Man, I would love to see EvilLore's thoughts on this. I just read his incredible post in the 'NYT - When the left turns on its own' thread and I dont think people casually condoning violence is what he had in mind when he asked everyone to exchange ideas in a civil way.
There is nothing civil about knocking a man out cold. What's next? Are we going to start knocking out pedophiles? Attack people who were convicted and carried out their sentence for manslaughter? What the hell is happening to this board?
- Is wearing a nazi badge illegal? I dont think, but if it is, call the cops and have him arrested.
- Harassing minorities IS illegal. Call the cops and have him arrested.
- Punching a man IS illegal. Call the cops and have the man who knocked him out arrested.
I am a minority and I would have gone and helped him get up on his feat and call an ambulance. Maybe he sees my act of kindness and changes his opinion. Maybe he doesnt. Worst case scenario, he turns around and punches me in the face. Fine. He's a fucking nazi. That's expected of him. Why in the world are WE turning into animals?
Do you just....not pay attention to anything concerning the treatment of minorities by our justice system?
Aren't you a minority? You think you'll actually get justice?
Again. So we take matters into our own hands? What do you want? A violent rebellion?Good thing our legal system is racially tolerant and not built on centuries of white supremacy
O wait fuuuc
White moderates have an immense fear of their bubble bursting.I think the Isis comparison someone made a page or two back is spot on.
If a brown guy was walking down the street wear Isis stuff spewing hate speech NO ONE would be saying punching them is a slippery slope. So why is it a slippery slope to punch a Nazi?
And not in the defence of others?
How did I know this would be Daryl Davis lol. He always comes up. There should be no expectation that minorities mirror his actions, which haven't proven to be very efficient in the grand scheme of things.I feel like everyone who's saying that these people can't be talked to/reasoned with etc. should go read some of this AMA:
https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comme...dium=hot&utm_source=reddit&utm_name=frontpage
If a brown guy was walking down the street wear Isis stuff spewing hate speech NO ONE would be saying punching them is a slippery slope. So why is it a slippery slope to punch a Nazi?
Do you just....not pay attention to anything concerning the treatment of minorities by our justice system?
Kinda like how there's this yet unsolved problem with white supremacy and nazism in the U.S. even including the white house because we don't think it's a good idea to come up with proper hate speech laws which have already proven to be effective in places outside the U.S.?
Again. So we take matters into our own hands? What do you want? A violent rebellion?
How many of you guys are actually minorities? Serious question. Do you really want us to take up arms and start going up to white supremacists and assaulting them?
Black people in this country have more right than anyone else to fight back against the justice system and white supremacy, do you want the 50 million black americans to take matters into their own hands? what the hell do you think that's going to accomplish?
If he punches me, it's a crime and he gets arrested for it. It goes through legal means.
I feel like everyone who's saying that these people can't be talked to/reasoned with etc. should go read some of this AMA:
https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comme...dium=hot&utm_source=reddit&utm_name=frontpage
I feel like everyone who's saying that these people can't be talked to/reasoned with etc. should go read some of this AMA:
https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comme...dium=hot&utm_source=reddit&utm_name=frontpage
Choice quote:
Being a Nazi is an act of violence by itself. Parading your support for nazism is an act of aggression, a statement in support for GENOCIDE.
It's worked the last couple millennia. Unless you think every revolution or new society being born didn't include at some stage a level of vigilantism.
This was self defense.
Good not agree more actually. This is a good post. It acknowledges what the law says...but you made a judgment upon whether the law is just. This is good IMO.So does this, so?
I'm still going to celebrate the dude that punched the Nazi, buy him a beer and pinch in for legal help if he needs it. I don't give a singly flying fuck that what the puncher did was "illegal". Laws are not morality. What the dude did was 100% a good thing.
I find myself losing little sleep over this. A man openly espousing Nazi philosophy - which is by no means a violence-free one - was punched. This does not bother me.
It's a local, civil matter. At least in this case, the police will likely step in and charge the hitter.
I don't worry about any slippery slope. You're at the bottom of the hill already.
To define this quite clearly, Nazis and Neo-Nazis are not a difference of opinion. It is not a philosophy that you "live and let live". I would not punch a person, but I again ask why people are so keen to uphold a "civil injustice" in the name of some weird idea of civility. Civility isn't tea and treaties, it's ensuring that your fellow man is equal and protected. There are limits to tolerance and in the name of acting "civil", we've somehow come to this idea that anything goes. Tolerating hate and intolerance doesn't make you a more moral person, it merely makes you an enabler of intolerance.
In relation to this situation, on a legal basis a crime was committed. That should be handled legally. On any other moral or ethical level, I find no such problem.
If you feel this is a problem, then I endeavor all - citizen, media, politician - to speak out against Nazism in as firm terms as possible. Because anything less is malpractice. Anything less, any hemming and hawwing about "extreme opinions", and you're simply opening the door for a violent, hateful philosophy, that will in many cases, harm others in a far greater manner than they'll probably harm you. It's not enough to say you dislike Nazis. That is the place you should be starting. That is the cancer. The punch is a civil matter, a crime. Nazism as a viewpoint taking root? A far greater crime.
You have a bunch of people on GAF saying that they don't think hate speech laws are a good idea because "muh slippery slope." same thing happens when we have white supremacists in the white house. You know what's trending on twitter? #TrumpsAWhiteSupremacist, the U.S. is in a sorry state atm.They don't? I'm sorry I didn't know about that. Iirc European countries started voting for anti-racism laws since 2008 or something. It truly is a big problem then and I don't see it being solved under the current US government.
