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I have zero respect for those NFL players that kneeled for the first time yesterday

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A

ApharmdX

Banned
TraBuch said:
It's all bullshit. When Kaepernick was, and still is, being blackballed by every single owner in the NFL, where were these people? When cops kept killing people, where were these people? When a fucking white supremacist killed somebody and tried to lynch another person at a rally, where the fuck were these players?

No, it took the fucking president of the United States calling them bitches for them to finally go "huh, you know what? Maybe we should try and send a message". And it's not even a message about racism. No, it's a "Hey, fuck you, Trump, don't talk shit about us" message that rings totally fucking hollow. People fucking died and they didn't do shit.
Click to expand...

Agreed. They waited until our shitbag president attacked them personally, THEN they responded. It's cowardice. NFL players are a gutless group overall. Don't forget that many players are Trumpers, even a surprising number of black players. They were ok with Trump attacking other blacks, browns, Muslims, and women. It was only Trump's direct attack on them that prompted action.

TraBuch said:
And all those players that linked arms with the owners are even fucking worse. This is a dude that's responsible for your fellow athlete not having a job, and you link arms with him in a show of "unity"? Bullshit. There is no unity with the owners. If there was, Kaepernick would have a job. You're fucking lucky that Kaepernick was brave enough to take the bullet. Those owners would be the first ones to blackball you if you would've been the first one to step out of the established line.
Click to expand...

Yeah, Trump coopted that weaksauce gesture. That's why you can't be ambiguous, have to take a clear stand.
 
W

WarLox

Member
TraBuch said:
It's all bullshit. When Kaepernick was, and still is, being blackballed by every single owner in the NFL, where were these people? When cops kept killing people, where were these people? When a fucking white supremacist killed somebody and tried to lynch another person at a rally, where the fuck were these players?

No, it took the fucking president of the United States calling them bitches for them to finally go "huh, you know what? Maybe we should try and send a message". And it's not even a message about racism. No, it's a "Hey, fuck you, Trump, don't talk shit about us" message that rings totally fucking hollow. People fucking died and they didn't do shit.

And all those players that linked arms with the owners are even fucking worse. This is a dude that's responsible for your fellow athlete not having a job, and you link arms with him in a show of "unity"? Bullshit. There is no unity with the owners. If there was, Kaepernick would have a job. You're fucking lucky that Kaepernick was brave enough to take the bullet. Those owners would be the first ones to blackball you if you would've been the first one to step out of the established line.

All yesterday did was make me respect Kaepernick even more than I previously did. He didn't wait for someone to insult him. He looked at what was happening in this country and said something needs to change. He put his livelihood on the line. He made people that used to ignore the injustices in this country take notice. And he did it without even trying to bring attention to himself. He made it about something bigger than himself. He didn't send out statements to the press before he sat down saying "hey, watch this. I'm about to make a statement."

This entire thing fucking infuriates me. Fuck the NFL and fuck those players.
Click to expand...

So my question is... what did you do when all those things were happening?
 
A

Agentnibs

Member
This is such a short sided way of thinking. It's never enough to change your position or come to a realization. You have to be first, else you become tainted and hated by the very people you're trying to support. Shame op, you should be glad more people are standing in support not berate them for being late.

It's frustrating I know, but change comes slowly. The quicker you realize that the happier you'll be.
 
B

BriGuy

Member
Imperfect friends aren't the same thing as enemies.

Maybe it is a late response, but it's better than nothing.
 
Z

ZealousD

Makes world leading predictions like "The sun will rise tomorrow"
Trump has turned people stupid.


You can't build a majority coalition against injustice by telling everybody to fuck off.
 
J

Jeronimo Jones

Member
First, if I was one of the players who kneeled for the first time yesterday, I wouldn't care if I didn't have your respect.

Second, people are trying to persuade others to boycott the NFL specifically because Kaepernick doesn't have a job now, but the movement was about drawing attention to police brutality and is bigger than just one player. Trump's dumb comment fired up more players to unite against him and hopefully sheds more light on the original movement, even if it's indirectly.
 
K

KojiKnight

Member
People are sheep. You can either herd sheep, or you can slaughter sheep. If you're trying to lead a cause, it's better to do the former than the latter.
 
T

TheOfficeMut

Unconfirmed Member
Sure, I can disagree for what prompted the current kneeling; however I do recognize that it's better late than never and I won't castigate anyone for not being there from the jump, if in fact they eventually get there.

