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World of Warcraft |OT9| People still play this? Isn't it from 2004

Flying isn't necessarily the issue. Shit enemy encounter design, agro range, and spacing is. You shouldn't need to drag a dozen mobs behind you getting from point A to B. Things were respawning on my protection pally last night faster than I could kill them, so I just had to run away after getting enough kills, taking a bunch back to the quest giver.
 

EmiPrime

Member
Quel'danas I believe is disabled for technical reasons. It's still it's own instance rather than an actual regular zone I believe--the same way the BE starting area was instances off and Azuremyst Isle as well. Timeless Isle has no real excuse.

Quel'danas, Eversong/Ghostlands and Azuremyst are all part of the Outland map. Quel'danas like Silvermoon wasn't made with flying in mind.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9rFE8HzIijY (RIP Hayven)

To those of you complaining about Argus, are you using the WQGF addon? Questing in Argus is dead easy and if you're training tons of mobs around you're probably doing something wrong.
 
To those of you complaining about Argus, are you using the WQGF addon? Questing in Argus is dead easy and if you're training tons of mobs around you're probably doing something wrong.

I'm not talking about difficulty. And BS on "doing something wrong". People without a trail of enemies behind them are the exception in my experience. The way they have pathways (right from the teleport shortcuts) are that if you go down the middle, you still agro both sides anyway.
 
Oh god, not this "You're probably doing something wrong" horse shit. Jesus fucking christ. People always want to carry the water for blizzard when they do dumb shit.
 

TheYanger

Member
Oh god, not this "You're probably doing something wrong" horse shit. Jesus fucking christ. People always want to carry the water for blizzard when they do dumb shit.

You're right, it could never be that it's supposed to be a hostile alien world and that there's not a problem with aggroing some mobs and running by them. Why does it matter if I'm training mobs behind me? Obviously it would be much more sensible for us to be completely impervious to the legion's might by simply floating 10 feet over them instead.

It's an MMO and there are groups for eVERYTHING in the group finder, it's a hardish endgame zone that is going to only get easier over time, not harder. Unless you're purporting that it's impossible to get around without constantly being dazed and killed (Which, as myself and others are pointing out, it is very much possible to do) then what's the issue? Dismissing arguments as people stanning for blizzard gets just as old as someone simply saying "Get good"

Here's my in-depth guide to not getting murdered riding around in hostile high level zones in wow, this is 13 years of experience playing this game speaking: Look at where mobs are, turn on names if you don't have them on (It makes it very easy to see what is hostile because of the red ass names over their head) and make very slight zigs and zags to skirt their aggro radiuses. If they aggro you, it's fine, just keep doing what you're doing. Unless you run directly through them, they likely will not hit you or dismount you. The only places this is not true are the MOST densely populated areas, which are generally intended to be done by groups. For example the shadow area in western Mac'aree - yeah, that's hard to run through and ignore mobs, you're not supposed to, they murder you fast. If you use your vindicator matrix abilities, you can even INSTANTLY save yourself from any mistakes once every 2 or 10 minutes. Similarly if you have trouble soloing named mobs, you can A) join groups. or B) press your warframe button and LOL all over them once every ten minutes. The notion that having a train behind you is bad is silly, they literally give you a 'who gives a shit' button from the intro questline to the zone, I spent last week training giant swaths of zones around, getting to where I wanted, and if they had not leashed (which is almost always) simply dropping light's judgement on them and being done with it.
 
You're right, it could never be that it's supposed to be a hostile alien world and that there's not a problem with aggroing some mobs and running by them. Why does it matter if I'm training mobs behind me? Obviously it would be much more sensible for us to be completely impervious to the legion's might by simply floating 10 feet over them instead.

He was saying that if you are trailing enemies, you're doing something wrong. Nothing to do with if that is the design choice.
 
You're right, it could never be that it's supposed to be a hostile alien world and that there's not a problem with aggroing some mobs and running by them. Why does it matter if I'm training mobs behind me? Obviously it would be much more sensible for us to be completely impervious to the legion's might by simply floating 10 feet over them instead.

