those to use the name 'The Doctor.' Peter Capaldi plays the 12th Doctor. Carry on.

It doesn't really matter.

They don't ever refer to their number. I think the closest they came is Clara saying that Matt Smith's was the 11th on the line of faces she saw. It's just a thing we as fans use to identify between them.

And referring to Hurt as "The War Doctor" keeps us from having to cognitively reframe 9 as 10 and so on, which would be annoying.

 

[CorrisD]

It doesn't really matter.

They don't ever refer to their number. I think the closest they came is Clara saying that Matt Smith's was the 11th on the line of faces she saw. It's just a thing we as fans use to identify between them.

And referring to Hurt as "The War Doctor" keeps us from having to cognitively reframe 9 as 10 and so on, which would be annoying.

Pretty much, there's not much more to it than that. The War Doctor is a new character set before existing ones so we call him something else and that way we don't rename all the existing ones. We're on our 14th regeneration, 12th "Doctor", and that's it. I believe in-universe he refers to himself differently with the War Doctor because till he experienced the end of the War through his 11 Doctor incarnation for the special he thought he had destroyed Gallifrey.

 

[Tizoc]

The War Doctor isnt numbered because he spent much of his existence dealing with the time war; he had not gone on adventures like the other 12.

 

[Sheroking]

The War Doctor isnt numbered because he spent much of his existence dealing with the time war; he had not gone on adventures like the other 12.

Well that's my point. NONE of them are numbered. They're just The Doctor. The numbers are a fan construct to better identify them.

 

[APZonerunner]

Well that's my point. NONE of them are numbered. They're just The Doctor. The numbers are a fan construct to better identify them.

Logically given how long they live, though, it'd make a lot of sense for Time Lords to count their lifetime in regenerations rather than years - something fairly well demonstrated in the exchange with the general on Gallifrey in the Series 9 finale -- "Regeneration!" "Ten." "Good luck."

 

[tomtom94]

Good news: UK Netflix has quietly added back the missing episodes of the new series (season 4 specials and second half of season 7) so it is complete up until Last Christmas.

Day of the Doctor and Time of the Doctor are still in the wrong place though lol. I've tried telling them a couple of times now to no avail.

Hoping for series 9 some time soon. The BBC usually keep a series as a buffer for DVD sales reasons (same with Death in Paradise), so now series 10 is over I assume Netflix will be negotiating that.

 

[VAD]

I finally got to see season 10 in its entirety. The last couple of episodes were brillant and John Simm's guest appearance was a surprising and welcome addition. I'm salty that the Master killed Missy for good but I guess him regenerating into her means we will see more of Michelle Gomez so all hope is not lost.
Good job with Bill, her death but not death was handled well in the traditional Moffat fashion, I loved the nod to Tennant and Smith at the end with Capaldi's post awakening scene.
Can't wait to see what's cooking for the Christmas special.

 

[KuwabaraTheMan]

This is apropos of nothing, but it's incredible how so many of Patrick Troughton's episodes are missing and how many full serials of his are incomplete, if not entirely gone. I know it was just the unfortunate style of the time to junk episodes without a second thought, but it seems like Troughton is way more impacted by that practice than Hartnell was.

Seasons 1 and 2 were the most widely distributed seasons internationally of all the 60s episodes, which is the main reason why Hartnell fares so much better than Troughton in that regard (The two missing episodes of The Crusade are down to the fact that the story wasn't distributed in the middle east at all). This makes Marco Polo's absence all the more baffling, as it was actually the most widely sold story of all 1960s Doctor Who.

Troughton mostly gets by on Season 6, since a lot of those stories were more recent. Seasons 3-5 just got absolutely destroyed.

 

[Vincent Alexander]

Welp, it is time to catch up! I have two Christmas specials and all of season 10 to watch.

The Husbands of River Song
I strongly dislike River Song, and have not been looking forward to this episode. However, i surprised me. A really great episode, and River herself was quite enjoyable in it. There were some very sweet moments between the Doctor and River. If I had one complaint, it was the very, very ending when it is revealed that one night on that planet is 24 years. I HOPE that means they lived there for 24 years, and then she goes off and dies. With such a good ending, I'll be supremely upset if she shows back up again. That was a proper sendoff, and I don't want it mucked with.

 

[EvilRedEye]

I've only just realised that Big Finish's Eighth Doctor boxsets are moving to one a year after the first Time War one in November. I wonder why that is. I've only just started to catch up to release pace (just need to wait for the next time Doom Coalition 4 is discounted to be completely caught up) so it's going to be odd only having new Eighth Doctor adventures as a rare treat.

 

[infiniteloop]

Christmas Special is called 'The Doctors'

http://www.doctorwhonews.net/2017/07/doctor-who-at-san-diego-comic-con.html

 

[lastplayed]

Christmas Special is called 'The Doctors'

http://www.doctorwhonews.net/2017/07/doctor-who-at-san-diego-comic-con.html

"What are we going to call this? The Two Doctors?"

"Already done"

"Damn.. what about The Doctors"

"Sounds good to me"

 

[Spectromixer]

I was holding out hope that it would be called "Last Breath"

 

[Bluth54]

"What are we going to call this? The Two Doctors?"

"Already done"

"Damn.. what about The Doctors"

"Sounds good to me"

Well technically they'll be at least 3 Doctors in the Christmas special even if only one of them is briefly in it.

 

[Hot Coldman]

"The First Doctors" could have worked...

 

[DeathyBoy]

Welp, it is time to catch up! I have two Christmas specials and all of season 10 to watch.

The Husbands of River Song
I strongly dislike River Song, and have not been looking forward to this episode. However, i surprised me. A really great episode, and River herself was quite enjoyable in it. There were some very sweet moments between the Doctor and River. If I had one complaint, it was the very, very ending when it is revealed that one night on that planet is 24 years. I HOPE that means they lived there for 24 years, and then she goes off and dies. With such a good ending, I'll be supremely upset if she shows back up again. That was a proper sendoff, and I don't want it mucked with.

Want to know something cool?

Every secret River knows about The Doctor? He told her in those 24 years. That's likely how she knows his real name etc. Pretty awesome way for Moff to wrap her story up.