Well you see those are not comparable to this situation. The creator of the product has some terrible beliefs that are actually explored and idealized in the game itself. The topic of exploitative consumer culture is a good topic to discuss though just not relevant to this one. Good try though to deflect criticism you may want to be more informed next time though.
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The Last Night: IGN Article [Quack Quack Slurp Slurp]
- Thread starter Bits N Pieces
- Start date
Well you see those are not comparable to this situation. The creator of the product has some terrible beliefs that are actually explored and idealized in the game itself. The topic of exploitative consumer culture is a good topic to discuss though just not relevant to this one. Good try though to deflect criticism you may want to be more informed next time though.
I need food and clothes, I dont need a pixel art GamerGate game, there are hundreds of thousands of other games to play instead.
By the way, you should check out farmers markets and locally sourced produce at the store.
Bumblebeetuna
Member
Can't wait for this. Don't give a shit about Gamergate or any of that nonsense. If the creators personal views sours the game, then so be it. But I'd still like to experience it for myself 
KonradLaw
Member
But isn't it just a game? I mean, it's creator might have tweeted some dubious stuff before, but so what? Did he actually assault somebody? Dox somebody? At worst he's an asshole and there's at least one asshole involved in most of all entertainment products being made. And this isn't Polanski, Chris Brown or that Naughty Dog situations. It's just shitty views and it's hard to get this worked up around this kind of stuff for me.
I mean, it's fine to not buy the game if you don't like the author's opinions, but acting like people not caring about that is some sort of immoral act is weird.
Can't wait for this. Don't give a shit about Gamergate or any of that nonsense. If the creators personal views sours the game, then so be it. But I'd still like to experience it for myself
I get this sentiment, but the creator's personal views are the game.
The alt-right are experts at engaging this way and I've seen it used time and time again. Even the "I'm just asking questions" talking line. People can be principled and still make compromises whenever they can't find an alternative. I'm fortunate enough to be able to live by my principles, but if you're arguing that someone doesn't have the choice to not play this game, you'll find yourself short of talking points. Hence all the "what about all them conflict minerals". If that's all you have as a counterpoint, we're not really having much of a discussion.
His views is the game itself.Can't wait for this. Don't give a shit about Gamergate or any of that nonsense. If the creators personal views sours the game, then so be it. But I'd still like to experience it for myself
At this point people are just ignoring the truth because they don't care or they agree with the dude.
No dude really. The plot and background of the world are literally he take on what if "rampant feminism" won. It is a story about a disconnected man taking on the PC system.
Bumblebeetuna
Member
Thats very dramatic.
Spring-Loaded
Member
It's a story-focused game and Soret never addressed its misogynistic origins until he was called outCan't wait for this. Don't give a shit about Gamergate or any of that nonsense. If the creators personal views sours the game, then so be it. But I'd still like to experience it for myself
KonradLaw
Member
They might have stemmed from them, but reading the articles they put out the dystopia they are aiming for is actually pretty interesting. I don't think anyone really expects things like mass-automation or basic income for everyone not to wreck our society, at least for some time and it's not something we've seen games tackle.
Saint Gregory
Member
I think what makes this different is the dev specifically made the point of incorporating his beliefs into the themes of the game. This isn't just a Palmer Luckey situation where a person with alt-right/GG views made a neutral product, in this case the guy made a GG game.
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
GG = white Supremacy. Will not support. Lol at if feminism won being some dystopian future. Caucasian bigots be doing the most.
No it's not. The game is literally centered around the creator's beliefs of what would happen in a world where "feminism won."
Hope for a Humble Bundle and give the money to charity instead.
Nor would I.
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
Low key, I wouldn't be surprised if this ends up being the video game equivalent of birth of a nation.
So you want to explore the concept of equality for women creating a future dystopia? This game is literal propaganda for his idea of egalitarianism.
It's been a while since I played it but I don't remember Monkey Island giving homophobia a positive light.
No people just would prefer coverage go to games not made by Gamergaters.
TrumanBurbank
Member
People just want to bury the indie dev because they feel like they have the power to do so.