It's an MMO and there are groups for eVERYTHING in the group finder, it's a hardish endgame zone that is going to only get easier over time, not harder. Unless you're purporting that it's impossible to get around without constantly being dazed and killed (Which, as myself and others are pointing out, it is very much possible to do) then what's the issue? Dismissing arguments as people stanning for blizzard gets just as old as someone simply saying "Get good"

Here's my in-depth guide to not getting murdered riding around in hostile high level zones in wow, this is 13 years of experience playing this game speaking: Look at where mobs are, turn on names if you don't have them on (It makes it very easy to see what is hostile because of the red ass names over their head) and make very slight zigs and zags to skirt their aggro radiuses. If they aggro you, it's fine, just keep doing what you're doing. Unless you run directly through them, they likely will not hit you or dismount you. The only places this is not true are the MOST densely populated areas, which are generally intended to be done by groups. For example the shadow area in western Mac'aree - yeah, that's hard to run through and ignore mobs, you're not supposed to, they murder you fast. If you use your vindicator matrix abilities, you can even INSTANTLY save yourself from any mistakes once every 2 or 10 minutes. Similarly if you have trouble soloing named mobs, you can A) join groups. or B) press your warframe button and LOL all over them once every ten minutes. The notion that having a train behind you is bad is silly, they literally give you a 'who gives a shit' button from the intro questline to the zone, I spent last week training giant swaths of zones around, getting to where I wanted, and if they had not leashed (which is almost always) simply dropping light's judgement on them and being done with it.

C'mon, Yanger. I typically agree with you, but movement around that area, regardless if it's supposed to be a hostile world, is shit. The entire world in wow for the most part has degrees of hostility, but this is tanaan jungle level shit. And like you, I'm a DK, so I'm not fucking dying to it. It's just annoying. And I've noticed the habit of most people when these kinds of annoyances are brought up is to pull this "GIT GUD" bullshit. It's intellectually dishonest, it's not remotely constructive and doesn't address the fact that zone structure in regards to mob density of this zone is suspect. What makes it more apparent is that this hasn't really been an issue in legion so far, so to have it crop up now makes it even more glaring.
 

EmiPrime

Member
He was saying that if you are trailing enemies, you're doing something wrong. Nothing to do with if that is the design choice.

She and well, I manage to not train dozens of mobs all over the zone. I group up for every quest and get everything done in short order. It also has the effect of phasing you onto someone else's server so if you have trained some mobs, they'll just vanish. If you're going it alone well yeah, you'll have a bad time in Argus. My gear is total trash and I am on a PVP server so this isn't elitism.

There's also the option to go through an area after someone has Leeroy Jenkinsed their way through and aggroed everything in a 5km radius or when you see a train of evading mobs running back to their spots. I don't mean you should wait for that to happen but when the opportunity presents itself, take full advantage!
 
Do I just need to improve (well, of course, heh), or is guardian a weaker tank, as far as soloing tough elites? Pally and DK is pretty straight forward. It takes a while to kill things with 40+ million health, but they can do it without much trouble. I haven't used protection on my warrior much, but when I did, it went well. I just tried to beat the BS rare elites solo on my guardian druid, and it just wasn't happening. I couldn't heal back enough of that slow damage he was taking with FR and I was keeping ironfur up, plus using defensive cooldowns. Damage taken was much less spiky, but that doesn't help solo. :)
 

TheYanger

Member
Do I just need to improve (well, of course, heh), or is guardian a weaker tank, as far as soloing tough elites? Pally and DK is pretty straight forward. It takes a while to kill things with 40+ million health, but they can do it without much trouble. I haven't used protection on my warrior much, but when I did, it went well. I just tried to beat the BS rare elites solo on my guardian druid, and it just wasn't happening. I couldn't heal back enough of that slow damage he was taking with FR and I was keeping ironfur up, plus using defensive cooldowns. Damage taken was much less spiky, but that doesn't help solo. :)

Druids and Monks don't self heal nearly as much as the other tanks. It's fine in raids and stuff, but it does mean you can't just meme oyur way through elites without caring as much. The warframe is what you want to kill solo bosses.
 