I want Nazis cowering in a fucking corner. Not parading down the street, proudly harassing people.Again. So we take matters into our own hands? What do you want? A violent rebellion?
How many of you guys are actually minorities? Serious question. Do you really want us to take up arms and start going up to white supremacists and assaulting them?
Black people in this country have more right than anyone else to fight back against the justice system and white supremacy, do you want the 50 million black americans to take matters into their own hands? what the hell do you think that's going to accomplish?
The fighting words doctrine, in United States constitutional law, is a limitation to freedom of speech as protected by the First Amendment to the United States Constitution.
In 1942, the U.S. Supreme Court established the doctrine by a 90 decision in Chaplinsky v. New Hampshire. It held that "insulting or 'fighting words', those that by their very utterance inflict injury or tend to incite an immediate breach of the peace" are among the "well-defined and narrowly limited classes of speech the prevention and punishment of [which] have never been thought to raise any constitutional problem."
Nazis are using the tolerance of the left to their advantage.Nazi apologists in disguise A.K.A. "so much for the tolerant left", kindly GTFO. Damn, are people really so distanced from reality that they think punching a goddamned nazi in the mouth is a bad thing?
Holy moly, what sort of armchair lawyer and pseudo intellectual do you have to be to think that giving nazis public space and letting them walk proudly on the streets is not an inherently stupid move?
Please sit down, get comfortable and continue to protests nazis on a forum while the Big Boys and Girls actually deal with the fact that ARMBAND WEARING NAZIS ARE WALKING THE STREETS OF THE USA.
How many of you guys are actually minorities? Serious question. Do you really want us to take up arms and start going up to white supremacists and assaulting them?
I think there's a pretty good argument to be made that progress was made in spite of those acts rather than because of them. It seems like the more important part involved drafting a constitution, electing just leaders that aren't corrupt, etc.
LOL
is the guy seriously asking the black guy to come closer, only to tell him to back off as soon as he does?
Again. So we take matters into our own hands? What do you want? A violent rebellion?
How many of you guys are actually minorities? Serious question. Do you really want us to take up arms and start going up to white supremacists and assaulting them?
Black people in this country have more right than anyone else to fight back against the justice system and white supremacy, do you want the 50 million black americans to take matters into their own hands? what the hell do you think that's going to accomplish?
The police say the nazi was instigating fights and he most certainly found one. So you can stop with the poor nazi bullshit.If he punches me, it's a crime and he gets arrested for it. It goes through legal means.
Again. So we take matters into our own hands? What do you want? A violent rebellion?
How many of you guys are actually minorities? Serious question. Do you really want us to take up arms and start going up to white supremacists and assaulting them?
Black people in this country have more right than anyone else to fight back against the justice system and white supremacy, do you want the 50 million black americans to take matters into their own hands? what the hell do you think that's going to accomplish?
Again. So we take matters into our own hands? What do you want? A violent rebellion?
How many of you guys are actually minorities? Serious question. Do you really want us to take up arms and start going up to white supremacists and assaulting them?
Black people in this country have more right than anyone else to fight back against the justice system and white supremacy, do you want the 50 million black americans to take matters into their own hands? what the hell do you think that's going to accomplish?
Are you guys joking with the repeated posting of this story?Vigilante violence won't fix anything. It will cement in their warped thinking that everything they thought was correct. The idea that you can't heal this sick ideology is 100% wrong:
http://www.npr.org/2017/08/20/54486...0-ku-klux-klan-members-to-give-up-their-robes
Hard to parse what you're saying.He's probably trying to explain that he just has an difference of opinion
I think if it was it probably would have stopped being so cool 50-60 years ago, but it's worth thinking about.
Don't know what to feel about this.
I think the Isis comparison someone made a page or two back is spot on.
If a brown guy was walking down the street wearing Isis stuff spewing hate speech NO ONE would be saying punching them is a slippery slope. So why is it a slippery slope to punch a Nazi?
How did I know this would be Daryl Davis lol. He always comes up. There should be no expectation that minorities mirror his actions, which haven't proven to be very efficient in the grand scheme of things.
Klan-Destine Relationships
KLAN WE TALK?
Vigilante violence won't fix anything. It will cement in their warped thinking that everything they thought was correct. The idea that you can't heal this sick ideology is 100% wrong:
http://www.npr.org/2017/08/20/54486...0-ku-klux-klan-members-to-give-up-their-robes
I feel like everyone who's saying that these people can't be talked to/reasoned with etc. should go read some of this AMA:
https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comme...dium=hot&utm_source=reddit&utm_name=frontpage
Choice quote:
I feel like everyone who's saying that these people can't be talked to/reasoned with etc. should go read some of this AMA:
https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comme...dium=hot&utm_source=reddit&utm_name=frontpage
Choice quote:
Vigilante violence won't fix anything. It will cement in their warped thinking that everything they thought was correct. The idea that you can't heal this sick ideology is 100% wrong:
http://www.npr.org/2017/08/20/54486...0-ku-klux-klan-members-to-give-up-their-robes
I love how this story got weaponized.
Perhaps because of opinions exactly like this who write him and his methods off. He's only one person. He's not going to change an entire nation by himself. But neither is anyone else with the use of violent force.How did I know this would be Daryl Davis lol. He always comes up. There should be no expectation that minorities mirror his actions, which haven't proven to be very efficient in the grand scheme of things.