If you spent 31 years on this earth and you haven't done either of those things or thought dumb ass thoughts you are a more righteous human being then me my g.
Saint Gregory
Member
Even that's more of a "Palmer Luckey" situation. It would be closer if Birth of a Nation was about a dystopian future where "anti-rape culture" won.
KonradLaw
Member
I've seen those old tweets, but I'm not sure if that's what this game is about anymore. Everything we've seen so far is showing dystopia where people moved on from creation to solely consumption, aided by mass automation and one guy being unable to participate because of his body rejecting the implants. I don't see much space there for feminist crtitique. There is no space for either egalitarianism nor for affirmative action in a world where people don't works anymore and everybody lives off the dime given by the goverment.
Were Advent Rising and Monkey Island built on the ideas that homosexuals are a problem and should be eradicated? OSC is problematic but at least his shitty views haven't permeated the games his writing is pulled from.
This is a game literally built on a guy's shitty ideas of feminism and egalitarianism (if women were treated like men the future would be hell)
All we have seen so far is that trailer - so we can't say if it is or isn't still in the game. Considering this guy still continues to be a fart hat on Twitter - I'm pretty sure that the writing hasn't change. I don't think we'll see any real gameplay for years - if it even comes out at all.
And crappy libertarian viewpoints are a cornerstone too. If people lived without adversity - then no one would improve! It's good that minorities have shit lives because it'll encourage them to pull themselves up by their bootstraps like I did - a white guy who's had everything handed to me on a plate.
Dude thinking stupid shit at some point of your life is a lot different then going out a buying products with a hate message embedded in it.
Ok lets try this again. The writer of the game has a gaf account and was communicating when the game was first revealed. When the views and statements of the producer came out instead of explaining how the game's story had changed he instead ghosted the thread and started liking tweets from Gamergaters telling them to ignore the haters. They have not changed the story.
What a dystopia!
i didn't read any more of the ender's game series after the first book when i learned about that. haven't played advent rising. played a minute of monkey island and thought it was bad. do i meet your arbitrary conditions for not being a hypocrite?
Baron von Loathsome
Member
Not strictly speaking, but they are very much in that area of the political spectrum.
KonradLaw
Member
I'm basing it on this blog by devs, which lays out pretty clearly where they are going with their vision of the future
https://medium.com/the-last-night-devblog/beyond-cyberpunk-71eacb8e8159
Now, today after the controversy the devs might be trying to hide their agenda (if it still exists there in the game) or trying to soften the image, but that blog post was from may 2017, before the whole controversy erupted, so they had no reason to obscure their views back them/
GG goes along with the general anti-intellectual bracket which is a cornerstone of any kind of supremacist - everyone's wrong but me.
Revolutionary
Member
I feel like some of you are conflating the dystopia in this game with feminism when, according to the Waypoint article posted earlier, that's not at all what's happening with the story in this game. I get WHY you would think that (based on his dumb tweet), but again, I don't think that's what's happening here. At least, not anymore.
Edit: link to article again in case anyone missed it https://waypoint.vice.com/en_us/art...unk-an-interview-with-the-last-night-designer
No. It's not.
Have you ever spent more than 2 milliseconds thinking about what it actually means to have no (or no meaningful) occupation and be completely dependent on the government, and what effect that would have on most people's mentality?
Baron von Loathsome
Member
Ahh yes the article with this very nice disclaimer on it.
"As a confession of my own biases here: I have known Martinez for several years and consider him a friend, and his vouching for Soret carries a lot of weight with me, even allowing that Martinez has a business stake in The Last Night."
I don't want to support Alt Right trash. End of story.