Mage tower is up again and I finally completed the feral challenge. Argus gear and the recent changes to the spec really helped a lot.

2txl9fv.jpg


And I now have the whole set.

 

Adaren

Member
C'mon, Yanger. I typically agree with you, but movement around that area, regardless if it's supposed to be a hostile world, is shit. The entire world in wow for the most part has degrees of hostility, but this is tanaan jungle level shit. And like you, I'm a DK, so I'm not fucking dying to it. It's just annoying. And I've noticed the habit of most people when these kinds of annoyances are brought up is to pull this "GIT GUD" bullshit. It's intellectually dishonest, it's not remotely constructive and doesn't address the fact that zone structure in regards to mob density of this zone is suspect. What makes it more apparent is that this hasn't really been an issue in legion so far, so to have it crop up now makes it even more glaring.

I feel compelled to call this out. Different people can have different experiences. It isn't "dishonest" to say that you're enjoying Argus. It isn't "dishonest" to enthusiastically share a few of the tricks you've been using to overcome the zone (even if you do it with a bit of a sassy edge).

I'm a Disc Priest (not the best Argus class, but probably not the worst) and I've been loving Argus. Yes, the mobs are dense and tough, but I really do enjoy it. With how gear scaling is this expansion, I'd much rather fight things on Argus than run around 1-shotting things on the Broken Isles. And if I didn't enjoy it, then I wouldn't be doing it in my spare time.

On the note of Argus tips: use Meatball as a follower if you have him. In addition to giving you a stacking damage buff, he'll instantly-kill any Argus rare below 20%.
 

EmiPrime

Member
On the note of Argus tips: use Meatball as a follower if you have him. In addition to giving you a stacking damage buff, he'll instantly-kill any Argus rare below 20%.

Yep I extolled the virtues of Meatball a little earlier too. When he's punching away in "Meatball hungry!" mode he also keeps the mob stunned before reducing them to a pile of guts. I see barely anybody with him on Argus, he's seemingly one of the best kept secrets.
 

TheYanger

Member
The problemw ith using Meatball in the world is that it precludes using Meatball at your table, and he's the best table npc in the game. If I could use 5 meatballs I would.
 
Do I just need to improve (well, of course, heh), or is guardian a weaker tank, as far as soloing tough elites? Pally and DK is pretty straight forward. It takes a while to kill things with 40+ million health, but they can do it without much trouble. I haven't used protection on my warrior much, but when I did, it went well. I just tried to beat the BS rare elites solo on my guardian druid, and it just wasn't happening. I couldn't heal back enough of that slow damage he was taking with FR and I was keeping ironfur up, plus using defensive cooldowns. Damage taken was much less spiky, but that doesn't help solo. :)

I'm unsure what you're doing wrong, but I just plow through everything as a bear. I have more survival clicks than I know what to do with. I don't think I've gone below 70% health in this expansion soloing every boss I see. True, if they have 130 million HPs its going to take me awhile to kill, but survivabilty is the last of my concerns. I have actually turned on auto attack and gone to get a snack or take a leak. Herbing is a cakewalk too thanks to travel form, barkskin, trinkets, and the shadowmeld NE racial ability. There is no where I fear to tread in this new land and I don't have to rely on anyone else to kill named.

I'm ilvl923 right now, was only 910 at the launch of this new content.
 

Rizzi

Member
I logged on to my level 100 paladin for the first time in a year. Very first thing that happened was a 110 monk dropped out of the sky and one shot me. Seems pretty fitting.
 

Magnus

Member
Wait Meatball?? The Gnoll? Damn, I thought he was a Garrison follower, didn't know they brought him back.

Same. Had no idea you could go out into the world and get more champions in Legion. One thing that I miss about Warlords of Draenor actually. Remember how everyone discovered Leeroy in UBRS? Was so good.
 
