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The Hobbit 48fps first impressions
- Thread starter Edmond Dantès
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This is the 2nd time you have said you quit. Please be serious this time.
Did you ever get that Red tattoo that you were talking about?
Eight Diagram Bat Fighter
Banned
I just don't understand why he used to be so nice to me in other threads when it came to discussions about RED, but instantly became a complete jerk towards me in this thread. It was almost bipolar.
man of science
Neo Member
Maybe this belongs in the hobbit production thread, but does this mean there will be 4 versions of this movie in theaters?
2d 24p
2d 48p
3d 24p
3d 48p
?
Also I think I can understand why 48p will be better, especially for 3d (I just saw titanic in 3d and anything with fast movement just looked a mess), but (a) I don't care for 3d and (b) I have a hatred of MotionFlow, and even though 48p is technically different since it's actual information, if there is any similarity then it will probably grind my gears.
Last question, what's it gonna take to watch 48p at home? 24p just needs a 120hz display and blu ray right?
2d 24p
2d 48p
3d 24p
3d 48p
?
Also I think I can understand why 48p will be better, especially for 3d (I just saw titanic in 3d and anything with fast movement just looked a mess), but (a) I don't care for 3d and (b) I have a hatred of MotionFlow, and even though 48p is technically different since it's actual information, if there is any similarity then it will probably grind my gears.
Last question, what's it gonna take to watch 48p at home? 24p just needs a 120hz display and blu ray right?
SCULLIBUNDO
Banned
I don't think you'll be seeing a 2D 48fps version in theatres, no.
Flying_Phoenix
Banned
Bluerei that 48fps video was awesome. Really changed my opinion on 48fps. Not impressed that its "technically" better but that it has its own unique look.
abstract alien
Member
Nice little article. The 48fps gif looks so much better and more cinematic. I've always been a fan of higher framerates when it comes to just about everything outside of horror or some purposeful effect. I'm so stoke that this is finally happening as its LONG overdue, but I'm sure the amount of data it will take up is through the roof...
Could you imagine viewing some of the best fight/actions scenes with such clarity and crispness?
Well obviously.
I hope to never see the day that a filmmaker like Jackson changes his resolve because of some internet backlash.
So, basically he was saying that even though you think it looks like shit, you'll get into it because the movie's pretty good.
SCULLIBUNDO
Banned
Did we get a huge influx of users from IGN or something in the last couple months?
Discotheque
Banned
Vestibule ftw! Oh and IGN Movies lobby shoutout to my juggalos woop woop
Are you referring to me?
SCULLIBUNDO
Banned
No. I had multiple tabs open and was meant to be posting in TDKR thread.
Ah. I have no idea what TDKR is. Carry on, then.
PhoncipleBone
Banned
Honestly, I have never clicked into the IGN boards in my entire life. I have heard enough about them from here to know NEVER to do it.
Discotheque
Banned
edit: never mind lol
Raitosaito
Member
I've never used the ign board, and I think I only visit the site when Gaf makes those mock threads.
Watched the basement 24 and 48 fps videos
48fps is straight up better.
Though it might be different seeing a feature film in 48fps.
But goddamn that panorama was painful when I watched it again in 24 fps after seeing the 48fps version.
This is like some 30 vs 60 fps "cinematic" argument.
48fps is straight up better.
Though it might be different seeing a feature film in 48fps.
But goddamn that panorama was painful when I watched it again in 24 fps after seeing the 48fps version.
This is like some 30 vs 60 fps "cinematic" argument.
Also 4k revs, though I don't know how many versions of that there will be.
Unfortunately HDMI isn't designed to support 48p, so we'll probably need new TV's.
It's possible there might be a way to hack it into how BD 3D is sent, but whether a TV would know what to do depends how standardized certain things are (does left eye always go first, etc) ... and I don't know if that's the case.
Also, 120Hz wouldn't allow a perfect representation since it would need to do some pull down. Granted it would be similar to the telecine judder you see with 24p on 60Hz, so some people might be okay with it. 240Hz on the other hand (or if your display offers 96Hz) would be okay. Unfortunately there isn't all that much precedence for TV manufactures offering major feature upgrades on older model TV's, assuming it's even possible.
Lastly, then there's the question of whether BD has enough space and bitrate. 3D can fit because it compresses quite nicely. It doesn't take up anywhere near twice the space. 48p shouldn't necessarily take 2x the space either (the shorter the frame interval, the more similar each frame is, the more you can compress), but I imagine it would be more than 3D and it might be pushing things to much. It's not worth offering 48p at the expense of good image quality. So assuming it isn't viable, they'll wait to include 48p along with 4K in the next BD spec. While the next iteration of BD will still be using the same blue laser frequency (we assume), it will be able to support higher bitrates and resolutions because they'll be using a new codec - h.265. It offers substantially better compression. Also I suspect they may go with BD XL so they can also fit more on a disc.