Revolutionary
Member
So Waypoint is no longer to be trusted? Isn't Austin Walker the EIC? Not sure what you're getting at here - a journalist did his dues and reported that he has previous ties to the person he interviewed. If this were Kotaku you wouldn't have seen that disclosure at all lol
Yui's Empire
Member
This game looked amazing at E3, I'll be honest though, I completely missed the controversy, then again I wasn't registered on GAF back then and between all the E3 news it's easy to miss stuff. Can't support a developer like this so no buy from me. Those who brining up other examples aren't too wrong however: Naughty Dog, for example, has every reason to be boycotted between the insane forced multiple year crunches, the (alleged) harassment, the sexist dev, etc.. It is, however, often a matter of comfort: you'll likely not miss out on the sequel to one of the most praised games around for such a "small" reason like the fact that people in the company are literally forced to sustain inhuman working conditions for years to provide you said piece of entertainment. It's an odd world where people find it easier to boycott over MTs, DLCs or lootboxes than over the fact hundreds of people live and work in horrible conditions for years to entertain us.
Mind you, this isn't supposed to be a criticism towards others. I stand by what I said in other threads: I'm skipping Destiny 2 (random example) because D1 didn't respect my time and tried to force me to buy expensive DLC at regular intervals based to not lose out on progress. Yet I buy games that are likely the result of insane crunches. Won't be buying this game surely, but it's rather interesting to think about how selective we are, and to be fair we'd likely never skip something we TRULY wanted all along over some controversies. It's always easier to target the smaller fishes.
Mind you, this isn't supposed to be a criticism towards others. I stand by what I said in other threads: I'm skipping Destiny 2 (random example) because D1 didn't respect my time and tried to force me to buy expensive DLC at regular intervals based to not lose out on progress. Yet I buy games that are likely the result of insane crunches. Won't be buying this game surely, but it's rather interesting to think about how selective we are, and to be fair we'd likely never skip something we TRULY wanted all along over some controversies. It's always easier to target the smaller fishes.
No but that article is one giant softball. Austin was much harsher on the whole thing. I don't think the dude should have done the article at all or he should have given it to another writer.
I just don't see why people are yelling hypocrisy on people being against this game though. It's not just a matter of the writer and producer having horrible viewpoints. Those viewpoints are also foundations for the game.
Revolutionary
Member
I'm not sure that I agree that it was a softball - he asked the questions that we were all wondering about. One could argue that due to their previous relationship, it allowed him to open up for the interview more.
Regardless, Austin is EIC so he has final say on anything that gets published on the website.
SomedayTheFire
Member
He straight up lies in that interview. Why should we take anything else he says to protect himself seriously?
Ah yes I guess we should go back to being in the workhouse to give our lives more meaning
You realize people, young and old, define themselves by their vocation right? It can be a major factor in someones life beyond paying the bills.
Deviousx
Member
I read the OP and I do understand the controversy behind the person making this game. I'm just keeping it 100 and saying the game looks good. Didn't want to hurt anyone's feelings. And it also doesn't mean I'll buy the game. I was blown away when they first unveiled it. And I'm still blown away now.
In the absence of work wouldn't people just define themselves by their hobbies or interests? The whole concept that you have to work to have meaning is kind of a shit idea.
Fantastapotamus
Wrong about commas, wrong about everything
"If you're not 100% perfect, why try at all?"
hey_it's_that_dog
benevolent sexism
The article points out multiple times that Soret's current statements don't match up perfectly with past record. It's a good piece of writing and you shouldn't just take the first opportunity to dismiss it.
Having read it, the bulk of the ideas of The Last Night are the sort of thing you might hear on an episode of the Freakonomics podcast. In fact, their episode about Universal Basic Income asked exactly the same questions about humanity's place in the world and the psychological effects of working/not working. I cannot be offended the exploration of these ideas nor the idea of thinking critically even about goals you agree with.
Maybe we shouldn't take him at his word at all and continue to speculate about the degree of his now-hidden white-supremacist agenda, but I'm going to read more about the game after it releases to see what kinds of ideas people actually find in there before I condemn the entire piece of work.
Those "boycott" comments are kinda funny, especially when they are from ND fanboys or every other developers around there, do you guys thing there aren't white supremacist, nazis, sexist or racists among the employee of your favorite developers? No, they are, even if they don't said it publicly a small amount of people with these ideas are in the gaming industry, just like every other media.
SomedayTheFire
Member
I can't believe that argument is still around after a mod (Stump I think)completely shut it down in the Hat In Time thread.
How many posts is this missing the point now? You guys can't even try.