Do I just need to improve (well, of course, heh), or is guardian a weaker tank, as far as soloing tough elites? Pally and DK is pretty straight forward. It takes a while to kill things with 40+ million health, but they can do it without much trouble. I haven't used protection on my warrior much, but when I did, it went well. I just tried to beat the BS rare elites solo on my guardian druid, and it just wasn't happening. I couldn't heal back enough of that slow damage he was taking with FR and I was keeping ironfur up, plus using defensive cooldowns. Damage taken was much less spiky, but that doesn't help solo. :)

Bear is "tankier" than than Blood DK and Prot Pallay but it has lower self-sustain. But those Broken Shore elites are pretty trivial so the difference shouldn't be so noticeable there. Gear or mechanics thing, I'm guessing.
 

RPGCrazied

Member
What do you think the next expansion will be about? That would be hilarious if we somehow got stuck on Argus, and the next expansion is all about Argus.
 

Nokterian

Member
Brewmaster monk is becoming my favorite tank, still self healing like Healing Elixir and passive talent that gives me a healing orb.
 
Few things give me more pleasure than flying qq on the forums. Like this guy http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/1071576-flying/, don't let the door hit you on the way out!

Anyway, I have ground mounts I really like I rarely get to use, it's great!

PS I hope the entire next expansion is like Vashj'ir, BWAHAHA.

Yeah, I enjoy flying as much as the next person but it's nice going back to use ground mounts that I love and never use.
 

RPGCrazied

Member
Flying really isn't the issue. I don't mind being on the ground. Its the mobs. Like Argus is the wrong way of doing it.

Timeless Isle was perfect.
 
Bear is "tankier" than than Blood DK and Prot Pallay but it has lower self-sustain. But those Broken Shore elites are pretty trivial so the difference shouldn't be so noticeable there. Gear or mechanics thing, I'm guessing.

I was testing on 110's that just got their class mount, and have the basic BS level gear (850+), nothing like the 910+ that was posted above. :) I'm sure things become easier and easier with a higher gear level. Highest level I actually have is 894 on my arms warrior, but I don't raid, minus the one needed to acquire flying, and I'm a certified (certifiable?) altoholic.
 
Wait Meatball?? The Gnoll? Damn, I thought he was a Garrison follower, didn't know they brought him back.

Yeah hes the best follower and bodyguard, although he was stealth nerfed with Argus since Meatball only counters bosses and they switched a lot of stuff to be countered by the Broken draenei

Theres also a Moroes follower dropped from the boss but its drop rate is absurdly low. I ran that place 20-30 times and never saw anyone get it once. Rarer then the mount from Attumen by a longshot.
 

erawsd

Member
Yeah hes the best follower and bodyguard, although he was stealth nerfed with Argus since Meatball only counters bosses and they switched a lot of stuff to be countered by the Broken draenei

Theres also a Moroes follower dropped from the boss but its drop rate is absurdly low. I ran that place 20-30 times and never saw anyone get it once. Rarer then the mount from Attumen by a longshot.

I dont know if its just my luck, but I've found that I'm hardly getting any missions that require the Argus troops. Like I've got 11 Argus missions open right now and only 2 of them need the Argus troop. and even still I could brute force to 200% without them.
 
I was testing on 110's that just got their class mount, and have the basic BS level gear (850+), nothing like the 910+ that was posted above. :) I'm sure things become easier and easier with a higher gear level. Highest level I actually have is 894 on my arms warrior, but I don't raid, minus the one needed to acquire flying, and I'm a certified (certifiable?) altoholic.

850 in Argus will fuck anyone up.
 
850 in Argus will fuck anyone up.

Testing when 850-ish was on the BS elites (around 55mil health), not Argus elites. Since then my paladin it up to 870-something and can solo those too now. Takes a million years, but yeah...it's a tank.

I wish I could mix and match specs and classes. I like protection paladin over blood DK, but I find frost DK more enjoyable than ret pally. Death Paladin incoming.
 

EmiPrime

Member
Testing when 850-ish was on the BS elites (around 55mil health), not Argus elites. Since then my paladin it up to 870-something and can solo those too now. Takes a million years, but yeah...it's a tank.

I wish I could mix and match specs and classes. I like protection paladin over blood DK, but I find frost DK more enjoyable than ret pally. Death Paladin incoming.

Why are you soloing anything especially at that gear level? You'll do everything much quicker in a group.