KojiKnight said:
People are sheep. You can either herd sheep, or you can slaughter sheep. If you're trying to lead a cause, it's better to do the former than the latter.
Click to expand...

I know sheep are the butt of a lot of idioms and jokes, but come on... at least wait a little while before paraphrasing It. :p
 
J

jonezer4

Member
This mentality is damaging and doesn't pave the way for our divided country to become more whole. If we're just going to hold a grudge against everyone that wasn't "on our side" forever, then there's no way for them to ever be "on our side". If you're not forgiving and accepting of others as they change, there's no incentive for people who are in the wrong to change.

What you're advocating OP is unfortunately the opposite of progress and progress is what we need.
 
T

TheCochese

Banned
I mean, isn't the whole point to gain more followers and change people's minds?

Isn't that the entire purpose of a movement? To bring along enough people to affect change? Having 12 people keep doing it is somehow more impactful than 250?

Or should the greeting be better late than never?
 
B

BobTheFork

Member
Exactly when did we abandon incremental change?

Yeah, fuck everybody that joined the civil rights movement AFTER Rosa Parks.
Fucking wannabe's
 
E

elrechazado

Banned
Iolo said:
Kaepernick originally sat during the anthem before changing it to kneeling. Shouldn't you be outraged at this capitulation of principle, OP?
Click to expand...
He also announced that when he was back in the league he would no longer protest the anthem at all, so what now op?
 
Suburban Thug

Suburban Thug

Member
ApharmdX said:
Agreed. They waited until our shitbag president attacked them personally, THEN they responded. It's cowardice. NFL players are a gutless group overall. Don't forget that many players are Trumpers, even a surprising number of black players. They were ok with Trump attacking other blacks, browns, Muslims, and women. It was only Trump's direct attack on them that prompted action.
Click to expand...

Were you at the forefront of every civil issue? Stop lampooning players for not doing something exactly when you wanted them to. The point is that it's better late than never. Some may have been scared of getting blackballed from the league, you know, kind of like Kaep. They work their entire lives to be in a position to make it to the NFL and most guys on a roster are fringe/glue players who have to fight to make the team in training camp/preseason.

How do you know that many players are Trump supporters, especially a surprising number of black players? I think you're talking out of your behind. The NFL is roughly 70% black and Trump only received around 3% of eligible African American votes in the general election which is a historic low if I recall correctly.

Just because they weren't making grand political gestures on national tv in unison until yesterday doesn't mean that they weren't expressing their opposition to Trump in private or on social media.
 
F

ForsakenLotus

Member
OP you are wrong. Taking a stand is what is important, not timeliness. Give credit to those who start the movement, but don't take credit away to those who are late to show support. My goodness.
 
P

PeakPointMatrix

Member
TraBuch said:
They didn't see the light. They're co-opting Kaepernick's message and turning it into something else entirely because they were personally insulted.
Click to expand...

So answer me this. Would it have been better if those players had done nothing? What can/should they do at this point that won't look like co-opting Kaepernick's message? And even if they are, are we better or worse off for it in terms of taking a stand against the white supremacist in chief?
 
M

mjc

Member
So I guess if you don't get in on the ground floor of a movement, just don't bother at all?

I'd love to see you during the Revolutionary War, mate.
 
P

p2535748

Member
I can actually understand this, though I don't agree.

The part I think makes the strongest argument is that there are a bunch of people (players and otherwise) who disliked this (or ignored it) when it was Kaepernick protesting police brutality and racism, but are all for it when it's anti-Trump. And while I'm obviously fine with it being anti-Trump, that's not what the protest was about, and it's upsetting to see it subsumed by something that doesn't have the same meaning.

However, that doesn't mean I have no respect for people kneeling, it just means that I have more respect for those who protested earlier. It takes more guts to do it when most of the team is standing, and I give them extra respect for the stand they took.

But the thing is even the people kneeling yesterday are opening themselves up to criticism and scorn from an (unfortunately) large portion of society to bring attention to something they think is wrong, and even if that protest has morphed from its initial purpose, I'll still respect that protest.
 
R

Raylan Targaryen

Member
The worst is ray Lewis kneeling

Dude shit on Kaep for kneeling. Absolutely disgusting to see him out there. Maybe he found out ESPN wasn’t going make him Jason Whitlocks replacement?
 