JoshuaJSlone
Member
Well, we do have precedent for Middle Earth movies split across multiple discs to preserve image quality.
But size isn't the only factor
Flying_Phoenix
Banned
For those who did not download the video:
24fps
48fps
And yes that is exactly what it looks like.
Yeah. Both look great for the own reasons.
Its sure as hell better than the 3D gimmick.
Why can it support gamings 60fps or framerate drops though?
24fps
48fps
And yes that is exactly what it looks like.
Yeah. Both look great for the own reasons.
Its sure as hell better than the 3D gimmick.
Why can it support gamings 60fps or framerate drops though?
For those who did not download the video:
24fps
48fps
48 is so much cleaner.
brandonh83
Banned
Well going by that gif at least I think it looks fine, but obviously I would need to see the actual footage being legitimately projected @ 48fps really make a judgment call.
Simply isn't part of the specification. An HDMI Rx (and further down the pipe, the video processor in the TV) is expecting specific resolutions and framerates so it knows how to process it. The reason it's not there though is because there hasn't been a reason to include it. No content and thus no displays designed to support it directly. Combine those and there's no reason to bother including it in HDMI.
It's one of the downfalls of the combination of digital transmission and fixed pixel displays. With analog transmission and a CRT, you can play any resolution and frequency the CRT can handle. Not only that, it doesn't require scaling (or even deinterlacing technically - though you'd have to live with scanlines)
BlueTsunami
there is joy in sucking dick
What hits me about the acuity of 48fps versus the blurring of 24fps is that it may break the illusion of a fantasy setting, at least initially. This may be good for modern day movies and better yet Sci-Fi but introducing it with an epic fantasy like The Hobbit may be off putting.
Because apparently people were born with vaseline in their eyes during medieval times.
lol i kid
cutmeamango
Banned
I think Cameron is gunning for 60fps here on out.
I think 48fps looks fine but I'm just worried about how 48fps will work on home displays since only a few have refresh rates that will synch properly to it.
You can have 60fps at 720p.
It's funny, 48fps films can be released with real 24fps versions, but we currently can't play 48fps at home, 60fps can't be used to make 24fps versions, but we can watch them with our current TVs.
None will sync to it natively.
Which would produce a telecine judder pattern that's more irregular than 24p on a 60Hz display.
I'll pass.
Theonik
Member
They probably could but it would only work with newer players or limited older ones. Doubling the framerate can increase the decoding requirements quite a bit and would cause other complications as well. (greater storage requirement, won't work with slower drives, though that's mostly irrelevant since newer players mostly have 2x drives at least)
Edit: There's also the complication that most current TVs aren't able to handle 48FPS natively so the player would have to do the suitable frame pull-down work. So yeah not holding my breath for a 48FPS home release for now at all.
Whogie
Member
Good to know, but I don't think people would be willing to take a resolution cut for something as controversial as 48p/60p.
But yeah, 48p is tricky -- 60p would be more ideal for home viewers.
I bet most people watched the sample vids at 60hz and didn't mind judder too much.
But yeah, 48p is tricky -- 60p would be more ideal for home viewers.
TVs can handle 1080 48p video just fine over HDMI. If it isn't supported it'll be because content providers will restrict it using HDCP.
I was talking about for 60fps content. I doubt 48fps content will be released in anything other than 24fps unless our TVs and BR players are changed to officially support it.
BlueTsunami
there is joy in sucking dick
Weren't they always drunk back then? 'Dat natural 24p.
I thought you could do 1080/60, just not 1080/60/3D?
Nope.
1920×1080 29.97-i 16:9
1920×1080 25-i 16:9
1920×1080 24-p 16:9
1920×1080 23.976-p 16:9
1440×1080 29.97-i 16:9 (anamorphic)
1440×1080 25-i 16:9 (anamorphic)
1440×1080 24-p 16:9 (anamorphic)
1440×1080 23.976-p 16:9 (anamorphic)
1280×720 59.94-p 16:9
1280×720 50-p 16:9
1280×720 24-p 16:9
1280×720 23.976-p 16:9
720×480 29.97-i 4:3/16:9 (anamorphic)
720×576 25-i 4:3/16:9 (anamorphic)
Is that a blu-ray spec issue or an HDMI issue? 1080p/60fps games run fine on modern displays.
Yeah, it's BR. HDMI 1.3 can support 1080p/60fps.
AlteredBeast
Fork 'em, Sparky!
Imagine the next Bourne movie! You might actually see 2 frames of the fighting between cuts, rather than the standard .03!
Ah, OK. I can see the BR spec getting altered once 60fps content comes up, especially since it'll have to use the newer higher capacity discs to accommodate it anyway.
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