For newly max level characters mailing across whatever unsullied tokens you have and doing some WQs with gear rewards should get you to 880 very quickly (I did this with my 3rd 110 this week).
 
Why are you soloing anything especially at that gear level? You'll do everything much quicker in a group.

For newly max level characters mailing across whatever unsullied tokens you have and doing some WQs with gear rewards should get you to 880 very quickly (I did this with my 3rd 110 this week).

For fun. I group up also, but seeing what a tank can do has always been fun in this game. Group finder was taking forever just now, so I did normal N. Lair solo on my DK to advance the alchemy quest.
 

mclem

Member
Flying really isn't the issue. I don't mind being on the ground. Its the mobs. Like Argus is the wrong way of doing it.

I think the last time all this came up I came to the conclusion that I'm not *that* fussed about lack of flying... because I'm a tank, and therefore I don't get dazed.

Maybe it's time dazed was removed across the board (maybe as a special ability for certain creatures so we still get the Kaliri effect where it has explicit gameplay uses)? Might make everyone a whole lot more comfortable being grounded.
 
So something about how demons die has been bothering me

I thought that if you killed a demon in the nether they die for good. in the trailer Illidan says that every demon that dies on argus dies its last death

But then in some world quests they say that they will be reborn in Antorus using the titan soul

so which one is it
 

Lain

Member
Yeah, I enjoy flying as much as the next person but it's nice going back to use ground mounts that I love and never use.

You've been on the ground for a year and flying for two mounts (times are hyperbolic) and already felt nostalgic about not being forced on the ground?
I'm being silly here, but I can understand the people annoyed by going back to the ground after waiting a long time for flying to unlock.
 
You've been on the ground for a year and flying for two mounts (times are hyperbolic) and already felt nostalgic about not being forced on the ground?
I'm being silly here, but I can understand the people annoyed by going back to the ground after waiting a long time for flying to unlock.

Oh, don't get me wrong. I'd much, much prefer to be flying for the convenience but not having access to it in this one zone doesn't bother me. I'm always specced as tank while there so it's easy to get around and deal with things. But it's also nice (in a weird way) to use mounts that I like and stop using once I can fly.
 

erawsd

Member
So something about how demons die has been bothering me

I thought that if you killed a demon in the nether they die for good. in the trailer Illidan says that every demon that dies on argus dies its last death

But then in some world quests they say that they will be reborn in Antorus using the titan soul

so which one is it

They should die but the twist seems to be that Sargeras found a way to allow them to cheat a "true death" by using the Argus world soul to resurrect them.
 

EmiPrime

Member
I think the last time all this came up I came to the conclusion that I'm not *that* fussed about lack of flying... because I'm a tank, and therefore I don't get dazed.

Maybe it's time dazed was removed across the board (maybe as a special ability for certain creatures so we still get the Kaliri effect where it has explicit gameplay uses)? Might make everyone a whole lot more comfortable being grounded.

The daze mechanic is fine, no need to remove it. There's even a crafted consumable that prevents being dazed while mounted for those who are having issues.

http://www.wowhead.com/item=131746/stonehide-leather-barding
 
Spent some time on Argus with my DK in blood spec, AKA the undying dead, the patient killer, the undefeated, the 5 button slow win. Getting a 925 and 955 upgrade raised my ilvl for sure, but I still need a second legendary.

Oh, what's up with the wild inconsistencies with followers? I run around with Koltira and can't hold agro in blood spec, yet Broll Bearmantle has to be the most useless guardian that's ever existed. The paladin tank follower seemed like an beast, too.
 

Tarazet

Member
I have to say, Sargeras is my favorite server that I've played on. But, after 7 years playing on a PvE realm, I just dread doing anything out in the world. Nothing boils my blood like getting victimized by some belligerent 14 year old who thinks he's hot shit.
 

Weevilone

Member
I've played since vanilla with the periodic, but very brief break. My gang is now on Area 52 Horde, but it's gotten small. I've been off for a few months for work obligations but about to fire it back up.

Anyone from the GAF gang around to do stuff with?
 
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