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JOHN CARTER (OF MARS!) |OT| (dir. Andrew Stanton)

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R

RobotNinjaHornets

Banned
kame-sennin said:
This is the most ridiculous thing I've ever read. A movie's job is to be entertaining. If people are entertained, they pay money. The movie failed the audience, not the other way around.
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I kind of understand what people mean with this argument, but it's always seemed kind of odd to me, considering...you pay first
 
W

Wind's Howling

Member
JoeTheBlow said:
Finally watched it, and can re-iterate the point that Disney's entire marketing dept needs shooting.

Part of the problem, that its always "Disney's John Carter", and that big fucking Disney logo on all the posters and the upcoming atrocious DVD/BR cases right above the title.
What do you associate Disney with? Kids films.
Certainly not sci-fi, which is all this was, and quite enjoyable for sci-fi fans.
Disney seemed shit-scared that only sci-fi fans would come to see it if it was marketed as such, and instead pushed for a family-friendly fantasy/CGI-creature funfest.

Fucking idiots. Promoting a film as a nerd-friendly action sci-fi certainly didn't do Avatar any harm, and nor will Prometheous find it hard breaking even.
And i liked the twist at the end. Though can't help wondering if he's gone back up there to wake up sealed in a tomb or coffin or something. And wouldn't princess hottie be 10 years older and have another husband and several kids by now?
Yeah, best not think about that one too much.
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Maybe his copy lived on with her.
 
G

Good Job Bob

Member
JoeTheBlow said:
Finally watched it, and can re-iterate the point that Disney's entire marketing dept needs shooting.

Part of the problem, that its always "Disney's John Carter", and that big fucking Disney logo on all the posters and the upcoming atrocious DVD/BR cases right above the title.
What do you associate Disney with? Kids films.
Certainly not sci-fi, which is all this was, and quite enjoyable for sci-fi fans.
Disney seemed shit-scared that only sci-fi fans would come to see it if it was marketed as such, and instead pushed for a family-friendly fantasy/CGI-creature funfest.

Fucking idiots. Promoting a film as a nerd-friendly action sci-fi certainly didn't do Avatar any harm, and nor will Prometheous find it hard breaking even.
And i liked the twist at the end. Though can't help wondering if he's gone back up there to wake up sealed in a tomb or coffin or something. And wouldn't princess hottie be 10 years older and have another husband and several kids by now?
Yeah, best not think about that one too much.
Click to expand...
Gods_of_Mars-1918.jpg
 
K

Kilrogg

paid requisite penance
RobotNinjaHornets said:
I kind of understand what people mean with this argument, but it's always seemed kind of odd to me, considering...you pay first
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You pay first, but after having seen the marketing and heard word of mouth. If the movie has a slow start, marketing is to blame. If it fizzles out after a few days/weeks or never gains steam, word of mouth is to blame.

By the way, by marketing I don't only mean "how much trailers and ads were thrown at us", but whether the very content of the movie looks appealing to someone who first sees a trailer for instance.
 
S

SCULLIBUNDO

Banned
JoeTheBlow said:
Finally watched it, and can re-iterate the point that Disney's entire marketing dept needs shooting.

And wouldn't princess hottie be 10 years older and have another husband and several kids by now?
Yeah, best not think about that one too much.
Click to expand...

Humans live for hundreds of years on Barsoom, which is why upon his return to Earth so much time has past and he seems strangely youthful to his nephew.
 
M

MadraptorMan

Member
Log4Girlz said:
How boring compared to Speed Racer?
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I guess way more boring, because I actually got some enjoyment out of Speed Racer whereas John Carter just about put me to sleep. In fact it did, and I went back and watched the scenes I slept through...dunno why though; wasn't worth it.
 
Christopher

Christopher

Member
I can't wait to see it on Blu Ray to give it another chance because I remember it being god awful...I thought at bare minimum it would be Prince of Persia fun.
 
K

kame-sennin

Member
RobotNinjaHornets said:
I kind of understand what people mean with this argument, but it's always seemed kind of odd to me, considering...you pay first
Click to expand...

Kilrogg explained it perfectly, but when I said the audience pays if they are entertained, I meant the American movie-going audience collectively. When a movie doesn't entertain the people who showed up opening weekend, those people don't tell their friends about it, or they tell their friends how bad it was, and audiences stop paying to go see the film. That's why the claims that marketing killed this movie are a little weak*, the movie had no legs and terrible word of mouth. It bombed because people hated it, period.

*The marketing of the movie was bad, but if anything I think that's a reflection of the film's shittastic design. Before the movie was released, people were complaining about how ugly the posters were and how corny the movie seemed in trailers. Now that I've seen it, the posters are ugly because they showed the movie's ugly characters, and the trailers were corny because they showed clips from a corny movie. I really don't see the discrepancy between the marketing materials and the actual content of the film.
 
P

Phaethon0017

Member
I thought this movie was going to be an abomination. I'm not a fan of Taylor Kitsch at all, and was pretty glad this film bombed as the trailers just got on my nerves.

Now having watched it, I actually enjoyed it. It didn't do one thing well, but the premise was great, and the story was interesting. Acting and writing though just fell flat.

Makes me want to read the books. In fact I downloaded the first three on Kindle for free. Edgar Rice Burroughs is pimp.
 