LordKasual

LordKasual

Banned
TraBuch said:
It's all bullshit. When Kaepernick was, and still is, being blackballed by every single owner in the NFL, where were these people? When cops kept killing people, where were these people? When a fucking white supremacist killed somebody and tried to lynch another person at a rally, where the fuck were these players?

No, it took the fucking president of the United States calling them bitches for them to finally go "huh, you know what? Maybe we should try and send a message". And it's not even a message about racism. No, it's a "Hey, fuck you, Trump, don't talk shit about us" message that rings totally fucking hollow. People fucking died and they didn't do shit.

And all those players that linked arms with the owners are even fucking worse. This is a dude that's responsible for your fellow athlete not having a job, and you link arms with him in a show of "unity"? Bullshit. There is no unity with the owners. If there was, Kaepernick would have a job. You're fucking lucky that Kaepernick was brave enough to take the bullet. Those owners would be the first ones to blackball you if you would've been the first one to step out of the established line.

All yesterday did was make me respect Kaepernick even more than I previously did. He didn't wait for someone to insult him. He looked at what was happening in this country and said something needs to change. He put his livelihood on the line. He made people that used to ignore the injustices in this country take notice. And he did it without even trying to bring attention to himself. He made it about something bigger than himself. He didn't send out statements to the press before he sat down saying "hey, watch this. I'm about to make a statement."

This entire thing fucking infuriates me. Fuck the NFL and fuck those players.
Click to expand...

FFS, learn when to take a W

people would rather not endanger themselves for the sake of others unless they know others are behind them, news at 11

Kaepernick is a rare breed of courageous, but the force of the career lynching he took as a result was basically to ensure that it wouldn't happen again.


Black Lives was not a significant enough rallying cry for the newcomers. "Fuck Trump" is. Welcome to 2017
 
C

captive

Joe Six-Pack: posting for the common man
disagree.


They got together to have other players backs. Just cause they weren't taking a knee before doesnt mean they don't support the cause or they disagree. But as soon as their friends get attacked they have their back.
 
P

PInk Tape

Banned
Stumpokapow said:
The people kneeling yesterday were not kneeling explicitly for black civil rights; they were kneeling as an act of protest against the asshole president abusing athletes and dividing the country. That's not the same thing Kaepernick did, and surely Kaepernick deserves respect for doing something genuinely challenging with no safety net, but I think they nevertheless deserve respect for doing this both because of the principle of the thing and because their choice to do so helps protect Kaepernick a bit.
Click to expand...

This is my opinion on this as well.
 
Suburban Thug

Suburban Thug

Member
PeakPointMatrix said:
for real

and people wonder how we got into the situation we're in today.
Click to expand...

Extremists on both sides. Obviously one side is worse than the other but how the hell are we supposed to work towards progress with an attitude like this? "Oh you didn't kneel when Kaep did the first time? Screw you, I don't want your support at all!"
 
R

RandomHopeInc

Member
People can express their opinions on their own way, to vilify someone's choice that way, is like saying the only way to respect the troops is by standing for the flag. You just played yourself op.
 
P

Pupperbabysassy

Member
Im not a Trump supporter. But didn't the NFL do exactly what he spoke about? Didn't the league "fire" Kaepernick for kneeling? He just called them SOB's.
 
T

TraBuch

Banned
Suburban Thug said:
Extremists on both sides. Obviously one side is worse than the other but how the hell are we supposed to work towards progress with an attitude like this? "Oh you didn't kneel when Kaep did the first time? Screw you, I don't want your support at all!"
Click to expand...
It's not about not doing it from the beginning. It's about waiting to do it until the most powerful person in the nation called somebody a bitch. It didn't matter when he insulted a million other people. How is this not the very definition of the "Fuck you, I got mine" attitude that so many people hate? They didn't care when it didn't personally affect them. Some of them even talked about how they believe there are better ways to protest. But now you have fucks like Ray Lewis kneeling with everyone else when he's been personally involved in Kaepernick still being unsigned.
 
Suburban Thug

Suburban Thug

Member
Slayven said:
Only one that bothers me is ray Lewis.
Click to expand...

I just read up on this. Crazy that this dude was using his platform to spew Trump rhetoric but had the stones to dramatically kneel on both knees before kick off yesterday. Embarrassing.

gdksc6qrcj7c4pvhagmc.jpg
 
X

Xe4

Banned
I ain't gonna blame someone for waiting to take a stand. Kaepernick is brave for doing what he did, but I think that makes him more brave than others assholes for not doing it.
 
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