A

artist

Banned
I'm going to probably catch this on a rental when it's out. Sculli has convinced me that the OST rocks so its probably one worth one watch at least.
 
Leatherface

Leatherface

Member
krypt0nian said:
You made it personal when you acted like an ass at the top of the page.

Nothing needs to be fixed in JC. They put out a film with all the right pieces, and the movie going public failed it.

Sculli knows great films. He doesn't let metacritics decide, but rather his innate sense of great film. I don't always agree with him, but I know it is heartfelt. That's why I'm defending him from pests like you.
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I agree with Mike Works here. Sorry man, John Carter just wasn't that great. I'm a big fan of the genre and just could not get into it. The characters were boring, the story was generic, the alien designs were even more so. Everything about the movie was just a bore honestly. Everyone here goes on and on about how poorly this movie did because of it's marketing, but I don't think that's the case. If the movie was awesome, word would have spread quickly, but it didn't, do you know why? Because no one cared. The movie sucked. I have friends that went to see it and never even mentioned it afterward, that's how forgettable it was.

/Truth
 
S

SCULLIBUNDO

Banned
Leatherface said:
Everyone here goes on and on about how poorly this movie did because of it's marketing, but I don't think that's the case. If the movie was awesome, word would have spread quickly, but it didn't, do you know why? Because no one cared. The movie sucked. I have friends that went to see it and never even mentioned it afterward, that's how forgettable it was.

/Truth
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Hard for WOM to generate when only a small few go and see the film. No, if a $250m film hasn't got an audience ready to see it week one, it isn't going to do well at the box office. Speed Racer says hi. Scott Pilgrim says hi. And now John Carter says hi.
 
Pollux

Pollux

Member
Scullibundo said:
Hard for WOM to generate when only a small few go and see the film. No, if a $250m film hasn't got an audience ready to see it week one, it isn't going to do well at the box office. Speed Racer says hi. Scott Pilgrim says hi. And now John Carter says hi.
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Tragedy is that all three of those were good movies.
 
S

SCULLIBUNDO

Banned
Exactly. John Carter could have done decently at the box office if Disney weren't so ridiculously incompetent. It should have been an easy sell after Avatar as well.
 
Leatherface

Leatherface

Member
All of the movies you listed are just okay though. Scott Pilgrim I liked but it wasn't amazing either. If a movie is good enough, word gets around and people go to see it. Better marketing would have helped a little but not much I bet.
 
S

SCULLIBUNDO

Banned
Leatherface said:
All of the movies you listed are just okay though. Scott Pilgrim I liked but it wasn't amazing either. If a movie is good enough, word gets around and people go to see it.
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Yes, but not in the cinemas. Blade Runner is also proof of this. If a big budget film can't make a big enough splash in its opening week, then it isn't happening. WOM can't function from the audiences that make up a $20m box office opening. More movies start coming out and screenings become rarer until it is excised much more quickly from the screens.
 
K

Kusagari

Member
John Carter opened with over 30 million. There are numerous movies that opened in that range that went on to have good legs and gross over 100mill.

John Carter had absolute shit legs, which doesn't do much for backing up the good WoM argument.
 
M

MrPink93485

Member
Kusagari said:
John Carter opened with over 30 million. There are numerous movies that opened in that range that went on to have good legs and gross over 100mill.

John Carter had absolute shit legs, which doesn't do much for backing up the good WoM argument.
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No, but considering the overwhelming amount of press around its budget, it may have dissuaded audiences from ever giving it a chance in the first place.
 
C

Caboose

Member
Scullibundo said:
WOM can't function from the audiences that make up a $20m box office opening.
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I'm sorry but that's complete bullshit. Plenty of movies do 100M+ off a 30 or even 20 opening weekend. You know why WOM didn't function for JC? People didn't like it very much. The end.
 
V

VistraNorrez

Member
People knew John Carter as a bomb months before it even came out because the negative hype was huge. The narrative was set that this film had to bomb. It has a 6.9 on IMDB and the audience meter at Rotten tomatoes is 66%. The audience seemed to like it well enough. It seems WoM just wasn't there enough to counterattack all the negativity surrounding the pre-release. It'll be cult film though and decades on there will be that group of people dreaming of what the sequels would've been like.
 
A

ascii42

Member
Scullibundo said:
Exactly. John Carter could have done decently at the box office if Disney weren't so ridiculously incompetent. It should have been an easy sell after Avatar as well.
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Possibly, but Avatar's Pandora looks a lot more appealing than Mars. I think that was a large part of the draw for Avatar that John Carter wouldn't have.
 
J

jett

D-Member
I don't approve of mentioning Scott Pilgrim or John Carter on the same line as Speed Racer.

Speed Racer uber alles.
 
B

bjb

Banned
I tried to convince my girlfriend this movie is shit, but she wanted to watch it anyway.

Now I've wasted 4 hours of my life, just to hear her confirm it was dogshit.
 
D

Discotheque

Banned
Scullibundo said:
My man. Stardust is also incredibly overrated. I have no idea what people see in Matthew Vaughn's B-films.
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Stardust has a good cast and I like the Take That (lol boy band) song at the end credits. That's about all I can say though.

All of Vaughn's movies feel like B-films. Even X Men First Class.
 
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